Star Wars
08-15-10, 07:43 PM
#101
DVD Talk Legend
re: Star Wars
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08-15-10, 08:50 PM
#103
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
re: Star Wars
I grew up with Star Wars but I've actually never seen the altered movies and refused to buy the DVDs until they released the original theatrical editions (albiet poor quality). When I was 17 and they announced these changes I bought the last pure edition VHS set with my grocery clerk wages (and still have it).
Sometimes I wonder if I haven't been too closed minded and should check out the edited re-releases to see what gives. I am tempted by the Blu-ray (and don't even have HD yet) but that makes me wonder if I've lowered my standards just to collect and amass films.
Sometimes I wonder if I haven't been too closed minded and should check out the edited re-releases to see what gives. I am tempted by the Blu-ray (and don't even have HD yet) but that makes me wonder if I've lowered my standards just to collect and amass films.
Last edited by Undeadcow; 08-15-10 at 09:04 PM.
08-15-10, 09:14 PM
#104
DVD Talk Limited Edition
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re: Star Wars
I really hope some of the deleted scenes include the wampa attack on the snow troopers or at least the 3PO ripping off the sticker on the wampa door. Only seen like 1 second of it online, would like to see the entire bit. Also would be nice to have the New Hope tatooine deleted scenes as well.
08-15-10, 09:39 PM
#106
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re: Star Wars
Whats really funny is, I never heard one complaint from people leaving the theatre for any showings of the star wars special editions back in1997 when I worked at the Muvico Palm Harbor 10 theatre.
Everyone loved them. There were no crys about Greedo shooting first, or about the Jaba scene, infact I heard quite a few commenting about how cool they thought it was that he found a way to include the Original Jaba scene. (even if Jaba didnt really look like how he did in RTOJ)
Now though there is a large portion of people who complain.
To most regular average fans the changes dont make a big differnce othewise, the theatrical rereleases wouldnt have broken box office records when they came out in 1997.
As someone who has occasionally had the opprotunity to be a actor though, I do take issue with the changes he made for the DVD special editions in 2004, such as replacing the voice over performance of Bobba Fett, and replacing Clive Revill with Ian Mcdiaramid as the emperor in ESB and replacing Sebastian Shaw in the final scene on Endor on RTOJ. at the end of the Day its lucas's film and he has the right to do with it what he sees fit.
Out of curiosity has Irvin Kershner ever come out in the years since the special editions and said anything about the changes made to ESB which he directed.
If anyone has the right to be upset over changes it would be Him or the many years Deceased Richard Marquand.
whats intresting though is how many people thought that whole ad campain to OWN the Original star wars trilogy for the last time, was only a advertising gimmick when in fact Lucas was dead serious.
I will buy these day one, and have a 6 movie marathon that same day/night.
Cant wait to see all the special features included with these.
what would really be awesome is if Lucas would get Mark, Harrison, Carrie, and or others to sit in on a commentary track for atleast one of the films this go around.
And even if he doesnt want to include the full holiday special atleast present the Bobba Fett cartoon featured in it. I would love to see that cartoon in HD
Everyone loved them. There were no crys about Greedo shooting first, or about the Jaba scene, infact I heard quite a few commenting about how cool they thought it was that he found a way to include the Original Jaba scene. (even if Jaba didnt really look like how he did in RTOJ)
Now though there is a large portion of people who complain.
To most regular average fans the changes dont make a big differnce othewise, the theatrical rereleases wouldnt have broken box office records when they came out in 1997.
As someone who has occasionally had the opprotunity to be a actor though, I do take issue with the changes he made for the DVD special editions in 2004, such as replacing the voice over performance of Bobba Fett, and replacing Clive Revill with Ian Mcdiaramid as the emperor in ESB and replacing Sebastian Shaw in the final scene on Endor on RTOJ. at the end of the Day its lucas's film and he has the right to do with it what he sees fit.
Out of curiosity has Irvin Kershner ever come out in the years since the special editions and said anything about the changes made to ESB which he directed.
If anyone has the right to be upset over changes it would be Him or the many years Deceased Richard Marquand.
whats intresting though is how many people thought that whole ad campain to OWN the Original star wars trilogy for the last time, was only a advertising gimmick when in fact Lucas was dead serious.
I will buy these day one, and have a 6 movie marathon that same day/night.
Cant wait to see all the special features included with these.
what would really be awesome is if Lucas would get Mark, Harrison, Carrie, and or others to sit in on a commentary track for atleast one of the films this go around.
And even if he doesnt want to include the full holiday special atleast present the Bobba Fett cartoon featured in it. I would love to see that cartoon in HD
Last edited by AmityBoatTours; 08-15-10 at 09:46 PM.
08-15-10, 09:47 PM
#107
DVD Talk Legend
re: Star Wars
I bought the first DVD release because I've always been okay with accepting the SE's as an "alternate" take on the story. Some of the changes are good, some neutral, and some just plain bad. I will pay a premium for the originals on DVD if Lucas is worried about recouping his costs. When they first announced the "Limited Editions", I had no trouble with the idea of double dipping on the SE's in order to get the originals. But when they just dumped old laserdisc transfers on the discs, I passed. I didn't boycott or picket the Ranch dressed up as a stormtrooper. I simply didn't buy them, and I haven't even bought them used (even though I could get them dirt cheap). The originals deserve better. The fans don't deserve better, the original actors and crew and FX people don't deserve better. The films deserve better. So I'll wait.
And I'm not completely boycotting Lucasfilm either; I've bought all the Clone Wars releases, but I can't get excited about another release of the SE's. I'm sure it will show up on the used market fairly quickly. There's been tons of DVDs I've thought about buying on release day just because they were in a fancy packaging or something, but ended up passing on them and then later finding them used for a decent price. That's likely what I'll do with these. Without the originals there's no real reason for me to get excited about it.
And that line about being too expensive is an absolute crock. There's too many other films, new and old, restored for modern home theater formats for anyone with half a brain to believe that. Unfortunately, I remember being at Theforce.net forums when the non-anamorphic DVDs were released, and every other post was some troglodyte Lucas-fellator trying to explain how "old" movies couldn't actually be done in 16x9 on DVD (despite, of course, the hundreds, even thousands of other "old" widescreen films already released on DVD in 16x9 transfers).
No anger here, seriously. Just ... disappointment.
And I'm not completely boycotting Lucasfilm either; I've bought all the Clone Wars releases, but I can't get excited about another release of the SE's. I'm sure it will show up on the used market fairly quickly. There's been tons of DVDs I've thought about buying on release day just because they were in a fancy packaging or something, but ended up passing on them and then later finding them used for a decent price. That's likely what I'll do with these. Without the originals there's no real reason for me to get excited about it.
And that line about being too expensive is an absolute crock. There's too many other films, new and old, restored for modern home theater formats for anyone with half a brain to believe that. Unfortunately, I remember being at Theforce.net forums when the non-anamorphic DVDs were released, and every other post was some troglodyte Lucas-fellator trying to explain how "old" movies couldn't actually be done in 16x9 on DVD (despite, of course, the hundreds, even thousands of other "old" widescreen films already released on DVD in 16x9 transfers).
No anger here, seriously. Just ... disappointment.
08-15-10, 09:55 PM
#108
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
re: Star Wars
As someone who has occasionally had the opprotunity to be a actor though, I do take issue with the changes he made for the DVD special editions in 2004, such as replacing the voice over performance of Bobba Fett, and replacing Clive Revill with Ian Mcdiaramid as the emperor in ESB and replacing Sebastian Shaw in the final scene on Endor on RTOJ. at the end of the Day its lucas's film and he has the right to do with it what he sees fit.
With Shaw, the problem is that showing us Young Anakin suggests that we're seeing him as he last appeared as a Jedi...which seems to undermine the entire point of his redemption. It sends the message that he didn't die a Jedi.
Out of curiosity has Irvin Kershner ever come out in the years since the special editions and said anything about the changes made to ESB which he directed.
If anyone has the right to be upset over changes it would be Him or the many years Deceased Richard Marquand.
If anyone has the right to be upset over changes it would be Him or the many years Deceased Richard Marquand.
08-15-10, 10:01 PM
#109
DVD Talk Legend
re: Star Wars
And that line about being too expensive is an absolute crock. There's too many other films, new and old, restored for modern home theater formats for anyone with half a brain to believe that. Unfortunately, I remember being at Theforce.net forums when the non-anamorphic DVDs were released, and every other post was some troglodyte Lucas-fellator trying to explain how "old" movies couldn't actually be done in 16x9 on DVD (despite, of course, the hundreds, even thousands of other "old" widescreen films already released on DVD in 16x9 transfers).
08-15-10, 11:07 PM
#110
DVD Talk Legend
re: Star Wars
Here's a few threads from USENET back in 1997, only a few days after the film's release:
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...51c3264?hl=en&
That is why we are so pissed off. Han's fate was put in the hands of a incompetent bounty hunter, who would have killed him had his aim been true. The Han we all know and love would never have let Greedo get the first shot off; GL really botched this one, and no one really knows why.
I *hate* the changes to the Greedo sequence. They change the tone of Han's voice and have him shoot Greedo in self defence. Greedo now shoots first. It is just too PC now. I preferred Han gunning him down coldly -- it gave his character more of an edge. Now he is more of a wimp.
I also thought that the only changes that diminished the movie instead of enhancing it were the "Greedo shoots first" scene, and the gratuitous "Boba Fett pauses and looks at the camera" scene.
With Greedo he is two or three feet from Han, and he misses han by at least a foot maybe two. Lame.
With Boba Fett, it was a little over the top.
With Greedo he is two or three feet from Han, and he misses han by at least a foot maybe two. Lame.
With Boba Fett, it was a little over the top.
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...+first&lnk=ol&
Han should shoot first because he is about to be shot. Greedo makes a verbal threat and that should be all that is needed. Surely you don't believe that a bounty hunter with the reputation that Greedo apparently had would miss at such close range??? Also I have heard that the look of the scene is pitiful and I must say if it is the same as it is on the Making Magic CD then I agree.
Also, at the time there was no reason to believe that the SE versions would become "definitive," and that Lucas wouldn't release the original, unaltered trilogy in other forms in the future. Up to that point, special editions of films were almost always secondary versions. The closest counterpart would be the Director's Cut of Blade Runner, which has supplanted the original cut for most, but even that film provides the original cut in anamorphic DVD and HD Blu-ray (and HD DVD).
Also, The Phantom Menace made a huge amount of money, but isn't that well regarded. Just because a movie made big box office doesn't mean it's good.
http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/fea...irvin-kershner
How did you like the changes made to Empire for the 1997 theatrical rerelease?
My film is the way I cut it. The other films were changed - a lot. My film, I can tell you just what was done. The Snow Creature [Wampa] was added, which was good for merchandising. It was okay, but I could have lived without it.
When I went up to San Anselmo, California, to see the work in progress on the Special Edition, we looked at the film, and I was making some notes about color changes and sound - never about cutting. No cut changes. And we came to the scene where the group is on Cloud City, walking through a corridor. When I had originally shot it, I was not happy, and I told George I didn't like the set because it was just a corridor and we should have had round openings so you see the city as they walked through. It would have cost a lot of money to open it up and put miniatures out there, and it would have taken more time to build it, and you're always fighting time.
So, I'm sitting in the screening room looking at the scene. They walk down the corridor, and here are the openings and there is the city. I was shocked. I said, "George, look!" And he said, "Yeah. It's a gift for you." But those were the only changes.
My film is the way I cut it. The other films were changed - a lot. My film, I can tell you just what was done. The Snow Creature [Wampa] was added, which was good for merchandising. It was okay, but I could have lived without it.
When I went up to San Anselmo, California, to see the work in progress on the Special Edition, we looked at the film, and I was making some notes about color changes and sound - never about cutting. No cut changes. And we came to the scene where the group is on Cloud City, walking through a corridor. When I had originally shot it, I was not happy, and I told George I didn't like the set because it was just a corridor and we should have had round openings so you see the city as they walked through. It would have cost a lot of money to open it up and put miniatures out there, and it would have taken more time to build it, and you're always fighting time.
So, I'm sitting in the screening room looking at the scene. They walk down the corridor, and here are the openings and there is the city. I was shocked. I said, "George, look!" And he said, "Yeah. It's a gift for you." But those were the only changes.
08-15-10, 11:34 PM
#111
DVD Talk Legend
re: Star Wars
It only seems relevant to those who subscribe to the auteur theory. The Empire Strikes Back wasn't an Irvin Kirschner film; it was a film directed by Irvin Kirschner. That was George Lucas's production, from start to finish. Being a director doesn't necessarily mean that person has some kind of guiding, artistic vision. Sometimes it just means that's the person who was hired to oversee the filming of a script.
Here's an interview with Kershner on just how hands-off Lucas was during filming:
http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/fea...irvin-kershner
That was one of the few times George Lucas flew over. He was only there about three times for a day or two. He stayed in California because he had his hands full...
But George only showed up on the set about three times. George was wonderful. He left me alone. If I had any doubts about a scene or if I wanted to cut a scene out or cut it down, or make a big change, I would call him on the phone and we would discuss it. And we would always come to an agreement very quickly. If it was small changes, I would just make them. But I would never deviate from the storyboards that I had made. If I deviated, I would always call him because he was in the special effects unit. I would say, "The ship is not going to come in from the right but from the left. Therefore, re-orient that whole scene." I would let him know ahead of time so that they wouldn't build stuff they didn't need. We were in touch that way but I didn't call him that many times.
I was shocked one day: I'm shooting, and I look over and way in the back of about 50 people is George standing there. And I said, "George, come over here!" He was sort of embarrassed, he's so shy! So he came over and watched the shooting. That was the morning that we shot a scene that ended up about 6 seconds on film and it took us 10 hours to shoot! Everything kept breaking! Nothing worked! (Laughter) And George just stood there and never said a word. George is just about the best producer I've ever worked with. He made sure that everything was there.
But George only showed up on the set about three times. George was wonderful. He left me alone. If I had any doubts about a scene or if I wanted to cut a scene out or cut it down, or make a big change, I would call him on the phone and we would discuss it. And we would always come to an agreement very quickly. If it was small changes, I would just make them. But I would never deviate from the storyboards that I had made. If I deviated, I would always call him because he was in the special effects unit. I would say, "The ship is not going to come in from the right but from the left. Therefore, re-orient that whole scene." I would let him know ahead of time so that they wouldn't build stuff they didn't need. We were in touch that way but I didn't call him that many times.
I was shocked one day: I'm shooting, and I look over and way in the back of about 50 people is George standing there. And I said, "George, come over here!" He was sort of embarrassed, he's so shy! So he came over and watched the shooting. That was the morning that we shot a scene that ended up about 6 seconds on film and it took us 10 hours to shoot! Everything kept breaking! Nothing worked! (Laughter) And George just stood there and never said a word. George is just about the best producer I've ever worked with. He made sure that everything was there.
08-16-10, 12:05 AM
#112
DVD Talk Limited Edition
re: Star Wars
I don't understand why everyone refers to the changed cantina scene as "Greedo shoots first." After looking at the original scene on youtube, Greedo never fires his weapon. Does anyone see him get off a shot? I don't. So shouldn't the revision be referred to as just "Greedo shoots?"
08-16-10, 12:13 AM
#113
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
re: Star Wars
I don't understand why everyone refers to the changed cantina scene as "Greedo shoots first." After looking at the original scene on youtube, Greedo never fires his weapon. Does anyone see him get off a shot? I don't. So shouldn't the revision be referred to as just "Greedo shoots?"
Don't forget; an entire generation was introduced to Han Solo mere moments before that scene. It told them who he was. No one knew he'd come back to save the day in the end of the movie, and his cold-blooded murder of Greedo is a big part of what sold that belief that we'd seen the last of him when he and Chewie are packing up their reward.
08-16-10, 12:16 AM
#114
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
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re: Star Wars
Yes thank you, Jay G. I remember MANY complaints. It was there from the start. Even before the first showings of ANH:SE there were rumors of what was coming. Terrible stuff.
08-16-10, 01:23 AM
#115
DVD Talk Gold Edition
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re: Star Wars
Just because you didn't hear any complaints doesn't mean that people weren't complaining.
Here's a few threads from USENET back in 1997, only a few days after the film's release:
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...51c3264?hl=en&
http://groups.google.com/group/hsv.g...7c68f8aa?hl=en
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...7590f526?hl=en
Hell, there were people complaining about the change a month or so before the SE was even released:
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...+first&lnk=ol&
.
Here's a few threads from USENET back in 1997, only a few days after the film's release:
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...51c3264?hl=en&
http://groups.google.com/group/hsv.g...7c68f8aa?hl=en
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...7590f526?hl=en
Hell, there were people complaining about the change a month or so before the SE was even released:
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...+first&lnk=ol&
.
Heck even where iam at now i see about 2 to 3 people walking out of the movies we actually hold the world premeires for complaining about the movie.
And I heard not one single complaint about the special editions back in 1997.
I am not saying there werent any complaints anywhere about them back then, by a very small minority, but I will say it again for the average movie goer, those changes didnt and still dont ruin the movie. And there was a large number of film goers that did think the special editions were pretty cool.
as for comparing these re releases to pm that really isnt the same thing seeing as phantom meance was the first ORIGINAL star wars movie in over a decade. For the special editions it was a big deal because it broke records not only rereleases but also for a jan feb and march release.
And I will say it again if people thought the movies were really ruined by the changes they would have suffered signifcantly after the opening weekends, and they didnt.
As much as the aintitcoolnews generation might like to think they speak for the general movie going audience,Trust me they dont. all you need to do is look at the thousands and thousands of people who spent boatloads of money(not to mention the reception Lucas recieved) this weekend at celebration to see that that most people love star wars even with lucas altering the films.
but most who dont refuse to believe they are the only ones who hate these changes
Last edited by AmityBoatTours; 08-16-10 at 01:30 AM.
08-16-10, 01:40 AM
#116
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
re: Star Wars
[off-topic rant]So far as I'm concerned, Harry Knowles has been a far more negative force in the world of film than anything Lucas has done retroactively. It seems harder and harder to avoid spoilers about a movie these days, and it seems to me that the spoiler-laden trailers reflect that obsession with knowing before seeing. The magic of storytelling is always luring in an audience and then taking them somewhere unexpected; thanks to Knowles, we're all too often told where we're headed as the lure.[/off-topic rant]
08-16-10, 02:03 AM
#117
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
re: Star Wars
I'm 99.9% you're getting that first one. When I saw Star Wars in concert and they showed the footage of the council meeting in Ep1, it was already a digital Yoda instead of the so-does-not-loook-like-Yoda puppet one.
08-16-10, 02:57 AM
#118
DVD Talk Special Edition
re: Star Wars
Think it was more like a way to stop people having a desire to get the laserdisc set or bootleg the original versions. I have those sets and the first disc of each I might as well use as a coaster. Never saw them and never plan to either.
08-16-10, 09:20 AM
#119
DVD Talk Legend
re: Star Wars
... It's rare for someone working in a theatre to not hear someone complaining about something in a movie playing there... I will say it again for the average movie goer, those changes didnt and still dont ruin the movie. And there was a large number of film goers that did think the special editions were pretty cool.
For example, in Empire, when Vader is talking to the three Star Destroyer commanders via hologram while in the asteroid field, one of the Star Destroyers is hit by an asteroid, and that commander's hologram flickers out. I remember when the SEs came out in theaters, quite a few people thought that was a new effect, because they hadn't seen it before. However, it had always been there, and the reason they hadn't seen it was because the TV and most VHS versions were 4:3 P&S, and that part of the image had always been cut off. So there was enough thrill from just seeing the full image for the first time that the theatrical releases could've been as popular.
Also, even the people who disliked the changes still liked the SEs, or at least seeing Star Wars in theaters. From the previous USENET articles I quoted:
"Still, I enjoyed it very much (and I'll try to go see it again). "
"I was so overjoyed to see it again at an age older than 2 that I really didn't care what the new additions looked like. "
as for comparing these re releases to pm that really isnt the same thing seeing as phantom meance was the first ORIGINAL star wars movie in over a decade. For the special editions it was a big deal because it broke records not only rereleases but also for a jan feb and march release.
As much as the aintitcoolnews generation might like to think they speak for the general movie going audience,Trust me they dont.
But it's probably true that the majority of people don't mind or don't care about the changes. However, I don't see that as a reason for ignoring the minority who want the unaltered versions, especially when that minority is sizable enough to get Lucas to release the unaltered versions on DVD.
I mean, the number of people who care about the original theatrical cut of Blade Runner is probably a minority, and the number of people who care about the workprint cut of that film is likely even smaller, yet both those cuts, and 3 others, made it onto the 5-disc Blu-ray set in HD. If Ridley Scott and WB can release a box-office bomb and cult favorite like Blade Runner in such a way, surely it'd be no problem for Lucas to do the same with Star Wars, which will likely outsell the Blade Runner set on its first day of release.
08-16-10, 09:21 AM
#120
DVD Talk Legend
re: Star Wars
That still counts as "fan demand," as I was thinking more of market demand for the unaltered trilogy than something like an internet petition. Lucas doesn't care what the online community is arguing about; he does care about what he can make a buck off of.
08-16-10, 09:38 AM
#123
DVD Talk Legend
re: Star Wars
From what I recall, Lucas didn't want to release any of the Star Wars films on DVD until after the prequel trilogy was completed. However, the DVD market was growing so fast that they decided to release the prequel films on DVD as they were produced.
08-16-10, 09:43 AM
#124
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
re: Star Wars
I agree...but I think I can deal with the Jabba/Han thing if they would put the fucking original song back at the end of Jedi, and remove that AWFUL "Weesa Free!!!" from the Gungan celebration. The Greedo incident, along with the Dance number and song at the end of Jedi are the three things I can't stand. I cringe when I hear that fucking song.
However...almost the entirety of the other changes are for the better. The one thing I'm surprised was never fixed was the lightsabers from the Vader/Kenobi fight at the end of A New Hope. How they got through both the '97 and '04 upgrades is beyond me.
Regardless...sign me up for these. I wonder if the supplements from the DVD box bonus disc are going to carry over? Empire of Dreams is fantastic...
However...almost the entirety of the other changes are for the better. The one thing I'm surprised was never fixed was the lightsabers from the Vader/Kenobi fight at the end of A New Hope. How they got through both the '97 and '04 upgrades is beyond me.
Regardless...sign me up for these. I wonder if the supplements from the DVD box bonus disc are going to carry over? Empire of Dreams is fantastic...
Regardless, I'll be getting the box set when it comes out.
08-16-10, 10:02 AM
#125
re: Star Wars
I've actually never hated Greedo shooting first, although I did hate the 1997 effect. I thought the "simultaneous" version on the '04 DVDs was...acceptable. But this is probably because I was a dumb kid with unadventurous tastes, so when my dad tried to encourage me to watch Star Wars one weekend, I refused and demanded to watch Ghostbusters for the eleven billionth time. In 1996 or so he taped them off TV and I got into them, and then in 1997 I saw the SEs in theaters, so 90% of my memories of SW is the tampered versions. In fact, as a kid, you're just excited to see more of the movie you really liked.
The things that bug me:
- Not so much the Jabba scene but the fact that he still doesn't look a damn thing like he does in Return of the Jedi. Frankly, while he looked more CG, I think he actually looked more accurate in 1997. I bet they try a third time on the Blus. Third time's the charm? (I do agree that Boba Fett looking at the camera is really stupid.)
- I could do without the Biggs scene. It doesn't really bug me but if I had the choice I'd leave it out.
- The added Vader Empire scene, if only because, even though it apparently is, it absolutely does not sound like James Earl Jones.
- The new version of the Emperor scene in Empire is also bad. Ian McDiarmid has been the Emperor for years and yet for some reason the makeup looks all wrong and his voice doesn't seem right. What the hell? The alternate dialogue also bugs me too.
- The crappy Jabba's Palace musical number in Jedi.
- Hayden.
The things that bug me:
- Not so much the Jabba scene but the fact that he still doesn't look a damn thing like he does in Return of the Jedi. Frankly, while he looked more CG, I think he actually looked more accurate in 1997. I bet they try a third time on the Blus. Third time's the charm? (I do agree that Boba Fett looking at the camera is really stupid.)
- I could do without the Biggs scene. It doesn't really bug me but if I had the choice I'd leave it out.
- The added Vader Empire scene, if only because, even though it apparently is, it absolutely does not sound like James Earl Jones.
- The new version of the Emperor scene in Empire is also bad. Ian McDiarmid has been the Emperor for years and yet for some reason the makeup looks all wrong and his voice doesn't seem right. What the hell? The alternate dialogue also bugs me too.
- The crappy Jabba's Palace musical number in Jedi.
- Hayden.