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Originally Posted by Jacobsen
The church is boycotting the film not because of its content, which is presumably irrelevant at this point, but because the film serves as a "hook", a kids' adventure story to get children interested in reading the books which, as it has been pointed out, amplify their atheistic intent the further into the series.
This isn't an example of Catholic bigotry jumping all over an offensive message, and certainly not the ridiculously reductive notion of judging a film's content before its release, which is calling the kettle black around here. This is a subterfuge by the author of the books to lure children into an atheistic mode of thinking by purely superficial means. If you care to think of a magical film or book from your childhood with such an idea superimposed, would you have rejected it based on its ideology? I would think not, nonetheless; word travels fast amongst children these days and its doubtful that the intent of the author would go 'under their radar'-- if kids like something they'll support it, ideology and all. So the only intolerance of beliefs comes from the author, not the catholic church, and not the film, or at least its too early to tell. The boycott at least makes this known to parents so that how they raise their children won't be undercut by a deceptive novelist. Nevertheless, the ignorance and blasé attitudes of this forum never fail to impress me. |
Originally Posted by Duality
Honey, I hope you are not referring to me. :) Seriously, first we had a boycott of Disney (didn't work), Harry Potter (same) and now this. As I said earlier, these boycotts only serve as publicity. We know what Hollywood believes about publicity...
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Originally Posted by Draven
You seem to be saying there is something wrong with writing a children's book with an atheistic "message". Would you say it's wrong to write a children's book a with Christianity, Muslim or Buddhist "message" as well?
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Draven:
Already the misunderstandings begin. C.S. Lewis wasn't deceptive in his use of Christian symbolism, they were open texts. Nor am I aware that he used any clever, misleading ploys to get children to read his books. You don't create a fantasy world in a movie, and then string them onto the books saying 'hey lets look at this other aspect'-- which brings me to my response to Finkpish: As I said in the original post, where both of these replies are already written-- is that unless a kid lives in isolation, they will most likely come to know, either by the internet, or their friends with internet, that the message is to not believe in God. Therefore the issue at hand is the unethical means and not the content. |
Originally Posted by Jacobsen
Draven:
Already the misunderstandings begin. C.S. Lewis wasn't deceptive in his use of Christian symbolism, they were open texts. Nor am I aware that he used any clever, misleading ploys to get children to read his books. You don't create a fantasy world in a movie, and then string them onto the books saying 'hey lets look at this other aspect'-- which brings me to my response to |
Originally Posted by Jacobsen
Finkpish:
As I said in the original post, where both of these replies are already written-- is that unless a kid lives in isolation, they will most likely comes to know, either by the internet, or their friends with internet, that the message is to not believe in God. Therefore the issue at hand is the unethical means and not the content. |
Originally Posted by Draven
I've read all three books and he is very clear about his message in his writing. It would be like C.S. Lewis naming Aslan "Jesus".
Originally Posted by FinkPish
I haven't read the books, so I can't comment on the "unethical means" you are talking about. Can you explain, since you seem to know?
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So you think the author made the producers and studio make his film so he could spread his atheistic dogma around, cleverly disguised as a kid's movie? It wasn't because the books were popular and award-winning and all that?
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Originally Posted by Jacobsen
C.S. Lewis didn't use a movie as a marketing gimmick. Even the movie made many years after his death doesn't cover up where its influence is, which The Golden Compass apparently does since it has been deemed so far as non-offensive.
If anything, "His Dark Materials" is much more obvious with its message. So I'm not sure why you think they are being so sneaky about it. |
Originally Posted by Draven
You seem to be saying there is something wrong with writing a children's book with an atheistic "message". Would you say it's wrong to write a children's book a with Christianity, Muslim or Buddhist "message" as well?
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Originally Posted by Draven
You seem to be saying there is something wrong with writing a children's book with an atheistic "message". Would you say it's wrong to write a children's book a with Christianity, Muslim or Buddhist "message" as well?
It is certainly Pullman's right to sell his dogma however he sees fit, within the bounds of the law. But it is also my right to object to it, since what he is preaching goes against my personal moral code (which a book with Christian, Judaic, Muslim or even Buddhist messages would not). So, while I would do nothing to force the removal of Pullman's books from store or library shelves or his film from theater screens, I would do everything in my power to ensure that every parent is fully informed of his intentions and tactics, and I would encourage parents to eschew his works, recognizing them for what they are. |
Originally Posted by Jacobsen
You don't create a fantasy world in a movie, and then string them onto the books saying 'hey lets look at this other aspect'-
Whatever. I'd much rather kids get the message of questioning dogmatic authority, than the creepy anti-woman/pro death messages of Narnia. |
Religion (or lack thereof) aside, this movie looks nowhere near as good as Narnia was.
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What? Wow, I find some of the posters in this thread to have some strange views. I would imagine they are the same ones who accuse J.K.Rowling of trying to turn their kids into pagans as well?
Have those that accused Pullman of trying to do such even read the books, much less seen the movies? I've read the books and have to say they are much less harsh on those with opposing viewpoints than C.S. Lewis' ever was. The fact that one character in C.S. Lewis books, clearly a Muslim, wasn't allowed into heaven until he believed in the "One true God" (all the rest were damned) said pretty much everything. |
Originally Posted by Brack
I support anything that kills God.
The trailer looked dumb but I might go see this now. |
Originally Posted by PopcornTreeCt
Religion (or lack thereof) aside, this movie looks nowhere near as good as Narnia was.
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This reminds me of this that I also read today on IMDB.
Dallas Mavericks owner Mark Cuban, who also heads the film company 2929 Entertainment and the TV channel HDNet and writes a regular blog, has called Fox News's Bill O'Reilly "my new best friend." Speaking at the Blog World Expo in Las Vegas Friday, Cuban acknowledged that his upcoming movie Redacted, directed by Brian De Palma, about how comments by some American soldiers fighting in Iraq have been censored by the military, had received little attention until O'Reilly began attacking it. As a result, he said, his "small film" has "grown bigger and bigger by the day. So I'm very grateful to him." He added, however, "At the same time, there is every bit of me that just wants to say, 'Bill O'Reilly is a moron.'" |
Originally Posted by Brack
I don't know, Narnia wasn't that wonderful.
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I have read LOTR, Narnia and Lewis' Space Trilogy as well, Harry Potter and His Dark Materials. I liked them all and their various religious or nonreligious points of view had little to do with it. I don't think any of the authors were trying to be deceptive.
The Golden Compass has been my most looking forward to movie for the holiday season since I learned of it. I just hope they don't screw up an excellent book. |
I really wish people didn't get their panties up in a bunch whenever something that they didn't agree with came about, yet they drag a whole label of people down with them. I personally haven't read the books, and from what everyone's said is it's a very over-exaggerated remark about "killing God".
I could understand a boycott if it was outright bashing everything about Christianity, but from what it appears its not, and its very subtle if it is. One thing athiests and other religions need to understand is it's not just Christians (or people who call themselves that, half the time they don't even know the history behind what they believe) that force their religion on people. I've had plenty of athiests try to bash me about what I believe, yet I've never tried to be forceful about my beliefs. Ugh.. anyway Boycotting is dumb |
I won't be seeing this movie mainly because I think that it looks like a crappy film. Trailer did nothing for me.
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I think if you've ever read up on both J.R.R. Tolkien and C.S. Lewis, both have strong beliefs in the Christian faith (Tolkien being a devout Catholic and Lewis "rediscovering" Christianity in the late 1920's and becoming an writer who explained Christianity in many books in the 1930's and 1940's). That's why the works of Tolkien and Lewis are so beloved among devout Christians.
Unfortunately, Philip Pullman's His Dark Materials trilogy is not liked by many Christian groups, who see a lot of his personal anti-Catholicism and atheist views in this trilogy. That's why people are highly skeptical of The Golden Compass movie, despite claims by several people involved in the movie that much of Pullman's atheist views were toned down in the shooting script. |
Originally Posted by RayChuang
I think if you've ever read up on both J.R.R. Tolkien and C.S. Lewis, both have strong beliefs in the Christian faith
Originally Posted by RayChuang
Unfortunately, Philip Pullman's His Dark Materials trilogy is not liked by many Christian groups, who see a lot of his personal anti-Catholicism and atheist views in this trilogy.
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Originally Posted by Draven
You seem to be saying there is something wrong with writing a children's book with an atheistic "message". Would you say it's wrong to write a children's book a with Christianity, Muslim or Buddhist "message" as well?
What I'm wondering is if you are objecting to the fact there is a message at all or if you simply object to the atheism. When I look at it, I see that that's the viewpoint of the book. It's not inherently right or wrong, it's just the viewpoint. It's up to the reader to take it from there. The boycott isn't meant for those who would go see it regardless of the controversy. It's meant for those who would be potentially offended by the message behind the books. What I would object to is if there was a movement to suppress the movie so no one could see it. That goes against the principles behind freedom of speech, and that I won't support. |
Originally Posted by rennervision
So Christian parents shouldn't be informed that a movie marketed to their kids is based on books that go against their beliefs? The boycott isn't meant for those who would go see it regardless of the controversy. It's meant for those who would be potentially offended by the message behind the books.
This movie, The Golden Compass, and starring Nicole Kidman is scheduled to come out December 7th and is being pushed as a Family Friendly film. We must inform everyone we know of the real message behind this movie. It is certainly not a film you want your children to see... It's equating "family friendly" solely with Christianity--the subtext being that all other views (particularly the atheist view) are "family UNfriendly." As I said at the start, this is more annoying than anything else. To me, it's indicative of that peculiar, insular religious fear of exposing children to alternative ideas. |
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