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X-Men: First Class (Vaughn, 2011)

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X-Men: First Class (Vaughn, 2011)

Old 09-22-13, 03:01 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class question (spoiler)

Originally Posted by Traxan
I wish they hadn't a) put Charles in the wheelchair so fast. It kind conflicts with X3, but then again, who wants to acknowledge that Ratner hairball?
First Class presents several other continuity problems as well.

One that has always bothered me is that the original movie said that Xavier and Magneto built Cerebro, and Magneto built his helmet to counteract it. First Class said that Beast built Cerebro, and Magneto stole the helmet from Sebastian Shaw.

Also Wolverine has that cameo in First Class where Xavier and Magneto tried to recruit him and he told them to fuck off, but they don't seem to remember each other in X1.

I guess continuity problems is just keeping it accurate to the comic books though since the X-Men are easily the biggest convoluted mess in all of modern comics.
Old 09-22-13, 03:08 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class question (spoiler)

Originally Posted by taffer
First Class presents several other continuity problems as well.

One that has always bothered me is that the original movie said that Xavier and Magneto built Cerebro, and Magneto built his helmet to counteract it. First Class said that Beast built Cerebro, and Magneto stole the helmet from Sebastian Shaw.

Also Wolverine has that cameo in First Class where Xavier and Magneto tried to recruit him and he told them to fuck off, but they don't seem to remember each other in X1.

I guess continuity problems is just keeping it accurate to the comic books though since the X-Men are easily the biggest convoluted mess in all of modern comics.
Wolverine wouldn't remember their encounter in First Class because of the adamantium bullet to the skull that erased his memory in Origins.

Of course, in The Wolverine he remembers WWii with no problem. So even more contradictions.

Since X-Men starts with the opening words of the MST3K theme song, I just repeat to myself they're movies and I should really just relax.
Old 09-22-13, 03:37 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class question (spoiler)

Originally Posted by taffer
First Class presents several other continuity problems as well.

One that has always bothered me is that the original movie said that Xavier and Magneto built Cerebro, and Magneto built his helmet to counteract it. First Class said that Beast built Cerebro, and Magneto stole the helmet from Sebastian Shaw.

Also Wolverine has that cameo in First Class where Xavier and Magneto tried to recruit him and he told them to fuck off, but they don't seem to remember each other in X1.

I guess continuity problems is just keeping it accurate to the comic books though since the X-Men are easily the biggest convoluted mess in all of modern comics.


Well, to be fair, Logan does get that glimmer of "where do I know these guys from" type of look. It's like the first X-Men movie where Wolverine and Sabertooth didn't know each but Sabertooth had that same I know this guy look.
Old 09-22-13, 04:00 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class question (spoiler)

Originally Posted by Traxan
Well if you want to keep debating it, FX is airing it again twice today (Sunday) at 8 et/5pt and again at 2 et/11 pt
FX seems to play the same movies a lot. X-Men Origins: Wolverine seems to be one they like to show often.

Originally Posted by taffer
First Class presents several other continuity problems as well.

One that has always bothered me is that the original movie said that Xavier and Magneto built Cerebro, and Magneto built his helmet to counteract it. First Class said that Beast built Cerebro, and Magneto stole the helmet from Sebastian Shaw.

Also Wolverine has that cameo in First Class where Xavier and Magneto tried to recruit him and he told them to fuck off, but they don't seem to remember each other in X1.

I guess continuity problems is just keeping it accurate to the comic books though since the X-Men are easily the biggest convoluted mess in all of modern comics.
I might be in the minority on this but in some ways I was sort of hoping that First Class would act as a reboot of sorts for the X-Men series. I wasn't that into the other films even though some of the casting (Jackman, McKellen, and Stewart) was absolutely great I just thought the series could have been better and a lot of the main characters such as Cyclops were badly mishandled in the first three X-Men films. I think it could have been well achieved by going back and making a couple more films with the First Class mutants and eventually leading into a more modern X-Men team.
Old 09-22-13, 04:06 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class question (spoiler)

I forgot about Sabertooth. Sabertooth in Origins seems like a completely different character.

In X1, Sabertooth seemed more like a feral beast who could barely talk. I think he only had maybe two lines. The rest of the time he was just grunting and/or growling.

In Origins, he was more of an actual human capable of actual speech.

Also, wasn't Emma Frost shown in Origins as a teenager? I remember one of the prisoners had diamond skin, but I don't know if she was intended to be Emma Frost or not. That contradicts First Class where she was an adult in the 60s.
Old 09-22-13, 04:36 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class question (spoiler)

Originally Posted by taffer
I forgot about Sabertooth. Sabertooth in Origins seems like a completely different character.

In X1, Sabertooth seemed more like a feral beast who could barely talk. I think he only had maybe two lines. The rest of the time he was just grunting and/or growling.

In Origins, he was more of an actual human capable of actual speech.

Also, wasn't Emma Frost shown in Origins as a teenager? I remember one of the prisoners had diamond skin, but I don't know if she was intended to be Emma Frost or not. That contradicts First Class where she was an adult in the 60s.
I figured at the end of Origins that Wolverine would end up giving Sabertooth a claw through the head and erase a lot of his humanity, putting him on the road to what we saw in X-Men. But no.

They showed a girl named Emma who had the same powers as Emma Frost. So maybe that was just retconned into a coincidence. Weak, but some things in these movies you just have to ignore.
Old 09-22-13, 06:11 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class question (spoiler)

It's funny that Liev Schreiber once mentioned how different his Sabretooth was from Tyler Mane's and that he would like to see one of the movies explore how that came about.

Maybe Victor just took to living in the woods like Logan did in The Wolverine but actually went full wild man by the time Magneto found him.

As for Charles and Erik having met Wolverine before, in X2 Erik flat out states that Charles knows everything about Logan's past and that Charles has simply chosen not to tell Logan the truth. This is in the scene where the plastic prison is gassed and Charles taken hostage.
Old 09-22-13, 06:30 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class question (spoiler)

Originally Posted by Mike86
I don't really get the complaint about the First Class. They were more of a backdrop to the main story arcs of Charles and Erik.
Uh, that's the point? Why call it First Class when it really had nothing to do with the first batch of mutants?

Originally Posted by Traxan
I wish they hadn't a) put Charles in the wheelchair so fast. It kind conflicts with X3, but then again, who wants to acknowledge that Ratner hairball? and b) split the two up after one movie, when McAvoy and Fassbender clearly had chemistry.
That's my problem with the movie. The movie was smooth sailing until the end. You have great younger versions of the X-men with killer chemistry, and ambiguous motivations. You didn't have the black and white, good vs. evil in this flick and it benefitted from it.

Then they went all Last Crusade on us and gave every character trait and motivation they are known for to multiple characters in a two minute span. Let's draw a line in the sand of good vs. evil! Erik was in the gray area? NOW HE'S EVIL! Look a hat! Oh, Mystique was all about the young charismatic Xavier and Fassbender gives her a wink and now she's evil! X hasn't been in a wheelchair yet in this movie, what?... boom! Done.

For all the praise First Class gets, the final 5 minutes deserve more vitriol for the X3 level of idiocy on display. I wouldn't say it ruins the movie, but it definitely taints the overall film. It also ruined any potential for an interesting sequel because they took the 40 years between FC and X1 and erased it by forcing the characters into their eventual incarnations too soon.
Old 09-22-13, 06:50 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class question (spoiler)

Originally Posted by Michael Corvin
Uh, that's the point? Why call it First Class when it really had nothing to do with the first batch of mutants?
It may not have been the best title in the world but it still suited the film. The focus was more on the relationship between Charles and Erik and also their gathering of the mutants to form the First Class so it made sense to me. Plus it's not like the mutants weren't featured at all they were just more a secondary story.
Old 09-23-13, 02:00 AM
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Re: X-Men: First Class question (spoiler)

Originally Posted by Michael Corvin

For all the praise First Class gets, the final 5 minutes deserve more vitriol for the X3 level of idiocy on display.
Uh I dunno about that. I mean, after all the mayhem Magneto causes, and he's sitting free in a park to play chess??

Does anyone else find the Charles/Raven relationship to be just a bit too close for a brother and sister?
Old 09-23-13, 05:53 AM
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Re: X-Men: First Class question (spoiler)

Originally Posted by Traxan
Does anyone else find the Charles/Raven relationship to be just a bit too close for a brother and sister?
Um, you do realize they're not really related, right?
Old 09-23-13, 11:51 AM
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Re: X-Men: First Class question (spoiler)

Nope. I could have sworn I heard Charles introduce her as his sister.
Old 09-23-13, 11:53 AM
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Re: X-Men: First Class question (spoiler)

Originally Posted by Traxan
Nope. I could have sworn I heard Charles introduce her as his sister.
He did, but she's not. He introduced her as his sister to the girl he was trying to hit on. To me, it came of like Charles thought of her like a sister, but Raven was interested in being more than that.
Old 09-23-13, 12:00 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class question (spoiler)

Originally Posted by Obi-Wan Jabroni
He did, but she's not. He introduced her as his sister to the girl he was trying to hit on. To me, it came of like Charles thought of her like a sister, but Raven was interested in being more than that.
Ditto.
Old 09-24-13, 07:03 AM
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Re: X-Men: First Class question (spoiler)

This scens is straight forward if you ask me. The room is not designed to keep telepaths out, being a nuclear reactor it is designed to keep radiation in. Otherwise why would Shaw enter the room wearing the helmet in the first place? Remember Shaw opens the door to let Erik in and yet Charles still cannot get control of Shaws mind....not until the helmet is removed. Plus the damage done to the room in the struggle creates an opening in the foundations of the room that allows Xavier to finally connect with Erik in the room, and once Shaws helmet is removed to be able to control Shaw.

Once the helmet gets removed and Erik puts it on Xavier controls Shaw, but Shaw is so powerful that he has to struggle to retain control of him. Hence his line to Rose that he needs to concentrate in order to maintain control. When Xavier sees what Erik is going to do he has two choices. He can let Erik kill Shaw or he can release Shaw. He realizes that Shaw is so dangerous that they may never get an opportunity to stop him again and so he chooses the lesser of two evils. Probably hoping that Erik will not continue down a path towards evil.

With regards to the discussion of the movies as a whole, i think First Class is without a doubt the best of the series. The first two X-men movies were pretty good, but Singer really has a hard time doing good fight sequences. The White House take down being an exception. I liked The Wolverine, but Origins was dreadful. The only two good things about that were the opening through time montage and Liev Schreiber as Sabretooth who was perfectly cast. For me it comes down to:

1. First Class
2. X2
3. The Wolverine
4. X-men

After that the remaining each have maybe moments or aspects, but are not good.
Old 09-24-13, 08:17 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class question (spoiler)

Originally Posted by Obi-Wan Jabroni
He did, but she's not. He introduced her as his sister to the girl he was trying to hit on. To me, it came of like Charles thought of her like a sister, but Raven was interested in being more than that.
Just watched the movie again the other night and it's amazing how something as straight forward as this exchange can get misunderstood.
Old 09-24-13, 08:35 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class question (spoiler)

Originally Posted by Michael Corvin
Just watched the movie again the other night and it's amazing how something as straight forward as this exchange can get misunderstood.
Pervs.
Old 09-24-13, 10:21 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class question (spoiler)

Originally Posted by Michael Corvin
Just watched the movie again the other night and it's amazing how something as straight forward as this exchange can get misunderstood.
You'd also have to forget about the scene where Mystique is first introduced as a homeless child pretending to be Charles' mother while she was stealing food from the kitchen.
Old 03-07-14, 12:47 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class (Vaughn, 2011)

I've rewatched this a few times on FX now, and something's stuck out at me: why does the adult Eric Lensher, a German, speak with a British accent and slang? ("More tea, vicar?")
Old 03-07-14, 12:53 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class (Vaughn, 2011)

Wolverine's time travelling in "Days of Future Past" resulted in some minor side-effects. Luckily, the effects were limited to changes in paralysis, accents and tuna sandwiches.
Old 03-07-14, 12:58 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class (Vaughn, 2011)

Originally Posted by Lord Zarak
Wolverine's time travelling in "Days of Future Past" resulted in some minor side-effects. Luckily, the effects were limited to changes in paralysis, accents and tuna sandwiches.
Old 03-07-14, 01:13 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class (Vaughn, 2011)

What's tuna?
Old 03-07-14, 01:49 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class (Vaughn, 2011)

Originally Posted by Meglos
What's tuna?
It's a large, saltwater finfish in the mackeral family. But that's not important right now.
Old 03-07-14, 01:57 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class (Vaughn, 2011)

If not tuna... Well what the fuck is important?
Old 03-07-14, 01:59 PM
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Re: X-Men: First Class (Vaughn, 2011)

It's not a tuna!

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