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I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

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I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Old 12-04-23, 06:04 PM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Originally Posted by Crocker Jarmen
You make many good points. #3 is the main one. I've gone to the movies almost a hundred times this year, and very rarely has there been more than a dozen other people in there. A few times there have been good crowds of thirty or more people, but more often it's been five or six. On one occasion, it was just me by myself. No one I know feels its worth the effort to go to the movies because of all their streaming options. Even for movies they want to see, there's no urgency, because it'll be out of the theatre and available for them to watch at home within a couple of months.
That's the way I feel. To relate it to another thread here, there is no FOMO
Old 12-04-23, 07:09 PM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

In other words, Television finally killed movies (more or less). It just took 70 years!
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Old 12-04-23, 10:42 PM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Originally Posted by Josh-da-man
One, the cost of going to the movies has skyrocketed. We're looking at about thirty dollars a head, so if people are going to go to movies, they want some kind of big spectacle like superheroes, sci-fi/fantasy, or Fast and Furious movies.
I haven't gone to a movie theatre in 6 years (and don't plan on ever returning), but $30 a person? Did ticket prices skyrocket in the last 6 years or is that including the theatre food and other stuff?
Old 12-04-23, 10:45 PM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Originally Posted by Coral
I haven't gone to a movie theatre in 6 years (and don't plan on ever returning), but $30 a person? Did ticket prices skyrocket in the last 6 years or is that including the theatre food and other stuff?
$10-20 ticket depending if it's a regular or premium screen. There are days with discount matinees that are 1/2 off.

And if you want to splurge on snacks, it could be $10 to 20+ depending on how much you want.

Movie theater subscription programs will save you a ton of money

AMC A-List - $24 for 12 movies a month (I save hundreds per month using this program)

Regal Unlimited - $24 - for Unlimited movies

That's how I see all the big spectacle movies.

But, I know there are some here who probably don't think they are worth it to them because they don't have the time to see that many.

Last edited by DJariya; 12-04-23 at 11:01 PM.
Old 12-04-23, 11:03 PM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Originally Posted by fujishig
That's the way I feel. To relate it to another thread here, there is no FOMO
Great, I'm looking forward to your review of Avengers: Kang Dynasty in 2030
Old 12-05-23, 01:56 AM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Originally Posted by Coral
I haven't gone to a movie theatre in 6 years (and don't plan on ever returning), but $30 a person? Did ticket prices skyrocket in the last 6 years or is that including the theatre food and other stuff?
Just checked the nearby theaters and tickets run about $8.00 for a matinee, $12 for an evening showing, and $18 for an IMAX ticket. Popcorn and a drink will then set you back an additional $18; $10 for popcorn and $8 for a drink. And if you want something like nachos, that's $8, chicken tenders are $10, hot dogs are $8, and boxes of candy are $5-$6.

So, yeah, about thirty bucks a person for a ticket, one food item, and a drink.

And, I swear, $18 for popcorn and a drink is just insulting. That shit probably has a cost of less than fifty cents.
Old 12-05-23, 06:27 AM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Last week I paid $18.50 for a single ticket, with senior discount, to see a morning screening of a foreign film with subtitles at a relatively small arthouse multiplex in Manhattan and I sat in their tiniest screen.

I came to the theater with a cup of coffee that I'd purchased at a nearby deli for $2. After the movie, I needed some food (not snack) to take my vitamins with before heading to another appointment, so I ordered a single beef empanada at the theater's concession stand. It was $5 and had about a teaspoon of ground beef in it,
Old 12-05-23, 10:15 AM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Originally Posted by Josh-da-man
Just checked the nearby theaters and tickets run about $8.00 for a matinee, $12 for an evening showing, and $18 for an IMAX ticket. Popcorn and a drink will then set you back an additional $18; $10 for popcorn and $8 for a drink. And if you want something like nachos, that's $8, chicken tenders are $10, hot dogs are $8, and boxes of candy are $5-$6.

So, yeah, about thirty bucks a person for a ticket, one food item, and a drink.

And, I swear, $18 for popcorn and a drink is just insulting. That shit probably has a cost of less than fifty cents.
Again though, that's how they make their money, they barely make money on the tickets.
Old 12-05-23, 12:00 PM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Originally Posted by Josh-da-man
Just checked the nearby theaters and tickets run about $8.00 for a matinee, $12 for an evening showing, and $18 for an IMAX ticket. Popcorn and a drink will then set you back an additional $18; $10 for popcorn and $8 for a drink. And if you want something like nachos, that's $8, chicken tenders are $10, hot dogs are $8, and boxes of candy are $5-$6.

So, yeah, about thirty bucks a person for a ticket, one food item, and a drink.

And, I swear, $18 for popcorn and a drink is just insulting. That shit probably has a cost of less than fifty cents.
$8 for a ticket isn't bad... $12 is a little too much IMO (which is what I paid the last time I went)... $18 is nuts.
$10 for popcorn and $8 for a drink - both are insane. In the last 20 years I've only been to a movie theatre about 15 times (a few of those times at the Toronto Film Festival)... I never grabbed anything from the concession.

While the price was a turnoff, the final straw was having to sit through 30+ commercials (not movie trailers, actual fucking commercials like you'd see on TV) before the movie would start. Pay to watch a movie and still have to sit through commercials? Fuck that shit. Nothing beats watching a movie in my own home.
Old 12-05-23, 04:36 PM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Originally Posted by Josh-da-man
The problem isn't superhero movies, it's just Hollywood (and the world) has moved beyond making the kinds movies Jodie Foster wants them to make. And it comes down to a lot of factors.

One, the cost of going to the movies has skyrocketed. We're looking at about thirty dollars a head, so if people are going to go to movies, they want some kind of big spectacle like superheroes, sci-fi/fantasy, or Fast and Furious movies.

Two, the kinds of movies Foster wants to see made are better served as tv series through venues like Netflix, Apple TV+, HBO, or FX.

Three, we can watch movies at home now on cheap 4K tvs on either DVD, blu-ray, or HD streaming. We aren't watching movies on an old 19" Zenith on VHS anymore. Our options for watching non-broadcast tv content at home have increased drastically since the 1970s and 1980s. Before the cable tv and VCR revolution, your only option for watching something that wasn't CHiPs or Starsky & Hutch was going to local movies theater and hoping they were playing something good that week.

Four, the crackdown on letting children and teenagers into R-rated movies also had a huge impact on Hollywood, where they were forced to water down a lot of their content to get a PG or PG-13 rating, making it essentially tv fare, in order to appeal to the broadest possible audience. This especially hurt the comedy and horror genres that traditionally appealed to the under-eighteen crowd.

So if people are going to watch a drama like Nell or Little Man Tate, they're going to do so in the comfort of their own homes instead of heading out to a movie theater. No w, those projects would be made as Netflix series.

I'm not sure if comparing superheroes to westerns is apt. Westerns were popular back in the mid-20th century because the cowboy image was part of the zeitgeist. The generations (mostly Generation X and beyond) that grew up in the space age seem to have left those pastoral fantasies behind for things like Star Wars, Harry Potter, and video games.

And the popularity of Westerns was probably helped because the movies were incredibly cheap and easy to make. Get some horses, guns, and cowboy hats. Shoot out in the desert on a pre-built backlot. And you have a quick and dirty movie. Making western movies was probably more like making episodes of a tv series with standing sets, andreadily available costumes and props.

I think another reason for the dominance of superhero movies in the 21st century comes down the simple fact that we only now have the movie-making technology to do them justice. Prior to the CGI revolution, filmmakers were really hamstrung by the available technology like green screens, the limits of make-up, and models. A comic book was just pen and ink on paper, limited only by what the writer could think up and what the artist could draw. Now, with CGI, those same rules now apply to film-making, and filmmakers are only bound by their imaginations (and budgets, but that's always been the case).

Superheroes have always been lurking around in the back of pop culture, but the stories were difficult to follow, represented a recurring cost, and reading comic books had a social stigma to it. But now, the past two or so decades, Hollywood has been able to deliver the content to an audience that's hungry for it.
I agree with you for the most part, but I'd still say, there are to many superhero movies. I understand that people want a spectacal when they go to the theater. I like to watch a Fast & Furious movie every couple of years, but not 5 of those every year. Make a Marvel movie something special, but three every year should be a phase. People would get tired of James Bond and Mission: Impossible if they had those every year, with a couple of spin offs.
Tim Burton's Batman was a huge phenomenon, so was Independence Day or Titanic, but they didn't make 3 of those per year, for 10 years.

Christopher Nolan shows on a regular basis that you can give the audience a spectacle without making the same movie over and over again. I don't think that superhero movies will vanish and my hope is that they will keep on making them, something like The Dark Knight trilogy or the Spider-Verse movies once year or every two years has more value to me than Blue Beetle, Shazam 2 and The Flash. None of those movies is terrible, but completly forgettable, because I've seen Blue Beetle 10 times before.
Now it's the 10th lone rider coming into town and getting into trouble with the evil rancher.
Old 12-05-23, 05:18 PM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

By contrast, seeing 6 hours of Marvel (3 films, 2 hr each) in a single year seems like too much, but then we go home and consume 22 hours of CSI or Chicago Fire in a single year (season).
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Old 12-05-23, 05:35 PM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

It's more than 6 hours though if you count the Disney + series.
Old 12-05-23, 05:36 PM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Originally Posted by GuessWho
By contrast, seeing 6 hours of Marvel (3 films, 2 hr each) in a single year seems like too much, but then we go home and consume 22 hours of CSI or Chicago Fire in a single year (season).
That's not really a fair comparison. That is free broadcast television that message boards like this doesn't talk about.

A big event Marvel or DC movie is a pop culture event that people have to spend money on, schedule day/week around. They are more the talk of social media, Cons, Fan Expos and even an outdated message board like this. I know some nowadays don't care, but if you don't keep up with it the 1st week or 2 it's released, then you will be completely out of the hot topics.
Old 12-05-23, 05:48 PM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Marty was right.
Old 12-05-23, 06:06 PM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Originally Posted by Coral
$8 for a ticket isn't bad... $12 is a little too much IMO (which is what I paid the last time I went)... $18 is nuts.
$10 for popcorn and $8 for a drink - both are insane. In the last 20 years I've only been to a movie theatre about 15 times (a few of those times at the Toronto Film Festival)... I never grabbed anything from the concession.

While the price was a turnoff, the final straw was having to sit through 30+ commercials (not movie trailers, actual fucking commercials like you'd see on TV) before the movie would start. Pay to watch a movie and still have to sit through commercials? Fuck that shit. Nothing beats watching a movie in my own home.
We get points with our Scene Visa credit card at Cineplex Odeon theaters here in Canada. We get so many points, we haven't actually paid for tickets or concessions there in five years or so (plus digital rentals on the Cineplex streaming channel). But we saw The Marvels at one of those fancy Landmark Cinemas with the big recliners, etc. It wasn't cheap ($16.99 for a "Laser Ultra" ticket, which looked and sounded great, compared to $11.99 for regular tickets) and we couldn't use the Cineplex points, but it was a fun night out for the family so we thought it was ok to splurge a bit. Plus as usual, my wife snuck in drinks and snacks for the kids (shhh!). I had to buy popcorn though (popcorn and drink combo around $17), I always need popcorn at the movie theater (the only time I really eat it).
Old 12-05-23, 09:52 PM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Originally Posted by darkflounder
Iron Man could attract J6P. Guy in a flying suit blowing stuff up. Can't get any more basic than that.

Hey, if Daredevil can do decent business, then pretty much any decent comic book movie has a shot.

I'm still waiting for the Reid Fleming: Worlds Toughest Milkman movie.
Damn, look at darkflounder and his crystal ball! Or maybe he's Kevin Feige
Old 12-05-23, 09:56 PM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Originally Posted by Why So Blu?
Marty was right.
About?
Old 12-05-23, 11:50 PM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Originally Posted by Coral
About?
I believe his criticism was that the MCU is sucking up capital that would normally finance original films.
Old 12-06-23, 12:25 AM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Originally Posted by Troy Stiffler
I believe his criticism was that the MCU is sucking up capital that would normally finance original films.
He's right about that - but it's not exactly a revelation or anything.
Old 12-06-23, 03:30 AM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Originally Posted by GuessWho
By contrast, seeing 6 hours of Marvel (3 films, 2 hr each) in a single year seems like too much, but then we go home and consume 22 hours of CSI or Chicago Fire in a single year (season).
I don't watch those or I stopped because it's always the same and even the people who do watch those, didn't care for CSI: Cyber.
No one watches Chicago Fire every week because it's a spectacle every week.
Old 12-06-23, 07:51 AM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

I liken the "comic book movie" to those comic stories having 3 or 4 two-page art only spreads in an issue. Lots of flash to show off the skills of the artists (penciller, inker, colorist) with little to no story to back up the art. Basically an issue you'll read once and likely never again as there's little to no substance outside the pretty pictures. Like those 2-page spreads, the 20-30 minute extended CGI battle/fight sequences bore me to tears.
Old 12-06-23, 08:58 AM
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re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

The splash page analogy could be said of any action set piece. Itís all about having the action being done intelligently and drive the overall plot. If Terminator 1 was a comic, when Arnold starts blasting in the nightclub that would be a two page splash page. But the buildup to that moment and the sequence itself reveals a lot.

With the MCU, a lot of the drama is muted by constant jokes during the fighting, or calling attention to how strange the situation is.
Old 01-01-24, 12:38 PM
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Superhero movie audience fatigue

Maya Phillips addresses this issue in a New York Times article that I found interesting. Since I've seen so few of these movies in the years since BLACK PANTHER and INFINITY WARS (I think the only one I've seen since has been SHANG CHI), I suffered this fatigue much sooner than most people. I wonder how those who continue to follow MCU closely would respond to this.

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/27/m...sultPosition=1

Phillips is a fan and has written well about this subject in the past and about anime, which endears her to me. Here are some choice quotes (and I love the callback to Stan Lee and his "Bullpen Bulletins," which I remember).

Even for dedicated fans of the Marvel Cinematic Universe, the amount of prerequisite knowledge required to watch any M.C.U. movie or show nowadays is tantamount to a college course.

And it seems like audiences are tiring of the constant homework assignments. A year of diminishing box office returns is more proof that the casual superhero moviegoer is becoming more and more of a rarity given how much is being asked of them, which is full, multiplatform investment.
These franchises are spelling their own downfalls, as the price of entry into the fandoms has become frustratingly high for the dedicated disciples of these worlds, and not at all worth it for casual viewers or prospective new fans. This year has been a prime example of what happens when a pop-culture movement takes hold of an industry and then overreaches.
Back when these superheroes were still on print pages and not big and little screens, Stan Lee, the godfather of American comics and the creator of many of these characters, used to include what he called “Bullpen Bulletins” in his issues. These informal letters to readers, including announcements, promotions and context for and commentary on his work, were indicative of Lee’s relationship to the fandom. He fostered a community around his heroes, built from the ground up: He maintained a dialogue with fans, treating them as not mindless consumers but highbrow connoisseurs of the art form.

Whatever “Bullpen Bulletin” factor may have ever existed with today’s superhero consumers seems to be fading fast. As franchises — particularly the M.C.U., fueled by Disney’s multibillion-dollar appetite — continue to grow and threaten ever more, ever greater crossovers, it’s becoming more difficult to understand what their endgame is (pun intended) when it comes to their fans. Who wants to watch 30 films and 10 TV series to engage with a franchise that continues to spread itself too thin at the expense of quality filmmaking?
The franchises continue to risk fatiguing their current fans and alienating potential ones. More stand-alone films, more inventiveness, more diversions from the grand plots and cookie-cutter setups would give these stories and their fans room to explore, but instead we’re stuck in a cycle of ever-expanding multiverses, narratives and timelines that even the best S.H.I.E.L.D. agents would find impossible to keep straight.
Old 01-01-24, 02:39 PM
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Re: Superhero movie audience fatigue

Westerns. Action movies. Comic book movies. They all have a lifespan.

Im not their accountant. But Iíd imagine Marvel will find itís time to scale back and adjust to lower demand.
Old 01-01-24, 04:41 PM
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Re: I'm Afraid Hollywood is Gonna Kill the Comic Book / Superhero Movie!

Wow. Time travel to start the new year.

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