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Blu-ray and DVD sales - We're number 2, but we try harder

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Blu-ray and DVD sales - We're number 2, but we try harder

Old 10-10-13, 05:56 PM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

Paramount would have priced it lower if they had put it out instead of Di$ney. The Target 3D Avengers pricing was a fluke since they had meant to price the 2D edition at $20, but falsely advertised it as coming with a 'digital copy' when in fact it didn't so they priced the 3D edition which did have it at the lower price to compensate. It was sold out at the first Target I went to. Would sure be nice if they didn't even HAVE separate 3D editions- Lionsgate doesn't, and they don't price their 3D titles higher either!
Old 10-15-13, 04:35 PM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

October 5:

Old 10-25-13, 11:34 PM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

October 12:

Old 10-29-13, 05:17 PM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

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Old 10-30-13, 03:19 PM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

Wow, The Heat really helped those numbers!
Old 10-30-13, 04:24 PM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

Originally Posted by orangerunner

More commonly, many people are selling their entire collection on craig's list usually with the reasons listed as "I ran out of storage", "I'm a Netflix-guy now", "Wife thinks they look ugly and 'man-boyish' in our living room" etc.

Many others are tossing the packaging away and placing 400 discs in 3-ring binder.

I can see why the studios are questioning how effective fancy packaging is for large runs or titles which don't have a collector-minded fanbase.
Before I sold off a ton of my collection I also did a hanging file system with the artwork in binders, saved a lot of room.

Originally Posted by big e
The thing with me is, I just don't rewatch movies that often. Out of all the movies I own, I've only watched maybe a few dozen more than once. Someone else in this thread had mentioned they would rather spend two hours watching something they had never seen before then something they'd seen three or four times. That’s the way I feel. Right now I have a stack of movies to watch (not that many, maybe four) but they’re all movies I’ve seen previously and I just don’t really have the desire to sit down and throw one of them in. I’ll get around to watching them at some point, just not right now. I get a lot of my movies from Netflix and 9 times out of 10 if I want to watch something, it’s usually what came from Netflix and almost never anything from my own collection. Unless it’s around Halloween, then I’ll start pulling out the horror movies.

A lot of the movies I watch, I just don't feel the need or desire to see them a second time. I've been with Netflix since mid 2009 (I think I joined in August), and out of all the movies I’ve rented from them, there’s only a very small handful that I’ve actually gone out and bought. I just don’t have that desired to rewatch a movie once I’ve seen it. Now, there are movies I own that I consider favorites and I do watch these multiple times, but for the most part I’m completely satisfied with that initial viewing.
That almost sounds like something I could have wrote. Basically how I have been over the last couple years. My desire to watch a film I know so well is just not there right now. I enjoy watching new shows and movies, I like not knowing what happens. Of course there are favorites which I think can go longer between viewings. Only so much time in a day so with new shows, movies and other media the time to re-view content is just not there as much. Sit down for two hours watching this film that I know every detail about? Nah.
Old 11-02-13, 07:14 AM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

Just saw the 3rd quarter D.E.G. report:

Home Entertainment Spending Was Flat In Q3 At $3.97B.

Results continue to look dismal for discs, though.
Sales fell 13.4% to $1.45B. DEG says that Blu-ray contributed to the decline due to “tough comparisons” with last year, which included two popular boxed sets: Bond 50: The Complete 22 Film Collection and Indiana Jones: The Complete Adventures.

On the rental side, brick-and-mortar stores were -14.5% to $244.6M, and subscription disc rentals (mostly Netflix’s mail business) fell 17.3% to $249.3M. Kiosk rentals — dominated by Redbox — were up 3.9% to $966M, but that’s a deceleration from last year (+9.9%) and 2011 (+23.3%).

http://www.deadline.com/2013/11/home...g/#more-625451
Old 11-02-13, 10:43 AM
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It's pretty much all over except the crying at this point.
Old 11-02-13, 12:28 PM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

Originally Posted by jackson walker
On the rental side, brick-and-mortar stores were -14.5% to $244.6M...
I had no idea there were any B&M stores left. There are none by me.

Old 11-02-13, 01:51 PM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

The comments that follow that article are rather interesting. There are lots of people who feel no need to convert to Blu-ray and I agree that the studios shouldn't be releasing bare bones DVDs because it probably is contributing to more lost sales than conversions (buying the combo).
Old 11-02-13, 02:47 PM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

Consumer spending chart

Old 11-05-13, 06:38 PM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

October 26:

Old 11-06-13, 02:47 AM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

You know, if the studios and/or retailers really wanted to, they'd start an awareness campaign to try and get media sales back up. Didn't acclaimed director Michael Bay speak out about Blu-Ray's superiority to HD-DVD during the format war? I know Bernardo Bertolucci did a magazine ad for laserdiscs back in the 80s too, telling everyone how much better they were than VHS. Why not put up ads saying how much better Blu-Ray is than most downloads? And for god's sake, stop with the crappy minimalist packaging with Eco-Cases and plain-looking disc labels!

Hell, I'll do a campaign for free if they want me to, and they can fire me if it doesn't work! If I were in charge of Best Buy especially, I'd be upping promotion on media rather than phasing it out!

Whatever happens, I'm sure there'll be a renaissance just like there's been with LPs- I never thought those would still be around today (I've been buying CDs since 1985) but some people have been convinced they're better than CDs OR downloads and I'm not one to argue with that. There's already a VHS cult developing too, though I wouldn't buy new titles on that!
Old 11-06-13, 09:03 AM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

Originally Posted by Alan Smithee
You know, if the studios and/or retailers really wanted to, they'd start an awareness campaign to try and get media sales back up. Didn't acclaimed director Michael Bay speak out about Blu-Ray's superiority to HD-DVD during the format war? I know Bernardo Bertolucci did a magazine ad for laserdiscs back in the 80s too, telling everyone how much better they were than VHS. Why not put up ads saying how much better Blu-Ray is than most downloads? And for god's sake, stop with the crappy minimalist packaging with Eco-Cases and plain-looking disc labels!

Hell, I'll do a campaign for free if they want me to, and they can fire me if it doesn't work! If I were in charge of Best Buy especially, I'd be upping promotion on media rather than phasing it out!

Whatever happens, I'm sure there'll be a renaissance just like there's been with LPs- I never thought those would still be around today (I've been buying CDs since 1985) but some people have been convinced they're better than CDs OR downloads and I'm not one to argue with that. There's already a VHS cult developing too, though I wouldn't buy new titles on that!
Acclaimed Director Michael Bay? Wow.

Eco-Cases and plain looking discs? Consumers don't care - only a handful of whiny folks.

Is your post for real or some sort of joke?
Old 11-06-13, 09:40 AM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

I'm not sure Blu-ray needs a "renaissance", but make no mistake - this is as good as it gets.

The pattern is holding - good sales on big tentpole releases; slowly declining sales on everything else.

I'm actually surprised a decent amount of catalog titles have come out this year. I think I've bought almost 10 new catalog titles in the last few months, and those are from studios like Universal and Paramount who have been stingy with them. But catalog isn't going to miraculously grow the format. The only thing that *might* help is a return to $15 release week prices like we had with DVD years ago. But I don't see that happening.
Old 11-06-13, 10:07 AM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

Originally Posted by bunkaroo
I'm not sure Blu-ray needs a "renaissance", but make no mistake - this is as good as it gets.
Yes, Blu-ray has peaked and is now beginning its inevitable decline. After being up 30% in Q1 (due to a strong YoY box office power) it has now shrunk to 5.8%. Box office power is still up 3.3% for the year. Looking at the release calender and those of last year, the next 3-4 weeks should be good, but December will be rough. It's likely Blu-ray will finish out the year with less revenue than last year ($2.36 billion).

Considering that it is declining at a point where it has only a 30% share of the optical market, one can call it a failure (even VHS generated nearly $6 billion in sell-through revenue at its peak). That's one reason why I think 4K won't come to Blu-ray (the others are copy protection and Sony's stance) and remain a digital medium. After all, that's what the studios are pushing, for consumers to move to digital.
Old 11-06-13, 11:13 AM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

Consider where Blu-ray would be were it not for some dumb Avenger movie coming out every few months.
Old 11-06-13, 02:39 PM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

Originally Posted by bruceames
Yes, Blu-ray has peaked and is now beginning its inevitable decline.
Blu-ray has been available for over 6 1/2 years. By the end of this year Blu-ray will be as old as DVD was in 2005, which was the year when the DVD format started to show signs of fading.

"Box office power is still up 3.3% for the year."


Even movie theatres showing a increase in sales is not as it seems. Movies are released on more screens worldwide at higher prices than before. Yeah, the revenue increases.

It's funny how success in the music industry is determined by how many CDs or downloads are sold, which is a more concrete and accurate calculation.

On the other hand, the theatrical exhibition of films has always calculated its success by money numbers, which are easier to manipulate. If they calculated their success by the number of tickets sold, that would be a more accurate figure.

Of course, the money numbers can be more easily spun into a positive light for end-of-weekend tallies and soundbites.

Originally Posted by bruceames
That's one reason why I think 4K won't come to Blu-ray (the others are copy protection and Sony's stance) and remain a digital medium. After all, that's what the studios are pushing, for consumers to move to digital.
I'll be surprised if true 4K (not the Blu-ray mastered in 4K) gets off the ground as an optical disc format. Blu-ray has already limped well behind DVD as far as sales go that I can't see the industry pushing yet another higher resolution disc format.
Old 11-06-13, 02:46 PM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

Acclaimed Director Michael Bay? Wow.
Sorry, I forgot my sarcasm tags there.

Eco-Cases and plain looking discs? Consumers don't care - only a handful of whiny folks.
Those "whiny folks" are the ones who are going to keep buying this stuff. Half-assed packaging certainly isn't going to HELP sales any.

On the other hand, the theatrical exhibition of films has always calculated its success by money numbers, which are easier to manipulate. If they calculated their success by the number of tickets sold, that would be a more accurate figure.
I'd sure like to see movie theaters get some bad press for a change- they're the ones that should be called 'dinosaurs'- having worked in that business I know they don't care about movies or their customers, just squeezing as much money out of them as they can while shoving ads in their faces on tiny screens.
Old 11-06-13, 04:50 PM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

Originally Posted by orangerunner
Blu-ray has been available for over 6 1/2 years. By the end of this year Blu-ray will be as old as DVD was in 2005, which was the year when the DVD format started to show signs of fading.
2004. You're only off by a year. Blu-ray launched in June 2006 and DVD March 1997 (although in only a few areas and then country-wide by the end of the year). DVD sell-through revenue actually peaked in 2006, although the "peak" really lasted for 3 years (2005-2007) as it was very flat. The peak of $13.89 billion in nearly six times what Blu-ray did last year (the likely peak for that format).

Code:
Year Total   DVDsell  DVDrent  BDsell  BDrent	% rent	% BD

1999	1.1	0.96	0.14	0.00	0.00	12.5%	0.0%
2000	2.4	1.82	0.58	0.00	0.00	24.0%	0.0%
2001	5.3	4.21	1.09	0.00	0.00	20.6%	0.0%
2002	8.6	6.45	2.15	0.00	0.00	25.0%	0.0%
2003	13.1	9.44	3.66	0.00	0.00	28.0%	0.0%
2004	16.7	12.45	4.25	0.00	0.00	25.5%	0.0%
2005	18.9	13.51	5.39	0.00	0.00	28.5%	0.0%
2006	20.2	13.89	6.29	0.02	0.00	31.1%	0.1%
2007	20.0	13.38	6.31*	0.25	0.05*	32.1%	1.8%
2008	19.3	12.48	5.92	0.63	0.27	33.0%	5.0%
2009	17.3	10.55	5.25	1.07	0.43	32.8%	9.2%
2010	16.2	8.50	5.35	1.80	0.50	36.2%  17.5%
2011	14.6	6.80	4.90*	2.15	0.77*	38.8%  24.0%


Even movie theatres showing a increase in sales is not as it seems. Movies are released on more screens worldwide at higher prices than before. Yeah, the revenue increases.
True, but both Blu-ray and box office power are measured in revenue. Box office receipts for the year rise very little each year, only a few percent.

It's funny how success in the music industry is determined by how many CDs or downloads are sold, which is a more concrete and accurate calculation.
It is actually far less accurate as revenue is the great equalizer. What is more impressive: selling 100000 cd for $8 each, or 75000 for $13? Units are more accurate, for a single item type, over a long period of time as it removes the necessity of adjusting for inflation. But that advantage is totally negated when prices per unit sold go down in order to boosts sales due to low demand.

On the other hand, the theatrical exhibition of films has always calculated its success by money numbers, which are easier to manipulate. If they calculated their success by the number of tickets sold, that would be a more accurate figure.

Of course, the money numbers can be more easily spun into a positive light for end-of-weekend tallies and soundbites.
Money is what makes the world go round. You can't manipulate a dollar into two dollars. The only thing that needs to be accounted for is inflation. If theaters and the studios can get more money per seat, even accounting for inflation, then that's more money in their pockets. Anybody can fill seats selling them at a discount.


I'll be surprised if true 4K (not the Blu-ray mastered in 4K) gets off the ground as an optical disc format. Blu-ray has already limped well behind DVD as far as sales go that I can't see the industry pushing yet another higher resolution disc format.
Totally agree here.
Old 11-06-13, 05:56 PM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

Ridin' in a Stutz Bear Cat, Jim
You know, those were different times!



We can look back on the VHS/DVD/BLU years as a perfect storm of being able buy and watch your favorite movies or TV shows. Of being able to collect entire seasons and show runs with extra added bonus attractions.

And the kids of today don't really know what that meant. How when Wizard of Oz came on TV and just about everybody watched it to going to owning it and watching whenever you wanted to.

Music just seems cheaper somehow now. Not in value in quality. And I think we have gone from experiencing a movie to consuming it.

Jeez I'm a dope.
Old 11-06-13, 07:09 PM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

Originally Posted by bruceames
It is actually far less accurate as revenue is the great equalizer. What is more impressive: selling 100000 cd for $8 each, or 75000 for $13? Units are more accurate, for a single item type, over a long period of time as it removes the necessity of adjusting for inflation. But that advantage is totally negated when prices per unit sold go down in order to boosts sales due to low demand.
It's more about the perception of how success is measured. "Katy Perry's album went Double-Platinum!" is what you hear, not that Katy Perry's album made $1.2 million. Maybe the album cost $5 million to market and produce? Who knows?

If the $8 CD only cost $.69 to produce in today's market compared to the $13 CD that cost $3.00 to make twenty years ago it's easy to confuse what is a success and what is not.


Originally Posted by bruceames
Money is what makes the world go round. You can't manipulate a dollar into two dollars. The only thing that needs to be accounted for is inflation. If theaters and the studios can get more money per seat, even accounting for inflation, then that's more money in their pockets. Anybody can fill seats selling them at a discount.
You can manipulate the perception of success. A movie can be a monster hit because it opened up in #1 with a $25 million weekend in February. If the same film had been released in June and had been #5 at the box office with $25 million, it would have been considered a bomb. Same dollars and cents, different perception.
Old 11-06-13, 07:49 PM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

Pretty soon this thread will die off as the format will settle into it's niche market and no one will wonder if it will grow beyond that. Much like the audio sites have stopped talking about SACDs potential growth even though it's still alive.
Old 11-06-13, 08:21 PM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

Originally Posted by Coral
Pretty soon this thread will die off as the format will settle into it's niche market and no one will wonder if it will grow beyond that. Much like the audio sites have stopped talking about SACDs potential growth even though it's still alive.
This is my favorite thread. 3+ years and nearly 1400 posts. Remember the days of the format war when Mods were forced to close the sales threads as real war had nearly broken out? Heady Days! Back then, DVDTalk was a busy place, with lots of active members, new threads opening all the time, and ceaseless insight & witty banter. Seems a lot quieter now, like the last lonesome stretches of RT 66.

Yessir, I sure do miss them Heady Days.
Old 11-07-13, 05:31 AM
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re: Blu-ray and DVD sales - #2, but we try harder

Originally Posted by dvdshonna
I'm surprised new DVD/Bluray sales are as strong as they are. ..Try selling used titles on craigslist, ebay, etc. ...If you can net $1 per DVD or $5 per Bluray you've had a good day.

The biggest change from the "good old days" is that DVDs use to be an easy sell. ..Redbox and Netflix have changed things a bit.
Yup. I used to cycle accounts at Columbia House all the time, selling the DVDs for a fair profit. Made enough to support my collecting habit. I haven't been able to break even on an account since 2011.

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