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-   -   bad scripts, good movies (https://forum.dvdtalk.com/movie-talk/590194-bad-scripts-good-movies.html)

Crocker Jarmen 11-15-15 08:12 PM

Re: bad scripts, good movies
 
The first thing that springs to my mind is Beverly Hills Cop. I can't imagine anyone looking at the script and thinking, "Yeah, this is a great story and will make a fine movie", but an in his prime Eddie Murphy, mixed in with great character actors like Judge Reinhold and the fat older guy from Midnight Run, well directed action scenes, good music, come together to make a movie I love watching even though I hardly know or care what the story is.

bluetoast 11-16-15 06:59 AM

Re: bad scripts, good movies
 
Beverly Hills Cop had a solid script and brilliant improvisation (and not just from Eddie Murphy). It was nominated for an Oscar for Best Original Screenplay.

ntnon 11-17-15 04:43 PM

Re: bad scripts, good movies
 

Originally Posted by FinkPish (Post 10749684)

A bad script executed well cannot exist
; it was bad to start with. A good script executed poorly happens all the time.

But that's not quite the question... it's not a 'well-executed bad script' (which can happen - good actors read rubbish well All The Time), it's a "'good' film, despite the script'. As already pointed out, you can direct a poorly scripted film well. It can look good, and be absorbing despite the majority of words uttered; actors can put in good performances; plot can even transcend script: any of these elements can allow a 'good' film to emerge from a poor script.


Originally Posted by Nick Danger (Post 10749709)
A bad script will never result in a great movie, but plenty of entertaining movies started with bad scripts. A good cast, a good director, a good DP, or a good fight choreographer can make a badly-written movie enjoyable. Some people, like Vincent Price, specialize in making bad material sound good.

At the very basic level, this is one definition of 'so bad they're good' and 'cheesy movies'. At a different level it's the difference between many "good, could have been great" films.

There's also a world of options to choose from when determining whether one considers a script "good" - is it 'authentic' (very few films sound realistic, if we're honest), or 'flowing' (snappy, but simple conversations between good actors transcend the often-mundane scripts - many screwball comedies and gangster films, for example), or 'memorable' (eminently quotable films like MPHG or a dozen other comedies don't have objectively "good" scripts, but the lines and their memorableness elevate the whole) or just 'well written' (technically? Plotwise? By a Good Writer/Author? ..other..)? There are no real objective criteria for judging a script, except maybe the questionable and debated awards shows.

Just as good scripts can rescue mediocre films, so good 'other elements' can allow a film to work and be watchable despite the dialogue. Sometimes. :)


Originally Posted by inri222 (Post 12645741)
With a good script, a good director can produce a masterpiece. With the same script, a mediocre director can produce a passable film. But with a bad script even a good director can't possibly make a good film. - Akira Kurosawa

Hmm........

Brack 11-18-15 08:51 AM

Re: bad scripts, good movies
 
If that's the case, almost all Ridley Scott films (that end up good anyway).

hasslein 11-18-15 12:43 PM

Re: bad scripts, good movies
 
I didn't think it possible, but then thought, PHASE IV maybe?

Matthew Chmiel 11-18-15 01:31 PM

Re: bad scripts, good movies
 

Originally Posted by Chet Desmond (Post 10749683)
Suspiria and Inferno get by on style. Mother of Tears had an equally silly script, but not much style and it didn't fare nearly as well.

I would argue most of Argento's filmography (at least from the '70s and '80s) fit this mold; complete style over substance that legitimately works. During that era, Argento's cinematography and editing skills were on point.

Phenomena is completely out there, but it works due to the visuals and sound. I can't say that I will ever enjoy another film about a teenage girl who talks to insects and is accompanied by a knife wielding chimpanzee as they take on a deformed kid and his crazy mother, but there you go.

Norm de Plume 11-18-15 04:47 PM

Re: bad scripts, good movies
 
Yes, an argument can be made that some of Argento's films fit the OP's query. Not all of his films have bad screenplays, but Inferno is an on-point example of a completely nonsensical script being made palatable by memorable visuals.

orangerunner 11-21-15 12:45 PM

Re: bad scripts, good movies
 
I read the script for "Boogie Nights" many years ago and I felt it was a pretty bad script with lots of contrived scenes and false/forced coincidences that were eventually cut from the film.

It's a good example of the actors, director (who was also the writer) and editors making a great film from having very little to work with script-wise.

auto 11-21-15 01:31 PM

Re: bad scripts, good movies
 
Good is not the same as entertaining or enjoyable.

Traxan 11-21-15 04:52 PM

Re: bad scripts, good movies
 
I would have thought Star Wars would own this thread.

Solid Snake 11-21-15 05:43 PM

Re: bad scripts, good movies
 
Never read the scripts. How difffernt were they from the end result? At least for SW and ESB..

orangerunner 11-21-15 06:37 PM

Re: bad scripts, good movies
 

Originally Posted by Solid Snake (Post 12650920)
Never read the scripts. How difffernt were they from the end result? At least for SW and ESB..

It's interesting when you read a script before ever seeing the finished film.

With reading the script first, you have no point of reference and no pre-conception of tone, visuals, sounds and what the actors bring to the material.


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