Eplicon

ROTS came the closest to the tone and feel of the classic trilogy. But Lucas failed on so many levels in telling Anakin's back story. He was made so unlikeable from the get-go that he was nothing like the tragic figure that I had expected from what little was known of him at the end of ROTJ. He was a pipsquirt in TPM and an annoying mama's boy in AOTC. It took too long to set up the brotherhood/friendship thing between him and Obi-Wan.

Besides the poor dialog, Lucas spent way too much time tying both trilogies together (e.g., similar situations and dialog), much to the detriment of pushing the story forward. He over-explained things that didn't need to be explored that deeply.

ukywyldcat

I hated the prequels. Hated.

And those movies have pretty much made me hate the entire franchise.

milo bloom

As I've noted in the other current Star Wars thread, the animated Clone Wars on Cartoon Network is the saving grace of the PT in my book. It gave us what we wanted: the frakkin Clone Wars!!



I think you contradict yourself there (not an attack, hear me out): I think people were wanting A. The Clone Wars, B. Anakain going bat-shit.

We got a smidge of A and a smidge of B. The twist of the clones defending the Republic (at first...) was brilliant, one of the few really interesting bits of screenwriting in my opinion.


My timeline for the PT would have been to have the highpoints of The Phantom Menace take up the first 45-60 minutes of Episode one, then start the Clone Wars, have Ep2 be a really pivotal battle of the CW while laying the groundwork of Anakin's fall, then Ep 3 start to wind down the CW, and crank up Anakin's fall.



There were a lot of things to enjoy about the PT, and honestly, TPM is the most fun to re-watch. I'm looking forward to the new Clone Wars series, and the new live-action series to really fill out the universe, the films were just the framework.

Hulkabrgr

Not taken as an attack at all- it's all good.
I just meant that people had their own set idea about what the prequels were going to be. Waiting sixteen years, and building things up in your mind during that time, can only lead to dissapointment at the end result. I was just using the clone wars as an example.

All I ever expected from the Prequels was to see Palpatine take power, and Anakin's fall. Anakin's turn might have been done too quickly(the novelization explained his choice in Palpatine's office much better), but I loved everything about Palpatine's rise to power in all 3 films. Overall, I would take any of the prequels over Jedi (Jedi had great moments, but way too inconsistent).

EdTheRipper

I didn't mind them so much.

zekeburger1979

I liked them. I thought each one improved on the previous one.

My ex-roommate on the other hand, loves all 3 of them. He has each one as the #1 movie of 1999, 2002 and 2005. My other friends and I tell him he's smoking crack, but he won't hear of it.

chanster

I don't like any of them, actually. And I think they demystify the OT, which for me, was always the "cool" part of it. Ben's speech in ANH and ROTJ told us all we needed to know..and left it open for imagination which I thought was the point of movies like Star Wars.

Plus is there anything more ridicoulous than Padme dying at the end of ROTS? Honestly, it doesn't jive with the ROTJ and, most imporantly, how could a mother who just gave birth to her children die of a broken heart? Seriously.

riley_dude

No. You and about 10 other people did.

Simpson Purist

Episode I pretty much stunk (aside from the 3-way duel at the end). Episode II has some great set pieces that are almost on par with the original trilogy, though the romantic plot is just blech. Episode III has the best dramatic scenes of the prequels (the Order 66 and finale scenes are as emotional as the prequels get), despite having kind-of a weak final duel.

coli

As for the PT, there are some people I know who hate it, I have yet to meet a person who loves it, and most people I know like myself think it is OK, as it has some great parts, but in the same vein has some bad parts in each movie too which really bring them down. But in the end, it is SW, and there is something about a GFFA that keeps you interested. The majority of friends I know agree with me, ANH & ESB are the great SW movies, ROTS & ROTJ are the good SW movies, AOTC & TPM have their moments but are severely hampered by Jar Jar, Jake Lloyd, and the AOTC Romance.

The problem as to why the PT will never be loved is three-fold:

1. You don't have those loveable iconic characters from the OT: Luke, Leia, and Han, as the ultimate guys to root for. Chewy, Lando, Yoda, and Kenobi who are great secondary characters to like. And Darth Vader & The Emperor as some of the coolest bad guys in movie history. What does the PT have? Anakin is whiney and unlikeable, Kenobi is liked, but doesn't have any screentime in TPM. Padme turns out to be barefoot and pregnant and gives up on her kids? Palpatine is really good, but really doesn't get solid screentime til ROTS, so you have alot of secondary characters playing the role of main characters, and that is hard for an audience to relate to. I actually really enjoy the PT story overall, but if you can't invest in any of the characters, the movies come off very hollow.

2. The OT movies were pure B-serial movies, as they had that combo of action/special effects/mythology/humor and a bit of drama to give them legitimacy in the genre. To me they were the ultimate guilty pleasure movies with alittle substance, and you could watch them over and over. The PT is a B-serial movie trying to be a drama like Schindlers List and the two dont' mix. You can't have all this cheesy dialogue, and average acting from actors like Christenson & Portman, and then expect the dramatic scenes to be dramatic! The audience can't go from one to another, you either have cheese or drama, but not both. The PT is ultimately a tragedy, and that has to be more adult then having Jar Jar hopping around like the Three Stooges for 2 hours, and that is why the movies come off very uneven.

3. The OT had more collaboration and the PT Lucas wrote and directed the whole thing, and I believe Lucas was in his prime in the late 70's/early 80's as he had the hunger to make a great movie, rather then being a CEO now. I would ask anyone, who would you want making a Sci-Fi movie, a guy in his late 20's who just got married and has no kids and knows whats cool, or a guy in his 50's with 3 kids who is kinda out of touch?

Drop

I love them, really. Not as much as the originals, but pretty damn close. Of course there are numerous faults with them, some that can take me out of the films, but they are great fun and just as far as stories go, they are very well thought up. I'll always admire that Lucas didn't just rehash the original trilogy. To keep plots fresh over six films is rarely ever done (especially when it's a film original idea).

As much as I didn't like Jar Jar, I'm still a bit angry Lucas really sweeped him to the sides in the second two films. I can just feel the regret he had, and that uncertainty somewhat kills the flow of the trilogy.

Still love them, and I am sure someday I'll have watched them just as much as the originals.

Drop

Are you forgetting these films are fairytales and moral stories in concept? Don't apply real life logic to these. Padme's death was more of symbolic thing than anything else.

coli

It's not the fact of how she died that gets people goat, it is that it doesn't jive with ROTJ. If Leia said to Luke in ROTJ(1983), I don't remember my mom either, and then Padme died at childbirth, then anyone really wouldn't have a problem other then that Padme is a quitter, but she was in love with Charles Mansion to begin with, so I wouldn't be too hard on her for checking out early!

Michael Corvin

Pretty much my feeling. So much was said and understated when Ben described Anakin to Luke in his hut on Tattooine(brotherhood, great fighter pilot, etc.). None of that came through in the PT or until the very end. He was an annoying kid, and then a whiny teen then an obnoxious teen. So it seems less tragic fall from grace when you've been a bitch from the get go.

starman9000

You like me!

cruzness

I enjoyed all of the PT even though there are some obvious shortcomings. Lucas' writing of dialogue was awkward in all three movies and some of the actors reactions to invisible props were just silly looking. Even though I liked Hayden and Natalie in their roles, the chemistry between them was horrible ( I attribute this to Lucas' dialogue and being a bad romantic director - all who had worked with him say his directions from behind the camera were always " faster and more intense".) Other than that I loved the series - cmon its f'in Star Wars.

Brian Shannon

No you are not alone. I like all the Star Wars movies.

cactusoly

If you figure that those who lurk on the internet and post on message boards are the only ones who have opinions then yes they are about the most hated movies of all time. If you look at the general population that does not care about what is on the internet, the films are quite popular.

Lastyear

Never liked a Star Wars movie since Lucas introduced the Ewoks and brought the whole franchise down to saturday morning kid's show level with a huge budget.

PixyJunket

You are my new favorite poster.

Anubis2005X

100% QFT.

EDIT: Honestly, I didn't care for the first two very much, but I really did enjoy ROTS. If that were split into two movies, and a couple of parts were touched up a bit (cut that awful NOOOOOO crap out), the PT would've been a lot stronger IMHO.

chanster

Well I would dispute they are fairy tales. But even fairy tales have internal logic, and logic drawn from other sources.

The natural logic of our society (heck any society, including animals) is for the mother to do all she can to protect her young. That does not mean a woman who just gave birth would die of a "broken heart"

Maybe some women can comment here, but I would guess it would be offensive to many woman, that Padme would just keel over and die because her husband turned out to be a genocidial maniac, although at that point, she thought he was dead, so it doesn't make sense to know that he has become a bad dude.

Especially since Padme was shown in the 1 + 2 movies as a strong, independent woman..the logic of having her die, with newborns because her husband did some bad things is ridicoulous.

Brack

So we're supposed to rely on the word of some OB droid that that is what Padme was doing, losing the will to live? I don't buy it. Anakin killed her. And even it is true that she lost the will to live, maybe Padme knew her children would survive better knowing that Anakin knows that she died, along with her children, as a way of protecting them.

Michael Corvin

Exactly. Wasn't she a thread away from dying anyway? Anakin killed her, plain and simple.

chanster

According to the online script, the medical droid says:

If there was a medical reason, it seems logical that a medical droid could figure out the reason. So yeah its word is the final word on why Padme died...just continuing bad dialogue exposition from the PT.

Furthermore, doesn't Obi-Wan check on Padme before the duel, I assumed that if she was dying, Obi-Wan would have said you killed her, congratulations.