"The Return of the Living Dead" BD 9/14
09-21-10, 02:52 AM
#76
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
Re: "The Return of the Living Dead" BD 9/14
09-21-10, 03:02 AM
#77
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: "The Return of the Living Dead" BD 9/14
09-21-10, 11:54 AM
#82
DVD Talk Special Edition
09-21-10, 01:41 PM
#83
DVD Talk Special Edition
09-21-10, 05:53 PM
#84
DVD Talk Special Edition
Re: "The Return of the Living Dead" BD 9/14
In case y'all didn't read the review on the site, the audio is still wrong. That makes me a sad panda. Just like the previous release, you can here the original track on O'Bannon's commentary. I still love the movie, but those changes will alway bug me.
09-22-10, 08:42 AM
#86
DVD Talk Legend
05-29-11, 07:21 PM
#88
Re: "The Return of the Living Dead" BD 9/14
Also, I was at a convention this weekend and someone else had the "Collector's Edition" DVD, and I was surprised to see it originally came with an insert. Does the old release have an insert too? I might have to track both down.
05-29-11, 07:56 PM
#89
DVD Talk Hero
Re: "The Return of the Living Dead" BD 9/14
^ This Amazon reviewer spells it out. And as someone who grew up watching this on HBO and VHS, the music changes are saddening:
Before we start. I want to affirm that I love this film. Great script, great performances, great soundtrack, great directing.
Also, regardless of the negative feedback I give this DVD, we are unfortunately obligated to buy it, if we ever want to see a special edition DVD.
Ok, here goes. Yeah it looks great. But it just felt wrong. I couldn't place the reason. I thought maybe it was a visual matter. But I quickly realized that what was bugging me was the soundtrack. It was inexplicably, utterly mangled.
Will someone tell me why? Why were the vocals for whole songs removed? I am sorely disappointed and angered by this. I am outraged by the George Lucas style of re-working your film for DVD, and abandoning the original theatrical cut. If you feel the need to improve your film, fine, provide an alternate cut, or additional scenes, or whatever, that's great. Give me the option on the menu to see the "improved version, or the regular cut. But don't alter a classic, and not even mention it and try to pass it off as the original.
There are so many examples of this butchering, that I can't name them all. I only watched it once last night, and am at work now, but a few definitely come to mind.
#1 The scene where Trash and Suicide and the gang are speeding towards the cemetery used to have the Damned song Dead Beat Dance as the background music. Well, not anymore! You get the inital maniacal laugh, and then nothing, a completely different song. Why?!
#2 The scene where the zombie says: "send more cops", with a thick new york accent. A classic scene right? We all loved it right? Well did you notice that they changed the voice? Did you notice that is was awful in comparison, and not nearly as funny? Was there a good reason for this sacrilege? Has Dan O'Bannon lost his mind, or was this the studios fault? In the end credits, where the best-of scenes replay a second time, we hear the "send more cops" line in all its original glory. So I know I am not imagining this.
#3 What's his name, the Pathmark guy (no slight intended, his performance was excellent), takes his own life by placing himself in the crematorium. In the original version of this scene is accompanied by the song Burn the Flames, which sports a haunting guitar solo at the exact moment the door shuts and we hear the man's tortured screams. It is actually one of my favorite scenes in the film. The haunting music enhances the sadness of the moment.
But not anymore. Now the music is faded out in a particularly unartistic way, and the scene plays silent. Sorry but this is a disgrace. I waited years for this film to be re-released and I feel betrayed. The soundtrack was perfect the way it was. In a different film it would not be as a big of a deal. But when you are the ONLY zombie/comedy/horror film with a punky soundtrack, and a damned good one, and everyone loves you for it, you don't go around meddling and altering, deleting and rewriting, compiling and defiling.
It go to the point where I held my breath with every song change, worried sick that they would ommit lyrics or do away with the track altogether. Waves of relief washed over me when I reached the scene where the zombies are attacking the funeral home (and our heroes are furiously nailing doors and windows shut)and I discovered that the Cramps song "Surfin Dead" was left intact. Thank god, or the devil, for that one.
Could I be wrong? Did I miss some sort of soundtrack feature, where mistakenly clicked something off or on? Or is the sad fact that this movie has been permanently altered...?
Also, regardless of the negative feedback I give this DVD, we are unfortunately obligated to buy it, if we ever want to see a special edition DVD.
Ok, here goes. Yeah it looks great. But it just felt wrong. I couldn't place the reason. I thought maybe it was a visual matter. But I quickly realized that what was bugging me was the soundtrack. It was inexplicably, utterly mangled.
Will someone tell me why? Why were the vocals for whole songs removed? I am sorely disappointed and angered by this. I am outraged by the George Lucas style of re-working your film for DVD, and abandoning the original theatrical cut. If you feel the need to improve your film, fine, provide an alternate cut, or additional scenes, or whatever, that's great. Give me the option on the menu to see the "improved version, or the regular cut. But don't alter a classic, and not even mention it and try to pass it off as the original.
There are so many examples of this butchering, that I can't name them all. I only watched it once last night, and am at work now, but a few definitely come to mind.
#1 The scene where Trash and Suicide and the gang are speeding towards the cemetery used to have the Damned song Dead Beat Dance as the background music. Well, not anymore! You get the inital maniacal laugh, and then nothing, a completely different song. Why?!
#2 The scene where the zombie says: "send more cops", with a thick new york accent. A classic scene right? We all loved it right? Well did you notice that they changed the voice? Did you notice that is was awful in comparison, and not nearly as funny? Was there a good reason for this sacrilege? Has Dan O'Bannon lost his mind, or was this the studios fault? In the end credits, where the best-of scenes replay a second time, we hear the "send more cops" line in all its original glory. So I know I am not imagining this.
#3 What's his name, the Pathmark guy (no slight intended, his performance was excellent), takes his own life by placing himself in the crematorium. In the original version of this scene is accompanied by the song Burn the Flames, which sports a haunting guitar solo at the exact moment the door shuts and we hear the man's tortured screams. It is actually one of my favorite scenes in the film. The haunting music enhances the sadness of the moment.
But not anymore. Now the music is faded out in a particularly unartistic way, and the scene plays silent. Sorry but this is a disgrace. I waited years for this film to be re-released and I feel betrayed. The soundtrack was perfect the way it was. In a different film it would not be as a big of a deal. But when you are the ONLY zombie/comedy/horror film with a punky soundtrack, and a damned good one, and everyone loves you for it, you don't go around meddling and altering, deleting and rewriting, compiling and defiling.
It go to the point where I held my breath with every song change, worried sick that they would ommit lyrics or do away with the track altogether. Waves of relief washed over me when I reached the scene where the zombies are attacking the funeral home (and our heroes are furiously nailing doors and windows shut)and I discovered that the Cramps song "Surfin Dead" was left intact. Thank god, or the devil, for that one.
Could I be wrong? Did I miss some sort of soundtrack feature, where mistakenly clicked something off or on? Or is the sad fact that this movie has been permanently altered...?
05-29-11, 10:51 PM
#90
Re: "The Return of the Living Dead" BD 9/14
Eh, 2 songs. and a couple of lines (I know the Tar Man's "Brains!" was changed too). If MGM ever releases a version that's intact, that'd be great, but it doesn't sound that significant.
05-30-11, 02:41 AM
#91
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Re: "The Return of the Living Dead" BD 9/14
It's not significant, at all. People just want what they are used to. If O'Bannon had had his way originally, that's precisely how the movie would have sounded (minus that one song cut which was due to licensing issues.)
05-30-11, 04:29 AM
#92
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
Re: "The Return of the Living Dead" BD 9/14
"Take A Walk" is also completely removed from where it originally played. So now you only hear the dialogue and sound effects as the gang boards up the door in the warehouse, yet the urgency of the scene is gone, since the song originally added to the mood. Then once they run out towards the cemetery. The opening chords of the song are heard briefly looped then fades out and it sounds really awful and just doesn't work. The way it was originally mixed with the song playing over the entire preceding sequence then the chorus starts in as they run out of the building was awesome. It just fit it beautifully and now it's been destroyed with the awful alteration.
If the original mix were included along with the bad altered mix. Then I don't think anyone would be complaining. But since this new lousy mix is all that's used on home video releases and tv showings now. It's something to be upset over, since it really does destroy the film in my opinion as everything we liked about the audio and what was memorable about the film has now been changed.
05-30-11, 06:04 AM
#93
Re: "The Return of the Living Dead" BD 9/14
I guess I get it, since the filmmaker changed it after the fact. But I have no attachment to the way those scenes originally played, since I've only seen it on Blu-Ray and the Collector's Edition DVD.
05-30-11, 07:53 PM
#94
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
Re: "The Return of the Living Dead" BD 9/14
That's fine, since the changes wouldn't be obvious then. But for fans who grew up on the film before the changes, it's a huge difference and not for the better. Also I think some people who have heard all the praise the film received might wonder what all the fuss is about because of this new mix, as they're not seeing the film everyone else has seen prior.
06-01-11, 07:08 AM
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Re: "The Return of the Living Dead" BD 9/14
Part II had some major audio re-workings as well (although the audio behind the commentary track is the original audio)
06-01-11, 07:50 PM
#97
06-02-11, 06:58 AM
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Re: "The Return of the Living Dead" BD 9/14
As someone who has seen all these movies (well up to part III) probably 50+ times each and saw them theatrically (parts 1 and 2) the audio changes don't really bother me all that much or hinder my enjoyment of the movie. If I really wanted to hear the audio "the way I remember it" I have DVD-R rips I made of the laser discs. The movie still plays well and is enjoyable and the Blu-Ray looks great.
07-05-11, 01:04 AM
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Re: "The Return of the Living Dead" BD 9/14
That's fine, since the changes wouldn't be obvious then. But for fans who grew up on the film before the changes, it's a huge difference and not for the better. Also I think some people who have heard all the praise the film received might wonder what all the fuss is about because of this new mix, as they're not seeing the film everyone else has seen prior.
Look, I can understand you wanting things "how they were" (regardless if they were not what the director originally wanted) but you are really exaggerating here.
07-06-11, 01:35 AM
#100
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
Re: "The Return of the Living Dead" BD 9/14
So all the praise the movie received dealt with the minor audio bits and nothing else? These small parts essentially made the movie and without them it totally sucks?
Look, I can understand you wanting things "how they were" (regardless if they were not what the director originally wanted) but you are really exaggerating here.
Look, I can understand you wanting things "how they were" (regardless if they were not what the director originally wanted) but you are really exaggerating here.
They're not 'minor' audio bits when huge sequences are affected by the changes("Take A Walk", "Surfin Dead" and so on). The editing fit the pace and tone of the songs used perfectly and to alter it does severely alter those sequences for the worse, not for the better.
Also the voice alteration of Tar Mans voice and the the other zombies 'send more cops' line do sound awful now compared to the original version. That does ruin the punch line as it were to those moments and they lack bite now, while the original voices were memorable and really sold the lines. Also if the alterations were done a tad more professional, the newer versions of the two zombie voices would be heard over the end credits instead of the original versions. That's just sloppy right there, and all the alterations do have a very amateur sloppy quality to them which does detract from the film in my opinion.
You can't just alter a films audio mix years after the fact and not think anyone won't notice or mind the changes. The soundtrack for the film is part of the film and changing it does drastically change the film itself. If the original mix were included on the past dvd and BR releases. There would be no problems at all. But since no option for the original theatrical mix was included, it is pretty irritating to have an inferior altered mix being the only option to listen to.
For example, imagine that the final scene in All That Jazz were altered. Where instead of the original 'Bye Bye Life' musical number, they decide to take out the music and just use a vocal mix instead, or replace it with another song entirely. It's the only change in the entire film, everything before it is exactly as it has always been. Would this change not drastically alter the film itself and ruin it in anyway? The film is building up this big grand finale set piece and yet now doesn't deliver at all. So yes, that version of the film would suck despite the supposed 'minor alteration' of the finale.
Or imagine if Repo Man, another punk rock classic soundtrack film had it's soundtrack completely altered. Maybe the director now feels hip hop is more fitting for the film(or used new recordings by the same bands which sound much worse than the memorable original versions) and also doesn't like certain lines and replaces them with altered dialogue or omits them entirely. Suddenly the film isn't what it used to be. Sure the film runs the same length and no scenes are cut, but the tone is off now, something doesn't seem right, and some memorable jokes are ruined as well.
Return of the Living Dead is a similar situation in my opinion. Since aside from the music changes and a couple voice alterations. The rest of the film is the same as it's always been. But those moments did add to the film and were part of what made it stand out a bit more and shouldn't be altered in anyway. So the film with the new mix does suck in my opinion, but the film with the original mix is classic and still is awesome.
