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The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

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The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

Old 12-04-23, 12:42 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by DJariya
I may be a little ignorant to this, but I don't understand why so many of these "fans" dislike her or flat out hate her. I've seen her interviewed many times and most recently promoting The Marvels and she seems pleasant enough.
She's a woman with views and opinions.
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Old 12-04-23, 12:42 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by Draven
I couldn't agree more. I think she's very charming and personable (and her character in The Marvels is the best version of her character yet). She might be too overpowered for the "fans". It's funny - no one ever says Superman is OP when he's running around with Batman (who has no super powers) but make Captain Marvel stronger than Thor and they get all in a tizzy.
The character is too powerful. I think if anyone resents the character its from the last 15 or so years of trying to make her a thing. Countless series and relaunch after relaunch and the character has never found a footing. There hasn't been a definitive "who she is" and Civil War II completely sent her off the rails.

Not to get too deep but I think if they'd have had Genis Veil be the Captain Marvel in the movies they'd have fared basically the same.
Old 12-04-23, 12:43 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by DJariya
https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/lessons_in_chemistry

84% on RT. But, that's not the kind of series that draws nerds to talk about. It's more of a prestige show.
But it's a damn good series...with the exception of the one episode which had nothing to do with Larson.
Old 12-04-23, 01:13 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by Draven
I couldn't agree more. I think she's very charming and personable (and her character in The Marvels is the best version of her character yet). She might be too overpowered for the "fans". It's funny - no one ever says Superman is OP when he's running around with Batman (who has no super powers) but make Captain Marvel stronger than Thor and they get all in a tizzy.
I feel like Superman isnít as popular as he once was and a criticism of the character is often that heís overpowered. Superman has more staying power though because of how long heís been around so people kind of accept him.

Brie Larson does get more hate directed towards her though which is unfair. I just donít think the character has been very well developed. Her first movie was a mixed bag, then she didnít really do much in Endgame. I havenít seen The Marvels yet but it just sounds like it was fairly mediocre.
Old 12-04-23, 01:25 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by Timber
The character is too powerful. I think if anyone resents the character its from the last 15 or so years of trying to make her a thing. Countless series and relaunch after relaunch and the character has never found a footing. There hasn't been a definitive "who she is" and Civil War II completely sent her off the rails.

Not to get too deep but I think if they'd have had Genis Veil be the Captain Marvel in the movies they'd have fared basically the same.
I mean tell me how well defined and popular a character Star Lord was in the comics? And then how different Chris Pratt's version is.

The one thing I can't explain is the popularity of Gal Gadot's Wonder Woman in comparison. She is similarly overpowered, and is perhaps even more "feminist" in character. Is it mainly because the character has the benefit of recognition from earlier works? It's certainly not Gadot imbuing the character with personality (though she does a fine job). Does she have more charisma than Larson or something?
Old 12-04-23, 01:38 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

I don’t think GotG can be shoehorned into the argument though. If that movie with that cast was done by anyone other than James Gunn would it have been that movie? Pratt has tons of charisma but it took something special to make D list superheroes hit. Look at the Eternals.
Old 12-04-23, 01:40 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

It definitely is because WW is a more known character than CM. CM hasn't had that history to build her up.
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Old 12-04-23, 01:58 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by Timber
The character is too powerful.
Why? I mean, some characters have to be the ďmost powerfulĒ, right? Why not her?

Originally Posted by Mike86
Brie Larson does get more hate directed towards her though which is unfair. I just donít think the character has been very well developed. Her first movie was a mixed bag, then she didnít really do much in Endgame. I havenít seen The Marvels yet but it just sounds like it was fairly mediocre.
The Marvels is the best version yet of Captain Marvel and a blast of a movie. There is no good reason for it to not do well. Itís not the best ever, but itís perfect comic book fare.
Old 12-04-23, 03:21 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by fujishig
I mean tell me how well defined and popular a character Star Lord was in the comics? And then how different Chris Pratt's version is.

The one thing I can't explain is the popularity of Gal Gadot's Wonder Woman in comparison. She is similarly overpowered, and is perhaps even more "feminist" in character. Is it mainly because the character has the benefit of recognition from earlier works? It's certainly not Gadot imbuing the character with personality (though she does a fine job). Does she have more charisma than Larson or something?
WW is a cultural icon and Captain Marvel is not.

One thing DC characters have over Marvel (that DC has repeatedly, frustratingly refused to capitalize on) is that they carry these mythic properties. They traditionally represent the best of humanity and embody our greatest hopes about ourselves, whereas Marvel characters are more realistic people thrust into extraordinary circumstances. Spider-Man and Captain America are probably the ones that come close to DC's ideas and you have like Kylie Rayner who goes the opposite way. Although DC has been trying to damndest to "Marvelize" their characters for a long time.
Old 12-04-23, 04:07 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

But that is also the problem they have with their "pantheon" that they've had (and tried to correct) since the first Crisis, they aren't as grounded as the Marvel heroes and thus can be a bit too distant from humanity.

I agree with WW being more of a cultural icon just pointing out that there's nobody claiming that WW is "too powerful" and it seems like it's all about expectations.

As far as GotG there is another weird parallel there. In the mid 2000s most of the Earth bound Marvel Universe was stuck in Civil War and after than a seemingly endless number of crossovers that drastically changed the landscape of the Marvel Universe (Secret Invasion among them). A bunch of creators had the bright idea to take this opportunity to basically redo the (mostly unused) cosmic heroes away from Earth, so they wouldn't be embroiled in those interweaving storylines. The current form of Drax, Star Lord coming back, the current incarnation of the Guardians of the Galaxy, Adam Warlock, etc. all came from Annihilation.

I think cinematic GotG also benefitted from being separated from what was going on on Earth. Obviously Thanos connected them but you didn't have to wonder "hey, where are the Avengers" or "why didn't the Guardians help during Ultron" or whatever other nonsense they had to explain by the time they got to Eternals and others. They could grow on their own in their corner of the universe. You don't really have that now, like at all. X-men and Fantastic Four will have their own corners of the universe and that will probably help but I'm not sure we can expect the same kind of, I dunno what you would call it, awe and reverence from comic book fans just happy to see their favorite properties make it to the big screen, instead it's mostly cynicism. On a side note Star Wars accomplished that whole arc within a single trilogy.

Maybe Gunn kicks some butt with his new DC cinematic universe and we go back and forth, which can only be good for both (please, please don't crash and burn)
m
Old 12-04-23, 04:42 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by fujishig
But that is also the problem they have with their "pantheon" that they've had (and tried to correct) since the first Crisis, they aren't as grounded as the Marvel heroes and thus can be a bit too distant from humanity.
Only a problem because of the kinds of stories they're trying to tell. They need to be theme-driven, not character- or story-driven
Old 12-04-23, 05:04 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by IBJoel
Only a problem because of the kinds of stories they're trying to tell. They need to be theme-driven, not character- or story-driven
I just think it's weird that.. all of the DC characters have had a few great story arcs in the comics. Why not just adapt those 'faithfully' instead of trying to reinvent the wheel all the time? I'm interested in what Gunn is doing, but at the same time, why? Just to spite the original creators so you don't have to pay them royalties?
Old 12-04-23, 05:13 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by devilshalo
I just think it's weird that.. all of the DC characters have had a few great story arcs in the comics. Why not just adapt those 'faithfully' instead of trying to reinvent the wheel all the time? I'm interested in what Gunn is doing, but at the same time, why? Just to spite the original creators so you don't have to pay them royalties?
From what I've seen, they can pretty much adapt whatever they want from the comics, and may not even have to write up an homage to the original creators unless the characters they're using demand it (ie: X-men 2 takes a lot from Claremont's run and God Loves Man Kills but I'm not sure they outright say that anywhere or paid him royalties for writing it).

But the other reasons are that things that work on the comics page may not adapt well to another medium, that some of this stuff is so steeped in continuity that it wouldn't work without a ton of buildup, that script writers may still look down on comic writing and not want to adapt things faithfully, that they want to put their own spin on things, etc. But I would love if they just did something like Morrison's All Star Superman, just start in the middle of all this wackiness and roll with it.
Old 12-04-23, 06:59 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by IBJoel
WW is a cultural icon and Captain Marvel is not.

One thing DC characters have over Marvel (that DC has repeatedly, frustratingly refused to capitalize on) is that they carry these mythic properties. They traditionally represent the best of humanity and embody our greatest hopes about ourselves, whereas Marvel characters are more realistic people thrust into extraordinary circumstances. Spider-Man and Captain America are probably the ones that come close to DC's ideas and you have like Kylie Rayner who goes the opposite way. Although DC has been trying to damndest to "Marvelize" their characters for a long time.
One interesting thing about DC vs Marvel is that, being a comics reader (predominantly Marvel) in the 1980s, DC always felt out place, like their characters and stories were stuck decades in the past. DC had Superman and Batman and Wonder Woman, and the Joker in his purple suit and big smiling mouth, and the Penguin, and The Riddler in a green question mark suit. And Marvel had the superhero equivalent of Dirty Harry and a guy with blades that came out of his hands and a demon with a flaming skull for a head on a motorcycle. Even their older characters like the Fantastic Four, Doctor Doom, and the Hulk felt contemporary. You know, cool kids like me read Daredevil, The Incredible Hulk, and X-Men; weird middle-aged men with comb-overs and bellies spilling out over the top of their pants obsessed over Legion of Superheroes, Green Lantern, and Detective Comics.

But, at the same time, DC could take these conservative, out-dated characters, and still tell stories like The Killing Joke, Year One, and Dark Knight Returns that had literary merit and could appeal to people who didn't read comic books. Whereas Marvel, with their more grounded characters and contemporary vibe, could never come to close to capturing that, and barely even tried. Closest they came was "Kraven's Last Hunt." And they even had a dedicated graphic novel line, but even those were just over-priced, overwrought extensions of their regular superhero comics.

Not to say they didn't have some good runs, but even stuff like Miller's Daredevil, Simonson's Thor, and Claremont's X-Men couldn't transcend the genre and medium like Dark Knight Returns or The Killing Joke. And there is no way in hell Marvel could have produced a Watchmen or Sandman.
Old 12-04-23, 07:58 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

Where did Marvel go wrong?

This pretty much sums it up...

Old 12-04-23, 09:18 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by Josh-da-man
weird middle-aged men with comb-overs and bellies spilling out over the top of their pants obsessed over Legion of Superheroes
Shut your mouth!
And there is no way in hell Marvel could have produced a Watchmen or Sandman.
What are you talking about? Sleepwalker was Sandman done right!
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Old 12-08-23, 01:18 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

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Old 12-09-23, 12:19 AM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

​​​​​​​Texts were revealed in court today that pretty much guarantee Major is out at Marvel and from any other mainstream project for the foreseeable future.

Also seeing a lot of people say he had a clause in his contract that he is the only one who can play Kang but havenít seen anything close to an official confirmation of that.
Old 12-09-23, 07:29 AM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

I wonder if he had a morals clause that might negate his entire contract
Old 12-09-23, 11:49 AM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by whotony
I wonder if he had a morals clause that might negate his entire contract
Yeah, it's Disney, so I'm sure he did. Eh, good riddance.
Old 12-09-23, 12:30 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

The average Joe probably wouldn’t know Jonathan Majors played Kang. It’s an easy recast if they continue with the character.

Was there some uproar when Cheadle replaced Terrence Howard? Nobody misses or would even remember Howard played Rhodie first?
Old 12-09-23, 12:52 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by DJariya
The average Joe probably wouldnít know Jonathan Majors played Kang. Itís an easy recast if they continue with the character.

Was there some uproar when Cheadle replaced Terrence Howard? Nobody misses or would even remember Howard played Rhodie first?
I've said before Shamier Anderson who played the Tracker in John Wick 4 would be a perfect replacement.

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Old 12-09-23, 04:43 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

A suggestion I saw that I really liked was Yasiin Bey.
Old 12-09-23, 04:46 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by Nesbit
A suggestion I saw that I really liked was Yasiin Bey.
I like Mos Def, but donít find him very intimidating. Heís also 15 years older than Johnathan Majors.
Old 12-09-23, 05:32 PM
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Re: The General Marvel Cinematic Universe Film discussion thread - News, rumors, etc.

Originally Posted by Decker
I like Mos Def, but donít find him very intimidating. Heís also 15 years older than Johnathan Majors.

Has he done anything recently?
That seems kind of random name.

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