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-   -   The illusionist (merged) (https://forum.dvdtalk.com/movie-talk/473984-illusionist-merged.html)

Peep 09-03-06 09:32 PM


Originally Posted by Caliking
The movie was predictable...But AWESOME! A good movie does not have to be "tricky" or whatever.

A good movie doesn't have to be tricky. My point was that this movie tried to be tricky and failed. And I found it even more insulting that it feltthat it had to recap the entire "trick", because we obviously never saw it coming a mile away.

Geofferson 09-03-06 11:11 PM

I saw this tonight and liked it quite a bit. Ed Norton was the best part (wonderful performance). Very well done period piece with a solid story.

movielib 09-03-06 11:26 PM

This film had the most predictable and telegraphed "twist" since The Lake House but I still found it quite enjoyable. Fine and earnest acting plus unrushed, deliberate and fairly elegant pacing were mostly what saved it. I appreciated the recap at the end even though it had been obvious from the moment, well, if you've seen it you know. It was perhaps not entirely necessary but it did fill in a few details.

I saw no boom mics. It looks like the people who buy the full screen version of the film, though, are going to see them a lot. Serves them right! ;)

DVD Josh 09-03-06 11:34 PM

Saw this tonight, and while it was "okay", it certainly was a let down. I like the way the film was shot, and the effects were great. But to me, Giamatti was the only convincing role. The others just seemed to be phoning it in. And yes, the ending was contrived. The film dragged in places, and Norton's flat performance didn't help advance the story.

I'd give it a B-. Definitely worth a rental, but I have a feeling that The Prestige will be the better "magic" movie this year.

Peep 09-04-06 02:19 AM


Originally Posted by DVD Josh
I'd give it a B-. Definitely worth a rental, but I have a feeling that The Prestige will be the better "magic" movie this year.

I agree. And it didn't help "The Illusionist" that the trailer for "The Prestige" preceded it. "Here's the movie that you're going to wish you saw instead."

Daytripper 09-04-06 08:37 AM


Originally Posted by Peep
I agree. And it didn't help "The Illusionist" that the trailer for "The Prestige" preceded it. "Here's the movie that you're going to wish you saw instead."

I didn't feel that way at all. Instead, it said to me 'Here's a movie you're going to like just as much". And who knows? Maybe it won't be any good. Everyone is foaming at the mouth (myself included) just by the trailer.

toddly6666 09-04-06 09:44 PM

A good and entertaining, yet predictable movie, but....

SPOILER QUESTION:


Did anyone else consider this movie as a symbolic reinvented Jesus Christ story with a happy ending or at least was thinking that the director was trying to throw off the audience to think that it was symbolic of the Jesus Christ story and ignore the obvious predictability starting right at Beil's staged death? Consider these interpretations:
1. Norton and Jesus can be interpreted as excellent magicians or super-powered beings.
2. Norton and Jesus were sons of a carpenter.
3. Norton and Jesus whereabouts were unknown from young teen til about late 30s.
4. Mary was considered by the masses to be a prostitute but she and Jesus were lovers
5. Beil was considered unfaithful by prince and police but she and Norton were lovers
6. Norton and Jesus have distrustful sidekicks only interested in money - the manager and Judas. In the movie though, the manager redeems himself, unlike Judas.
7. Jesus and Norton both act modest, say they aren't special, and have followers that spread the gossip of their powers/magic.
8. Giamatti is like a heroic Pontias Pilate that saves Jesus from getting arrested/killed.

I thought the director was trying to say that if Jesus Christ came back today, he would be considered a magician by the masses.




END SPOILER

DVD Josh 09-04-06 10:03 PM


Originally Posted by toddly6666
A good and entertaining, yet predictable movie, but....

SPOILER QUESTION:


Did anyone else consider this movie as a symbolic reinvented Jesus Christ story with a happy ending or at least was thinking that the director was trying to throw off the audience to think that it was symbolic of the Jesus Christ story and ignore the obvious predictability starting right at Beil's staged death? Consider these interpretations:
1. Norton and Jesus can be interpreted as excellent magicians or super-powered beings.
2. Norton and Jesus were sons of a carpenter.
3. Norton and Jesus whereabouts were unknown from young teen til about late 30s.
4. Mary was considered by the masses to be a prostitute but she and Jesus were lovers
5. Beil was considered unfaithful by prince and police but she and Norton were lovers
6. Norton and Jesus have distrustful sidekicks only interested in money - the manager and Judas. In the movie though, the manager redeems himself, unlike Judas.
7. Jesus and Norton both act modest, say they aren't special, and have followers that spread the gossip of their powers/magic.
8. Giamatti is like a heroic Pontias Pilate that saves Jesus from getting arrested/killed.

I thought the director was trying to say that if Jesus Christ came back today, he would be considered a magician by the masses.




END SPOILER


All things are about Jesus, Homer. Except this.

movielib 09-04-06 10:03 PM


Originally Posted by toddly6666
A good and entertaining, yet predictable movie, but....

SPOILER QUESTION:


Spoiler:
Did anyone else consider this movie as a symbolic reinvented Jesus Christ story with a happy ending or at least was thinking that the director was trying to throw off the audience to think that it was symbolic of the Jesus Christ story and ignore the obvious predictability starting right at Beil's staged death? Consider these interpretations:
1. Norton and Jesus can be interpreted as excellent magicians or super-powered beings.
2. Norton and Jesus were sons of a carpenter.
3. Norton and Jesus whereabouts were unknown from young teen til about late 30s.
4. Mary was considered by the masses to be a prostitute but she and Jesus were lovers
5. Beil was considered unfaithful by prince and police but she and Norton were lovers
6. Norton and Jesus have distrustful sidekicks only interested in money - the manager and Judas. In the movie though, the manager redeems himself, unlike Judas.
7. Jesus and Norton both act modest, say they aren't special, and have followers that spread the gossip of their powers/magic.
8. Giamatti is like a heroic Pontias Pilate that saves Jesus from getting arrested/killed.

I thought the director was trying to say that if Jesus Christ came back today, he would be considered a magician by the masses.

:lol: Congratulations. You must be about ten feet tall now because that was the stretch of the year.

Giantrobo 09-05-06 05:00 AM

I really liked this movie. One thing I really liked was how the Director used the quiet moments during the magic. I mean most modern filmakers feel the need to fill every scene with music instead of letting the actor's performace set the vibe and that sucks.

Here's my comparison, and I know many here will flame me but oh well...bite me. :D

The Illusionist = Deep Impact... A decent film with less flash but overshadowed by another movie(Armageddon) with similar subject matter and more A-list actors.

The Prestige = Armageddon... The 800 lbs. Gorilla with A-list stars/Director, flashier sfx, and possibly more over the top storyline. But still a likeable movie.

Daytripper 09-05-06 06:44 AM


Originally Posted by Giantrobo
I really liked this movie. One thing I really liked was how the Director used the quiet moments during the magic. I mean most modern filmakers feel the need to fill every scene with music instead of letting the actor's performace set the vibe and that sucks.

Here's my comparison, and I know many here will flame me but oh well...bite me. :D

The Illusionist = Deep Impact... A decent film with less flash but overshadowed by another movie(Armageddon) with similar subject matter and more A-list actors.

The Prestige = Armageddon... The 800 lbs. Gorilla with A-list stars/Director, flashier sfx, and possibly more over the top storyline. But still a likeable movie.


Not going to bite you, was thinking along those lines. Although "Antz" and "A Bug's Life" came to mind ;)

Giantrobo 09-05-06 10:09 AM


Originally Posted by Daytripper
Not going to bite you, was thinking along those lines. Although "Antz" and "A Bug's Life" came to mind ;)


Fair enough. I never saw "A Bug's Life" so I couldn't make the comparision. :D

fernsita 09-05-06 10:29 AM

The movie didn't do quite as well as I thought it would at the box office this weekend...makes me think that people were not as impressed with it?!

DVD Josh 09-05-06 10:53 AM


Originally Posted by fernsita
The movie didn't do quite as well as I thought it would at the box office this weekend...makes me think that people were not as impressed with it?!

I don't think it's in wide release yet. I had to go to the local indie theater to see it. Either way though, word of mouth has been warm at best, especially with the big budget Prestige getting pushed heavily.

Ginwen 09-05-06 11:15 AM

I liked it pretty well, although I don't think they needed to explain things quite so much at the end--I may be slow but I'm not a complete idiot.

RichC2 09-05-06 11:20 AM


Originally Posted by fernsita
The movie didn't do quite as well as I thought it would at the box office this weekend...makes me think that people were not as impressed with it?!

Actually it did incredibly well considering the number of theaters it was in. It was the #1 per-theater grossing movie in the top 10.

Daytripper 09-05-06 11:35 AM


Originally Posted by DVD Josh
I don't think it's in wide release yet. I had to go to the local indie theater to see it. Either way though, word of mouth has been warm at best, especially with the big budget Prestige getting pushed heavily.


Word of mouth has been great. From boxofficemojo:

Labor Day weekend's most impressive gross, though, ranked fifth. Proving to be a late summer sleeper, The Illusionist summoned an estimated $8 million at 971 venues over the extended weekend, its first nationwide. Like Little Miss Sunshine, the $16 million period drama has maintained a high per theater average with each expansion, suggesting broad appeal and strong word-of-mouth, and, with a $12.1 million gross in 17 days, it has already exceeded the rosiest of expectations prior to opening.

fernsita 09-05-06 11:55 AM


Originally Posted by DVD Josh
I don't think it's in wide release yet. I had to go to the local indie theater to see it. Either way though, word of mouth has been warm at best, especially with the big budget Prestige getting pushed heavily.

Ohh...I thought this weekend was the wide release since they had mentioned it in the BO numbers, which I thought they only did with wide releases. But this would make more sense to me. Thanks!

DVD Josh 09-05-06 11:56 AM


Originally Posted by Daytripper
Word of mouth has been great. From boxofficemojo:

Labor Day weekend's most impressive gross, though, ranked fifth. Proving to be a late summer sleeper, The Illusionist summoned an estimated $8 million at 971 venues over the extended weekend, its first nationwide. Like Little Miss Sunshine, the $16 million period drama has maintained a high per theater average with each expansion, suggesting broad appeal and strong word-of-mouth, and, with a $12.1 million gross in 17 days, it has already exceeded the rosiest of expectations prior to opening.

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/illusionist/

Right at 75%, which is warm. Heck, even in this thread it's up and down.

Daytripper 09-05-06 12:06 PM


Originally Posted by DVD Josh
http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/illusionist/

Right at 75%, which is warm. Heck, even in this thread it's up and down.

Well, as we all know, that's just the critics. And "The Illusionist" also got an 88% cream of the crop on rottentomatoes. I believe the strong word of mouth they are referring to is from the actual movie goers. Who also gave it a B+ on boxofficemojo (so far), and it's currently at 7.6/10 on IMDB.

Peep 09-05-06 01:19 PM

Except, unlike "Little Miss Sunshine", expect this movie to be blown out of the water when "The Prestige" opens.

RichC2 09-05-06 01:24 PM

Everyone's expecting so much of The Prestige, I can't help but think there's going to be a lot of disappointed viewers.

Hype kills. That said, by the time it comes out in late October, The Illusionist will already be on it's last legs in theaters.

DVD Josh 09-05-06 01:30 PM


Originally Posted by Daytripper
Well, as we all know, that's just the critics. And "The Illusionist" also got an 88% cream of the crop on rottentomatoes. I believe the strong word of mouth they are referring to is from the actual movie goers. Who also gave it a B+ on boxofficemojo (so far), and it's currently at 7.6/10 on IMDB.

I missed the User ratings on RT. I think the movie deserves some praise. I'll tell that at this moment, if you want a drama, it's the best out right now.

I also agree that the hype machine for the Prestige is probably jading some viewers.

toddly6666 09-05-06 06:51 PM

The Illusionist is like David Blaine
The Prestige is like David Copperfield

I prefer David Blaine...

RichC2 09-05-06 07:09 PM


Originally Posted by toddly6666
The Illusionist is like David Blaine
The Prestige is like David Copperfield

I prefer David Blaine...

You've seen The Prestige? Neat, wanna give a review?

toddly6666 09-05-06 09:14 PM

Rich, sorry I haven't seen The Prestige yet..i was just adding another comparison to the deep impact/armgeddon, bug's life/antz conversation...

The Bus 09-06-06 06:50 AM

Will you people stop comparing Christopher Nolan to David Copperfield and Michael Bay? You're giving me a heart attack. :lol:

DVD Josh 09-06-06 07:58 AM


Originally Posted by The Bus
Will you people stop comparing Christopher Nolan to David Copperfield and Michael Bay? You're giving me a heart attack. :lol:

Maybe the Dark Knight will be the Island meets Armaggedon.

Daytripper 09-06-06 09:19 AM


Originally Posted by DVD Josh
Maybe the Dark Knight will be the Island meets Armaggedon.

Good one.

OK, we all know "The Prestige" is going to kick ass. I just wish people would stop comparing it to "The Illusionist". Or having it compete against it. I loved "The Illusionist". And I'm sure I'll feel the same about "The Prestige". It's a win/win situation for me :)

Crashnburn 09-06-06 09:41 AM


Originally Posted by mdc3000
I was a projectionist for years, it was the projectionists fault... there is more information in the film image than is actually supposed to be projected on screen (the film is FLAT ratio, where this is a problem)... if they had moved the frame UP on the screen, you would have seen what you were intended to see.

Thanks for the info. I did not realize that there is a difference between what is on the filmstrip and what is projected on the screen.

DVD Josh 09-06-06 09:59 AM


Originally Posted by Daytripper
Good one.

OK, we all know "The Prestige" is going to kick ass. I just wish people would stop comparing it to "The Illusionist". Or having it compete against it. I loved "The Illusionist". And I'm sure I'll feel the same about "The Prestige". It's a win/win situation for me :)

Unfortunately, they are both movies dealing substantially with magic, thus lending themselves to easy comparisons.

Patman 09-23-06 09:44 PM

I thought the film had too ho-hum of a pace to it (plus I also guessed the outcome early in the film). The energy level was too understated, with the exception of Rufus Sewell, who's a royal bastiche with no redeemable qualities. Norton is good, but understated as the Illusionist. Biel is not as vacant as she typically is, given her past film credits, and actually connects with Norton in their scenes. Giamatti does his darnedest to be convincing in a role that ultimately undermines his character, but purposefully so. The minor nitpicks have to do with some of the illusional cheats for the film's time period that lower the plausibility of the illusions. It's definitely worth a matinee viewing if you are a fan of actors involved in the film.

I give it 2.75 stars, or a grade of B-.

dpz301 09-24-06 04:14 PM


Originally Posted by Patman
Norton is good, but understated as the Illusionist. Biel is not as vacant as she typically is, given her past film credits, and actually connects with Norton in their scenes. Giamatti does his darnedest to be convincing in a role that ultimately undermines his character, but purposefully so.

i disagree, i liked norton understanded-ness. made him seem more real to me. he wanted to make a living by doing what he loved and he did that, IMO. Biel wasn't bad and did connect with Norton as you said. i also like giamatti as the cheif inspector and how his character changed throughout the movie.

overall, i really liked it and can't wait to pick it up on dvd. also makes me really excited for the prestige!

Mikael79 09-30-06 05:25 PM

I saw this last night, and I really enjoyed it. I'd read some great reviews beforehand on Rottentomatoes.com, and some bad ones by DVDTalk staff, so I wasn't sure how I'd like it. It really delivered for me, and I'll be getting the DVD when it comes out - for sure.

atlantamoi 10-04-06 07:39 PM

One of the few times I enjoyed a movie knowing full well how it was going to end (were they seriously thinking people wouldn't figure this out?). Entertaining.... no more, no less.

exm 10-29-06 10:53 AM

Let's give this one a bump. Saw it last night and loved it. Great story & acting.

ShaunoftheDead 01-10-07 08:57 AM

The Illusionist? (slight spoilers)
 
I just saw this and liked it ok
Spoiler:
and think the ambiguous ending was a little pat and too cut and dryly explained.

What I want to know is, there wasn't any explanation given for how he performed the illusions, especially the apparitions.

Is there any physical way those can be performed and was it explained anywhere?



[Edited to add spoiler tags, just in case. D-]

baracine 01-10-07 09:01 AM

It's out on DVD. I liked the atmosphere, I liked the colours and photography. I liked the art direction. I liked the story-telling. I liked the fictitious universe. (There never was a Crown Prince of Austria named Leopold in that era, by the way, although there was a suicidal Prince Rudolf he seems modeled on.) I was captivated. There is not a single misstep in the whole story. Edward Norton coasts on his good looks and elegance but that's part of the charm of this film. A very finely crafted work of art from a young director who can only go far.

I even liked it in spite of Philip Glass's score. Mr. Glass is a hack whose "music" gives me a rash but he is getting very good lately at recycling those same two ot three simplistic chords for mysterious effect.

I can't wait to see The Prestige for comparison purposes.

baracine 01-10-07 09:16 AM


Originally Posted by ShaunoftheDead
I just saw this and liked it ok
Spoiler:
and think the ambiguous ending was a little pat and too cut and dryly explained.

What I want to know is, there wasn't any explanation given for how he performed the illusions, especially the apparitions.

Is there any physical way those can be performed and was it explained anywhere?



[Edited to add spoiler tags, just in case. D-]

You know we will get witch-hunted if we go on with this second thread on the same film but my answer is...

Spoiler:
Since the orange tree trick appears (in the film) to have had a very complicated mechanical explanation, we must assume that all the other tricks were the result of careful planning and hard work and "before their time" innovations. The fact that the magician is surrounded by a legend that he may have learned mystical tricks from mysterious otherworldly strangers and that he has lived in "the Orient" is just so much second-hand window dressing designed to keep you wonderstruck all through the film and believe in the supernatural long enough for the hero to effect his very real, very carefully-planned and very practical getaway. He does everything he does in order to elope with a woman of flesh-and-blood after all, not a ghost.

Also note that the magician fires his manager and replaces him with a crew of Chinese stagehands in order to keep his methods secret, not only from the public but also from any pressure coming from the police to divulge them. He trusts the manager with his money but not with his secrets.

The film's story also exploits the myth and mystery surrounding famous stage magicians of the XIXth century whose best tricks have been kept secret for generations by the magician's oath and never publicly revealed , some of which still seem impossible today, like one magician, David Douglas Home (see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Dunglas_Home ), who was reputed to have levitated out of a third-storey window and flown back in through another window in front of at least a hundred witnesses who never asked for their money back.

http://library.thinkquest.org/C01209...historical.jpg

RichC2 01-10-07 09:21 AM

Entertaining. I liked the darkness of The Prestige, but the Illusionist had a better connected (tho predictable... they really did foreshadow the hell out of it, starting 10 minutes into the thing) conclusion.


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