The One and Only XMEN the Last Stand REVIEW Thread SPOILERS
#201
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I thought the movie was good. I'm not getting all the hate unless it's by the non-comic book fans. Are there some conflicts? sure. The Dark Phoenix saga wasn't the same but at what time in the X-men movie universe have they ever acknowledged life on any planet other than Earth? It woud be a little difficult to explain Dark Phoenix destroying a planet with over 5 billion lives.
Has Charles X died? Yep, a few times. And the key here is...would Magneto maybe become the leader of the X-men? Sure, it diffinitly could and IMO they set it up for that very thing to happen. Just like in the comic book at one time.
The Beast was dead on. Kitty was as well.
I think this movie was more true to the comic series than any other.
Has Charles X died? Yep, a few times. And the key here is...would Magneto maybe become the leader of the X-men? Sure, it diffinitly could and IMO they set it up for that very thing to happen. Just like in the comic book at one time.
The Beast was dead on. Kitty was as well.
I think this movie was more true to the comic series than any other.
#202
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Originally Posted by waporvare
The Beast was dead on. Kitty was as well.
When did Kitty have some crush on Bobby? It's like between X2 and X3 they just figured Rogue without her stolen powers was just not a good character and tossed her aside.
You figure that if anyone else wanted to stand up against Magneto it would be her. Since, you know, he tried to kill her in the first film and all. They just decided they needed another female character with decent powers that actually would be neat to show on screen and pushed Rogue aside.
Though I admit she's a cuttie.
#205
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Originally Posted by M2theAX
Anyone have any stills of Rebecca Romjin laying naked on floor after being hit with the "cure?"
OK, I'll admit, that shot was beautiful.
#206
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
Anyone have any stills of Rebecca Romjin laying naked on floor after being hit with the "cure?"
#207
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
This should have been a story about Scott and Jean.
#208
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
but a great movie for what it was and definitely much better than X3.
Okay, you're annoying.
#209
DVD Talk Limited Edition
The only thing that really really bothered me was the discontinuity throughout the movie...one minute it's day, another it's night, mutants running across the country in a matter of hours/days...
about running across the country as I understand the Blackbird can travel at Mach 4 speeds....not sure how that equates to time but I can suspend disbelief long enough in a comicbook movie that it could travel from coast to coast fairly quickly.
To all the cries about character development..... I love character development but I feel the first 2 movies did enough of that to allow this movie to breathe more and be more about the action.
Sometimes it is better just to have characters in these movies just to see them as opposed to not having them at all. I go back to what others have said about the first 2 movies
where was the character development for
Cyclops - X1
Storm - X1
Sabretooth - X1
Toad - X1
Iceman - X1
Deathstrike - X2
Kitty Pride - X2
Colossus - X2
etc....
I thought something like Angel was done as good as it needed to be done .... hell I would I been fine just seeing him in the background
instead we were given a look into his childhood (ala Rouge)
introduction to his father and their relationship
his later life acceptance of his mutation
and his ability to forgive his father's lack of understanding and his ability to use his mutation to rescue his father in his moment of need
what more did we need to know or get in this flick?
that he hangs with Iceman, Black Widow, a Zeus god, and that dude from the movie previews (Blaze, not Depp) in his spare time?
Last edited by musick; 05-30-06 at 01:03 AM.
#210
DVD Talk Limited Edition
When did Kitty have some crush on Bobby?
is a crush assumed because she allows Bobby to comfort her after Charles dies by taking her ice skating?
and so what if you assume she has a crush on him in this movie, maybe all the girls at the school had a thing for the Iceman
#211
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Kitty's character development was in X2? Huh? am I missing some deleted scenes or something?
How about Angel's character development? In his five minute screen time of escaping, showing up at the mansion and then showing up to save his dad he has no character development and is just placed there for shits and giggles.
How about some character development for Rogue. She goes from the first one of not being accepted of her own self and the powers she has to finally coming to terms with them and then suddenly we get this twist that since she can't touch her boyfriend she wants to change herself.
It's like all the message of accepting yourself for who you are that was placed in the first two films and the whole "mutants are people too" mentality got tossed out the window when you can simply take a shot and cure yourself. Hey, being different sucks so change yourself to be happy.
How about Angel's character development? In his five minute screen time of escaping, showing up at the mansion and then showing up to save his dad he has no character development and is just placed there for shits and giggles.
How about some character development for Rogue. She goes from the first one of not being accepted of her own self and the powers she has to finally coming to terms with them and then suddenly we get this twist that since she can't touch her boyfriend she wants to change herself.
It's like all the message of accepting yourself for who you are that was placed in the first two films and the whole "mutants are people too" mentality got tossed out the window when you can simply take a shot and cure yourself. Hey, being different sucks so change yourself to be happy.
#212
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Originally Posted by musick
when was a crush established?
is a crush assumed because she allows Bobby to comfort her after Charles dies by taking her ice skating?
and so what if you assume she has a crush on him in this movie, maybe all the girls at the school had a thing for the Iceman
is a crush assumed because she allows Bobby to comfort her after Charles dies by taking her ice skating?
and so what if you assume she has a crush on him in this movie, maybe all the girls at the school had a thing for the Iceman
There was a very big hinting at a love triangle. Why else would rogue go and change herself?
The real question is why was there a lack of Kitty/Piotr relationship hinted?
#213
Banned by request
Originally Posted by IIG
I don't hesistate to say this this was much more true to the comics than even X2 .
The Phoenix doesn't have a firebird or even much power in comparison to her comic book self. The only comic reference to the Phoenix in this movie is when she holds back Scott's optic blast. The whole "Dawn of the Dead" look she got was also something made just for the movie.
Wolverine becomes leader of the X-Men. This is against his character in both the comics AND the films.
Rogue seeks a cure for her powers.
The Professor completely writes off Scott at the beginning of the movie, which he would never do in the comics. Scott, for his part, still leads the X-Men after Jean's death (and rebirth, and death, and cloning, and rebirth) in the comics. In the film he gets killed in the first reel.
Kitty's phasing a man into a solid object doesn't kill him in the film. This is practically canon in the comic that something like that would kill a person.
Colossus does nothing in this film. He's a huge part of the comics. If you're going to put him in as one of the "team of six", then you should maybe let him speak.
The only thing I can think of that was really true to the comic was Iceman turning to ice. Oh, and Beast reading a book while standing on the ceiling. That's about it.
Also, I was thinking about it, using the cure on Magneto really undercut the X-Men's position. By doing it, they basically prove Magneto right. And, oddly, once he loses his powers, he's just allowed to roam free. No prison, no nothing.
The more I think about this movie, the angrier I get.
Last edited by Supermallet; 05-30-06 at 01:14 AM.
#214
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Originally Posted by Jackskeleton
Kitty's character development was in X2? Huh? am I missing some deleted scenes or something?
How about Angel's character development? In his five minute screen time of escaping, showing up at the mansion and then showing up to save his dad he has no character development and is just placed there for shits and giggles.
his appearance in X3 was more developed than many of the character appearances in the first 2 movies
why no outcry that Hank McCoy was in X2 just for shits and giggles
How about some character development for Rogue. She goes from the first one of not being accepted of her own self and the powers she has to finally coming to terms with them and then suddenly we get this twist that since she can't touch her boyfriend she wants to change herself.
The real question is why was there a lack of Kitty/Piotr relationship hinted?
Last edited by musick; 05-30-06 at 01:20 AM.
#215
Banned by request
Originally Posted by musick
his appearance in X3 was more developed than many of the character appearances in the first 2 movies
why no outcry that Hank McCoy was in X2 just for shits and giggles
why no outcry that Hank McCoy was in X2 just for shits and giggles
If for the entirety of X2 people were talking about Beast, and that 3-second cameo was all we saw, than it might be more comparable. Angel's character had NO point in the film other than to motivate his dad to make the cure. But, let's face it, you could have done away with that and still justified some pharmacuetical company making a cure. Heck, they could have done it just because of the threat Magneto poses.
The problem with this film is that the new characters had inadequate character development, and the characters who were developed in the first two suddenly went through drastic changes that went against all the development that had happened in the last two movies.
Imagine if, in The Return of the King, Aragorn suddenly joins Sauron, Gandalf kills all the hobbits, and Legolas and Gimli get married and run off to live under a mountain. That's about the kind of character changes we're talking about here.
#216
DVD Talk Limited Edition
I hope you're joking. You're seriously trying to compare his appearance in X3 to a 3-second cameo in X2?
If for the entirety of X2 people were talking about Beast, and that 3-second cameo was all we saw, than it might be more comparable. Angel's character had NO point in the film other than to motivate his dad to make the cure. But, let's face it, you could have done away with that and still justified some pharmacuetical company making a cure. Heck, they could have done it just because of the threat Magneto poses.
If for the entirety of X2 people were talking about Beast, and that 3-second cameo was all we saw, than it might be more comparable. Angel's character had NO point in the film other than to motivate his dad to make the cure. But, let's face it, you could have done away with that and still justified some pharmacuetical company making a cure. Heck, they could have done it just because of the threat Magneto poses.
flesh out his character more in later movies if you choose to
no you see your LOTR's comparison is completely off base
Peter Jackson tried to make the movies as accurate as possible to the 3 books
the brainpower behind the X-Men movies did not try to make the movies as accurate as possible to 40+ years of X-Men books and all the different interpretations of characters held within
nice try though
Last edited by musick; 05-30-06 at 01:35 AM.
#217
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My point wasn't about accuracy to the printed material. My point was about accuracy to the characters as they were developed in PREVIOUS FILMS.
Nice try and changing the subject, though.
If you want a purely cinematic example: In Return of the Jedi, Luke embraces the Dark Side and kills the emperor and Vader, ruling the galaxy with an iron fist. Leia uses the new Death Star to blow up more peaceful worlds. Han and Chewie get married and go live under a big tree on Kashyyk. Are you happy?
Nice try and changing the subject, though.
If you want a purely cinematic example: In Return of the Jedi, Luke embraces the Dark Side and kills the emperor and Vader, ruling the galaxy with an iron fist. Leia uses the new Death Star to blow up more peaceful worlds. Han and Chewie get married and go live under a big tree on Kashyyk. Are you happy?
#218
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Originally Posted by musick
again did you even read my post
his appearance in X3 was more developed than many of the character appearances in the first 2 movies
why no outcry that Hank McCoy was in X2 just for shits and giggles
his appearance in X3 was more developed than many of the character appearances in the first 2 movies
why no outcry that Hank McCoy was in X2 just for shits and giggles
not to mention that Singer has said that there was something taken away from X2 that would have bridged the gap and turned Hank into the beast like character we see in the third.
seemed to me pretty early on like her killing her childhood boyfriend with a kiss showed that she always struggled with her powers and it seemed to me that she would want to rid herself of her powers so she could have contact with Bobby.....pretty much what she was getting at early on in X3 in a conversation with him.
This film just went ahead and turned that around completely. Gave you the message that being different is wrong and you should change yourself for others and you'll be happy in the end. It goes against the message of the previous two films. Nuff said.
your question infers that there will be a 'love' relationship shown between the 2 in a future movie.....just as has been the case in the first 2 movies there is no rule that everything from the comics is interpreted the same way on the screen
#220
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
The whole "Dawn of the Dead" look she got was also something made just for the movie.
If you want a purely cinematic example: In Return of the Jedi, Luke embraces the Dark Side and kills the emperor and Vader, ruling the galaxy with an iron fist. Leia uses the new Death Star to blow up more peaceful worlds. Han and Chewie get married and go live under a big tree on Kashyyk. Are you happy?
Jack, I think the main point musick was trying to make was the lack of development for many characters in X3 is not different than the complete lack of character development for numerous characters in X1 and X2. Basically, the same complaint could be leveled at all 3 films.
But I found myself enjoying the film, and only thought the film needed another 25-30 minutes of fleshing out.
#222
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
Gave you the message that being different is wrong and you should change yourself for others and you'll be happy in the end. It goes against the message of the previous two films.
#223
Banned by request
What Rogue did would be the equivalent of a black man dying himself white so he could date a white girl. I don't think anyone would have found that to be good character development, especially if that same character had been used previously to trumpet black pride.
#224
DVD Talk Limited Edition
Originally Posted by Suprmallet
So, musick, do you still disagree that the movie made drastic changes from the established development of the characters in the first two films?
Cyclops - you want him to be the 'comic book' leader of the X-Men
but he was never given that role as early on as the first movie
Would it have been good if he was the one who tried to save or had to kill Phoenix at the end instead of Wolverine sure but he has had the short shaft in all the movies so it was left to the other character who early on they tried to establish a love relationship with
he loved Jean (about his only character development in X1 or X2) and still loved her in X3 so no drastic changes
Rogue - she is a child.....she has been conflicted in all the movies thus far. Despite Jackskeleton acurate assesment of what the theme of the first two movies was she has always been conflicted between retaining her powers and getting rid of them
Storm - the only drastic changes I can say were that she was a stronger character in this movie more to her comic book portrayal but still light years away from the motherly and strong Ororo
Wolverine - you're upset he became the leader but by default with Scott gone (again who was never portrayed as the strong leader) he took on this role ..... you say this portrayal is not accurate to the comics but while he was always an outsider he still had power struggles with Scott and in the absence of a leader would take command.
smartass, protector, animal, fighter to the end, in love with Jean all in X3 no drastic changes
Phoenix/Jean - well being that we never saw her in her X3 state in X1 or for the most part in X2 there is no way to say the change was drastic.
Xavier/Magneto - no drastic changes
Mystique - no drastic changes
I think I covered them all
Last edited by musick; 05-30-06 at 02:10 AM.
#225
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where were the accents? rogue had one in the first movie yet lost it completely in this one. pyro's an aussie, pete's a russian, and moira had one but was laughable. the effects were bad. new line cinema should of had the franchise and make a phoenix trilogy ala LOTR. First movie have jean sacfrice to save x-men against say Mutant Liberation Front, second movie have dark phoenix and x-men vs. hellfire club's inner circle with the end having the shi'ar show up. third movie have x-men vs. shiar on the moon. yes a huge budget but it will easily make it back. and please a cgi 9 foot non mutant juggernaut with vinnie jones doing voice over. and a bigger more accurate colossus that doesnt' spin around wolvie a dozen times before throwing him, hello he's class 80 strength, wolvie just jumps on his large hand and gets tossed.