Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
12-14-15, 07:52 AM
#177
Re: Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
Doesn't mean "Actors can win Oscars" playing in comic book movies is a thing though. It's an outlier among outliers, and to make that a supporting argument of how well respected comic book movies are is laughable when it most likely will never, ever happen again.
12-14-15, 08:07 AM
#178
DVD Talk Hero
Re: Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
Ledger got his nomination because he elevated the hell out of a high grossing movie (he was the best part of the movie, and it wasn't even close). Same reason Streep was nominated for Devil Wears Prada and Johnny Depp for Pirates of the Caribbean. Also, that movie was destined to make a boatload of money any way you cut it. The Avengers made substantially more and that actually always had me more baffled.
Standout performances usually get recognized regardless of genre, there just haven't been a lot of them in the comic book cinematic world. It isn't that the Academy doesn't respect the genre, it just hasn't made anything good enough to really standout. The closest thing I'd list toward a snub would be Alfred Molina in Spider-man 2, and possibly Adapted Screenplay (though the actual nominees were mostly deserving.)
I think Furious 7 actually had more of a benefit, because there was a curiosity to see how they filmed parts of the movie without the star.
Standout performances usually get recognized regardless of genre, there just haven't been a lot of them in the comic book cinematic world. It isn't that the Academy doesn't respect the genre, it just hasn't made anything good enough to really standout. The closest thing I'd list toward a snub would be Alfred Molina in Spider-man 2, and possibly Adapted Screenplay (though the actual nominees were mostly deserving.)
I think Furious 7 actually had more of a benefit, because there was a curiosity to see how they filmed parts of the movie without the star.
Last edited by RichC2; 12-14-15 at 08:12 AM.
12-14-15, 08:23 AM
#179
Re: Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
Streep gets nominated because she's Streep. And Depp should have never been nominated for the movie, as much as I like him and his performance, but had Johnny Depp died prior to the film's release, his chances of winning would have increased. By "that movie", are you taking about Pirates of the Caribbean? It never was destined to make a boatload of money. It was the surprise hit of the summer by all box office forecasts. It was a bigger surprise than Guardians of the Galaxy.
12-14-15, 08:24 AM
#180
DVD Talk Hero
Re: Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
No, "That movie" is Dark Knight.
12-14-15, 08:47 AM
#181
Re: Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
Batman Begins opening weekend was $45+m. The Dark Knight's was $158m. The jump wasn't because people loved the Batman Begins, though many like myself did, but because of the hype around the film, and prominently marketing the Joker, played by a dead guy. And why do I focus on him being dead so much? Because that's what most media outlets touted about his performance, being one of his last ones on film. So is it really that outlandish to assume his death combined with his performance pushed him over the edge to get a win? And there's a world of difference between getting nominated and winning. Robert Downey Jr. was nominated for Tropic Thunder, but did anyone think he had a chance at actually winning? No way.
Last edited by Brack; 12-14-15 at 09:04 AM.
12-14-15, 09:50 AM
#182
DVD Talk Godfather
Re: Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
Obviously I was talking about box office performance, not Oscar nods.
I just think it's funny this is the only Oscar win anyone cares about, while every other time the Oscars are seen more or less irrelevant (and they really are when we have this 10 film nomination crap that completely destroys the show, not the awards, portion).
Of course Ledger gave a memorable performance, but as I supported with circumstances around his nomination and win, it felt like his win had more to do with his death than anything else. Besides winning the Oscar, he won practically everything else he was nominated for at other awards shows/honors. That's unheard of even for Oscar front runners. It's blatantly obvious why he won EVERYTHING, and it wasn't so much because he was so great, but because no one wanted to be the bad guy and not give the dead guy, who died tragically I might add, awards.
There is no difference to playing a comic book character and playing a character in a video game adaptation, especially one like Assassin's Creed. Maybe if he was starring in Pong the Movie or something I'd agree.
I just think it's funny this is the only Oscar win anyone cares about, while every other time the Oscars are seen more or less irrelevant (and they really are when we have this 10 film nomination crap that completely destroys the show, not the awards, portion).
Of course Ledger gave a memorable performance, but as I supported with circumstances around his nomination and win, it felt like his win had more to do with his death than anything else. Besides winning the Oscar, he won practically everything else he was nominated for at other awards shows/honors. That's unheard of even for Oscar front runners. It's blatantly obvious why he won EVERYTHING, and it wasn't so much because he was so great, but because no one wanted to be the bad guy and not give the dead guy, who died tragically I might add, awards.
There is no difference to playing a comic book character and playing a character in a video game adaptation, especially one like Assassin's Creed. Maybe if he was starring in Pong the Movie or something I'd agree.
And while I don't necessarily disagree that there shouldn't be a difference between characters from each type, I can easily see many feel that there are. At least until we get a video game movie that's actually considered good or elevates the material.
As for The Dark Knight, looking at the dates I think the hype was getting pretty huge even before Ledger died. The opening IMAX scene and first trailer came out with I Am Legend in December of 2007, whereas Ledger died in January. I remember a lot of hype around that IMAX trailer, I know I went to a packed house for I Am Legend just to see that IMAX opening. To me it goes back to what I said before; his death had an effect, but how big can be debated.
12-14-15, 10:11 AM
#183
Re: Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
It can be debated, hence the "end of discussion" argument dismissive at best, condescending at worse. The hype was there prior to Ledger's death, but it grew immensely afterwards. An IMAX trailer is enough to drive an opening to $158m after the former movie opened to $45m? Riiiight.
12-14-15, 10:18 AM
#184
DVD Talk Godfather
Re: Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
It can be debated, hence the "end of discussion" argument dismissive at best, condescending at worse. The hype was there prior to Ledger's death, but it grew immensely afterwards. An IMAX trailer is enough to drive an opening to $158m after the former movie opened to $45m? Riiiight.
And there are sequels that open significantly bigger then the originals. The before mentioned Pirates movies went from $46 million to $135. The Matrix went from $27 to $91. It's not unheard of.
12-14-15, 10:26 AM
#185
Re: Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
I don't see anything wrong with the use of "end of discussion" in the context of Draven's post, since it accurately summed up the series of events. And no more condescending then you calling everyone naive.
And there are sequels that open significantly bigger then the originals. The before mentioned Pirates movies went from $46 million to $135. The Matrix went from $27 to $91. It's not unheard of.
And there are sequels that open significantly bigger then the originals. The before mentioned Pirates movies went from $46 million to $135. The Matrix went from $27 to $91. It's not unheard of.
It's not unheard of, but keep in mind the original Pirates grossed $305m. The Matrix's overall gross was $171m after that somewhat soft opening. The opening weekend multiplier was much higher for for those films than Batman Begins.
12-14-15, 10:34 AM
#186
DVD Talk Godfather
Re: Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
I called EVERYONE naïve? Since when? Must have struck a nerve. My apologies to the oversensitive around here.
It's not unheard of, but keep in mind the original Pirates grossed $305m. The Matrix's overall gross was $171m after that somewhat soft opening. The opening weekend multiplier was much higher for for those films than Batman Begins.
It's not unheard of, but keep in mind the original Pirates grossed $305m. The Matrix's overall gross was $171m after that somewhat soft opening. The opening weekend multiplier was much higher for for those films than Batman Begins.
Christ, it's like the XBox One AV Sync argument again.
12-14-15, 10:35 AM
#187
DVD Talk Hero
Re: Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
I don't see anything wrong with the use of "end of discussion" in the context of Draven's post, since it accurately summed up the series of events. And no more condescending then you calling everyone naive.
And there are sequels that open significantly bigger then the originals. The before mentioned Pirates movies went from $46 million to $135. The Matrix went from $27 to $91. It's not unheard of.
And there are sequels that open significantly bigger then the originals. The before mentioned Pirates movies went from $46 million to $135. The Matrix went from $27 to $91. It's not unheard of.
Twilight also jumped from a $70m opening to a $143m opening for its first sequel. I recall them being slightly disappointed that Batman Begins didn't do better theatrically, but the highly favorable reaction from audiences and video sales/rentals drove the franchise forward which paid off beautifully.
Last edited by RichC2; 12-14-15 at 10:44 AM.
12-14-15, 10:42 AM
#188
Re: Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
Wow, I guess I should be somewhat flattered by you remembering something two yeas ago. You still can't argue I never called everyone naïve, can you? We're not perfect, so quit pretending you are.
12-14-15, 10:44 AM
#189
DVD Talk Godfather
Re: Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
I'm just saying you were just as condescending here.
12-14-15, 10:49 AM
#191
DVD Talk Godfather
12-14-15, 10:51 AM
#192
DVD Talk Hero
12-14-15, 10:51 AM
#193
Re: Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
You said I called everyone naïve. I surely did not, so I called you out just like others mentioned when I forgot about Ledger. Just sick of the snark is all. Wasn't really going there, unlike so many others here. I'm done with this, as it is going nowhere and stemmed from a comment about Fassbender taking a video game adaptation as being lesser than playing Magneto.
12-14-15, 11:14 AM
#195
DVD Talk Godfather
Re: Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
You said I called everyone naïve. I surely did not, so I called you out just like others mentioned when I forgot about Ledger. Just sick of the snark is all. Wasn't really going there, unlike so many others here. I'm done with this, as it is going nowhere and stemmed from a comment about Fassbender taking a video game adaptation as being lesser than playing Magneto.
12-14-15, 11:37 AM
#196
Re: Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
Your argument was that I said everyone was naïve. That's taking it too literally? Backpedaling much? Pot, kettle, black. I called people naïve within the context of the argument. No one seems to be reading what I have provided so far as having merit. Whatever, a simple Google search says differently.
12-14-15, 11:41 AM
#197
DVD Talk Godfather
Re: Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
Your argument was that I said everyone was naïve. That's taking it too literally? Backpedaling much? Pot, kettle, black. I called people naïve within the context of the argument. No one seems to be reading what I have provided so far as having merit. Whatever, a simple Google search says differently.
And I think some of the stuff you're saying does have merit. It probably just would have been better if you said you forgot about Ledger initially rather then immediately saying he doesn't count. That's what started all this stuff.
12-15-15, 06:54 AM
#198
Re: Assassin's Creed (12/21/2016, Kurzel) S: Fassbender, Cotillard
You all have made valid points. Sorry I derailed this thread to this extent. I'll try to refrain from being such an asshat in the future.
why I wrote "try" 