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Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Old 02-22-19, 11:00 AM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by morriscroy View Post
Wonder how large of a bribe the bluray patent holders (ie. Sony, etc ...) paid Microsoft to include it on XboxOne.
None, if I had to guess. Microsoft is more services/bells-and-whistles-oriented than Sony is.

Originally Posted by DJariya View Post
Yeah waiting for Black Friday or 60-70% off sales is not the encouraging the studios to release more quality titles on physical media.
I don't necessarily wait until Black Friday, but the studios have trained me to wait a little bit. A $29.99 title on week 1 will frequently be $19.99 2-3 weeks later. If it'll be 2-3 weeks until I get around to watching it anyway, why not wait that extra little bit and save some money?
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Old 02-22-19, 11:37 AM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by Gizmo View Post
So because you don't know how to properly use Netflix for streaming you think disc is superior? Maybe one of your grand kids can come over and show you the dozens (?) of monthly TV releases exclusive to the service, all of last years (and seasons) CW shows + tons of other stuff that isn't 10+ years old. And the Netflix DVD ones you got are old movies....so are you trying to trash the streamer for apparently having "old" shows yet you asked Netflix to send you "old" movies?
Calling something "ten years old" doesn't mean to me that they're bad. Calling something "TV shows" means to me they're bad. While I was stuck on the sofa I watched a dozen episodes of Death in Paradise, which was the same thing over and over, and I got bored. I watched the first season of Dexter, which takes nine hours to resolve the plot, and I got bored. I watched three episodes of Better Call Saul and five episodes of Jessica Jones before I got bored with them.

I didn't watch any programs about cute 20-year olds with superpowers or magic powers.

As I said in my original post, I don't see the point of streaming. If the point is watching TV shows, then I'm not interested.
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Old 02-22-19, 12:11 PM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by Nick Danger View Post
As I said in my original post, I don't see the point of streaming. If the point is watching TV shows, then I'm not interested.
Streaming is terrific if you're attacking it from a broad perspective. Rather than "hey, let's watch this specific movie", more of a "let's watch something". If you want horror, you're covered. If you want romantic comedies, you're covered. If you want action, you're covered. But if you want to watch, say, a sequel in your favorite summer blockbuster franchise or your wife's most cherished rom-com, you're probably gonna be S.O.L. And, personally, I usually do have something specific in mind.

There's a lot that Netflix does extremely well. They have more buzzy series than I could ever hope to keep up with. The medium is incredibly flexible in a way that broadcast/basic cable could never match. Take Russian Doll, for instance: a three and a half hour Groundhog Day-style comedy/drama. It's too oddball and vulgar to exist on, say, NBC. It's probably too short and self-contained for HBO to interested. But it's perfect for Netflix, with each episode ending on a note that practically demands watching just one more. Or even The Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt, which was created with broadcast TV in mind, can be a half hour comedy most of the time but indulge itself in a borderline-feature-length homage to Sliding Doors if it's so inclined. Netflix is far better at series than they are at movies, but there are a few gems along those lines, attracting talents like Noah Baumbach, Alfonso Cuarón, and the Coens.

Still, I spend more time with discs than I do with streaming, at least when it comes to movies. It's annoying when my wife or I have something in particular we want to watch, it's not on Blu-ray, and we have to search one of those meta-streaming-engines to see who, if anyone, has it streaming. (And the answer is fairly frequently "nobody", even if you're willing to pay a la carte.) But then there are those times when something's streaming and it's unavailable on Blu-ray, and I'm thankful to have the option.
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Old 02-22-19, 03:12 PM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by melasnus View Post
QUESTIONS:

What does UHD discs max out at?
Also, why do reviews (at other sites) claim a disc release comes from a <4K resolution master?
Raw scans for new film transfers are often struck at 4K resolution. This largely applies to older movies shot entirely on film stock. That is what most reviews and press are mentioning when they use 4K. When reading a UHD review, the important thing to pay attention to is the quality of the HDR pass. That is the real magic that separates UHD from Blu-ray, not the mere resolution difference.

Newer movies are usually transferred from their 2K digital intermediate, or occasionally a 4K digital intermediate.
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Old 02-22-19, 08:58 PM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by Gizmo View Post
Wait till it goes on sale just like physical media? Most new release start out at $19.99-$24.99, but typically iTunes/VUDU has them on sale a month later for $9.99 (and in 4k). You can buy digital copies directly from people buying the physical media version for $5-$8 all day every day and often 2-3 weeks before the disc even hits shelves. I've been enjoying Wreck it Ralph 2 for a week now. I won't even bother to mention catalog, over time, will see significant sales as low as $4.99 or in a bundle.

So yes, $19.99 may not be worth it on day 1 (which I also won't pay - even for a disc version), but let's not pretend every movie has that price for ever and ever.
True true
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Old 02-23-19, 12:38 AM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by Gizmo View Post
Wait till it goes on sale just like physical media? Most new release start out at $19.99-$24.99, but typically iTunes/VUDU has them on sale a month later for $9.99 (and in 4k). You can buy digital copies directly from people buying the physical media version for $5-$8 all day every day and often 2-3 weeks before the disc even hits shelves. I've been enjoying Wreck it Ralph 2 for a week now. I won't even bother to mention catalog, over time, will see significant sales as low as $4.99 or in a bundle.

So yes, $19.99 may not be worth it on day 1 (which I also won't pay - even for a disc version), but let's not pretend every movie has that price for ever and ever.
We really don't know how the pricing structure will work once everything is digital. Right now the studios want to entice consumers with the digital product and are willing to cut the prices accordingly to compete with the other formats. There may come a day when the Paramount website has the exclusive rights to stream Raiders of the Lost Ark and they want $15, you're just going to have to pay it or watch something else.

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Old 02-23-19, 08:49 AM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by PhantomStranger View Post

Newer movies are usually transferred from their 2K digital intermediate, or occasionally a 4K digital intermediate.
Sooo, if a 2K DI is used for a 4K UHD disk it has to be upconverted (as opposed to the use of a 4K DI)?
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Old 02-23-19, 09:02 AM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by melasnus View Post
Sooo, if a 2K DI is used for a 4K UHD disk it has to be upconverted (as opposed to the use of a 4K DI)?
That's exactly right!

Actually, I have no idea and the above question is entirely why 4K is where it is at right now as far as home media goes. Whoever said earlier about 98% of the population doesn't know or care...is correct.
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Old 02-23-19, 09:56 AM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by melasnus View Post
Sooo, if a 2K DI is used for a 4K UHD disk it has to be upconverted (as opposed to the use of a 4K DI)?
Right. But the 2K DI is what's being shown in theaters (in fact, most projectors in theaters max out at 2K), so it's not that the home video release is specifically being compromised. 2K is still the standard finish (despite these movies pretty much always being shot at a much higher-res), although 4K finishes are becoming more and more prevalent for new theatrical releases. Shooting at a higher resolution than the final output has its advantages as well -- oversampling, more flexibility for reframing, etc.

2K is faster/less expensive to work with in post-production (replacing all these 2K-centric pipelines is a huge deal), and visual effects are generally rendered at 2K, so even a 4K DI will invariably have a bunch of 2K material in it. (And if the VFX are 2K, everything in the shot is 2K, upscaled even in a 4K DI.) Completely computer animated movies are always 2K and will be for the foreseeable future. And a 2K DI, as mentioned earlier, is still a considerable step-up from what Blu-ray can reproduce.

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Old 02-23-19, 12:37 PM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by orangerunner View Post
We really don't know how the pricing structure will work once everything is digital. Right now the studios want to entice consumers with the digital product and are willing to cut the prices accordingly to compete with the other formats. There may come a day when the Paramount website has the exclusive rights to stream Raiders of the Lost Ark and they want $15, you're just going to have to pay it or watch something else.
That's a pretty bold assumption not really based in reality.
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Old 02-23-19, 03:26 PM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by Adam Tyner View Post
Right. But the 2K DI is what's being shown in theaters (in fact, most projectors in theaters max out at 2K), so it's not that the home video release is specifically being compromised. 2K is still the standard finish (despite these movies pretty much always being shot at a much higher-res), although 4K finishes are becoming more and more prevalent for new theatrical releases. Shooting at a higher resolution than the final output has its advantages as well -- oversampling, more flexibility for reframing, etc.

2K is faster/less expensive to work with in post-production (replacing all these 2K-centric pipelines is a huge deal), and visual effects are generally rendered at 2K, so even a 4K DI will invariably have a bunch of 2K material in it. (And if the VFX are 2K, everything in the shot is 2K, upscaled even in a 4K DI.) Completely computer animated movies are always 2K and will be for the foreseeable future. And a 2K DI, as mentioned earlier, is still a considerable step-up from what Blu-ray can reproduce.
Thanks for the explanation!
I appreciate your confirming many of my suspicions.
Originally Posted by Spiderbite View Post

Actually, I have no idea and the above question is entirely why 4K is where it is at right now as far as home media goes.
The way 4K UHD releases are being marketing will kill the format if it doesn't change.
If the studios truly want the format to succeed, they have to step up the AV quality considerably.

When compared to The Early Days, the AV of BD releases of recent films today is often amazing.
The difference between the 2 formats of these releases is often NOT great enough IMO.
There has to be an obvious benefit or consumers won't pony up their hard-earned cash.
Hell, many BDs have an Atmos track...

BD went thru the very same thing years ago...the studios had to up their game.
Whoever said earlier about 98% of the population doesn't know or care...is correct.
Maybe it's because 98% haven't seen/heard the REAL deal?
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Old 02-23-19, 11:52 PM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

FWIW, this popped up on my YouTube tonight:

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Old 02-24-19, 12:51 PM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Not sure who that video is targeted towards.

The few people who agree with it are buying movies on discs for the reasons he mentioned. And the majority of people already have shown they don't care about the better video/audio and view movies as disposable entertainment and don't need it sitting on their shelves.
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Old 02-24-19, 01:34 PM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by DJariya View Post
I'm personally not worried with one player exiting the market. I
Two - Oppo already left the market. A premium and a middle-of-the-road brand decided physical media isn't worth their time.
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Old 02-24-19, 02:17 PM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by Coral View Post

The few people who agree with it are buying movies on discs for the reasons he mentioned. And the majority of people already have shown they don't care about the better video/audio and view movies as disposable entertainment and don't need it sitting on their shelves.
Really? You think the art of movies is like tissues or paper towels? Disposable.

I know not every movie is good, but there are many including new ones that people love and cherish and want to relive. I would never view movies as disposable. Movies bad or good provide jobs for people and the economy and many takes years to even get made. So a lot of pride goes into getting them made. I would never have the attitude to throw it away like trash and move on because it's "disposable." Many appreciate the time and technical aspects that go into making films. Not every movie I see I want to own, but again I would never view film that way.






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Old 02-24-19, 04:48 PM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

I think it's more of disposable income. Folks may love film and film art but they're not going to fork over the cash for the best. To some, a DVD or stream, is good enough. I know those into niche markets have a hard time grasping that concept - but most folks don't give a shit about bells and whistles when it comes to media entertainment.

EDIT - I am not saying that cinema is disposable. I am talking about the money on hand angle.
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Old 02-24-19, 06:16 PM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

so bottomline it for me: what's the big deal about Samsung not making bluray players anymore?
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Old 02-25-19, 12:00 AM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by DJariya View Post
Really? You think the art of movies is like tissues or paper towels? Disposable.

I know not every movie is good, but there are many including new ones that people love and cherish and want to relive. I would never view movies as disposable. Movies bad or good provide jobs for people and the economy and many takes years to even get made. So a lot of pride goes into getting them made. I would never have the attitude to throw it away like trash and move on because it's "disposable." Many appreciate the time and technical aspects that go into making films. Not every movie I see I want to own, but again I would never view film that way.


The average person just doesn't care that much. They'll watch a movie, either hate it, like it or love it - and then move on. Maybe they'll watch it a few more times if they love it, but that doesn't happen often. They just don't take it so seriously.

I can't tell you how many people I know who will gladly start watching a movie halfway in, have no problem letting a movie to play while they go to the bathroom or get some food, or just talk throughout a movie. Hell, how many times have we heard about people in theatres talking during a movie or going on their phone? It's just disposable entertainment to them. Consume it in whatever manner they want and then move on.
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Old 02-25-19, 12:05 AM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by OldBoy View Post
so bottomline it for me: what's the big deal about Samsung not making bluray players anymore?
It's just another example of a company bailing on physical movie format. You'll still be able to buy blu-ray players from other manufacturers, but it's showing a trend. It may go the way of CD players and CDs. You can still buy CDs, but the market is getting smaller. When was the last time you saw a CD player for sale at a store that wasn't an audio/audiophile shop?
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Old 02-25-19, 09:22 AM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

so bottomline it for me: what's the big deal about Samsung not making bluray players anymore?
Samsung was first to the market with a blu-ray player and now they are washing their hands clean of physical media. Bottom line for you is if you care or not about a major CE deciding that physical media isn't worth it anymore for them (while doubling down on streaming with Apple). Given that LG also is in bed somewhat with Apple they could also be going that way or making very limited about of players.

BTW - anyone want to buy an Oppo 203 region modded? Just sitting in its box for the past few years...
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Old 02-25-19, 09:31 AM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Ha, Oppo. My cheap Curtis Mathes still does the job easily. And for a fraction of those overpriced players.
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Old 02-25-19, 10:29 AM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by Coral View Post
When was the last time you saw a CD player for sale at a store that wasn't an audio/audiophile shop?
I'm not sure if anyone actually makes standalone CD players.
AFAIK, all optical players are multi-format these days: CD, BD, etc.

Originally Posted by Gizmo View Post

BTW - anyone want to buy an Oppo 203 region modded? Just sitting in its box for the past few years...
DVD and BD region-free?
I know UHD disks do not have region locks on them...
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Old 02-25-19, 10:40 AM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by melasnus View Post
I'm not sure if anyone actually makes standalone CD players.
I see a fair number on Best Buy when I do a quick search -- home theater components as well as standalone boomboxes, portable players, etc.
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Old 02-25-19, 11:17 AM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by Adam Tyner View Post
I see a fair number on Best Buy when I do a quick search -- home theater components as well as standalone boomboxes, portable players, etc.
But do you see stand-alone CD players in the actual stores?

I can't remember when I saw an actual stand-alone CD player at any store outside of an dedicated audio shop.
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Old 02-25-19, 11:26 AM
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Re: Samsung exiting Blu-ray Player Market

Originally Posted by Coral View Post
But do you see stand-alone CD players in the actual stores?
There are 10 Best Buy locations within 75 miles of me, and the Onkyo 6-CD changer is in-stock at every single one of them. Best Buy's in-house brand, Insignia, has a portable CD player that's in-stock in every store I could quickly find as well.

Nearly all of those 10 have LG's mini-shelf CD system in-stock. Ditto for this Sony CD boombox.
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