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CLERKS vs THE BROTHERS McMULLEN - which is the better debut film?

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CLERKS vs THE BROTHERS McMULLEN - which is the better debut film?

Old 12-01-07, 02:25 PM
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CLERKS vs THE BROTHERS McMULLEN - which is the better debut film?

Clerks by writer/actor/directorKevin Smith was released in 1994.

The Brothers McMullen by writer/actor/director Edward Burns was released in 1995.

Both were filmed on a shoestring budget; both were "independent films;" both were written and directed by amateur, first-timers.

The only difference I can see is that Kevin Smith has more of a cult following than Edward Burns, even though Edward Burns emerged as a higher-paid actor (to be fair, Kevin Smith never projected himself as "actor" - he was more into writing and directing).

Which film will be remembered as "best?"
Old 12-01-07, 02:55 PM
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Um, Clerks by far. The Brothers McMullen had a little indie hype when it came out, but it has not passed into the cultural consciousness in any significant way. Plus it turned out Edward Burns wasn't really able to keep up with the writing and the directing, although I do like him as an actor.
Old 12-01-07, 03:06 PM
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no contest!

Old 12-01-07, 05:48 PM
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I gotta go against the grain. I like Clerks and think itís a cute little movie. I also understand the cult following and slavish devotion that Smith has.

That said, taken independently from the hype and judged solely on directorial merit and writing ability, The Brothers McMullen is a better over all film.
Old 12-01-07, 05:57 PM
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I agree with Dave. If I didn't know better I wouldn't even have thought The Brothers McMullen was a directorial debut. Clerks on the other hand has "film school" written all over it.

The only reason Clerks has such a large following is that it's audience has worked in such fields and can relate to the material.
Old 12-01-07, 06:03 PM
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Old 12-01-07, 06:42 PM
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I'm going to go against the grain here, too. Brothers was a far better flim. His "sequels" (i.e., follow-ups) weren't horrible, he just kept typcasting himself, of all people. He keeps playing the same character.
Old 12-01-07, 10:59 PM
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Clerks by a country mile.
Old 12-01-07, 11:48 PM
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Originally Posted by DeputyDave
I gotta go against the grain. I like Clerks and think itís a cute little movie. I also understand the cult following and slavish devotion that Smith has.

That said, taken independently from the hype and judged solely on directorial merit and writing ability, The Brothers McMullen is a better over all film.
Brothers McMullen held a lot more emotional weight which makes me choose it over Clerks.
Old 12-02-07, 02:44 AM
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Originally Posted by DeputyDave
That said, taken independently from the hype and judged solely on directorial merit and writing ability, The Brothers McMullen is a better over all film.
Definitely. Clerks looks like something a couple of doofuses filmed for laughs and stuck on public access television. The direction, writing, and cinematography are poor. The performances are laughably terrible, almost to the Plan 9 from Outer Space level. Everything about it is amateurish, and that's being very very generous.
Old 12-02-07, 08:43 PM
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Clerks. While Clerks was funny, Brothers was somewhat annoying.
Old 12-03-07, 09:07 AM
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The Brothers....Who?
Old 12-03-07, 09:23 AM
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The Brothers McMullen
Old 12-03-07, 10:18 AM
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I would rate them equally. I consider both to be minor masterpieces and have watched everything they have made since.

I enjoyed "The Groomsmen" and "Looking for Kitty" and wish they would have found some kind of audience.

One thing for Burns, he hasn't made a movie as bad as "Jersey Girl."

Last edited by pjflyer; 12-03-07 at 12:52 PM.
Old 12-03-07, 11:57 AM
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Clerks.
Old 12-03-07, 12:01 PM
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I'm a fan of Kevin Smith and have seen all the movies and enjoyed them. I've only watched Clerks twice whereas I've probably watched The Brothers McMullen 7 or 8 times.

The Brothers McMullen is a much better film.
Old 12-03-07, 01:41 PM
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Originally Posted by pjflyer
One thing for Burns, he hasn't made a movie as bad as "Jersey Girl."
Have you seen the one with Bon Jovi?
Old 12-03-07, 01:59 PM
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Originally Posted by PopcornTreeCt
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Old 12-03-07, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by pjflyer
I would rate them equally. I consider both to be minor masterpieces and have watched everything they have made since.

I enjoyed "The Groomsmen" and "Looking for Kitty" and wish they would have found some kind of audience.
Yeah, I really enjoyed "The Groomsmen" and have "Kitty" in my to-watch pile.

I love both "Clerks" and "Brothers" but would have to pick "Brothers" as the better film.
Old 12-03-07, 03:26 PM
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Clerks.
Old 12-03-07, 04:56 PM
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Originally Posted by GoldenJCJ
The only reason Clerks has such a large following is that it's audience has worked in such fields and can relate to the material.
i don't think that is entirely accurate. i have never worked in the field and was blown away by "Clerks" the first time i saw it. simply because the writing is stellar and the crisp banter back and forth was something i have never seen before or even liked before enjoying this one immensely. it isn't about the acting in anyway shape or form, it is simply about the dialogue and interactions of everyday people in everyday situations, slightly exaggerated that is.
Old 12-03-07, 06:40 PM
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Originally Posted by DonnachaOne
Have you seen the one with Bon Jovi?
I have. I don't love it, but I think it is a fine movie. It is a bit depressing, but it did seem to have characters and situations that exist in real life.

For my money, the worst Burns film was "Ash Wednesday"
Old 12-04-07, 02:50 AM
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The Brothers McMullen
Old 12-04-07, 09:39 AM
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Obviously, in terms of the collective conciousness, ''Clerks'' is far more recognisable, but as an overall experience, and in a ''i'm the teacher, and I have to grade it'' sort of way, Brothers McMullen is a better overall film - better script, better actors, better pretty much everything.

But, in fairness, it's like comparing Porky's to Terms Of Endearment.
Old 12-04-07, 10:07 AM
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Porky's

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