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Why is there a double standard on Political threads in this forum?

Old 02-09-03, 03:17 PM
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Why is there a double standard on Political threads in this forum?

You can post Bill Clinton is a rapist or whatever you like without whatsoever any documenting sources, but dare post a link to an actual civil complaint filed against George Bush and it is locked for trolling.
The thread that was closed
http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showthr...hreadid=269940

Link to court document from the clerk of the courts office in question
http://ccweb.co.fort-bend.tx.us/imgc...217038-1-7.pdf


It is particularly sad some moderators canít put their own political beliefs aside when moderating. I might add another moderator posted right under my original post. Apparently that moderator didnít see anything wrong with my post.


Here are some posts over the last couple of months where it is rather nonchalantly offered by the posters as a statement of fact that Bill Clinton is a Rapist.



http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showth...threadid=256396
quote:

If molesting and raping interns in the oval office does not get someone kicked out of office, the MAKING UP an INFERRING racist statements about the senate majority leader will not do anything either...

quote:

It's your opinion that he didn't rape or molest anyone - and the previous posters opinion that he did.

quote:

Well, actually rape charges were leveled. And many people think they were credible.


http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showth...threadid=256384
quote:

I wanted to be less graphic. What I really wanted to do was somehow use the word "rape".

quote:

She is quite a credible witness, as is Kathleen Willey who says that the "Sink Emperor" fondled her

quote:

If I accuse bubba of raping chickens does that make him a rapist as well?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Fixed your post for you. Knowing Bubba's nature and history, such charges would probably need investigating.




http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showth...threadid=227495
quote:

accused of rape by Juanita Broadderick and others, smeared and lied about Kathleen Willey

Last edited by goop; 02-09-03 at 07:08 PM.
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Old 02-09-03, 03:23 PM
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Sometimes a poster just has to be saved from themself -- no matter their political philosophy. Too much trolling is not good for one's tenure here at DVD Talk.

Please find the equivalent thread title referring to Clinton and let me know if it was left open or closed so I can see the double standard.
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Old 02-09-03, 03:25 PM
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I have a better question. How long is a member allowed to troll until that member is banished?
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Old 02-09-03, 03:32 PM
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An excellent question. I'm trying to avoid that. Thus the closed thread -- and only a closed thread.

But when members can't, or won't, respect the limits here we are forced into taking more serious measures.
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Old 02-09-03, 03:36 PM
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Originally posted by X
Sometimes a poster just has to be saved from themself -- no matter their political philosophy. Too much trolling is not good for one's tenure here at DVD Talk.

Please find the equivalent thread title referring to Clinton and let me know if it was left open or closed so I can see the double standard.
I think the difference X is that I posted a news story. Like it or not someone has filed a civil complaint against George Bush alleging rape. How would you write the thread title? Is the fact that someone filed a rape complaint against George Bush forbidden fruit as subject matter? Was the Broadderick rape accusation not discussed at great length here or am I mistaken?

Last edited by goop; 02-09-03 at 09:22 PM.
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Old 02-09-03, 03:42 PM
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I have no further comment. The decision is made, my reasons explained, the thread is closed. I am not going to have this thread turn into another one of your back-and-forth arguing threads.

If you have complaints about the decisions made here please send Geoff an e-mail at [email protected].
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Old 02-09-03, 04:26 PM
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Originally posted by X
I have no further comment. The decision is made, my reasons explained, the thread is closed. I am not going to have this thread turn into another one of your back-and-forth arguing threads.

If you have complaints about the decisions made here please send Geoff an e-mail at [email protected].

I tell you what X you win. This is my last post for the foreseeable future. Since the time I started posting here, you have threatened me with your administrative power, (softening the threats with donít worry I donít make those decisions by myself) and in almost every thread I have participated in you pop in with an appearance claiming I am trolling. It is ok I see through you, and others do as well. You are so scared and intimidated by my ideas and my beliefs that you want to see that I am shut up. Your treatment of me as a board administrator gave other members a license to treat me the same way. One example was a member had a signature quoting me out of context for several months that I complained about numerous times. It wasnít until someone else stepped in and looked at the matter (months later) that it was removed.

I simply canít engage in intelligent debate here as long as you are here. You canít put your politics aside when doing your moderating. You will always be closing my threads because you find anything that is critical of George Bush offensive and on its face trolling. So you and the other conservatives can have your little ditto paradise back. I am so sorry for bucking the status quo and not merely parroting whatever political idea I heard on talk radio for the day.
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Old 02-09-03, 04:35 PM
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Old 02-09-03, 05:11 PM
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Why did the other links just go to the home page?
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Old 02-09-03, 05:22 PM
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It appears he incorrectly cut and pasted links he used in a previous post where he was talking about the same thing.

http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showthr...NG#post3237167
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Old 02-09-03, 07:55 PM
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Originally posted by X
Sometimes a poster just has to be saved from themself --
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Old 02-09-03, 08:30 PM
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"It is ok I see through you, and others do as well. You are so scared and intimidated by my ideas and my beliefs."

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Old 02-09-03, 08:42 PM
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Political issues are driving a lot of people away from DVDTalk. I venture into Other seldom and post little for fear of being shot down or simply ignored. My solution has been not to read political threads, but sometimes the politics seeps into unexpected places. If it was intellectual debate I would not mind. But usually it is gibberish. I hope problems like goop's don't become the norm...

And goop does have a point: perhaps moderators should keep their political opinions to themselves. I know that the moderators are part of the posting community, but they must also be unbiased when it comes to all threads and debates in the forums.

Last edited by diacritic; 02-09-03 at 08:44 PM.
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Old 02-09-03, 11:12 PM
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Moderators should *not* keep their opinions to themselves. That is a bad idea. These mods were members of the forum first and their personalities are part of the reason they got their positions. Let them lead by example. On the other hand, they ought to think twice about modding in threads they participate in debates in.
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Old 02-09-03, 11:28 PM
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Geoff's Mod Bot 1.1 should be out soon, it scans for the posts for words like "pad", "I_B_T_L" and "jackskeleton" and closes posts based on that.
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Old 02-09-03, 11:32 PM
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Well, I for one don't agree with the thread closure. I have had some trouble myself with Goop in the past (not any friction, but just having to call him on some spin) but I just don't see how the thread in question was trolling. It truly does seem to be a double standard that people can bash Clinton left, right, and sideways on nothing other than Monica Gate, but when it comes to Bush, it's "hands off baby".
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Old 02-09-03, 11:35 PM
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Originally posted by Bushdog
Moderators should *not* keep their opinions to themselves. That is a bad idea. These mods were members of the forum first and their personalities are part of the reason they got their positions. Let them lead by example. On the other hand, they ought to think twice about modding in threads they participate in debates in.
I agree, especially with that last sentence. Not that I've seen any gross abuses (X, I am totally not talking about you here, just talking in general), but a moderator has got to keep their "Member self" and their "Mod self" seperate. IMHO anyway.
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Old 02-09-03, 11:38 PM
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Originally posted by Bushdog
Moderators should *not* keep their opinions to themselves. That is a bad idea. These mods were members of the forum first and their personalities are part of the reason they got their positions. Let them lead by example. On the other hand, they ought to think twice about modding in threads they participate in debates in.
That's the way I've always felt and the rule the current moderators have always followed at DVD Talk.

Rarely, but sometimes, inline comments may be warranted when someone goes over the line in a thread. But administrative action following a heated exchange is never exercised by any of the moderators here.

Along with the obvious total waste of time, that is the primary reason I stopped dealing with goop's posts as a debating member. I wanted to be able to objectively handle problems that came up from any member in those threads instead of being unable to because I was part of the debate.

Closing an obvious troll thread from a problem poster is about the most I would do without consulting the other moderators of DVD Talk. I've seen people question a thread closing, but this may be the first time someone has left because of it. And I think the stated reasons speak for themself.
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Old 02-09-03, 11:44 PM
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But how do you deduce that that was a troll thread X? Just because it would tick off Bush fans? Not to challenge you, but seriously, how was it trolling? And obvious trolling at that. I guess I'm blind. If I'm out of line, I'll shut up, but I just don't see it.
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Old 02-09-03, 11:51 PM
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I deduced that it as a troll thread by the general content ("I will be the first to state that the person that filed this complaint sounds a little wacky."), the reaction it was created to elicit, the reason it was posted, and how I would handle an equivalently titled post with so little substance concerning anybody else.
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Old 02-09-03, 11:56 PM
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The reaction it was created to illicit? The reason it was posted? Okay, I think I will just shut up now.
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Old 02-10-03, 12:01 AM
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Quite frankly, it's good the thread was closed. We are about to go to WAR here, people, and we need to stand 100% behind our Commander-in-Chief. The reason Clinton jokes are okay is because he is out of office, and not about to lead our fighting boys to defend our freedom.
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Old 02-10-03, 12:19 AM
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Originally posted by Groucho
Quite frankly, it's good the thread was closed. We are about to go to WAR here, people, and we need to stand 100% behind our Commander-in-Chief. The reason Clinton jokes are okay is because he is out of office, and not about to lead our fighting boys to defend our freedom.
I can agree with the latter part of that in general Groucho, but I don't think the musings of a bunch of Otters will matter much in the overall acceptance ratings of the nation for Bush. Make no mistake, I am a hawk, but I don't think people should just shut up when they disagree with the president.

It's one thing for Dascle to speak out against Bush if/when we go to war, it's another for Otters to.

ps., when I said I'd shut up, I meant about the Goop vs. X stuff, not Clinton vs. Bush.

Last edited by Mutley Hyde; 02-10-03 at 12:22 AM.
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Old 02-10-03, 12:20 AM
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Originally posted by Mutley Hyde
but I just don't see how the thread in question was trolling.
Though I can't speak for X, I can offer my opinion on the thread in question and on goop's threads in general. The general problem that I see with goop's threads is that it appears his only real purpose is to incite. Notice how he started attacking "conservatives here", personalizing his distaste and directing it in part toward the conservative members here, in the first line of the thread and continued doing so as the focus of paragraph two and three? How much of what he included tells us details about the "topic"? The meat of his post is dedicated to attacking conservatives in general, not actually addressing the supposed topic. As in every thread of his that I've read, it appears that the topic at hand is fairly immaterial to him. It seems to me that he sees the topic as simply a launching pad by which he can attack a conservative individual or position. Had he simply posted information about the "topic" (some type of details would have been nice), asked serious questions or offered something of substance to generate an intelligent discussion of the accusation, then I wouldn't have thought of it as trolling. But, that's not what he did. And, at least in the threads I've seen, this post wasn't exactly out of the norm for him.

Last edited by Dead; 02-10-03 at 12:23 AM.
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Old 02-10-03, 12:26 AM
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Well, I can see some of that, there's no denying, but I think there's also quite a bit of a chip on Goop's shoulders about all the flak Clinton got, and he's searching for anything to call conservatives on. It's a natural reaction to what one might consider hypocracy; to seek out proof that "the other side" can mess up just as bad. I think in this case, Good actually had a point, and I for one would certainly like to find out if the document posted is on the up and up.
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