Harry Potter, POA - the truth about the aspect ratios offered.
Visit this page: http://plum.cream.org/HP/poa.htm
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I sense a widescreen circle-jerk over the horizon.
Oh yeah. vague thread titles are looked down upon here. |
Uh no! And all this time I'd been buying Fullscreen DVDs becuase I wanted the full picture!
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can't we just lock this thread? nothing good will come of this.
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Yes, let's lock this thread and discuss dumpster diving for DVDs or "how my cousin stole OOP DVDs and sold them on ebay."
The impact the Pan & Scan process has on this film, as opposed to the open matte versions of the first two films is alarming and truly worthy of intelligent discussion. I guess that's lacking around here these days. |
Originally Posted by pdinosaur
can't we just lock this thread? nothing good will come of this.
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My genius uncle bought the fullscreen version for my brother. I still haven't forgiven him.
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This thread makes me wanna go hug my widescreen TV :)
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Good comparo on that page :thumbsup:
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The first 2 movie were framed "much better" in 4:3.
I like the wide better, but the first 2 HP movies would easier to watch in 4:3 than the last movie. |
This thread would serve much more purpose if people understood WHY the first 2 movies, directed by Chris Columbus, were much better in pan-scan than this 3rd movie, directed by Alfonso Cuaron.
It's simple, really. Chris Columbus prefers to use Super 35, which films a 35mm 4:3 frame which is then cropped at the top and bottom for theatrical release. Alfonso Cuaron prefers to use Panavision, which is a 35mm 4:3 frame but which uses an anamorphic optical lens to "squash" what is being filmed at the theatrical aspect ratio. The result is that there is actually more image available above and below the theatrical frame for use in the pan-scan versions of the first 2 movies, so they are used, and the pan-scan versions of the first 2 films look a lot better. There is nothing to do with a Panavision-filmed movie except cut the sides right off, because there is no additional image that can be used. The result is that the pan-scan versions of the first 2 HP films in some cases actually show MORE image than the widescreen versions. The 3rd film is butchered because that is all that can be done. |
Originally Posted by Mr. Cornell
The result is that the pan-scan versions of the first 2 HP films in some cases actually show MORE image than the widescreen versions. The 3rd film is butchered because that is all that can be done.
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Originally posted by Mr. Cornell This thread would serve much more purpose if people understood WHY the first 2 movies, directed by Chris Columbus, were much better in pan-scan than this 3rd movie, directed by Alfonso Cuaron. It's simple, really. Chris Columbus prefers to use Super 35, which films a 35mm 4:3 frame which is then cropped at the top and bottom for theatrical release. Alfonso Cuaron prefers to use Panavision, which is a 35mm 4:3 frame but which uses an anamorphic optical lens to "squash" what is being filmed at the theatrical aspect ratio. . . . The result is that the pan-scan versions of the first 2 HP films in some cases actually show MORE image than the widescreen versions. The 3rd film is butchered because that is all that can be done. A sure sign of an anamorphic lens is when lights--flashlights, headlights, etc--pointed at the camera cause intense bands that stretch across the picture. The anamorphic squeeze is what creates the effect. (James Cameron has addressed this very issue. Looks unnatural to him, which is partly why he prefers Super 35.) I noticed the apparent panning-and-scanning of the full screen version of Prisoner of Azkaban, a movie that I expected to be filmed open matte, so I watched the Knight Bus scene specifically for the light bands. And I saw none. This tells me that Prisoner of Azkaban was, in fact, shot Super 35, but for some reason they decided to pan and scan the widescreen print rather than open the mattes. Makes no sense, but I don't know how else to explain it. The movie shows no signs of being filmed anamorphically, which means there should have been plenty of extra picture information to work with. Yet the full screen version is butchered beyond belief. I actually watched full screen and widescreen side-by-side to compare them, and I was taken aback constantly by the insane degree of cropping that was being carried out on the full screen version. One site I found illustrated how they not only chopped off the sides, but a little off the top and bottom, as well. As I remember my own full screen experience, I observe this to be true. Amazing. --THX |
I find this pretty interesting. Anytime I see how butchered pan & scan versions of films are compared to its intended aspect ratio, it just fascinates me why people would buy the fullscreen.
Anyway, I guess the first two films don't look too bad in fullscreen due to the open mattes. There's a pretty noteworthy shot where the camera pans up to reveal Hogwarts that might even look better in fullscreen. |
The more the P&S process butchers the original, the happier I am.
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Hands down the best comparison of FS vs WS I have ever seen....Well perhaps because I am addicted to Harry Potter
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i'm guessing the reason POA was P&S, despite being shot on Super35, is because of the digital color correction process which was only done to the 2.40:1 image extracted from film.
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Originally Posted by CertifiedTHX
This tells me that Prisoner of Azkaban was, in fact, shot Super 35, but for some reason they decided to pan and scan the widescreen print rather than open the mattes. Makes no sense, but I don't know how else to explain it. The movie shows no signs of being filmed anamorphically, which means there should have been plenty of extra picture information to work with. Yet the full screen version is butchered beyond belief.
The other possibility is that, in trying to reformat the movie for 4:3, the director made his choices on a case-by-case basis and decided that the entire visual design of the film would have to be changed and only focus on smaller parts of the frame. Or, maybe he just really hates "full frame" and decided to crop the hell out of the 4:3 transfer out of spite. That's what I would have done. Hell, I'd take it a few steps further and make sure that in every shot the only thing you see is a small square around Harry's face. |
I think this is an interesting bit
This exemplifies something about fullscreen releases of widescreen movies which makes me angry. There is a requirement in the movie industry that the end credits must be included in their entirety on DVD or video releases. In cases like this one, where there are so many names, and the list meanders down, left, right and up at times, the only way to display all the names is to include the full width of the original widescreen design, which requires the inclusion of the dreaded "black bars" at the top and bottom of the screen. My issue is this: if it is considered important that all the people who worked on the movie get the recognition they rightly deserve (and which I certainly don't begrudge them), why does the movie industry allow their work to be decimated and degraded the way this movie does? It makes them look at best incompetent, and at worst fools |
Now, many of the previous posts are exactly why I opened this thread. Thanks to everyone who posted entertaining/informative reading. If anyone has anything else to add, I'm sure many would appreciate your thoughts. :)
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Originally Posted by CertifiedTHX
A sure sign of an anamorphic lens is when lights--flashlights, headlights, etc--pointed at the camera cause intense bands that stretch across the picture. The anamorphic squeeze is what creates the effect. . . . so I watched the Knight Bus scene specifically for the light bands. And I saw none.
This tells me that Prisoner of Azkaban was, in fact, shot Super 35 |
Originally Posted by hogfat
Seriously, you believe that there exists no anamorphic lens which can be used by a talented enough director of photography in a heavy CGI scene and not produce that effect? I'll make no comment otherwise, but today's technology can certainly eliminate any "anamorphic byproduct."
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Originally posted by hogfat Seriously, you believe that there exists no anamorphic lens which can be used by a talented enough director of photography in a heavy CGI scene and not produce that effect? I'll make no comment otherwise, but today's technology can certainly eliminate any "anamorphic byproduct." --THX |
Originally Posted by hogfat
Seriously, you believe that there exists no anamorphic lens which can be used by a talented enough director of photography in a heavy CGI scene and not produce that effect?
I'll make no comment otherwise, but today's technology can certainly eliminate any "anamorphic byproduct." DJ |
The biggest point, however, is that while the presence of an anamorphic lens flare likely implies that an anamorphic lens was used in filming, the inverse is not necessarily true. That's simple logic.
Beyond that, a large deal of work is done with computer image generation to mimic actual properties of film. Lens flares may be added if one believes the image would look more "film-like." |
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