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stunned by Last Tango In Paris

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stunned by Last Tango In Paris

Old 12-05-16, 09:53 AM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

Originally Posted by Mondo Kane
See it just for the casket scene with Brando. Roger Ebert said that was the greatest bit of acting he ever saw in a film.

I agree with Roger.
Old 12-05-16, 10:23 AM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

Just saw that bit. Even without the context of that scene, damn good acting.
Old 12-05-16, 10:36 AM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

Originally Posted by Mondo Kane
See it just for the casket scene with Brando. Roger Ebert said that was the greatest bit of acting he ever saw in a film.
That's because he wasn't really acting, rather he was pretty much falling apart emotionally and psychologically, for reals, during the filming and Bertolucci was fortunate enough to capture it on film.
Old 12-05-16, 10:37 AM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

Originally Posted by slop101
That's because he wasn't really acting, rather he was pretty much falling apart emotionally and psychologically, for reals, during the filming and Bertolucci was fortunate enough to capture it on film.
So just another day in the life of Brando.
Old 12-05-16, 12:08 PM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

I tried watching this movie twice, but i could never get through it...
Old 12-05-16, 12:17 PM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

It seems like most of the shitstorm around this is people reacting to Brando actually shoving his cock up Schneider's buttered poop chute without consent while filming the scene, which neither Brando, Bertolucci, or Schneider have actually claimed.

It's a bit unclear on what happened, as the story seems to contradict itself (one story claims it was unscripted, and later, in the same article, says the rape scene was in the script) and it isn't clear what actually happened. Even in the deadline article it says that it was sprung on her at the last minute, so she did know beforehand.

Seems like, at worst, the scene was scripted, but Bertolucci and Brando turned it into a sodomy scene at the last minute.
Old 12-05-16, 12:28 PM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

I believe the story has always been the same. She was not aware a stick of butter was going into her....

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/...b0c68e04813517

In a recently surfaced video, Bertolucci indicates the film is even more disturbing than previously thought. The director admits that he and Brando planned to film the rape scene without telling Schneider the full details of it.

“The sequence of the butter is an idea that I had with Marlon in the morning before shooting it,” Bertolucci said during the 2013 interview at La Cinémathèque Française in Paris.

“I’d been, in a way, horrible to Maria, because I didn’t tell her what was going on,” he said, because “I wanted her reaction as a girl, not as an actress.”


“I wanted her to react humiliated,” Bertolucci said. “I think she hated me and also Marlon because we didn’t tell her.”

Before Schneider died in 2011, the French actress revealed that the scene made her feel “humiliated” and “a little raped.” It wasn’t in the script, she claimed, and neither Bertolucci nor Brando apologized after filming.

“But during the scene, even though what Marlon was doing wasn’t real, I was crying real tears. I felt humiliated and, to be honest, I felt a little raped, both by Marlon and Bertolucci,” she said in a 2007 Daily Mail interview. “After the scene, Marlon didn’t console me or apologize. Thankfully, there was just one take.”
Old 12-05-16, 12:54 PM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

Originally Posted by Josh-da-man
It seems like most of the shitstorm around this is people reacting to Brando actually shoving his cock up Schneider's buttered poop chute without consent while filming the scene, which neither Brando, Bertolucci, or Schneider have actually claimed.
Is this what happens in the scene?

I haven't watched the movie. Caught the naughty bits on ... somewhere.

Is the hand-in-crotch shot as far as it goes? That's like PG-13 nowadays (okay, not, but you know what I mean). Oddly, Google doesn't seem to have an easy answer to this question.
Old 12-05-16, 01:11 PM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

'Maria, don’t worry, it’s just a movie,’ but during the scene, even though what Marlon was doing wasn’t real, I was crying real tears.
This quote really gets down to the essence of performance and the complexities of acting and the cinematic experience. "What he was doing wasn't real, (but) I was crying real tears." And when Sophie made her choice she wasn't really picking which of her children would die, but she cried real tears; so did the audience. The Method demands that you prepare your character to the point where it can get dangerous or identity can get clouded.

Similarly, Douglas Fairbanks and Tom Cruise and Johnny Noxville put themselves into situations where they could genuinely die. When you are making a film about the extremities of human behavior you run the risk of actually becoming a victim.
Old 12-05-16, 02:45 PM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

^ I think the big difference is that Cruise, Fairbanks and Noxville willingly go into those extremes, but Schneider didn't willingly go there she was forced into that state.
Its like me trowing you off a plane for the sake of the scene, of course i give you a parachute but you know still a dick move
Old 12-05-16, 06:08 PM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

It's hardly the first time a director has been abusive toward a star. Ford, Lang, Hitchcock, and Kubrick all have legends of physical and/or mental abuse. I get that it's the sexual angle that's setting people off, but it's really just another form of physical abuse that many directors have perpetrated. They do it believing it will be great art to push boundaries.

A director by his/her very nature is a manipulator.

There's been numerous examples of a director telling an actor the slap will be fake and then telling the other actor "slap her for real and we'll get a great reaction." Is that director manipulative? Definitely. Is he abusive? Possibly. Is he criminally guilty of assault? Doubtful.

Last edited by Mabuse; 12-05-16 at 06:43 PM.
Old 12-05-16, 10:00 PM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

I just want to point out that we have reached a point where people are talking about the performance qualities of Marlon Brando and Johnny Knoxville in the same breath.
Old 12-06-16, 07:19 AM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

I haven't seen the film and I'm confused by a lot of what I'm reading.

Stars are tweeting their outrage at the film, Bertolucci, and Brando saying things like "you're watching a 19 y/o get raped."

But the actress herself said "even though what Marlon was doing wasn’t real", which leads me to conclude that she filmed a disturbing scene and felt genuinely disturbed by it. Which is different than being raped. Right?

Don't get me wrong, I find rape one of the the most deplorable things you can do to a person but this seems a bit overblown. There may be ethical questions about the practice of a director not fully explaining to his/her actor what a scene is about but to throw accusations about rape is serious business.
Old 12-06-16, 08:47 AM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

Rape is sexual penetration of a person through force or threats, or of a person who is unable to consent. People on Twitter who are using the word 'rape' for an unpleasant experience that did not involve sexual penetration are softening the word. It minimizes the experiences the victims who were actually raped.
Old 12-06-16, 09:35 AM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

So... am I not allowed to say I love The Dreamers anymore?
Old 12-06-16, 09:40 AM
  #41  
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

Originally Posted by Nick Danger
Rape is sexual penetration of a person through force or threats, or of a person who is unable to consent. People on Twitter who are using the word 'rape' for an unpleasant experience that did not involve sexual penetration are softening the word. It minimizes the experiences the victims who were actually raped.
I haven't seen the movie, and I'm a bit confused about what the actual situation here is, but...

Sticking butter up someone's ass without telling them... does that qualify as forced sexual penetration, or are you only talking about body parts or solid objects going inside body orifices?
Old 12-06-16, 09:59 AM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

I'm glad that things are going so well in the world that we can throw some faux outrage at an early 70's movie.
Old 12-06-16, 09:59 AM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

Originally Posted by Timber
I'm glad that things are going so well in the world that we can throw some faux outrage at an early 70's movie.
I am outraged at your lack of outrage.
Old 12-06-16, 10:36 AM
  #44  
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

Originally Posted by Nick Danger
Rape is sexual penetration of a person through force or threats, or of a person who is unable to consent. People on Twitter who are using the word 'rape' for an unpleasant experience that did not involve sexual penetration are softening the word. It minimizes the experiences the victims who were actually raped.
I think people are under the impression that Brando actually raped Schneider on the set, and Bertolucci filmed it and included it in the movie.
Old 12-06-16, 11:34 AM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

That was the first impression that I got when reading the click-bait article and one they don't do a good job of clarifying unless you research yourself further and read statements by both Schneider and Bertolucci.

Basically it appears that all parties knew they were filming a forceful sex/rape scene. What Schneider didn't know was that Brando was go to take some butter and smear it on her anus before simulating the sex/rape for the camera. At no point did Brando actually penetrate her during the scene. Is that the gist?
Old 12-06-16, 12:27 PM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

Hey, can we bring back the term "legitimate rape" now?
Old 12-06-16, 12:58 PM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

let me translate for you guys. She wasn't penetrated by anything in this scene. It was just a physical violation of her and her comfort. She knew wtf the scene was. But didn't know wtf Brando and Bertolucci were going to do w/ her. It was a violation on her body by those two.

Her saying it was like she was raped? Means that it was a violation of her. Rape, by definition, can be attributed to how she feels by how she was treated. There's a difference and she saying how she felt about it is fine.

Was it wrong of them to do that? Yes. It's a personal violation of her bodily comfort. And the way she said it, reads like that. It's not penetration but a feeling of violation of her body. Her feeling what she felt is right for her to have such an emotion.

Last edited by Solid Snake; 12-06-16 at 01:05 PM.
Old 12-06-16, 03:40 PM
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Re: stunned by Last Tango In Paris

Before he died, Brando regretted wasting that delicious butter.

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