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Will & Grace Season 4 is here!!! I stopped...

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Will & Grace Season 4 is here!!! I stopped...

Old 08-16-05, 10:45 AM
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Will & Grace Season 4 is here!!! I stopped...

by Fry's this morning and I can't wait to watch some episodes tonight. This is the last great season before the rocky seasons 5 & 6 aired. I'll still buy 5 & 6, but I acknowledge they had some "iffy" episodes. Thank God season 7 was a return to Heaven.
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Old 08-16-05, 10:51 AM
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Wow
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Old 08-16-05, 10:56 AM
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I applaud you on your enthusiasm.
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Old 08-16-05, 11:15 AM
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Season 7 was THE WORST season that has aired thus far. I found some of the eps utterly unwatchable. You watch seasons 1-4 and you see pure comedic genius. After the creators left, the show went downhill. I like 5 a lot more than i used to. 6 is pretty painful. 7 was downright awful. We'll see if 8 takes us back and out with a bang.

That said, it should be interesting to see if Season 4 carries the same torch as 2 and 3, dvd-wise. And by that, i mean edited episodes.
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Old 08-16-05, 11:27 AM
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No disrespect...

but I find your claim about season 7 difficult to believe. Shows that are nominated for 13 Emmy awards, including Best Comedy, usually don't "suck". Will & Grace requires quite a bit of education and pop culture literacy in order to fully enjoy the show - obscure references to everything from great literature to disco abound. You probably just aren't "getting it".

BTW, what's your idea of a great sitcom?
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Old 08-16-05, 11:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Duality
Shows that are nominated for 13 Emmy awards, including Best Comedy, usually don't "suck".
Most of those Emmy nods are for the crutches, I mean, guest stars they insist on using. You have to admit this show is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay past its prime.
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Old 08-16-05, 11:48 AM
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I completely disagree. This show has intelligence and suffered a couple "rocky" seasons. 13 Emmy nods are not crutches - I know people in the entertainment industry and making that crutches statement is quite insulting.
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Old 08-16-05, 12:00 PM
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Shouldn't this thread be in TV Talk?
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Old 08-16-05, 12:19 PM
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Old 08-16-05, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Numanoid
agreed
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Old 08-16-05, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Duality
I completely disagree. This show has intelligence and suffered a couple "rocky" seasons. 13 Emmy nods are not crutches - I know people in the entertainment industry and making that crutches statement is quite insulting.
Uhhh...i AM in the entertainment industry.

And my example of great TV *was* will and grace. I don't know anyone that still watches it..besides myself. And if you're looking to argue with someone who has EVERY episode on DVD plus several bonus discs, you're fighting the wrong argument. I'll be a fan up until the very last episode airs. Doesn't mean that I haven't completely lost respect for the show and what it has become. Check the will and grace boards. Even the die-hard fans there criticize it for what they've turned the characters into. It lost all focus once the creators left and veered off into strange territory. I didn't really have a problem with the whole "baby" thing...and Leo wasn't too bad. But the Jack and Karen of S1-4 would kick/mock the shit out of the Jack and Karen 6-7.

Sorry to take this in a different direction but it had to be said. And i will bet you that W&G is lucky to win 1 or 2 of those 13 nominations...IF that.
The sitcom as a type of TV show is dying. After Will and Grace leaves the airwaves, there will be VERY few left. I also believe it's a crutch. Great for them that they got it but everyone knows that it's far from deserving.
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Old 08-16-05, 12:23 PM
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I'm sorry. I simply have to disagree.
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Old 08-16-05, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Duality
I'm sorry. I simply have to disagree.
That's ok. America agrees apparently. W&G is now getting the worst ratings since it debuted. It used to be a top 10 show. I don't even know where it is now but nowhere near that. Check the numbers of how many people used to watch the show and now do. Rob's W&G page is a great resource. It gives the stats for each and every episode and you can do your research there.

Oh and one more thing...please don't assume that if people don't agree with you that their opinion is suddenly irrelevent or that they don't know what they're talking about...or even insulting.

That said, if YOU ever need any episodes (both the UK and US dvd's, plus my personal recordings of other seasons, earlier being on VHS), personal appearances or, hell, the HUGE Will and Grace poster that I took from a telephone booth in NYC and had mounted on foam backing which now hangs in my living room, I'll give em to you for free. Cause...you know...*I* don't know what good TV is according to you.

Last edited by digitalfreaknyc; 08-16-05 at 12:39 PM.
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Old 08-16-05, 12:39 PM
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Considering my explosion earlier you are being most gracious and I thank you.
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Old 08-16-05, 12:46 PM
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I'm just waiting for the spinoff series 'Jack & Karen' -
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Old 08-16-05, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Giles
I'm just waiting for the spinoff series 'Jack & Karen' -
Nope. They're all ready and happy to move on to other things. I know Megan is getting her own talk show. Not sure about the rest.

Maybe Sean Hayes will finally "come out" now.
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Old 08-16-05, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
Nope. They're all ready and happy to move on to other things. I know Megan is getting her own talk show. Not sure about the rest.

Maybe Sean Hayes will finally "come out" now.
I'm joking, hence the smile.
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Old 08-16-05, 12:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Giles
I'm joking, hence the smile.
Oh. Right. You must be one of the writers on the current staff.

In all fairness to the show...i think there have been 3 episodes in the last 2 seasons that I thought were hysterical. So that's 3 out of 48. Used to be that there was 1 episode that was mildly amusing. Hmmmm....

And in all seriousness, W&G was the only show that I totally devoted myself to. I couldn't wait until it came on each and every Tuesday/Thursday night and was guaranteed laughs. I watch those early episodes and am constantly reminded of how ingenious this show used to be. Go from a season 2 episode to a season 6 and 7 and you'll see what a drastic difference there is. All 4 characters are mere shells of what they used to be. The jokes are trite. Plot lines are completely dropped suddenly, some with a stupid explanation (Leo, Will's boyfriend, Jack's boyfriend, every other boyfriend Grace has had) and some without (Jack's son, hello??). Karen is reduced to a stupid drunk...whereas before she was witty. Jack is a stupid "***" whereas he used to be witty, endearing and yes, intelligent. Will and Grace I won't even touch. They're just really going nowhere. It's not that they, as characters, have stayed the same. It's that their characters have gone nowhere. It seems like they've abandoned all hope for getting them SOMEWHERE.

And don't even get me started on Stan still being alive. I almost cried when I saw that. How can a show that I loved so much turn into soap-opera crapola? I really really wish the creators would have mended ways with NBC (or the other way around). It would have been a beautiful run...and possibly might have still been on another couple of years.

Last edited by digitalfreaknyc; 08-16-05 at 12:56 PM.
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Old 08-16-05, 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
That's ok. America agrees apparently. W&G is now getting the worst ratings since it debuted.
Yeah... because it doesn't have a Friends or Frasier based line up anymore to help it in the ratings.

The show has had its moments though.
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Old 08-16-05, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by nightwing82
Yeah... because it doesn't have a Friends or Frasier based line up anymore to help it in the ratings.

The show has had its moments though.
Not true. It didn't always have those line ups. It started out on Tuesday nights.
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Old 08-16-05, 01:10 PM
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Originally Posted by digitalfreaknyc
Oh. Right. You must be one of the writers on the current staff.
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Old 08-16-05, 01:36 PM
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In all fairness, W&G has been in the top 10 at least 20 times over the past three seasons and has come close many times. The season 7 premiere was #4. All shows change with time and W&G is no exception. Furthermore, many great shows are ratings "bombs" and are unfortunately cancelled. I'm sure we all have a favorite that was dumped by a network.

digitalfreaknyc, thanks for the info. on Rob's W&G page - great resource.
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Old 08-16-05, 02:40 PM
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Where do I get in line to beat this dead horse some more...
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Old 08-16-05, 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by THX7966
Where do I get in line to beat this dead horse some more...
I'm just stating some interesting facts that will most likely affect the release of seasons 5, 6 and 7 on DVD. The fact that the show has been renewed for a record 8th season is noteworthy too. Even MTM only lasted 7 seasons.

BTW, the horse just walked off.

Last edited by Duality; 08-16-05 at 02:59 PM.
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Old 08-16-05, 02:46 PM
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Record? Lots of shows have gone eight seasons or more.
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