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boogie nights, and Magnolia, should i give them both another try?

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boogie nights, and Magnolia, should i give them both another try?

Old 07-31-04, 02:39 AM
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Sounds like maybe I just have weird taste, but I didn't think there was a single boring minute in Magnolia. It's probably my favorite movie. Boogie Nights is great too, and the cinematography is incredible.
Old 07-31-04, 03:34 AM
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Having long running times, both films can be trying for the average viewer.

That said:

Magnolia was trying the first time I saw it. I watched it a second time and I was hooked. Top 5 of 1999.

Boogie Nights is pure entertainment (in a good way). I love everything about this film. Has great re-watchability.

What's funny is that Boogie Nights has the porn arc, yet that is the last thing I am thinking about when watching it. The actors and the script are that good.
Old 07-31-04, 05:22 AM
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Originally posted by Debaser
After seeing the sources for both Magnolia and Boogie Nights Paul Thomas Anderson can go F- himself.
Could you expand on that? Is this just a "the book was better than the movie" thing, or are you talking about an early script?

I thought both movies were excellent technically. Cinematography and the soundtrack was very well done and the performances where great. So I assume it was a character or plot change you didn't like?
Old 07-31-04, 07:27 AM
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Originally posted by wmansir
Could you expand on that? Is this just a "the book was better than the movie" thing, or are you talking about an early script?
He's probably referring to the fact that Boogie Nights borrows from everything and the kitchen sink: Scorsese, Tarantino, Spike Jonez, etc., etc. The influence of Robert Altman throughout Magnolia is undeniable.

That said, Magnolia practically demands repeat viewings. It's a brilliant, ballsy film with fantastic performances, a great soundtrack, wonderful cinematography and epic, operatic drama. It explores the importance of love and family to give an individual self-worth and reminds you that we do need others to help us overcome adversity, that we cannot make it through this crazy life alone. Anderson's best movie and one of the very best of 1999.
Old 07-31-04, 03:06 PM
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Originally posted by Rivero
He's probably referring to the fact that Boogie Nights borrows from everything and the kitchen sink: Scorsese, Tarantino, Spike Jonez, etc., etc. The influence of Robert Altman throughout Magnolia is undeniable.

That said, Magnolia practically demands repeat viewings. It's a brilliant, ballsy film with fantastic performances, a great soundtrack, wonderful cinematography and epic, operatic drama. It explores the importance of love and family to give an individual self-worth and reminds you that we do need others to help us overcome adversity, that we cannot make it through this crazy life alone. Anderson's best movie and one of the very best of 1999.
If you listen to the commentary on Boogie Nights PTA points out when he "stole" certain shots from directors. I think Jonathan Demme was one of them. I don't really see how he could of ripped off Spike Jonze, unless he's been making movies I've never heard about for awhile. Also, I don't believe there is anything wrong with doing what PTA did. I think most directors try to emulate their favorite directors in their works.
Old 08-01-04, 06:26 AM
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Originally posted by PopcornTreeCt
If you listen to the commentary on Boogie Nights PTA points out when he "stole" certain shots from directors. I think Jonathan Demme was one of them. I don't really see how he could of ripped off Spike Jonze, unless he's been making movies I've never heard about for awhile. Also, I don't believe there is anything wrong with doing what PTA did. I think most directors try to emulate their favorite directors in their works.
He 'stole' more than just certain shots from directors. If PTA wants to believe that's all he did than he seriously needs to re-evaluate his ability as a filmmaker. And if it's ok with him than he joins the ranks like Quentin Tarantino, Michael Bay, and Tony Scott as talented hacks.

Bottom line is PTA like Quentin Tarantino likes to watch 70's movies and do creative 'borrowing'. It might be ok for some people and not a big deal but it's a 'bitch' way of doing things.

It's a 'bitch' way to write. It's a 'bitch' way to direct. It's a 'bitch' way to think.

PTA is a talented 'bitch'. I'll give him that. Magnolia and Boogie Nights honestly looks very professional. They really look like 'good' movies and if you didn't know any better I know why you'd be fooled.

But YMMV.
Old 08-01-04, 08:12 AM
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I gave Boogie Nights a second viewing recently, but decided it was still just an ok film, so I sold th DVD.
Old 08-01-04, 10:36 AM
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yes without a doubt re boogie nights.

the opening single shot alone is worth multiple viewings. the drug deal scene is maybe my favorite of any scene in any movie. love how walhberg goes through so many emotions/thoughts while sitting on that couch. there is the one point (on the couch while everything else is going on) where he is almost smiling for a second then back to despair, anxiety, fear, etc.

sorry one of my favorite movies.

still havent seen magnolia (own it but just havent been in that knid of mood lately) so i cant comment on that film.
Old 08-01-04, 10:37 AM
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Originally posted by Debaser
He 'stole' more than just certain shots from directors. If PTA wants to believe that's all he did than he seriously needs to re-evaluate his ability as a filmmaker. And if it's ok with him than he joins the ranks like Quentin Tarantino, Michael Bay, and Tony Scott as talented hacks.

Bottom line is PTA like Quentin Tarantino likes to watch 70's movies and do creative 'borrowing'. It might be ok for some people and not a big deal but it's a 'bitch' way of doing things.

It's a 'bitch' way to write. It's a 'bitch' way to direct. It's a 'bitch' way to think.

Old 08-01-04, 11:20 AM
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Yes, Boogie Nights didn't really groove with me the first time I saw it and I had no real desire to watch it again, it was Mark Wahlberg's acting that detracted from the overall movie for me.

I gave it another shot based on all the great word of mouth and went back in with an open mind and it was amazing. I loved every frame of the movie, from the acting (each character really stands out and is remembered...well, Wahlberg still was not very good) and PT Andersen's directing.

Definitely give it another try.

Magnolia was a very good experience for me as I expected brilliant performances and that's what I got, the movie itself is outstanding. I'm in the minority here (as all of my friends left the theatre ), but give it another try. The pace is one to grow on you, but the pay off is well worth it.
Old 08-01-04, 11:33 AM
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Originally posted by Debaser

It's a 'bitch' way to write. It's a 'bitch' way to direct. It's a 'bitch' way to think.

PTA is a talented 'bitch'.
Did he also kill your dog and rape your wife?
Old 08-01-04, 04:59 PM
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Originally posted by Debaser
He 'stole' more than just certain shots from directors. If PTA wants to believe that's all he did than he seriously needs to re-evaluate his ability as a filmmaker. And if it's ok with him than he joins the ranks like Quentin Tarantino, Michael Bay, and Tony Scott as talented hacks.

Bottom line is PTA like Quentin Tarantino likes to watch 70's movies and do creative 'borrowing'. It might be ok for some people and not a big deal but it's a 'bitch' way of doing things.

It's a 'bitch' way to write. It's a 'bitch' way to direct. It's a 'bitch' way to think.

PTA is a talented 'bitch'. I'll give him that. Magnolia and Boogie Nights honestly looks very professional. They really look like 'good' movies and if you didn't know any better I know why you'd be fooled.
Someone forgot to take their medication.

Everyone 'borrows' from everyone. There's nothing original now. I guess everyone is a 'bitch', probably even your favorite directors 'borrowed' from someone. It's called inspiration.

And the word "hack"...so misused!
Old 08-01-04, 05:45 PM
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No. You obviously don't know what you're talking about. I'm not talking about inspiration I'm talking about plagarism.

Theft.

You know, 'Tarantinoism'

I'd love to freebase the drugs your taking where stealing is called 'inspiration'.

Thumbs up on your assesment.

PTA and Quentin are 'prison bitches' then.
Old 08-01-04, 06:08 PM
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Originally posted by Debaser
plagarism.
Could you give some examples? You have me interested.
Old 08-01-04, 06:13 PM
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i guess brian de palma could get in there and make it a 3 way with his "theft" of hitchcock.
Old 08-01-04, 11:10 PM
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Magnolia is one of my favorite movies of all time.

Still, for all the praise Tom Cruise gets for it, I think his is one of the weakest performances in the film.
Old 08-01-04, 11:19 PM
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Originally posted by DVD-ho78(DTS)
Could you give some examples? You have me interested.
Yeah, I'd be interested in some examples also. Cause I don't recall the movies that PTA and Quentin directly copied off of. Or maybe he hasn't seen the 1998 version of Psycho, which IS more in line with what he is saying.

Honestly, while these guys lift ideas from here and there, disregarding the fact that their films aren't really the same as the films they borrow things from (is anyone really going to pretend Magnolia is a rip off of short cuts? or that Reservoir Dogs is a direct rip off of City on Fire cause there share a story? Or that Kill Bill is somehow a lesser film because it borrows ideas and stylistic flourishes from many many movies that weren't nearly as good as Kill Bill?).

I think we need some perspective. Debaser, your rant against these guys is just silly, and just seems like bashing. So what if they borrowed stuff? Name me a director who hasn't. In the end it's about the movie itself.

I know some bash The Lion King for ripping off Kimba: the Japanese cartoony thingy but let's be honest, how much of a rip off is it anyway? The story is a direct lift from Shakespeare, and the animation, art, and music is a million times better than that old cartoon and hardly the exact same thing whatsoever. But some people like to latch onto the surface similarities and completely ignore everything else in the film for...whatever reason.
Old 08-01-04, 11:38 PM
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Originally posted by jaeufraser
Yeah, I'd be interested in some examples also. Cause I don't recall the movies that PTA and Quentin directly copied off of. Or maybe he hasn't seen the 1998 version of Psycho, which IS more in line with what he is saying.

Honestly, while these guys lift ideas from here and there, disregarding the fact that their films aren't really the same as the films they borrow things from (is anyone really going to pretend Magnolia is a rip off of short cuts? or that Reservoir Dogs is a direct rip off of City on Fire cause there share a story? Or that Kill Bill is somehow a lesser film because it borrows ideas and stylistic flourishes from many many movies that weren't nearly as good as Kill Bill?).

I think we need some perspective. Debaser, your rant against these guys is just silly, and just seems like bashing. So what if they borrowed stuff? Name me a director who hasn't. In the end it's about the movie itself.

I know some bash The Lion King for ripping off Kimba: the Japanese cartoony thingy but let's be honest, how much of a rip off is it anyway? The story is a direct lift from Shakespeare, and the animation, art, and music is a million times better than that old cartoon and hardly the exact same thing whatsoever. But some people like to latch onto the surface similarities and completely ignore everything else in the film for...whatever reason.
Yes, its quite amusing. Seeing how everyone borrows from everyone. I've read even Akira Kurosawa borrowing shots and ideas from American and French directors. I think Paul Thomas Anderson is a great director. My favorite film of his being Punch-Drunk Love.
Old 08-01-04, 11:54 PM
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Originally posted by jaeufraser
Yeah, I'd be interested in some examples also. Cause I don't recall the movies that PTA and Quentin directly copied off of. Or maybe he hasn't seen the 1998 version of Psycho, which IS more in line with what he is saying.

Honestly, while these guys lift ideas from here and there, disregarding the fact that their films aren't really the same as the films they borrow things from (is anyone really going to pretend Magnolia is a rip off of short cuts? or that Reservoir Dogs is a direct rip off of City on Fire cause there share a story? Or that Kill Bill is somehow a lesser film because it borrows ideas and stylistic flourishes from many many movies that weren't nearly as good as Kill Bill?).

I think we need some perspective. Debaser, your rant against these guys is just silly, and just seems like bashing. So what if they borrowed stuff? Name me a director who hasn't. In the end it's about the movie itself.

I know some bash The Lion King for ripping off Kimba: the Japanese cartoony thingy but let's be honest, how much of a rip off is it anyway? The story is a direct lift from Shakespeare, and the animation, art, and music is a million times better than that old cartoon and hardly the exact same thing whatsoever. But some people like to latch onto the surface similarities and completely ignore everything else in the film for...whatever reason.
Fair enough.
Old 08-02-04, 08:05 AM
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Originally posted by Debaser
Fair enough.
So you go on this ridiculous rant, insult a few members and call QT and PTA 'prison bitches' and that's your only retort, just "Fair enough"??? You've added so much to the discussion, thanks.
Old 08-02-04, 09:37 AM
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I have only ever seen Boogie Nights and Punch Drunk Love and they are two of my favorite movies. I enjoy PTA.

A couple of great Boogie Nights Quotes:

Reed Rothchild: Want to hear a poem I wrote? "I love you, you love me. Going down the sugar tree. We'll go down the sugar tree, and see lots of bees: playing, playing. But the bees won't sting, because you love me." That's it.

Dirk Diggler: What can you expect when you're on top? You know? It's like Napoleon. When he was the king, you know, people were just constantly trying to conquer him, you know, in the Roman Empire. So, it's history repeating itself all over again.

Buck Swope: See this system here? This is Hi-Fi... high fidelity. What that means is that it's the highest quality fidelity.
Old 08-02-04, 11:39 AM
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Originally posted by Rivero
He's probably referring to the fact that Boogie Nights borrows from everything and the kitchen sink: Scorsese, Tarantino, Spike Jonez, etc., etc. The influence of Robert Altman throughout Magnolia is undeniable.

That said, Magnolia practically demands repeat viewings. It's a brilliant, ballsy film with fantastic performances, a great soundtrack, wonderful cinematography and epic, operatic drama. It explores the importance of love and family to give an individual self-worth and reminds you that we do need others to help us overcome adversity, that we cannot make it through this crazy life alone. Anderson's best movie and one of the very best of 1999.
^ Well said. Magnolia is a stunning film and a personal favorite of mine.

And this rant about PTA and Altman... Duh. Altman is a huge influence on PTA's work, he's acknowleged that. But in no way does that "taint" Magnolia or make PTA a "hack bitch"...
Old 08-02-04, 12:18 PM
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I'd say it all has to do with how much time and how many movies you have. When I saw Magnolia, my reaction was prety much "Eh . . . nice, but not great." With all of the other movies that I have that I want to watch, I need a better reaction than that to put it on my rewatch list.

On the other hand, I was really surprised by how impressed I was with Boogie Nights the first time that I saw it (as many of you know, I have a particular fondness for good cinematograpghy. ) and have, since, seen it a number of times and purchased a copy.
Old 08-02-04, 02:22 PM
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Originally posted by Debaser
Fair enough.
You just made me spit Diet Dr Pepper all over my keyboard!
Old 08-02-04, 02:37 PM
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Not adding much here, but Boogie Nights is my favorite film of the 90's, and I love Magnolia too.

The actors that PTA featured in Boogie Nights have become ones I single out to watch in other films (Cheadle, PS Hoffman, JC Reilly, Molina, Guzman, Macy). He seems to have a way to showcase actors to their best advantage. His camerawork (while consistently labeled derivative) is wonderful. The common notion that he has elicited career best performances from "stars" like Burt Reynolds and Tom Cruise is another feather in his cap. His scores have been excellent....the whole Aimee Mann soundtrack being the impetus behind Magnolia is just an impressive concept to me.

Anyway, Boogie Nights is my favorite, although it is somewhat of a "hard watch" in the 2nd half...I would say try them again!

Last edited by Big Quasimodo; 08-02-04 at 02:44 PM.

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