Working on a paper on the format war...help needed!
 

Hello fellow DVD Talkers, my name is Kevin and I can use your help, if it all possible.

For sometime now, the format war has been raging. HD-DVD, Blu-Ray, SD DVD...oh my this can confuse anyone over 40 for sure. But something came up the other day and I am curious to see what people pick, why, and what they like the most.

I had some family over and I was discussing about upgrading to one of the hi-def formats, when one finally beat the other. I started to explain what I knew so far and I got blank stares across the board. And in a moment of weakness, I had to say, "I can't explain it any further than that", which sucked.

So what I am planning to do is to literally write a paper showing the pros and cons of both formats and perhaps a little history on both (Yes, I do plan on submitting this for a college class I have coming up as well on consumerism). I have a few questions and a few rules too. First the rules:

1. Do not say "This format sucks" or "this copy sucks". We all know that is thread crapping and I personally can't stand it.

2. Please attempt to backup your argument...if you have a link, post it.

3. Since I am probably going to copy/paste most of this thread, can we keep the foul language to a minimum. Although I don't care about it, it will be hard to edit out later.

Ok now on to my questions (in no specific order):

1. Which format do you support and why?

2. What has been the best film/show on your supported format so far?

3. How much have you spent?

4. How much are you willing to spend?

5. What kind of setup do you have?
5a. If you don't specifically have a stand alone Hi-def player, who do you play your discs?

6. Do you see yourself spending as much on hi-def as you did on standard definition DVD's?

7. Do you think either format will be out of date in a few years?

8. If you haven't gone to hi-def, why not?

9. What is the worst hi-def disc you bought and why?

10. What are your feelings about some Blu-ray disc being released (or remastered) to correct previous mistakes (see The Fifth Element)?

11. Should studios stay format neutral?

12. What do you feel is the biggest difference between HD-DVD and Blu-Ray?

13. Does hardware make a difference (players, TV's, audio)?

14. What are you feelings about the enhanced protection on the new formats?

15. What are your feelings about Paramount going to HD-DVD only? Will this discourage you? If you are a Blu-Ray supporter, what is your take?

I would like to thank everyone in advance for answering any questions I posted...it is greatly appreciated and hopefully help me in my quest.

Kevin

Ok now on to my questions (in no specific order):

1. Which format do you support and why?

I support Blu-ray for two reasons. The first reason is that I feel it has the best chance of winning the format war. The second reason is that I wanted a PS3 anyway, so I killed two birds with one stone.

2. What has been the best film/show on your supported format so far?
It is a tie between The Guardian and Casino Royale. The Guardian had excellent special features and is a great movie. Casino Royale has the best picture quality I have seen on HD.

3. How much have you spent?
$800

4. How much are you willing to spend?
$400 per year on new movies.

5. What kind of setup do you have?
42 in. Panasonic Plasma. I don't have a reciever or any extra speakers.

5a. If you don't specifically have a stand alone Hi-def player, who do you play your discs? PS3

6. Do you see yourself spending as much on hi-def as you did on standard definition DVD's?
Yea.

7. Do you think either format will be out of date in a few years?
Not a few years, but I have a feeling one of the formats will become as popular at Beta in about 6 years.

8. If you haven't gone to hi-def, why not?

9. What is the worst hi-def disc you bought and why?
The Fountain. I purchased the movie because it sounded like it had a great plot. But, they sure screwed up a great idea. So far, it is the only Blu-ray that I have sold or wanted to sell.

10. What are your feelings about some Blu-ray disc being released (or remastered) to correct previous mistakes (see The Fifth Element)?
I'm glad that they are willing to admit they made a mistake and fix it. Some companies would refuse to admit a mistake.

11. Should studios stay format neutral?
No, a studio has a right to make choices just like consumers.

12. What do you feel is the biggest difference between HD-DVD and Blu-Ray?
Probably the biggest difference is the name. In other words, there really isn't much of a difference.

13. Does hardware make a difference (players, TV's, audio)?
Of course. Do you really want to watch a Blu-ray on a 13 inch television.

14. What are you feelings about the enhanced protection on the new formats?
I don't really care.

15. What are your feelings about Paramount going to HD-DVD only? Will this discourage you? If you are a Blu-Ray supporter, what is your take?
Paramount made a decision that they think is in the best interest of their company. As a Blu-ray support, I feel that this will just extend the format war a couple years. Blu-ray will probably become the dominant format in the future.

1. I went with Blu-Ray because it has more studio support (thus more selection) and the durability promised by the new coating is a plus (I have never seen a BD with a scratch that I couldn't just wipe off with a microfiber cloth).

2. The best title available on both formats would be Planet Earth. It's able to stun and amaze anyone within seconds of starting up. As far as BD-exlusive titles go, Crank and Curse of the Golden Flower are both amazing. Golden Flower gets the edge because I also really enjoy the movie and it's a significant jump from DVD which seemed kind of muddy.

3. $500 on the player, maybe 200-250 on discs. (Thank God for the exchange on this site!)

4. If you mean per disc, I am willing to spend a maximum of $30 for a single feature. For TV shows, I'd probably spend double that for a season.

5. I have a 26" LCD HDTV, PS3 (connected through HDMI), and a 550 watt 5.1 system.

6. I'm spending more on HD than SD-DVD right now, but it pretty much matches my spending during my first year with DVD.

7. Tough questions. Studios make the calls on who to back, but if customer support shows overwhelmingly for the other, they'll change their tune pretty quick. I'd bet that this "war" will end with one side buying the weaker side out because of the realization that customers are hesitant to spend that much without some assurance of lasting power.

8. N/A

9. I haven't had too many bad experiences since I read a lot of reviews to check up on picture quality. Every disc I've bought shows a significant difference from DVD.

10. I got the remastered Fifth Element and it is a showcase disc. It should have been done right at first or delayed until it could have been done right though.

11. It seems to be working well for Warner Bros. It would put some pressure on the rival side, but it wouldn't change the tide overnight.

12. Durability and storage space.

13. There is no benefit to having an HD disc player if you don't have the HDTV to back it up.

14. Copy protection? I'm fine with it unless something comes out saying that it's taking significant space away from the movie and special features.

15. It was surprising but Paramount hasn't put much out on HD and was probably losing money by doing both formats. I'm disappointed, but I'm one of the few that could care less about Transformers. Since a large part of the Blu-ray base are PS3 players, they probably made less money with BD. The average gamer concerned with HD probably wouldn't be too interested in Babel or Black Snake Moan.

1. Which format do you support and why? HD-DVD. It was vastly more affordable and offers features which are authentically next-gen (300 Bluescreen PIP is the coolest special feature I've seen to date), outstanding audio and video, and had more current titles I wanted (The Thing, Shaun of the Dead, Hot Fuzz, Elizabeth, etc; ) or superior versions (300).

2. What has been the best film/show on your supported format so far?
The Thing was the most impressive off the bat, amazing how good the movie looks. In terms of flat out best? Shaun of the Dead. The sound also, for some reason, really stood out as impressive.

3. How much have you spent?
about $300 (Amazon Deal ($220 for the A2 w/ Shaun of the Dead, Big Lebowski, 300, and 5 others I haven't received yet) + $25 for Hot Fuzz + $20 for Elizabeth + Netflix Subscription))

4. How much are you willing to spend?
$250 or less for the player itself. Movies are still a bit too expensive.

5. What kind of setup do you have?
Toshiba HD-A2 connected to a Mitsubishi HD1000U Front Projector (720p at about 115" now) w/ an Onkyo 5.1 surround setup operating via optical.

6. Do you see yourself spending as much on hi-def as you did on standard definition DVD's?

Yep.

7. Do you think either format will be out of date in a few years?

Yes.

9. What is the worst hi-def disc you bought and why?
I'm happy with all the discs I've purchased.

10. What are your feelings about some Blu-ray disc being released (or remastered) to correct previous mistakes (see The Fifth Element)?

At least they're owning up and admitting they screwed up.

11. Should studios stay format neutral?

Yes.

12. What do you feel is the biggest difference between HD-DVD and Blu-Ray?

HD-DVD is more established in terms of outlined specs and requirements, Blu-ray has great scratch protection.

13. Does hardware make a difference (players, TV's, audio)?
Huge difference. While the features and menu systems remain cool, they alone aren't worth upgrading for. You need to have a setup that will take advantage of the format before it is actually worthwhile.

14. What are you feelings about the enhanced protection on the new formats?
No qualms from me.

15. What are your feelings about Paramount going to HD-DVD only? Will this discourage you? If you are a Blu-Ray supporter, what is your take?

I think it's a mistake to go format exclusive, but it is nice to help balance Fox/Disney exclusivity.

1. Which format do you support and why?
I support both, though I tend to buy the HD DVD when there is a choice, mainly due to the fact that my A2 works with my Harmony remote.

2. What has been the best film/show on your supported format so far?
Still probably The Searchers on HD DVD.

3. How much have you spent?
Too much, honestly. I had an A1 (but sold it), have an A2, a PS3, a 360 add-on, and an internal BD-R drive for my notebook. I also have 269 (as of today) total HD movies.

4. How much are you willing to spend?
I buy what I want.

5. What kind of setup do you have?
I have an A2 and a PS3 going into a Pioneer Elite 84TxSi, which feeds a Panasonic 50 inch plasma. Front speakers are Definitive BP-8 (next upgrade for sure), center is a DT Mythos 3, rears are Mythos 6.

5a. If you don't specifically have a stand alone Hi-def player, who do you play your discs?

6. Do you see yourself spending as much on hi-def as you did on standard definition DVD's?
That'd be hard to do, but I'm young.

7. Do you think either format will be out of date in a few years?
No. I don't really think it's possible. The only way something will supplant them is if it offers a quantum leap in speed and convenience, which I don't see happening in the near future.

8. If you haven't gone to hi-def, why not?

9. What is the worst hi-def disc you bought and why?
Probably Tomb Raider or Bourne Supremacy. Bad-looking movies that have the added bonus of being bad films.

10. What are your feelings about some Blu-ray disc being released (or remastered) to correct previous mistakes (see The Fifth Element)?
I'm glad they did it, since it allowed me to pick up the film.

11. Should studios stay format neutral?
Studios should operate outside the CE framework altogether. Any time I hear that studios "overwhelmingly support" X technology, I get nervous, since the studios are these archaic beasts that are interested in their own self-preservation at all costs. I think CE companies were foolish to court the studios at all during this process, since they are now slaves to their whims. I liken this to back in the day when studios would pay companies for the privilege of using their products onscreen. Once the studios realized how foolish this was, the tables were turned and the companies now pay studios to place their products in films. The studios should be looking for any and all ways to provide content to consumers, and any collusive attempt to change that relationship is suspect to me.

12. What do you feel is the biggest difference between HD-DVD and Blu-Ray?

There is no fundamental difference as far as quality goes. Consider me lucky, but I've yet to come across a defective combo disc or problem blu-ray disc.

13. Does hardware make a difference (players, TV's, audio)?

As far as playback hardware goes, the answer is no for most users. Like anything else, high-end users require other options (24p, etc) that simply don't affect most people. To me, anyone not using at least a receiver with a 5.1 setup is insane, simply because they are missing out on half of what makes the HD formats special. I know that my 50 inch plasma (720p) is considered average in some circles and below average in others, but we have to temper our expectations accordingly. I see a few people above me with setups that I find appalling for even rendering an opinion about HD movies, but some people would say the same about my setup, so it's all relative.

14. What are you feelings about the enhanced protection on the new formats?

As usual, the protection will be rendered impotent before it has the chance to protect the formats from professional pirates. The only people DRM ever affects are legitimate users. The fact that anyone would embrace DRM in 2007 shows that they have not paid one lick of attention to the evolution of the DRM market over the past 10 years.

15. What are your feelings about Paramount going to HD-DVD only? Will this discourage you? If you are a Blu-Ray supporter, what is your take?

This topic has really been beaten to death here and elsewhere, so there is nothing I could say about it that hasn't been said before. More than anything, I think it guaranteed that we will likely see mass adoption of dual-format players before we see a decisive winner.

Very cool..thanks everyone.

I do need to clarify two questions:

2. What is the best in terms of presentation?

9. What is the worst in terms of presentation?

1. Which format do you support and why?

HD DVD. I already owned an Xbox 360, so the add-on was a cheap way to get on board. I have no desire to ever own a PS3. Also, there are just more titles exclusive to HD DVD right now that interest me more than the Blu Ray exclusive titles.

2. What has been the best film/show on your supported format so far?

Planet Earth has been the most impressive so far, but I haven't really been disappointed with any titles yet.

3. How much have you spent?

Haven't really been keeping track. I bought the 360 add-on, plus around 20-25 titles.

4. How much are you willing to spend?

I have no set limit. I'll continue to buy new movies that interest me as they come out.

5. What kind of setup do you have?

Right now, just the 360 add-on plus a 52" 1080i screen. I plan to upgrade both next year at tax return time.

6. Do you see yourself spending as much on hi-def as you did on standard definition DVD's?

No. I certainly don't think I need to double dip and re-purchase the 800-something standard DVDs I already own. Even if all the titles do eventually find their way to an HD format - there are some movies I just don't really feel like I need to upgrade. Do I really need to spend $30 to buy a new copy of Caddyshack so I can watch it in hi-def? For me, no.

7. Do you think either format will be out of date in a few years?

Personally, I hope so. I would much rather get away from a room full of shelves full of cases full of discs - and would much rather just have a set-top box in my home theater rack with a couple terabytes of disc storage that could store my entire movie library. If I want to buy a new movie, I could connect via a high speed internet connection and purchase the movie from my recliner - no more trips to Best Buy or waiting for UPS to knock on my door. No more getting up to swap out a disc, just mash a few buttons on the remote and instantly see all of the details about the movie on my screen. That's a perfect world scenario for me - but doubt that's anywhere close to reality any time soon.

9. What is the worst hi-def disc you bought and why?

Haven't been disappointed yet.

11. Should studios stay format neutral?

I don't think it's realistic to release every movie on two separate formats.

12. What do you feel is the biggest difference between HD-DVD and Blu-Ray?

For me the biggest difference is the quality of titles available for each format. HD DVD just has the better movies available right now.

15. What are your feelings about Paramount going to HD-DVD only? Will this discourage you? If you are a Blu-Ray supporter, what is your take?

It has to happen sooner or later, if the format war is ever going to end. At some point, every studio will have to go exclusive. This is a good thing.

1. Which format do you support and why?
I buy both formats but I'm rooting for HD-DVD. HD-DVD is region free, which is good since I have about 7 import discs. HD-DVD is cheaper. HD-DVD can support more extra features. Really on paper, this choice is a no-brainer.

2. What has been the best film/show on your supported format so far?
I'd have to say either King Kong or La Haine. Both those have astounding picture quality.

3. How much have you spent?
I don't want to know but it's a lot.

4. How much are you willing to spend?
Well, I bought into both formats so a lot I guess.

5. What kind of setup do you have?
5a. If you don't specifically have a stand alone Hi-def player, who do you play your discs?
I have the 360 add-on and the PS3 and a big Sony LCD, I currently do not have a sound set up.

6. Do you see yourself spending as much on hi-def as you did on standard definition DVD's?
That depends on the amount of High Def releases, great bargains that can be had, and whether or not Criterion enters the HD game.

7. Do you think either format will be out of date in a few years?
No, I think this will be the Hundred Years War. Not literally of course.

8. If you haven't gone to hi-def, why not?
N/A

9. What is the worst hi-def disc you bought and why?
Worst in presentation or worst as in the movie bit the big one? I haven't watched a bad movie per say, but I didn't care for Perfume.

10. What are your feelings about some Blu-ray disc being released (or remastered) to correct previous mistakes (see The Fifth Element)?
I'll get back to you when Disney fixes Pirates of the Caribbean.

11. Should studios stay format neutral?
Not now since I already bought into both formats.

12. What do you feel is the biggest difference between HD-DVD and Blu-Ray?
Price!! Superbad has an MSRP of $43.95, $43.95!!!! HD-DVD is cheaper bar none.

13. Does hardware make a difference (players, TV's, audio)?
T.V. definitely makes a difference, the players might but I've had no issues.

14. What are you feelings about the enhanced protection on the new formats?
Pointless. At least HD-DVD is region free.

15. What are your feelings about Paramount going to HD-DVD only? Will this discourage you? If you are a Blu-Ray supporter, what is your take?
I'm happy to see HD-DVD being thrown a life raft. It certainly deserves it.

1. Which format do you support and why?

I support both formats. However, not equally. I've have found myself leaning more towards HD-DVD because of their classic films.

2. What has been the best film/show on your supported format so far?

Blu-Ray Blood Diamonds / Blu-Ray Casino Royale: OO7. Older films Forbidden Planet HD and Adventures of Robin Hood HD

3. How much have you spent?

$3.2K+


4. How much are you willing to spend?

It all depends on what titles are coming out per month - At this time I would have to say that I will be spending about $300 this month alone on new titles.


5. What kind of setup do you have?

No stand alone players


5a. If you don't specifically have a stand alone Hi-def player, who do you play your discs?

X-Box360 w/HD Drive
PS3 60G

6. Do you see yourself spending as much on hi-def as you did on standard definition DVD's?

If not the same, alittle bit more.

7. Do you think either format will be out of date in a few years?

No, this is really pushing the barrier of physically visible resolution - 1560p/i? if possible, the human eye would have a hard time distinguishing the diffrence.

8. If you haven't gone to hi-def, why not?

n/a

9. What is the worst hi-def disc you bought and why?

ANY TITLE THAT DOESNT TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THE SPACE AVALIABLE ON THE FORMAT - With the ammount of storage capacity on these disc's you would think there would be
a complete transfer of all the DVD, laser, vhs footage avaliable. The titles that have nothing more than the film itself really upset me. I honestly dont think I
can think of one title that really didnt look good in Hi-Def.

10. What are your feelings about some Blu-ray disc being released (or remastered) to correct previous mistakes (see The Fifth Element)?

I feel that this is a complete apology to the consumer and would wish other manufacturers would make the same corrective steps

11. Should studios stay format neutral?

I can see how individuals could just sit it out and wait, see whats going to happen with both formats. But It really isnt nessacary. All you are doing is
pigeon-holing your customers into choosing one or the other format - If the format that they've choosen goes belly up. You may be stuck with Software that is
obsolete.

I really dont suffer from this problem. which ever way it goes I'm going to be a winner - I own both formats.



12. What do you feel is the biggest difference between HD-DVD and Blu-Ray?

Red and Blue cases

13. Does hardware make a difference (players, TV's, audio)?

Absolutely.


14. What are you feelings about the enhanced protection on the new formats?

I like it, but than again - I'm not brushing my teeth with these disc's. So i'm not overtly concerned because its from my shelf to the player and visa versa



15. What are your feelings about Paramount going to HD-DVD only? Will this discourage you? If you are a Blu-Ray supporter, what is your take?


Good for them! Its called business - Dont get upset.

The best thing you can do for your paper, is explain that this is not a format "war", but a format "battle".

The "war" will start if/when one of these two formats beats the other.

DVD is the giant and will swat the winning HD format like a fly.

The war is not between 2 formats. Its 3.

Yes, I have to take SD-DVD into consideration while doing this. I personally concern is that both formats (Blu-Ray and HD DVD) will be out dated by the time one format wins over the other.

I don't like Paramount going format exclusive, it screws the consumer. For the person who is Blu-Ray, it really limits them. But at the same time, it limits people who are on the fence (like myself...although I am leaning towards Blu-Ray).

The other issue is, how many consumers are going to upgrade again? There are plenty of VHS's that didn't make it to DVD's, and now how many DVD's aren't going to make it to Hi def? For the average consumer it is incredibly intimidating. I am happy with my DVD's, but I do want to go to hi-def. I suppose a dual format player is a great way to help the consumer, but those are few and far between.

Again thank you for your responses.

If I may add an additional question:

What are the best players for both formats and why?

Paramount going format exclusive doesn't screw the consumer anymore than Disney or Fox being format exclusive. If you're going to write a report on the current situation, try to level it out a little and hide the bias.

1. Which format do you support and why?
I'm a dual owner of both formats, so I'd be happy if either side won. However, if forced to pick just one, given the POTENTIAL of the format, I think Blu-ray would be the best option (and I put that word in bold because I don't think the format is currently living up to that potential).

2. What has been the best film/show on your supported format so far?
Casino Royale

3. How much have you spent?
Including the cost of the players? Probably close to $2000. Not including players, closer to $1000.

4. How much are you willing to spend?
My DVD budget ($100 or so per month) has become my HD budget.

5. What kind of setup do you have?
Mitsh. 50" HDTV, 5.1 Home Theater system, Toshiba A1 HD DVD player, PS3 for Blu-ray.

5a. If you don't specifically have a stand alone Hi-def player, who do you play your discs?
As noted, I use the PS3 for Blu-ray, if you don't consider that "stand-alone".

6. Do you see yourself spending as much on hi-def as you did on standard definition DVD's?
As noted, by DVD budget is now my HD budget, so yes.

7. Do you think either format will be out of date in a few years?
Not really...there's actually a better chance BOTH will be out of date (or still not mainstream), than neither.

8. If you haven't gone to hi-def, why not?
N/A

9. What is the worst hi-def disc you bought and why?
Dracula (Blu-ray) - there's a whole forum thread on why. :(

10. What are your feelings about some Blu-ray disc being released (or remastered) to correct previous mistakes (see The Fifth Element)?
No problems here, although obviously get it right the first time. I'd have a bigger issue with releases now, since the format isn't new anymore.

11. Should studios stay format neutral?
In a perfect world, all studios would be format neutral.

12. What do you feel is the biggest difference between HD-DVD and Blu-Ray?
Currently, HD DVD offers more interactivity and slightly better sound, but I would argue that Blu-ray's picture quality is slightly better. Blu-ray obviously has more POTENTIAL in the long-run (there's that word again!).

13. Does hardware make a difference (players, TV's, audio)?
I can't speak for the other HD players, since I've only used the ones I own...but I have heard the PS3 (which I do own) is one of the better Blu-ray players to have...especially if you can't afford the high-end players. Obviously, the bigger a TV you have, the more you'll appriciate owning a HD player in either format.

14. What are you feelings about the enhanced protection on the new formats?
As long as it doesn't affect playability, I have no problems...although I'm not sure they've solved that issue yet. :)

15. What are your feelings about Paramount going to HD-DVD only? Will this discourage you? If you are a Blu-Ray supporter, what is your take?
I have no problem with a studio deciding to go to one side or another...that's their right. Again, though: in a perfect world, ALL studios would be format neutral.

Easy there amigo, I did not know Fox & Disney were format exclusive. I'm kind of new to the HD world, so be careful of accusations.