Don't hold your breath but there are signs that Song of the South may happen
02-11-04, 04:13 PM
#52
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What is going on. I got a simple answer for you all. If you don't like it, don't buy it. It's been said before. It's not like Disney is re-releasing Salo. It's a child's fantasy movie. Nothing more, nothing less. It is NOT meant to be taken seriously. Oh, and Mikey, you need to take the Gay marriage thing to the "Other" forum. It has nothing to do with this movie and ........justice for all.
02-11-04, 05:26 PM
#53
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Originally posted by Mickey_O'Neil
Still, as folklorist Patricia A. Turner writes: Kind old Uncle Remus caters to the needs of the young white boy whose father has inexplicably left him and his mother at the plantation.
Still, as folklorist Patricia A. Turner writes: Kind old Uncle Remus caters to the needs of the young white boy whose father has inexplicably left him and his mother at the plantation.
That article is so biased it's not even funny. I especially love loaded phrases like "caters to the needs of the young white boy". In the real world without an agenda, it's called "befriending".
Uncle Remus is Johnny's *friend*. That means spending time with someone, caring for them, helping them out if needed etc.
Highly recommend those who haven't seen the film to search out a copy in whatever form. I downloaded the film last year, and was shocked at what a wonderful film it was, because I was expecting this racist piece of trash. The black characters are the heroes, and the the white characters are the villains. There's *nothing* racist at all in it.
02-11-04, 05:37 PM
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The reason this should be released has nothing to do with how acurately it depicts Georgia circa 1865, but rather how 100% accurately it depicts Hollywood circa 1946! It isn't a question of historical fidelity to the Reconstructionist South. The film depicts the attitudes of America in reguards to blacks in the mid 20th Century.
The only hypocrisy is that Disney releases the film in Japan but not in America. Either release it everywhere are nowhere. Why are the Japanese allowed to see it and not us. Total Bull
The only hypocrisy is that Disney releases the film in Japan but not in America. Either release it everywhere are nowhere. Why are the Japanese allowed to see it and not us. Total Bull
02-11-04, 08:37 PM
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Originally posted by Feathers McGraw
The black characters are the heroes, and the the white characters are the villains. There's *nothing* racist at all in it.
The black characters are the heroes, and the the white characters are the villains. There's *nothing* racist at all in it.
maybe not in the way everyone talks about SOTS, but racist nonetheless?
02-11-04, 09:11 PM
#56
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Originally posted by JoeyOhhhh
This might appear on Walt Disney Treasures: On the Front Lines, although I might be wrong.
This might appear on Walt Disney Treasures: On the Front Lines, although I might be wrong.
FILMS
1943
VICTORY THROUGH AIR POWER - This film was basically propaganda with some entertainment and some powerful animation. Mainly championed Major Seversky's 1942 book of the same title with the theory that long-range air power could defeat the WWII enemies. The scene of an American eagle attacking the Japanese octopus is very powerful, moving animation.
ENTERTAINMENT/PROPAGANDA SHORTS
1942
DONALD GETS DRAFTED-always enjoyed the idea of Donald reporting to the draft board in his sailor suit.
THE ARMY MASCOT-Pluto schemes to take over the job of a mascot goat, with hilarious results.
THE VANISHING PRIVATE-Donald goes crazy with invisible paint, leading to war with his sergeant Pete, with a perfect, funny ending.
SKY TROOPER-Donald wants to be a pilot, and his sergeant Pete gives him more than Donald bargained for.
1943
DER FUEHRER'S FACE-the famous and infamous cartoon in which Donald dreams he is in Naziland where he is forced to work in a munitions plant.
EDUCATION FOR DEATH-very strong propaganda about Germany's totalitarian state which turns an innocent young boy into a robotic soldier.
PRIVATE PLUTO-Pluto has a war with the chipmunks in guarding the area.
FALL OUT - FALL IN-Donald experiences some of the trials of Army life, such as super-long hikes.
REASON AND EMOTION-entertainment and propaganda used in a story about reason and emotion working together for the war effort, enjoyable animation.
VICTORY VEHICLES-Goofy shows off alternate transportation due to the wartime rubber and gasoline shortage, settling on the pogo stick.
THE OLD ARMY GAME-Sergeant Pete catches Donald sneaking back into base after a late night on the town, leads to a merry chase.
HOME DEFENSE-Donald's nephews conflict with Donald after he sleeps during his duty of watching for enemy attack.
CHICKEN LITTLE-The classic "the sky is falling" story, originally planned to have more wartime references.
1944
HOW TO BE A SAILOR-Goofy's story of the history of sailors, ending with him using himself as a torpedo to sink Japanese ships.
COMMANDO DUCK-Donald is sent on a suicide mission to wipe out an entire Japanese air base, with hilarious results.
EDUCATIONAL SHORTS
* = Created for Canada to sell their war bonds.
** = CIAA films (Coordinator of Inter-American Affairs) created to combat the German Nazy influence that was widespread in Latin American in the early 1940s.
1941
THE THRIFTY PIG * - animation from Three Little Pigs cartoon adapted, with the Big Bad Wolf wearing a Nazi hat and armband.
THE SEVEN WISE DWARFS * - animation from Snow White adapted to show dwarfs buying war bonds.
1942
DONALD'S DECISION * - uses animation from 1938 Donald Duck cartoons "Donald's Better Self" and "Self Control" to convince Donald to buy war bonds.
ALL TOGETHER * - uses animation from several sources, including The Band Concert (1935) and Mickey's Amateurs (1937) to show several Disney characters in a parade to sell war bonds.
THE NEW SPIRIT - Donald is encouraged to pay his income tax to help the war effort.
FOOD WILL WIN THE WAR - Stresses the importance of farmers to the war effort. Includes the Three Little Pigs leading a long line of pigs.
OUT OF THE FRYING PAN INTO THE FIRING LINE - Minnie & Pluto star in an effort to show how important it was for housewives to save kitchen fats and greases for the war effort.
1943
THE GRAIN THAT BUILT A HEMISPHERE ** - Tells the history of corn and its importance to the world.
THE SPIRIT OF '43 - Donald Duck resists Nazi propaganda and pays his taxes to support the war effort.
WHE WINGED SCOURGE ** - The Seven Dwarfs point out ways to defeat the malaria-carrying mosquito.
DEFENSE AGAINST INVASION ** - Shows the human body's ability to fight off germs through vaccination.
1945
CLEANLINESS BRINGS HEALTH ** - The difference between the Clean Family that is happy and healthy and the Careless Family that is unhappy and unhealthy.
WHAT IS DISEASE ** - Shows what causes disease and how to protect against disease.
1946
PLANNING FOR GOOD EATING ** - Careless Charlie is used to teach a family about good dietary habits.
TRAINING FILMS
1942
FOUR METHODS OF FLUSH RIVETING - basic animation for education purposes
STOP THAT TANK (BOYS ANTI-TANK RIFLE) - a great deal of live action but fun, enjoyable animation of Hitler being blown to Hell by the rifle
1942-1945?
TRAINING FILM MONTAGE - A selection of scenes from various training films, I assume.
There are a few war-related entertainment shorts not listed here - one or more might be added to this collection instead of what is listed above.
1943
DONALD'S TIRE TROUBLE - most likely short. Donald has continual trouble with flat tires due to the wartime shortage of rubber.
PLUTO AND THE ARMADILLO - small connection to the wartime. Short releated to the Latin Armerica trip and the Saludos Amigos and The Three Caballeros films developed from that trip.
1944
THE PELICAN AND THE SNIPE - same info as for Pluto and the Armadillo.
1945
DOG WATCH - Pluto is a watchdog for a Navy ship.
02-11-04, 09:42 PM
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Originally posted by The Exister
Couldn't have said it better myself.
I do think Disney could release the film, however. There is plenty of racist entertainment out there from days gone by, and it's instructional in some ways not to bury the past, but to expose the ugly realities of the past for what they really were.
In the case of this film, however, no reality is represented at all; this is what most people (who decry SOTS) find objectionable.
Couldn't have said it better myself.
I do think Disney could release the film, however. There is plenty of racist entertainment out there from days gone by, and it's instructional in some ways not to bury the past, but to expose the ugly realities of the past for what they really were.
In the case of this film, however, no reality is represented at all; this is what most people (who decry SOTS) find objectionable.
African Americans who were free didn't own slaves? Were there no white Indentured servants?
02-11-04, 10:31 PM
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Originally posted by Seeker
er - isn't making all the black characters heroes and all the white characters villains sort of racist?
maybe not in the way everyone talks about SOTS, but racist nonetheless?
er - isn't making all the black characters heroes and all the white characters villains sort of racist?
maybe not in the way everyone talks about SOTS, but racist nonetheless?
02-11-04, 10:57 PM
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I'm not African-American, but I have seen some on TV. They seem friendly enough. I bet we'd all like to sit around one fine evening and watch Song of the South together! You know, on DVD. In Technicolored.
02-11-04, 11:31 PM
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I'm Black and I don't have a problem with Song of the South.
I highly recommed people read this email. I find it very touching and very disturbing at the same time.
F--k censorship! I've ordered a bootleg copy of Song of the South. Guess what I'm going to be watching during black history month.
I highly recommed people read this email. I find it very touching and very disturbing at the same time.
F--k censorship! I've ordered a bootleg copy of Song of the South. Guess what I'm going to be watching during black history month.
02-12-04, 04:18 AM
#61
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Originally posted by KOROVAMILK
Whether or not Song of the South is racist or not really doesn't matter... The movie shows viewpoints that were indicative of the time period in which the film was made. It was a part of history and therefore should be preserved for us to learn from and remember how pop culture used to portray blacks in America. It is an insult to anyone with a brain to suppress parts of culture and information. The same thing goes with editing the three stooges, tom and jerry, amos and andy, wartime propaghanda, etc.
Whether or not Song of the South is racist or not really doesn't matter... The movie shows viewpoints that were indicative of the time period in which the film was made. It was a part of history and therefore should be preserved for us to learn from and remember how pop culture used to portray blacks in America. It is an insult to anyone with a brain to suppress parts of culture and information. The same thing goes with editing the three stooges, tom and jerry, amos and andy, wartime propaghanda, etc.
Exactly.
02-12-04, 05:35 AM
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Originally posted by ThatGuamGuy
Didn't they ("they" because I'm not sure exactly who, beyond Tipper Gore) create an entire "parental advisory" label on music specifically because rap was getting more popular?
Didn't they ("they" because I'm not sure exactly who, beyond Tipper Gore) create an entire "parental advisory" label on music specifically because rap was getting more popular?
02-12-04, 07:54 AM
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Originally posted by Onizuka
F--k censorship! I've ordered a bootleg copy of Song of the South. Guess what I'm going to be watching during black history month.
F--k censorship! I've ordered a bootleg copy of Song of the South. Guess what I'm going to be watching during black history month.
02-12-04, 08:38 AM
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Originally posted by Cathepsin
I believe that it was the popularity of heavy metal bands of the time that sparked the PMRC, led by Tipper Gore and others. Frank Zappa, John Denver and Dee Snider testified at the Congressional hearings - Luther Campbell didn't. I don't think rap had gotten really big at that point, at least not NWA or 2 Live Crew.
I believe that it was the popularity of heavy metal bands of the time that sparked the PMRC, led by Tipper Gore and others. Frank Zappa, John Denver and Dee Snider testified at the Congressional hearings - Luther Campbell didn't. I don't think rap had gotten really big at that point, at least not NWA or 2 Live Crew.
It was 2 Live Crew that spurred on Tipper Gore and resulted i the "Parental Advisory" labels now seen on most CDs.
02-12-04, 08:47 AM
#65
DVD Talk Gold Edition
Originally posted by Pants
The reason this should be released has nothing to do with how acurately it depicts Georgia circa 1865, but rather how 100% accurately it depicts Hollywood circa 1946! It isn't a question of historical fidelity to the Reconstructionist South. The film depicts the attitudes of America in reguards to blacks in the mid 20th Century.
The reason this should be released has nothing to do with how acurately it depicts Georgia circa 1865, but rather how 100% accurately it depicts Hollywood circa 1946! It isn't a question of historical fidelity to the Reconstructionist South. The film depicts the attitudes of America in reguards to blacks in the mid 20th Century.
Very well said.
Originally posted by Pants
The only hypocrisy is that Disney releases the film in Japan but not in America. Either release it everywhere are nowhere. Why are the Japanese allowed to see it and not us. Total Bull
The only hypocrisy is that Disney releases the film in Japan but not in America. Either release it everywhere are nowhere. Why are the Japanese allowed to see it and not us. Total Bull
Q. What about legitimate Disney videos, VCDs or DVDs released outside the United States?
A. You cannot sell videos, VCDs or DVDs that were released for sale in other markets. These are called “parallel imports,” and it is a violation of federal law to import or sell product in the United States that was released for sale in other markets.
Q. What about Song of the South?
A. Song of the South has not been released for distribution in the United States in any home viewing format. Any listing that offers any video, VCD or DVD of Song of the South for sale in the United States may be suspended. Any listing that offers Song of the South “converted” for viewing on NTSC video players or Zone 1 DVD players is an illegal copy.
A. You cannot sell videos, VCDs or DVDs that were released for sale in other markets. These are called “parallel imports,” and it is a violation of federal law to import or sell product in the United States that was released for sale in other markets.
Q. What about Song of the South?
A. Song of the South has not been released for distribution in the United States in any home viewing format. Any listing that offers any video, VCD or DVD of Song of the South for sale in the United States may be suspended. Any listing that offers Song of the South “converted” for viewing on NTSC video players or Zone 1 DVD players is an illegal copy.
I find this pretty frightening. In the past, individual property rights trumped publishers rights. With all the new laws, DMCA most especially, who knows?
02-12-04, 08:56 AM
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Originally posted by Qui Gon Jim
BZZZZZZZZZZZT! Wrong!
It was 2 Live Crew that spurred on Tipper Gore and resulted i the "Parental Advisory" labels now seen on most CDs.
BZZZZZZZZZZZT! Wrong!
It was 2 Live Crew that spurred on Tipper Gore and resulted i the "Parental Advisory" labels now seen on most CDs.
02-12-04, 11:45 AM
#67
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Originally posted by Qui Gon Jim
BZZZZZZZZZZZT! Wrong!
It was 2 Live Crew that spurred on Tipper Gore and resulted i the "Parental Advisory" labels now seen on most CDs.
BZZZZZZZZZZZT! Wrong!
It was 2 Live Crew that spurred on Tipper Gore and resulted i the "Parental Advisory" labels now seen on most CDs.
On topic: I think this boils down to one thing; Disney doesn't think you're too immature or incapable of handling this content, rather they (and all of hollywood) are embarrased that this kind of content used to be entertainment. They're supressing it out of embarrassment, not to confound consumers. We need to convince them that it's part of their history and nothing to be defensive or embarrassed about.
Last edited by Pants; 02-12-04 at 11:49 AM.
02-12-04, 01:06 PM
#68
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Originally posted by Sonicflood
1945
CLEANLINESS BRINGS HEALTH ** - The difference between the Clean Family that is happy and healthy and the Careless Family that is unhappy and unhealthy.
1945
CLEANLINESS BRINGS HEALTH ** - The difference between the Clean Family that is happy and healthy and the Careless Family that is unhappy and unhealthy.
02-12-04, 07:18 PM
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Yeah, "Song Of The South" is too good a movie too languish forever in the Disney vault. (It was shot by Gregg Toland, of "Citizen Kane" fame!)
I suspect eventually we'll see a release, accompanied by a documentary about the real ugliness of slavery... and how the Uncle Remus stories, FOR THEIR TIME, did what they could to engender sympathy for American blacks.
I suspect eventually we'll see a release, accompanied by a documentary about the real ugliness of slavery... and how the Uncle Remus stories, FOR THEIR TIME, did what they could to engender sympathy for American blacks.
02-13-04, 07:08 AM
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No to veer off topic, but it was the 2Live Cre CDs that caused the outrage. They even released a CD about being banned. I am sure that the sexual content of the Heavy Metal videos and songs certainy started the "fire" but 2Live Crew's explicit lyrics are what made it explode...
02-13-04, 06:06 PM
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Originally posted by Class316
I hope you make sure to get a good copy (ie and LD transfer and not a VHS one)
I hope you make sure to get a good copy (ie and LD transfer and not a VHS one)
02-13-04, 09:11 PM
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Originally posted by whaaat
I call bullshit on this. I understand that ebay can set it's own rules, and if they want to forbid (say) the sale of purple erasers, that's their right. I also understand that Disney is powerful enough that they can dictate to ebay what Disney products they don't want sold on ebay. But to claim that importing DVDs, VCDs or LDs is illegal? Do we have any lawyers on here that can confirm or deny the truth of this statement?
I find this pretty frightening. In the past, individual property rights trumped publishers rights. With all the new laws, DMCA most especially, who knows?
I call bullshit on this. I understand that ebay can set it's own rules, and if they want to forbid (say) the sale of purple erasers, that's their right. I also understand that Disney is powerful enough that they can dictate to ebay what Disney products they don't want sold on ebay. But to claim that importing DVDs, VCDs or LDs is illegal? Do we have any lawyers on here that can confirm or deny the truth of this statement?
I find this pretty frightening. In the past, individual property rights trumped publishers rights. With all the new laws, DMCA most especially, who knows?
08-28-04, 10:06 AM
#74
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SoS documentary?
Disney could issue SoS with a companion documentary about the depiction of African-Americans in film history, and provide a basis for discussion. This could include their hiring of the actor who portrayed Uncle Remus and what he experienced. I had thought the over-riding theme of the movie was one of love despite differences. To not release it would be a shame, but like I said, provide a good documentary. I WAS embarrassed a bit with the depiction of Japanese-Americans in the Ugly Dachsund, but Disney did feature a documentary on one of the actors that gave a little balance.
08-28-04, 11:22 AM
#75
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Originally posted by Qui Gon Jim
No to veer off topic, but it was the 2Live Cre CDs that caused the outrage. They even released a CD about being banned. I am sure that the sexual content of the Heavy Metal videos and songs certainy started the "fire" but 2Live Crew's explicit lyrics are what made it explode...
No to veer off topic, but it was the 2Live Cre CDs that caused the outrage. They even released a CD about being banned. I am sure that the sexual content of the Heavy Metal videos and songs certainy started the "fire" but 2Live Crew's explicit lyrics are what made it explode...
The Parental Adisory sticker started in roughly 1985...or '84(when Tipper went on her nutty crusade).
