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"A Streetcar Named Desire"...couple ?'s

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"A Streetcar Named Desire"...couple ?'s

Old 02-06-06, 05:07 PM
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"A Streetcar Named Desire"...couple ?'s

1. Why did the all 3 leads win the Oscar and NOT Brando? I thought he was so powerful in this, so volatile at just the right moments. I mean why did Karl Malden and Hunter win, as they didn't seem that great, especially Malden, enough to get an Oscar?

2. Why did Stella say she wasn't going back inside with Stanley at the end? Was it because of Blanche feeding her all that stuff about him not being refined and all that? Stanley and Stella seemed to be truly in love and he wasn't that bad of a guy- he did really care for Stella. Sure, he pushed Blanche over the edge, but he was just helping her along to her inevitable conclusion and opening everyone else's eyes to the truth about her.
Old 02-07-06, 02:55 AM
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1. I agree with you completely. Brando eclipsed ALL of the other actors in that movie. Even in the original stage production the audience was riveted by him and the director even had to reblock the play because the audience literally couldn't keep their eyes off him!

This was the performance that really introduced Method acting to hollywood, and it really is a landmark performance for how it would affect the art form from then on.

as to why he didn't win an oscar, the only thing I can think of is that he was so relatively new to movies that the Academy didn't want to award him too soon. This way he would only work harder and put out even greater performances.


2. This is open to interpretation but in my opinion Stella believed that Stanley had raped Blanche which led to her insanity. As to if he did or not, it's deeply implied in the movie version. But interpret it any which way you want.
Old 02-07-06, 03:34 AM
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Humphrey Bogart won that year for "The African Queen".

Bogart was one of Hollywood's greatest stars, winding down his career, and he had never won an Oscar (and had only been nominated once before, for "Casablanca").
Old 02-07-06, 08:48 AM
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Originally Posted by MASAMUNE2
2. This is open to interpretation but in my opinion Stella believed that Stanley had raped Blanche which led to her insanity. As to if he did or not, it's deeply implied in the movie version. But interpret it any which way you want.
how is rape at all implied? we saw exactly what happened between him and Blanche. i think you are way off in this assumption. the only thing close to rape was maybe he raped her mind with the mind games, that were in fact truth, that is what sent her over the edge. nothing physical between them could ever be implied from the film or the play for that matter (which i read).
Old 02-07-06, 10:46 AM
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Originally Posted by scott1598
i think you are way off in this assumption.
not at all....that Stanley raped Blanche is the most widely accepted interpretation of the film. just google "streetcar named desire rape" and you will find a lot of articles about the film. it's definitely implied in the film, but in the language of 1951 films. I think that in 1951, The Production Code was still very much in effect. Your interpretation of the film may also depend on which version of the film you have seen. I don't know if the older version is still shows on tv or not, but in the early 90s, the film had some footage added back into the film that was censored at the time.

http://www.filmsite.org/stre.html
The visceral film, considered controversial, decadent, and "morally repugnant" challenged the regulatory Production Code's censors (and the Legion of Decency) with its bold adult drama and sexual subjects (insanity, rape, domestic violence, homosexuality, sexual obsession, and female promiscuity or nymphomania). Ultimately, it signaled the weakening of Hollywood censorship (and groups such as the Catholic Legion of Decency), although a number of scenes were excised, and new dialogue was written. And the Production Code insisted that Stanley be punished for the rape by the loss of his wife's love at the film's conclusion. In 1993, approximately three to five minutes of the censored scenes (i.e., specific references to Blanche's homosexual - or bisexual young husband, her nymphomania, and Stanley's rape of Blanche) were restored in an 'original director's version' video re-release.
http://stud-www.uni-marburg.de/~Blas...liams/asnd.htm
D. Rape and Punishment

The second major objection the MPAA raised, was Stanley’s rape of Blanche. Williams absolutely refused to eliminate this scene as he thought it was of a vital need for the play. Phillips quotes:

Streetcar is an extremely and peculiarly moral play, in the deepest and truest sense of the term. ... The rape of Blanche by Stanley is a pivotal, integral truth in the play, without which the play loses its meaning, which is the ravishment of the tender, the sensitive, the delicate, by the savage and brutal forces of modern society (230).

Breen didn’t succeed in getting through his demand, but agreed that the rape could remain in the movie, if only Stanley would be punished for his action. The stage productions ends with Blanche’s famous last words: "Whoever you are – I have always depended on the kindness of strangers," (Williams, Tennessee, Streetcar 142) followed by Stella yelling her name and the doctor taking her away to a mental home. The screenplay had to have another scene added; Stella is seen in front of the tenement building, holding her baby in her arms, she utters words of regret and that she would leave Stanley for sure. This different ending is intended to be Stanley’s punishment, for losing Stella and his child had always been his weak spot, as we are told in scene three. And just this return of Stella in the early beginning makes it so unbelievable that she would be strong enough to leave him after all. She is just like Blanche, always needing someone to cling to, someone that takes care of her and that she is attracted to, anything Stanley offers, although he can be seen as a fierce brute force, following his basic instincts, taking whatever he desires. Furthermore this behavior of his was another point Breen made Warner cut out after the movie was already finished. Originally Stanley says: "Come to think of it – maybe you wouldn’t be bad to – interfere with ..." and after Blanche trying to defend herself with a broken bottle: "Tiger – tiger! Drop the bottle top! Drop it! We’ve had this date with each other from the beginning" (Williams, Tennessee, Streetcar 129-30)! These words clearly expressing that he raped his sister-in-law on purpose. The officially released movie version was missing both sentences, giving the impression that both, Stanley and Blanche, were drunk and a "bad" thing happened for which Stanley is being punished in the end. Breen’s only objection were to words and plot only, thus leaving Kazan the opportunity to work with symbols that couldn’t be used in a stage production. Earlier in the scene Stanley uncaps a bottle of beer, letting it spill over – a symbol for his sexual energy – and immediately after the rape a cut to a street cleaner’s hose is inserted, another strong phallic image. Kazan later calls it "a little too obvious," but it helped him underline the rape without showing it on the screen at all, "because in those days we had to be very indirect in depicting material of that kind" (Phillips 231).
I have not read the play, but all these articles state that the rape is definitely too in the play.

http://www.albany.edu/writers-inst/fns04n5.html
And so it was that the Hollywood studios struggled for three years with Streetcar, and the nation's great theatrical hit remained stalled in the pipeline. Finally, in April of 1950, a first draft of a screenplay was ready; independent producer Charles Feldman was producing the film for Warner Brothers. Still, the Breen Office fretted. The story still turned on rape, and the play's intimation of homosexuality remained prominent, and Blanche still seemed vaguely nymphomaniacal. Director Elia Kazan watered down Blanche's lustful past and the remembered homosexuality of her first husband, but he was adamant on Stanley's rape of Blanche. As Tennessee Williams put it eloquently in a letter to the Breen Office, any further changes would be crass, because A Streetcar Named Desire was already "an extremely and peculiarly moral play, in the deepest and truest sense of the word." Williams announced to Breen that he and director Elia Kazan would stand for no changes that tampered with the fact of Stanley's rape of Blanche, warning Breen that the simplistic moralizing of prewar Hollywood was hypocritical in the wake of new realities:
Old 02-07-06, 03:34 PM
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Originally Posted by garmonbozia
not at all....that Stanley raped Blanche is the most widely accepted interpretation of the film. just google "streetcar named desire rape" and you will find a lot of articles about the film. it's definitely implied in the film, but in the language of 1951 films. I think that in 1951, The Production Code was still very much in effect. Your interpretation of the film may also depend on which version of the film you have seen. I don't know if the older version is still shows on tv or not, but in the early 90s, the film had some footage added back into the film that was censored at the time.

http://www.filmsite.org/stre.html


http://stud-www.uni-marburg.de/~Blas...liams/asnd.htm


I have not read the play, but all these articles state that the rape is definitely too in the play.

http://www.albany.edu/writers-inst/fns04n5.html
ehhh...i still don't agree that it was very much implied.
Old 02-07-06, 04:35 PM
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its definately there, just notice the pre and post rape Blanche....its in the play and its def in the movie
Old 02-08-06, 12:07 AM
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Originally Posted by scott1598
nothing physical between them could ever be implied from the film or the play for that matter (which i read).
are you sure? memory can often be distorted. I have the play here in my hand and i'll type it out for you:


(after she smashes the bottle)

Stanley: what did u do that for?

Blanch: so i could twist the broken end in your face!

Stanley: i bet u would do that!

Blanche: i would! i will if you -

Stanley: Oh! So u want some rough house! All right let's have some rough house!
[he springs toward her, overturning the table. she cries out and strikes at him with the bottle top but he catches her wrist]

Tiger- tiger! Drop the bottle top! Drop it! We've had this date with each other from the beginning!

[she moans. the bottle top falls. she sinks to her knees. he picks up her inert figure and carries her to the bed. the hot trumpet and drums from the Four Deuces sound loudly.]



-----------------------------------------

one of my favorite plays
Old 02-08-06, 09:08 AM
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Originally Posted by scott1598
ehhh...i still don't agree that it was very much implied.

As we mature, our ability to understand and appreciate works of art hopefully increases. You should probably revisit Streetcar in a few years.
Old 02-08-06, 09:28 AM
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Originally Posted by marty888
As we mature, our ability to understand and appreciate works of art hopefully increases. You should probably revisit Streetcar in a few years.
that is probably the dumbest statement i have ever seen written to me. next time keep the snarky remarks to yourself.
i wholeheartedly appreciated and enjoyed this story. the acting was tremendous. just because i didn't see an aspect doesn't mean a stupid retort like i can't understand masterful cinema is in order.
Old 02-08-06, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by scott1598
that is probably the dumbest statement i have ever seen written to me. next time keep the snarky remarks to yourself.
i wholeheartedly appreciated and enjoyed this story. the acting was tremendous. just because i didn't see an aspect doesn't mean a stupid retort like i can't understand masterful cinema is in order.

Sorry - most people realize that they mature, and are able to re-evaulate the world around them, as they grow older and gain more knowledge. In fact, that sentiment is in keeping with my signature item.

I'm fully aware that I do not necessarily grasp every aspect of a work of art (be it a movie, a play, a book, etc.) on first encounter, and readily admit that I can still learn things.

Sorry if my "dumb, snarky and stupid" concept offended your intelligence,
Old 02-08-06, 06:55 PM
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Originally Posted by marty888
As we mature, our ability to understand and appreciate works of art hopefully increases. You should probably revisit Streetcar in a few years.

Originally Posted by scott1598
that is probably the dumbest statement i have ever seen written to me. next time keep the snarky remarks to yourself.
i wholeheartedly appreciated and enjoyed this story. the acting was tremendous. just because i didn't see an aspect doesn't mean a stupid retort like i can't understand masterful cinema is in order.
Guys, these comments aren't a good idea. Insulting each other will only serve to decrease the chance of meaningful dialogue.
Old 02-08-06, 09:03 PM
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Dead you never seem to miss an insult. It's amusing to me. It's like Chris Rock in Pootie Tang hitting Pootie with the belt when he was a kid. One day Pootie was alone with his friend and he was about to steal some fruit when suddenly Chris Rock's belt came out of no where *THWAK!* "Don't you steal that fruit boy!"

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