+1.

I wonder how many of those $99 A2s get hooked up to a TV via a composite cable? ("Hey Marge, does this new HD DVD thing look any better to you? I don't get what all the fuss is about!")

I don't buy the notion that this move by Toshiba is some sort of death blow to BD. I don't see Sony giving up (after all they will have millions of Blu-ray capable PS3s in homes) and Fox and Disney seem pretty solid also. Toshiba is fighting for the life of its HD DVD format, with BD having had the better year thus far. My guess is that the best Toshiba can hope for is coexistence. That would be fine with me.

I don't think you'd want a 1080p/24 native display. Even film projectors display each frame at least twice, essentially making it 48 fps.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Movie_projector#Shutter

^I think the expectation is that a "1080p/24 native" display would actually be able to convert it to 1080p/72 (or the 1080p/120 Paul_SD mentioned). No 3:2 pulldown needed, just 3 repeats of each frame per second.

I, too, think that 24 fps might have a noticeable flicker.

I believe this IS a potential death blow to BD. A TON of people jumped off the format war fence in the past few days. Even a lot of BD backers picked up HDDVD players because, at $99, why not?

BD's arrogance is what's going to kill it. Right now, BD is being established in the mind of the mainstream consumer as ridiculously overpriced. BD has about 6 months to make some SERIOUS hardware price cuts, or they will lose this format war. There is NO WAY BD is going to win a format war when their cheapest player is four times the price of the cheapest HDDVD player, regardless of whether it doubles as a video game system. That's obvious. If BD doesn't start making the prices of its hardware VERY competitive, and darn soon, they will lose the war by next Christmas.

Player prices will win this war, not software prices. People aren't going to buy a player that costs hundreds of dollars more because of a few dollars savings on each DVD. The average consumer doesn't buy nearly enough DVDs for that to make sense.

Depending on how much money Sony wants to lose being stubborn, BD might survive as a niche technology, with a only a few titles released per year, for those who need to feel like they are smarter than "J6P". But HDDVD will be the clear mainstream format winner, the player in everyone's home, and the format on which every movie gets released. It's crisis time for BD, and it seems that most BD backers don't even realize it. I wonder if the execs at Sony do?...

Hey thanks for the FUD. If any format is considered niche, it's HD-DVD. A format that has hardware support from like one major company, and doesn't have the support of Disney, Fox, or Columbia Tristar.

It's just as FUDDY as your post. MrDs10e said "I believe" which means it's an opinion. Just like yours. If anything, BOTH formats are a niche.

I'm not sure either BD or HD should be trying label the other as niche ... pot calling kettle.

I like them both being niche. I kinda hope they stay that way I feel like I'm part of an exclusive club of people that are watching movies better than everyone else.

I felt the exact same way about DVD when it first came out. Let the masses watch their fullscreen VHS, while I watch my movies in widescreen, with 5.1 surround sound and loads of special features.

Now we lost the inserts and have to pay a preminum for that same bonus disc that used to come standard. Damn masses ;)

I don't have a rooting interest either way. I couldn't care less if HD-DVD or BD wins the war. I just know that one will. And from what I see right now, HD-DVD is taking the steps that lead to victory, though there is still plenty of time for the tide to change. I'm just telling you what I see. Backing by studios doesn't mean much. They can change horses midstream, and WOULD if they thought BD wasn't going to have the player market saturation to move their discs.

In five years, SD-DVD will be in about the same place in the market as VHS is now, and a SINGLE HD format will have at least 80% of the market. Write that down, put it in your wallet, and in 2012 pull it out and see that I'm right. If there are really so many that don't realize that this is inevitable, I should start a website and take bets on it. I could retire in 5 years. In the long term, HD-DVD and BD coexisting as anywhere near equals is not a plausible scenario. And SD-DVD remaining the standard for more than another 3-5 years is not a plausible scenario either.

While I'd like to agree with your prophesy of the future, I'm not quite sure that DVDs will be a primary concern in 2012.

Members are already starting to plan- http://forum.dvdtalk.com/showthread....highlight=2012

^^^^LOL, yes, in truth that is the more urgent matter that we should be discussing :D

I don't think too many are saying this is a death blow. This sale has proved significant in moving people off the fence, however. That is undeniable. I have long said (before the was an HD forum) that the player prices would be a HUGE factor the first couple of years. It is far easier to justify $100 than $400. I hope that Sony counters with some kick ass pricing on BD decks.

Sony does have millions of BD capable PS3s in homes, but they also have tons of UMD capable PSPs in homes too, but studio support has dried up. Sony (Columbia Tri-Star) will support BD to the bitter end. It will be interesting to see if a larger installed base becomes too enticing for BD studios to ignore. This comes on the heels of BD's holy grail of copy protection being broken open.

This format war is far from over.

Well, you have to ask yourself one question. Do you feel lucky?

Nah, it isn't that one. But seriously, the question is, let's say HD DVD "wins". Do you think Sony is going to start making HD DVDs? Fat chance. I suspect they'll give the middle finger to consumers and if they do, the titles will sell for $50. I just don't see Sony rolling over just because HD DVD is declared a winner. It would make things very frustrating for the rest of us.

Blu-ray has penetrated a large audience, and so has HD DVD, so both formats will be around after the December 31, 2007. :)

Also, we haven't heard the response from Sony in regards to discounting PS3's. And for BD movies, they might even do a B1G2 Free promotion. Sony has money, and they have room to play.

I'm not saying Sony doesn't have money, but another year like this year for Sony and it could mean trouble for the company as a whole, not just the BD/VG divisions. PS3 caused huge losses for the company. It will be interesting to see how far they will go to win.

They have a lot of arms and their TV division is very profitable again. They will be fine, but at some point they will have to make a decision if the PS3 remains a huge money loser.

Plus consoles are always sold at a loss if I'm not mistaken. Microsoft still hasn't seen a penny from the gen 1 and gen 2 Xbox.

You make it up on software and the PS3 isn't moving consoles or software that in any way makes up for the costs. PS3 is a long term project for them so they still have time to turn it around.

I seem to recall that Disney and Fox were major holdouts back in 1997 when they supported that other format, DIVx over DVD.

You would be correct. There were even a few people back then saying that Divx would succeed based purely on the exclusive support from Disney.

I'm going to rent movies from here on until there is only one format! May happen may not. But this sucks.

Just choose one and go. I chose Blu Ray, b/c currently they have the titles I enjoy most-Disney, Sony, Anchor Bay...

I am only buying certain titles that I truely like and will benefit from HD. I still buy plenty of SDVD.