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The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

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The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Old 02-23-15, 04:03 PM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

I bought the theatricals and then the extendeds of LOTR on DVD. I still have the extendeds because of the beautiful packaging, but replaced the theatricals on Blu because the DVDs looked pretty bad.

We've bought the theatrical versions of The Hobbit on Bluray with the Lego extra but I'm waiting for a boxset of the extended versions to buy all at once.
Old 02-26-15, 12:28 PM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Looks like Best Buy is getting a steelbook



Also on the same day, the trilogy is being released. Best Buy is also getting a steelbook version of that



and regular 2D & 3D versions as well

Old 02-26-15, 12:35 PM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

they look nice and all, but will wait for the 3D Extended Edition and rent the theatrical...
Old 03-06-15, 10:06 AM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

ditto on the 3D Extended Edition
Old 03-06-15, 10:31 AM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

I'm not sure I could sit through an extended trilogy

I like that steel book.
Old 03-06-15, 11:32 AM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Originally Posted by DVD Polizei View Post
I hope there's a box set EXACTLY like the Blu-ray EE Trilogy, with the gold accents, etc., so they will match. Haven't purchased any of these movies yet, and I'm getting anxious. Very anxious.
Originally Posted by Why So Blu? View Post
Extended for me.
That's what she said.

Originally Posted by RocShemp View Post
Given WB claiming to be fully on board with Atmos (enough for them to re-issue Gravity) and doubtlessly not passing up an opportunity to milk even more money from this franchise, it just might happen. What they would never do is remaster a movie whose previous BD had mediocre picture quality (I'm looking at you The Dark Knight).
Much as I love Christopher Nolan's devotion to celluloid, the fact that he doesn't use DIs from which HD masters can easily be transferred to disc probably means that they're too lazy. I'm taking it DK and DKR BDs were substandard?

Originally Posted by DVD Polizei View Post
Probably looking at mid to late 2017 for this set. Depending on Jackson's idea of creating a respectable 6-film collection and possibly more extras being piled on (there are several hours of deleted scenes from LOTR alone, and having the cast reflect back on their roles, etc.), it could be later.
Don't know how he'd further extend any of the films, unless it's footage of him masturbating. The EE will probably be December this year, so I'm vainly hoping that they'll do the big boxed set either to coincide with it or the following year. At mostly, it'll probably just repackage the EEs all together, though there's always that fool's hope that they'll do an ultimate set that'll port over the TC extras and maybe fix the green wash on FOTR. Doubt it though.

Originally Posted by DJariya View Post
Fuck, since I already whored myself out to the theatrical and extended cuts of the 1st 2 movies, might as well do the same for this.

I can probably sell the UV code for the theatrical release for around $4-5 bucks to off set the cost. Same with the Extended release when that's released.




When all is said and done, I can't believe I will own the following by the end of 2015.

The Lord of the Rings trilogy theatrical cuts (DVD) and extended cuts (DVD)

The Lord of the Rings trilogy blu-ray extended cuts

The Hobbit trilogy theatrical and extended cuts on blu-ray.
I still have the DVDs of the TC and EE for LOTR, Ive been waiting on the Hobbit flicks for the boxed set. I'd love to chuck the TV DVDs, but they haven't ported the extras from them yet.
Old 03-07-15, 08:03 AM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
Much as I love Christopher Nolan's devotion to celluloid, the fact that he doesn't use DIs from which HD masters can easily be transferred to disc probably means that they're too lazy. I'm taking it DK and DKR BDs were substandard?
TDK was digitally manipulated in post. The colors were changed, contrast was boosted, and the image artificially sharpened. Apparently the blame lies with IMAX. It seems they like to fuck up movies with overzealous digital manipulation in an effort to make them look "better".

TDKR looks fantastic. It might seem soft to some but this is due to dupes being used instead of DIs. It would be great if Nolan and Pfister were willing to use DI's but I'm sure they'd fear the studio would then use that as an excuse to apply the Teal & Orange filter (there is no such filter but the assembly line look to color graded movies these days makes it seem as if they are using a standard T&O preset) with no care whatsoever as to achieving a certain look for the film.
Old 03-07-15, 08:07 AM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
Don't know how he'd further extend any of the films, unless it's footage of him masturbating.
There are whole sequences excised from the original three. There was an action sequence in a forest after the Fellowship escape Moria (snippets of this made it into the trailers), Arwen originally fought in Helm's Deep (there are pictures of this online and in some film magazines), and originally Aragorn encountered Sauron sans armor (instead of speaking to the Mouth of Sauron, which explains the lack of a cadaver during the extended cut) and then fought a losing battle against an armored Sauron (who was digitally covered up with a troll in the finished cut of the movie). Apparently there's tons more footage like this that was never released.
Old 03-07-15, 08:34 AM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Originally Posted by RocShemp View Post
There are whole sequences excised from the original three. There was an action sequence in a forest after the Fellowship escape Moria (snippets of this made it into the trailers), Arwen originally fought in Helm's Deep (there are pictures of this online and in some film magazines), and originally Aragorn encountered Sauron sans armor (instead of speaking to the Mouth of Sauron, which explains the lack of a cadaver during the extended cut) and then fought a losing battle against an armored Sauron (who was digitally covered up with a troll in the finished cut of the movie). Apparently there's tons more footage like this that was never released.
I think there was also an epilogue that showed the fates of the various members of the fellowship that was excised from ROTK.
Old 03-07-15, 06:41 PM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Originally Posted by RocShemp View Post
There are whole sequences excised from the original three. There was an action sequence in a forest after the Fellowship escape Moria (snippets of this made it into the trailers), Arwen originally fought in Helm's Deep (there are pictures of this online and in some film magazines), and originally Aragorn encountered Sauron sans armor (instead of speaking to the Mouth of Sauron, which explains the lack of a cadaver during the extended cut) and then fought a losing battle against an armored Sauron (who was digitally covered up with a troll in the finished cut of the movie). Apparently there's tons more footage like this that was never released.
do you mean Eowyn? because in early trailers of 'Two Towers' she's persued by orcs and a fight ensues: (sorry for the crappy picture) - the fight scene is not in the trailer but the orc stalking her is.



http://www.eorlingas.org/elfsheen/ae.php?cut

Éowyn fighting in the caves at Helm's Deep (TTT)
We know about this because of two pictures (1 2) and a trailer clip (screencap). It would have been very cool to keep this scene for Éowyn, especially since I can't see her being present at Helm's Deep and not fighting. Also, it's frustrating that her character is built up in TTT, then dropped until the very end of the movie (the same thing happens to her in RotK). This would have been a great way to keep Éowyn's storyline going. On the other hand, it makes it more special when Éowyn rides to the Pelennor in disguise. Miranda mentioned on the TTT actors' commentary that she's glad the cave scenes were cut.


~


from wiki - yes apparently at one point Arwen was at Helm's Deep

Jackson talks about several scenes that hit the cutting room floor in his commentary track on 'Fellowship' (extended cut) - but as he points out, just because there was more footage doesn't mean it was all worthy of reinstating back into the extended cuts.

- Additional footage from the Battle of the Last Alliance in The Fellowship of the Ring prologue.
- An obscure shot from the trailers of two Elven girls playing about in Rivendell.
- Scene mentioned in The Fellowship of the Ring commentary, about an animal disrupting Frodo and Sam while they sleep, after seeing the Wood Elves. Many animals were used, including rabbits and deer.[10]
- Dialogue from the Council of Elrond, such as Gandalf explaining how Sauron forged the One Ring.[10]
- An attack by Orcs from Moria on Lothlórien after the Fellowship leaves Moria. Jackson replaced this with a more suspenseful entrance for the Fellowship. Much of the lost footage can be seen as promotional material on The Fellowship of the Ring theatrical DVD and tie-in books, documentary footage on the Extended Editions, and Trading Cards.
- More Arwen footage, including a flashback scene of her first meeting with a beardless Aragorn (seen in The Two Towers teaser).
- Faramir having a vision of Frodo becoming like Gollum.[13]
- Footage of Arwen at Helm's Deep, cut by Jackson during a revision to the film's plot. Foreshadowing this sequence were scenes where Arwen and Elrond visit Galadriel at Lothlórien (seen in The Two Towers teaser trailer). - The scene was edited down to a telepathic communication between Elrond and Galadriel.[13]
- Théoden speaking to the troops in the armoury, prior to the Battle of Helm's Deep.
- Éowyn defending the refugees in the Glittering Caves from Uruk-hai intruders.[27]
- An unknown scene displayed in The Two Towers preview of Éomer lowering a spear while riding his horse in a forest.
- Frodo and Sam fighting on the ground in Osgiliath (after Sam tackles Frodo away from the Ringwraith). The scene's fighting was deleted, but Frodo drawing Sting and pointing it at Sam after he is tackeled was left in.[28]
- A line of dialogue during the death of Saruman, in which he reveals that Wormtongue poisoned Théodred, giving further context as to why Wormtongue kills Saruman and Legolas in turn kills Wormtongue.[29]
- A conversation between Elrond and Arwen in a library in Rivendell, after Arwen decides to wait for Aragorn. Elrond leaves, saying, "You gave away your life's grace. I cannot protect you anymore."[30]
- Sam using the Light of Eärendil to pass the Watchers at Cirith Ungol.
- Aragorn having his armour fitted during the preparations for the Battle of the Black Gate. This was the final scene filmed during principal photography.[17]
- Sauron fighting Aragorn at the Black Gate. A computer-generated Troll was placed over Sauron due to Jackson feeling the scene was inappropriate. Sauron is also seen in a beautiful form as Annatar, Giver of Gifts.[17]
- Also at the Black Gate sequence, Pippin was seen in the trailer holding a wounded Merry, a scene which takes place after the Battle of the Pelennor Fields upon Pippin discovering Merry under the mûmak.
- Further epilogue footage, including that of Legolas and Gimli, as well as Éowyn and Faramir's wedding and Aragorn's death and funeral.[31]

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/x_k8RTKGlg0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/ybiAMHT7HvA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Last edited by Giles; 03-07-15 at 07:21 PM.
Old 03-07-15, 07:37 PM
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Originally Posted by RocShemp View Post
There are whole sequences excised from the original three.
I had no idea. So maybe Jackson is prepping more extensions for the further releases?

There was an action sequence in a forest after the Fellowship escape Moria (snippets of this made it into the trailers)
I had no idea. Did it eventually evolve into the Amon Hen sequence?

Arwen originally fought in Helm's Deep (there are pictures of this online and in some film magazines)
I knew that they'd planned this when it was going to be two films, I didn't know that it ever got to a stage where they shot anything.

and originally Aragorn encountered Sauron sans armor (instead of speaking to the Mouth of Sauron, which explains the lack of a cadaver during the extended cut) and then fought a losing battle against an armored Sauron (who was digitally covered up with a troll in the finished cut of the movie).
Why? Because Jackson makes up scripts as he goes along, did they just have different idea and use the flexibility CG brings, or what? I had no idea about that.

Apparently there's tons more footage like this that was never released.
Certainly a selling point for the boxed set if WB will let Jackson fiddle with it some more. I wonder what else there is for the new trilogy? It was already padded beyond belief, I can't imagine that there's much. Saw the EE of DOS, wasn't quite the improvement I was hoping for, though some cool stuff, especially Thrain at Dol Goldur. No new Smaug. Alfrid annoyed me in BOTFA, so more of him in DOS was not particularly pleasant, and Gandalf sweet-talking Beorn was kind of pointless, though his council with Gandalf about Dol Goldur was interesting. I wonder what the BOTFA EE will pay off with Alfrid? Hopefully he serves some narrative purpose beyond being annoying. Took the damn library long enough to get it.

Originally Posted by RocShemp View Post
TDK was digitally manipulated in post. The colors were changed, contrast was boosted, and the image artificially sharpened. Apparently the blame lies with IMAX. It seems they like to fuck up movies with overzealous digital manipulation in an effort to make them look "better".
Do they even mess with negatives, or apply digital manipulation even to their prints, back when they used to make them?

TDKR looks fantastic. It might seem soft to some but this is due to dupes being used instead of DIs. It would be great if Nolan and Pfister were willing to use DI's but I'm sure they'd fear the studio would then use that as an excuse to apply the Teal & Orange filter (there is no such filter but the assembly line look to color graded movies these days makes it seem as if they are using a standard T&O preset) with no care whatsoever as to achieving a certain look for the film.
I think it has more to do with their steadfast holding to using celluloid in a traditional way, including photochemical color-timing, and their aesthetic preference for it. Like I said, it's admirable, and they're pretty much it. Even Quentin "I hate digital so much I'm going stop making movies because 35mm is magical" Tarantino is using DIs.

Last edited by hanshotfirst1138; 03-11-15 at 08:40 PM.
Old 03-15-15, 06:11 PM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
I had no idea. So maybe Jackson is prepping more extensions for the further releases?
No, Jackson just changed his mind while editing the movies and that's why each year there were reshoots.

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
I had no idea. Did it eventually evolve into the Amon Hen sequence?
Remember in the EE of FOTR when Aragon is with the Elves negotiating passage into the realm of Galadriel? Notice how fucked up the Hobbits look. This is because the scene with Gimli referring to Galadriel as an "Elf Witch" was a reshoot. Originally, the Orcs exited Moria and followed the Fellowship into the forest. As the Fellowship was overrun, suddenly arrows whiz bye (one passes right in front of Legolas' face - this is the shot that made it into the trailer) and kill the Orcs. Then the Elves reveal themselves and the EE version of the scene plays out.

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
I knew that they'd planned this when it was going to be two films, I didn't know that it ever got to a stage where they shot anything.
Pictures made it online and fans started complaining. Some even started making comments of Arwen: Warrior Princess. So Jackson reshot the whole sequence of the Elves arriving to Helms Deep without Arwen and had the telepathy conversation between Elrond and Galadriel to explain the Elves' arrival.

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
Why? Because Jackson makes up scripts as he goes along, did they just have different idea and use the flexibility CG brings, or what? I had no idea about that.
It's because there is never a confrontation between Aragorn and Sauron and it didn't feel cinematic. In the appendices it's mentioned that Sauron once appeared without armor. This was when Morgoth was defeated and Sauron was taken prisoner. Jackson liked the idea that Sauron could coerce people (even more than Saruman ever could) and that he would potentially convince Aragorn to surrender. We were to see Sauron as some beautiful man (I've seen no pictures or footage of the actor chosen nor do I know his name) so basically an uber- Elf. You see a bit of this when Aragon hears Sauron's voice coming from the Eye (just before Aragorn says "for Frodo"). Sauron would then materialize his armor (at which point it was Sala Baker in the same costume he wore during the prologue of FOTR) and beat the living crap out of Aragorn during the big battle.

Jackson and Co. claim they felt they strayed too much from the books (although I'm sure there was likely fan backlash like with Arwen in Helms Deep) so they changed it in post to Aragorn fighting a troll and shot the Mouth of Sauron sequence that was in the book.

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
Certainly a selling point for the boxed set if WB will let Jackson fiddle with it some more. I wonder what else there is for the new trilogy? It was already padded beyond belief, I can't imagine that there's much. Saw the EE of DOS, wasn't quite the improvement I was hoping for, though some cool stuff, especially Thrain at Dol Goldur. No new Smaug. Alfrid annoyed me in BOTFA, so more of him in DOS was not particularly pleasant, and Gandalf sweet-talking Beorn was kind of pointless, though his council with Gandalf about Dol Goldur was interesting. I wonder what the BOTFA EE will pay off with Alfrid? Hopefully he serves some narrative purpose beyond being annoying. Took the damn library long enough to get it.
I'd like the EE of BotFA to feature less Alfrid. He should have been flattened alongside the Master. It's obvious his only purpose was to counterpoint how selfless Bard was but that really wasn't necessary and was already achieved in his dealings with Thorin and Thranduil, as well as how he took care of the needs of his people.

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
Do they even mess with negatives, or apply digital manipulation even to their prints, back when they used to make them?
They scan the negatives. Make the color alterations on computer and then print out a brand new negative. All subsequent interpositives are based off the newly printed negative.

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
I think it has more to do with their steadfast holding to using celluloid in a traditional way, including photochemical color-timing, and their aesthetic preference for it. Like I said, it's admirable, and they're pretty much it. Even Quentin "I hate digital so much I'm going stop making movies because 35mm is magical" Tarantino is using DIs.
Yeah, they have also mentioned the aesthetic look. But Nolan has also gone on record that he believes photochemical color-timing is also a more efficient method. It seems he has no patience for the scanning process. This would explain his insistence on using as little CGI as possible and doing most visual effects in-camera. Although, I like that approach since CGI looks its best when used sparingly. When there's CGI overload, the effects houses tend to cut as many corners as possible.
Old 03-15-15, 06:36 PM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Old 03-15-15, 06:41 PM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Annatar The Giver of Gifts - this was some unfinished renderings of what that figure would have looked like before shifting into the armoured form.

Old 03-15-15, 07:56 PM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Originally Posted by Giles View Post
do you mean Eowyn? because in early trailers of 'Two Towers' she's persued by orcs and a fight ensues: (sorry for the crappy picture) - the fight scene is not in the trailer but the orc stalking her is.



[url]Jackson talks about several scenes that hit the cutting room floor in his commentary track on 'Fellowship' (extended cut) - but as he points out, just because there was more footage doesn't mean it was all worthy of reinstating back into the extended cuts.

- Additional footage from the Battle of the Last Alliance in The Fellowship of the Ring prologue.
- An obscure shot from the trailers of two Elven girls playing about in Rivendell.
- Scene mentioned in The Fellowship of the Ring commentary, about an animal disrupting Frodo and Sam while they sleep, after seeing the Wood Elves. Many animals were used, including rabbits and deer.[10]
- Dialogue from the Council of Elrond, such as Gandalf explaining how Sauron forged the One Ring.[10]
- An attack by Orcs from Moria on Lothlórien after the Fellowship leaves Moria. Jackson replaced this with a more suspenseful entrance for the Fellowship. Much of the lost footage can be seen as promotional material on The Fellowship of the Ring theatrical DVD and tie-in books, documentary footage on the Extended Editions, and Trading Cards.
- More Arwen footage, including a flashback scene of her first meeting with a beardless Aragorn (seen in The Two Towers teaser).
- Faramir having a vision of Frodo becoming like Gollum.[13]
- Footage of Arwen at Helm's Deep, cut by Jackson during a revision to the film's plot. Foreshadowing this sequence were scenes where Arwen and Elrond visit Galadriel at Lothlórien (seen in The Two Towers teaser trailer). - The scene was edited down to a telepathic communication between Elrond and Galadriel.[13]
- Théoden speaking to the troops in the armoury, prior to the Battle of Helm's Deep.
- Éowyn defending the refugees in the Glittering Caves from Uruk-hai intruders.[27]
- An unknown scene displayed in The Two Towers preview of Éomer lowering a spear while riding his horse in a forest.
- Frodo and Sam fighting on the ground in Osgiliath (after Sam tackles Frodo away from the Ringwraith). The scene's fighting was deleted, but Frodo drawing Sting and pointing it at Sam after he is tackeled was left in.[28]
- A line of dialogue during the death of Saruman, in which he reveals that Wormtongue poisoned Théodred, giving further context as to why Wormtongue kills Saruman and Legolas in turn kills Wormtongue.[29]
- A conversation between Elrond and Arwen in a library in Rivendell, after Arwen decides to wait for Aragorn. Elrond leaves, saying, "You gave away your life's grace. I cannot protect you anymore."[30]
- Sam using the Light of Eärendil to pass the Watchers at Cirith Ungol.
- Aragorn having his armour fitted during the preparations for the Battle of the Black Gate. This was the final scene filmed during principal photography.[17]
- Sauron fighting Aragorn at the Black Gate. A computer-generated Troll was placed over Sauron due to Jackson feeling the scene was inappropriate. Sauron is also seen in a beautiful form as Annatar, Giver of Gifts.[17]
- Also at the Black Gate sequence, Pippin was seen in the trailer holding a wounded Merry, a scene which takes place after the Battle of the Pelennor Fields upon Pippin discovering Merry under the mûmak.
- Further epilogue footage, including that of Legolas and Gimli, as well as Éowyn and Faramir's wedding and Aragorn's death and funeral.[31]
While this stuff might not necessarily work in the Extended Editions of the films, the deleted scenes should have been included somewhere on the DVDs (and blu-rays) if it was filmed.

Still pissed that they wasted so much of the 4 disc EE of RotK on the dead kid when they could have included all of these scenes.
Old 03-15-15, 08:11 PM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Originally Posted by Josh-da-man View Post
While this stuff might not necessarily work in the Extended Editions of the films, the deleted scenes should have been included somewhere on the DVDs (and blu-rays) if it was filmed.

Still pissed that they wasted so much of the 4 disc EE of RotK on the dead kid when they could have included all of these scenes.
I only skimmed through the special features of the EE of RotK. What dead kid?
Old 03-15-15, 10:17 PM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Originally Posted by RocShemp View Post
I only skimmed through the special features of the EE of RotK. What dead kid?
http://www.dvdtalk.com/reviews/13658...d-edition-the/

The last section in the special features feels a bit out of place. "Cameron Duncan: The Inspiration for 'Into the West'" is a 32-minute featurette that focuses on a young New Zealand filmmaker who was the inspiration for the song that closes The Return of the King. We learn about him and his struggles with cancer, and get to see clips of his work, but it doesn't really feel particularly relevant or compelling.
Old 03-15-15, 10:31 PM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

One thing that irked me about the EE BDs was that they recycled the DVDs for the special features. Even if they didn't want to include HD versions of any of the footage, all that SD content could have been packed into one or two BDs. Heck, if they wanted to bloat the set with extra discs, include an additional BD with all the deleted scenes.

Also, despite the length of these movies, the AVC codec is efficient enough that they didn't need to split the EEs across two discs. The first release of Kingdom of Heaven clocks just over 3 hours and was encoded in the space hog that is MPEG2 and still managed to look great. And don't give me the audio commentary excuse. Those were encoded at like 192kbps. That's barely a blip in the radar.

Wow, that does seem excessive.
Old 03-15-15, 11:08 PM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Originally Posted by DJariya View Post
When all is said and done, I can't believe I will own the following by the end of 2015.

The Lord of the Rings trilogy theatrical cuts (DVD) and extended cuts (DVD)

The Lord of the Rings trilogy blu-ray extended cuts

The Hobbit trilogy theatrical and extended cuts on blu-ray.
Here's what I currently have:

-LOTR trilogy two-disc theatrical DVDs
-LOTR trilogy extended edition DVDs (including the FOTR collector's set with bookends)
-LOTR theatrical/extended DVDs with Costa Botes documentaries
-LOTR theatrical BD set
-LOTR extended BD set
-LOTR theatrical digital copies
-LOTR extended digital copies

Here's what I have for Hobbit:

-first film extended edition purchased with Xbox credit
-second film theatrical BD combo with digital HD

I have no idea what I'm going to do about the third film.
Old 03-16-15, 07:50 PM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

I got the digital version of the third film on my PS3. That will suffice until the release the EE on BR. I own the other two BRs only in EE form , so I'm not going to get a TC in that format.
Old 03-16-15, 08:09 PM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Jackson talks about several scenes that hit the cutting room floor in his commentary track on 'Fellowship' (extended cut) - but as he points out, just because there was more footage doesn't mean it was all worthy of reinstating back into the extended cuts.
- A line of dialogue during the death of Saruman, in which he reveals that Wormtongue poisoned Théodred, giving further context as to why Wormtongue kills Saruman and Legolas in turn kills Wormtongue.[29]
Finally this makes sense! Gonna have to disagree with PJ on adding scenes. Maybe not EVERYTHING needs to put BACK INTO the films, but there is still a lot of footage which I think would solidify issues like the one above.

I also cannot get enough of the visual effects, so if there's a deer playing around in a field...add it. Because so much work went into this film, I'd like to see as much effects as possible. It just looks so awesome on an HDTV.
Old 03-17-15, 09:03 PM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Originally Posted by RocShemp View Post
No, Jackson just changed his mind while editing the movies and that's why each year there were reshoots.
Explains the slightly erratic nature of the storytelling occasionally .

Remember in the EE of FOTR when Aragon is with the Elves negotiating passage into the realm of Galadriel? Notice how fucked up the Hobbits look. This is because the scene with Gimli referring to Galadriel as an "Elf Witch" was a reshoot. Originally, the Orcs exited Moria and followed the Fellowship into the forest. As the Fellowship was overrun, suddenly arrows whiz bye (one passes right in front of Legolas' face - this is the shot that made it into the trailer) and kill the Orcs. Then the Elves reveal themselves and the EE version of the scene plays out.
I didn't think that Jackson would ever pass up a chance at a big action scene. So did the hobbits look messed up because they had originally been a part of the set piece? I wonder why he changed it around? Just to hew more closely to the novel?

Pictures made it online and fans started complaining. Some even started making comments of Arwen: Warrior Princess. So Jackson reshot the whole sequence of the Elves arriving to Helms Deep without Arwen and had the telepathy conversation between Elrond and Galadriel to explain the Elves' arrival.
And having the Elves at Helm's Deep still pissed of a bunch of fans anyway .

It's because there is never a confrontation between Aragorn and Sauron and it didn't feel cinematic. In the appendices it's mentioned that Sauron once appeared without armor. This was when Morgoth was defeated and Sauron was taken prisoner. Jackson liked the idea that Sauron could coerce people (even more than Saruman ever could) and that he would potentially convince Aragorn to surrender. We were to see Sauron as some beautiful man (I've seen no pictures or footage of the actor chosen nor do I know his name) so basically an uber- Elf. You see a bit of this when Aragon hears Sauron's voice coming from the Eye (just before Aragorn says "for Frodo"). Sauron would then materialize his armor (at which point it was Sala Baker in the same costume he wore during the prologue of FOTR) and beat the living crap out of Aragorn during the big battle.
This does sound kind of interesting, though given that Sauron never threw down with Aragorn in the books as far as I know, a little too far from the mark.

Jackson and Co. claim they felt they strayed too much from the books (although I'm sure there was likely fan backlash like with Arwen in Helms Deep) so they changed it in post to Aragorn fighting a troll and shot the Mouth of Sauron sequence that was in the book.
So the Mouth of Sauron sequence was a reshoot then?

I'd like the EE of BotFA to feature less Alfrid.
So would I, but Jackson isn't one to cut stuff out of the EE.

He should have been flattened alongside the Master. It's obvious his only purpose was to counterpoint how selfless Bard was but that really wasn't necessary and was already achieved in his dealings with Thorin and Thranduil, as well as how he took care of the needs of his people.
A point DOS made well to begin with. Why he kept being used in BOTFA, I don't get. I thought maybe he'd turn into Wormtongue or something, but mostly he was just irritating.

They scan the negatives. Make the color alterations on computer and then print out a brand new negative. All subsequent interpositives are based off the newly printed negative.
That...sucks.

Yeah, they have also mentioned the aesthetic look. But Nolan has also gone on record that he believes photochemical color-timing is also a more efficient method. It seems he has no patience for the scanning process. This would explain his insistence on using as little CGI as possible and doing most visual effects in-camera. Although, I like that approach since CGI looks its best when used sparingly. When there's CGI overload, the effects houses tend to cut as many corners as possible.
The more CG you use, the more work there is for the FX crew and without years of post, some of it is likely to look clunky (like it does way too often with Jackson). I've heard that Spielberg, for instance, is really a taskmaster and won't final shots until he thinks they look right, and tries to get the number down to much less than would be average for an FX movie. Nolan says he also prefers the practical effects because it allows actors to physically interact with what's there on the set. He should enjoy 35mm for the remaining six months he'll be able to .

Originally Posted by Josh-da-man View Post
While this stuff might not necessarily work in the Extended Editions of the films, the deleted scenes should have been included somewhere on the DVDs (and Blu-rays) if it was filmed.
I remember reading an article on the Digital Bits about Jackson considering reworking of the LOTR stuff for a future release. While I wouldn't be hugely enthusiastic about that, seeing all of this would be very interesting, and a great selling point for a new release.

Originally Posted by RocShemp View Post
One thing that irked me about the EE BDs was that they recycled the DVDs for the special features. Even if they didn't want to include HD versions of any of the footage, all that SD content could have been packed into one or two BDs. Heck, if they wanted to bloat the set with extra discs, include an additional BD with all the deleted scenes.
I think that the new masters for the BD versions came right off of the DIs. My assumption was that they just recycled old discs of the extras. If all of the stuff was in SD, it could easily fit on one BD, maybe for all three movies. It'd also save tons of space.

Also, despite the length of these movies, the AVC codec is efficient enough that they didn't need to split the EEs across two discs. The first release of Kingdom of Heaven clocks just over 3 hours and was encoded in the space hog that is MPEG2 and still managed to look great. And don't give me the audio commentary excuse. Those were encoded at like 192kbps. That's barely a blip in the radar.
Each movie had four commentaries though . I wish I could figure out how to rip my audio commentaries on some of my DVD commentaries into files for my iPod. Maybe they're planning on making that new footage selling point for a future release (And just maybe, they'll fix the green wash on FOTR). I hope in vain that they'll include the TE extras too so I can finally get rid of those and my DVD EEs. And since I haven't bought and of the Hobbit releases, I hope they'll do likewise, though I'm sure the best we can hope for is the EEs repackaged. And it'll probably be like 2016 before we get that boxed set .
Old 03-17-15, 10:05 PM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
Explains the slightly erratic nature of the storytelling occasionally .
Ain't that the truth. It's kinda like my pet peeve with the TC of TTT. Frodo tells Gollum that Gandalf told him he was Sméagol. That never happened in the TC of FotR. That only makes sense if you watched the EE of FotR. I'm okay with that scene being a part of the EE of TTT but it should not have happened in the TC.

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
I didn't think that Jackson would ever pass up a chance at a big action scene. So did the hobbits look messed up because they had originally been a part of the set piece?
Yeah, they looked fucked up because of the action set piece that was cut. Funny enough, that continuity error does not happen in the TC because they use an alternate version of the Elves leading them to realm of Celeborn and Galadriel that was part of the reshoot.

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
I wonder why he changed it around? Just to hew more closely to the novel?
Quite the reverse. That action sequence that was cut was from the book. Jackson cut it because he wanted to have Gimli talking trash about Galadriel before he grew enamored with her. That and he wanted that dumb bit of comic relief when the Elves point their arrows in Gimli's face.

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
And having the Elves at Helm's Deep still pissed of a bunch of fans anyway .
True. Which is why I wish he had stuck to his guns about Arwen. Especially since fans of the books always bitched about how she comes out of nowhere in the novel and marries Aragorn. For years, book fans wanted Aragon to hook up with Eowyn instead. Sure, the Appendices give you the missing history but it feels like a narrative flaw in the story proper since Aragorn doesn't even mention Arwen when he continuously rebuffs Eowyn.

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
This does sound kind of interesting, though given that Sauron never threw down with Aragorn in the books as far as I know, a little too far from the mark.
You are correct. Sauron stayed locked in his tower. That said, Jackson was a bit literal about the Eye. That's simply how his power and reach was perceived. He never actually lost his physical form. He was just content to sit on his thrown and let his grunts do the real work, while he waited for his Ring to return to him.

In any case, despite Jackson's claim to want to stick to the book, I'm sure it was a case of fan backlash (like Arwen at Helms Deep) that made him change that final action sequence.

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
So the Mouth of Sauron sequence was a reshoot then?
As far as I know, he was a reshoot. Which explains why his horse, cadaver, and severed head all go missing when Aragorn and his allies ride away from the Black Gates as they open.

Of course, those probably vanished with all the horses that vanished during the final charge when Aragorn said "for Frodo".

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
So would I, but Jackson isn't one to cut stuff out of the EE.
Actually, he has cut stuff out. He just tends to replace them with alternate footage. I'd gladly take more Thranduil scenery chewing in exchange for every Alfrid scene after the pre-title sequence.

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
A point DOS made well to begin with. Why he kept being used in BOTFA, I don't get. I thought maybe he'd turn into Wormtongue or something, but mostly he was just irritating.
Yup. It was just a case of going back to an already dry well.

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
That...sucks.
Not really. It leaves the original negative untouched and undoes the need for dupes. That means a sharper (more detailed) interpositive. Dupes tend to look a tad soft.

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
The more CG you use, the more work there is for the FX crew and without years of post, some of it is likely to look clunky (like it does way too often with Jackson). I've heard that Spielberg, for instance, is really a taskmaster and won't final shots until he thinks they look right, and tries to get the number down to much less than would be average for an FX movie. Nolan says he also prefers the practical effects because it allows actors to physically interact with what's there on the set. He should enjoy 35mm for the remaining six months he'll be able to .
Well, even if 35mm goes away, the approach of doing almost everything in camera wouldn't/shouldn't necessarily go away. It's still more expedient and a big selling point of digital photography is expediency (since you can see your footage on the day rather than relying on dallies or waiting for prints from a lab).

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
I remember reading an article on the Digital Bits about Jackson considering reworking of the LOTR stuff for a future release. While I wouldn't be hugely enthusiastic about that, seeing all of this would be very interesting, and a great selling point for a new release.
As far as I recall, all Jackson wanted to change was Gollum in FotR. It's obvious it's a completely different CGI model than what was used in the sequels. That's a change I could get behind because the differences always bothered me.

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
I think that the new masters for the BD versions came right off of the DIs. My assumption was that they just recycled old discs of the extras. If all of the stuff was in SD, it could easily fit on one BD, maybe for all three movies. It'd also save tons of space.
Yes but FotR was tweaked a bit when the EE was released. There's a green push. Not as bad as people make it out to be but very noticeable when you do an A/B comparison with the BD release of the TC.

Some of the documentaries were shot in HD. So WB were just being super cheap. And, yes, if they insisted on keeping everything in SD, they could have easily crammed the bulk of the special features on one BD.

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138 View Post
Each movie had four commentaries though . I wish I could figure out how to rip my audio commentaries on some of my DVD commentaries into files for my iPod. Maybe they're planning on making that new footage selling point for a future release (And just maybe, they'll fix the green wash on FOTR). I hope in vain that they'll include the TE extras too so I can finally get rid of those and my DVD EEs. And since I haven't bought and of the Hobbit releases, I hope they'll do likewise, though I'm sure the best we can hope for is the EEs repackaged. And it'll probably be like 2016 before we get that boxed set .
True but those commentaries were all encoded in the lowest data rate possible.

As for the TC special features, they are on the TC BDs. They could always do a super box set with both cuts and the special features. That and Jackson did say he wanted to convert the LotR films to 3D. So a new boxset is very likely.
Old 04-01-15, 04:14 PM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Just going to wait for the Extended Edition. No need for 3D, just the Extended Edition.
Old 04-01-15, 08:31 PM
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Re: The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - March 24

Originally Posted by RocShemp View Post
Ain't that the truth. It's kinda like my pet peeve with the TC of TTT. Frodo tells Gollum that Gandalf told him he was Sméagol. That never happened in the TC of FotR. That only makes sense if you watched the EE of FotR. I'm okay with that scene being a part of the EE of TTT but it should not have happened in the TC.
When you consider that they had a novel as the source material and one of the most logistically complex productions in history, it's kind of surprising how much of their production was based on a script that they rewrote as they went along.

True. Which is why I wish he had stuck to his guns about Arwen. Especially since fans of the books always bitched about how she comes out of nowhere in the novel and marries Aragorn. For years, book fans wanted Aragon to hook up with Eowyn instead. Sure, the Appendices give you the missing history but it feels like a narrative flaw in the story proper since Aragorn doesn't even mention Arwen when he continuously rebuffs Eowyn.
It is kind of odd how she sort of dips in and out of the story. Part of that probably has to do with pulling her out of the appendices, but I'm sure Tolkien has some sort of genealogy for her an Aragorn.

You are correct. Sauron stayed locked in his tower. That said, Jackson was a bit literal about the Eye. That's simply how his power and reach was perceived. He never actually lost his physical form. He was just content to sit on his thrown and let his grunts do the real work, while he waited for his Ring to return to him.
I thought that he didn't want leave the tower without the Ring because he wasn't powerful enough without it?

Actually, he has cut stuff out. He just tends to replace them with alternate footage. I'd gladly take more Thranduil scenery chewing in exchange for every Alfrid scene after the pre-title sequence.
I would gladly see him cut out Alfrid, though I doubt he will. Still, hope spring eternal.

Yup. It was just a case of going back to an already dry well.
An annoying one-not character who overstayed his welcome.

Not really. It leaves the original negative untouched and undoes the need for dupes. That means a sharper (more detailed) interpositive. Dupes tend to look a tad soft.
Given that IMAX won't be making any more prints, it's going to be academic shortly.

As far as I recall, all Jackson wanted to change was Gollum in FotR. It's obvious it's a completely different CGI model than what was used in the sequels. That's a change I could get behind because the differences always bothered me.
I don't know, that can't help but feel like a bit of uncomfortable Lucasing to me. You hardly see Gollum enough for it to matter in FOTR anyway, so I kind of like him looking a little different in the shadows.

Yes but FotR was tweaked a bit when the EE was released. There's a green push. Not as bad as people make it out to be but very noticeable when you do an A/B comparison with the BD release of the TC.
I don't think Jackson had anything to do with that though, it sounds like it was just a foul-up on the part of New Line's home video department that they'd rather not spend the money on an exchange program to fix.

Some of the documentaries were shot in HD. So WB were just being super cheap. And, yes, if they insisted on keeping everything in SD, they could have easily crammed the bulk of the special features on one BD.
Ideally if it was SD, you could just cram the extras for pretty much everything onto one BD, though I doubt that they would.

As for the TC special features, they are on the TC BDs.
That's really stupid, though maybe just to force completists to buy both. The could just put them on the EE BDs if they wanted, though maybe they don't feel like pressing whole new discs.

They could always do a super box set with both cuts and the special features.
They could, and that's what I'm holding out for, but it'll be a long-ass wait, and that's if BD is even still around by that time.

That and Jackson did say he wanted to convert the LotR films to 3D.
Great, so if that boxed set ever comes out, I'll probably be stuck with those .

So a new boxset is very likely.
Hey, fingers crossed. I keep hoping that they'll re-release those Complete Recordings boxed sets and even do some for The Hobbit films. The CR sets go for silly sums on the aftermarket, I'm assuming that they were designed for limited production runs.

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