kyle

I read Justin Felix's DVD review of Stargate - The Ark of Truth at http://www.dvdtalk.com/reviews/read.php?ID=32658 and...

This movie is definitely not a good stand-alone film for people who have not watched the show. It serves to add closure to the plots of seasons 9 and 10 of the TV series. The prelude is a good refresher if you have seen the show, but likely confusing for those who have not. I suspect the forthcoming Continuum movie will be a better stand-alone film.

Overall I didn't think the picture quality was that great--would have appreciated a Blu-Ray release for this.

B5Erik

That was one of the most worthless reviews ever on DVD Talk.

If you haven't seen the series (and this series ran for TEN years), then starting off with the DVD movie that acts as the ending of the story thread that ran throughout seasons 9 & 10 is just stupid.

This is not a stand alone movie, it is the finale to season 10 (basically).

Let's see a review from someone who has actually seen the series...

...Justin Felix's review was a complete waste of time (for him AND anyone who reads it).

Yakuza Bengoshi

Speaking as someone who has seen all ten seasons, but not Ark of Truth, I'll say that I thought Justin's criticisms were fair, and representative of how the the show would appear to a new viewer. Further Justin's review of the extras will be generally helpful to everyone. As for the fact that the review could not address image and sound quality, that's not Justin's fault, and any criticism of that belongs with the studio's decision to only provide a subpar screener for review. I don't know, but I highly doubt that Justin knew he'd be getting a crappy screener when he agreed to do the review.

mrpeavey

Thanks. I tried to be as fair in my analysis as possible.

For the record, it was a burned screener copy in a paper envelope.

Justin.

jayntampa

It really was a rather unfair review ... it's kind of like judging whether a book is good or not by reading only the last chapter, then informing people that they shouldn't read it because it didn't make sense.

The disc should have been passed to someone familiar with the series. I understand that you didn't have the retail release, but the retail version makes it clear that it's the continuation of a story. No one would be walking in blind to watching it.

I use DVDTalk reviews quite a bit, and this was kind of a misfire.

nemein

I completely agree. How on earth can anyone give a fair review of this w/o having seen the 10 seasons (or at least the last 2 that this acts as a closer for)? Talk about taking things completely out of context. It's not meant as a stand alone movie, why try to treat it as such?

Yakuza Bengoshi

Justin can answer for himself regarding what his preconceptions were about this release, but I can well image that some viewers will come to this release cold in the same way that many viewers came to Serenity without having seen Firefly. Serenity is more enjoyable if you've seen Firefly, but Firefly is not an absolute prerequisite. It could have been the same with Ark of Truth, but apparently the creators didn't go out of their way to make the release accessible to new viewers.

nemein

I disagree... they left the end of season 10 completely open w/ lots of unresolved issues. This movie was meant only to wrap that up and could not have been done in a way to make it both accessible to new viewers and keep fans interested. If they choose a different topic/story line then I agree a lot more needed to be explained. I don't believe that was the point here.

Also explaining the 1/2 season of Firefly at the beginning of Serenity is a lot different than trying to explain 2 full seasons (based on relationships created in the 8 seasons before), so I don't think that's a fair comparison either. A better one might have been the X-Files movie and IIRC that took a lot of knocks for being confusing to the non-fan as well. I agree it's hard to do these things right and sometimes (like in this case) it's not even worth it. We'll have to see what the later SG1 DTD movies bring.

B5Erik

I've got to respectfully disagree.

Justin kept trying to justify his opinions by saying, "Oh, but I LOVE cult genre TV shows," and then rips this thing to shreds. Come on.

This was never intended as a stand alone movie. This was ALWAYS promoted as the proper ending to seasons 9 & 10. This WAS just like reading only the final chapter of a book and saying that it was stupid and made no sense.

I'm sure that there was someone who could have (and may yet still) reviewed The Ark of Truth who HAS seen all 10 seasons of SG1, so I don't know why Justin did this review at all.

Stargate SG1 has always been a fun, somewhat tongue-in-cheek adventure series. It has more in common with the original Star Trek (in tone) than any other series since that show originally aired. If you haven't watched at least 3 or 4 of the 10 seasons of SG1 you won't get that. It's serious action/adventure/drama, but it's also got a great sense of humor. The show doesn't take itself TOO seriously, unlike a lot of other genre shows.

And Justin just didn't get it. Not entirely his fault, but after watching it he should have admitted as much and asked to have someone else review it. For fans of the show his review of the MOVIE itself was completely worthless. (How well does it tie up the Ori saga? From his review I have absolutely no idea...) For people who haven't seen the show, it paints SG1 in a rather negative light, which could turn them off from trying out a season set (that they may otherwise end up really enjoying if they gave it a chance).

Sorry, that's just not a fair review. It's not fair, and it's not helpful.

mrpeavey

I didn't specifically request this movie (unless it was on a wish list somewhere) to review. It was just sent to me, so I reviewed it.

I tried to be as honest as I could about both my interest in genre television and my scant knowledge of the series itself before I made my comments.

Despite being lost at times, I personally didn't think it was a good movie. I would have been similarly "lost," I suppose, with BSG: Razor had I never seen BSG before. But, I still would have thought Razor was a much better film than this. Acting is better; special effects are better and don't look like outtakes from Star Trek shows; etc.

I just called it like I saw it. Perhaps one of the other reviewers on this site - a die-hard Stargate fan perhaps - could review it for Stargate fans.

To be fair, a quick search on IMDB shows other reviews that make similar points about viewers new to the series like here.

If you don't agree with the review, that's fine. I just wrote a review as I saw it.

B5Erik

I must say, that you really gave this movie a fair chance. I mean, quotes like, "This movie is kind of dumb. The acting is over-the-top and action sequences look derivative of other shows and seem about 1980s TV quality at times.." and, "There's stuff about the magician Merlin and these bad folks called the Ori, and lots of uninspiring and bland spaceship-ish sets replete with the ever-present corridors and some rather silly-looking characters (even by sci-fi standards)," those are clearly helpful comments in terms of describing the movie. (Just who were those rather silly looking characters, by the way? Were you watching Farscape, by any chance, and didn't know the difference? Talk about silly looking characters! And yet, Farscape is still a great show.)

Of course, at least sampling the series might have helped, but I don't know if that crossed your mind or not.

Why don't you actually try watching the series and get back to us then? (Rather than just slamming the movie and being condescending...)

You can be defensive about your review, and that's fine, but take a look at all the negative comments in your review without ANY positive comments (just saying that you didin't get the context AT ALL) - that should have been a dead giveaway that your review wasn't fair or helpful.

I'll tell you what, I'll post MY thoughts on the movie in the next few days (I'm watching it tonight). I won't sugar coat it, but at least I'll know the context of what's going on and have a good point of view from which to critique it.

(By the way, the review you linked WAS fair - there were positive comments such as this one, "It is certainly action-paced enough for newbies to not sweat plot details too much," to go along with any negative impressions that a newbie may have. That's what your review lacked, Justin.)

Yakuza Bengoshi

B5Erik, you come off a little hostile, and you seem to be blowing this out of proportion. I don't think any diehard SG-1 fans are going to decide not to see this flick because of Justin's review, and I doubt many people who missed the first 10 years of the series are really going to be seeking out the review to determine if they should go back and catch up on the last 250 +/- eps. Justin called it as he saw it, and said from the beginning that fans may still appreciate it. You don't have to agree with his opinion, but having expressed your negative opinion of the review now three times, I think we've all got your point.

Speaking of which, having myself jumped in three times here, I suppose everybody's got my point as well, and with this, I'll now drop out myself.

B5Erik

Hey, I'm sorry if you think I'm, "Blowing this out of proportion," but my basic point was that the review of the movie wasn't fair or helpful in the least.

Justin's been arguing that point and got defensive about his review - so I rebutted his points. So what?

nemein

I'm not a DVDtalk reviewer but I'll give it a quick shot since I just watched it this afternoon.

Frankly, as I think someone in one of the threads about it around here said, it really just seemed like an extended episode and not a "movie" (aside from lack where the commercial breaks would go ). As far as wrapping up the Ori saga it did do that. The whole thing seems a little rushed, but frankly when comparing the Ori to the Ghould, season 9 and 10 in general seemed rushed. I think the sidebar[1] was a bit unnecessary and probably dragged things out a bit and overall frankly they could have wrapped this up at the end of season 10, I guess that wouldn't have left the "hook" into making movies though.

Bottom line though if you have enjoyed the series up until now, you'll probably like this. It has the same sort of acting/writing/effects that has been present in the series up until now (although I will agree w/ Justin's review and the firefight at the ruins at the beginning did seem sub-par to the show's usual standards [it definitely seemed to be an indoor set made up to be outdoor instead of actually shooting outdoors like they usually seemed too]). While it does wrap up the Ori story line, I'm pretty sure most people will agree w/ me that the real series closer was the last episode of season 8 (season 9 and 10 always seemed like Stargate SG1a to me, but that's another thread/discussion ).



[1]

nemein

Honestly though, and not being a reviewer maybe this is something one of you can answer for me, why bother reviewing it at all? It was not meant as a stand alone movie and not investing the time to even look into the mythology of the show it's no doubt he's going to be confused. Frankly it seems like it was a waste of time for him to watch it, write about it and then all of us to comment on it. Are you people paid to do these? Are there any negative consequences if you don't review something? It seems it would have been better off just to leave this one of the shelf if you aren't going to take the time to get the back story...

jrobinson

We receive no monetary reimbursement for writing reviews.

B5Erik

Well, having just finished The Ark of Truth, I've got to say that was the kind of satisfying finale to season 10 that I was hoping for. Great stuff - a lot of fun.

The only gripe I had about it was that they threw in everything but the kitchen sink (all of the prerequisite SG1 subplots were there). Paring it down and eliminating one of those subplots might have made the movie a little better (Sam and Teal'c don't get quite enough to do in the movie as a result), but as it is I still think it's a damned entertaining movie - as long as you've watched the last 10 years of SG1. If not, you're going to be lost.

Clearly, though, this was not made to win over new fans. This was made for the fans who have been following the show for the last decade. This was made for the fans who weren't happy about the Sci-Fi channel cancelling the show in a cost cutting move, and as one of those fans I am very glad they made this movie. I enjoyed the hell out of it.

It was well written SG1 stuff. The actors continued to do what they do with these characters (which is a good thing), and the action was very good (although they've done better before). As for the special effects, I thought they were excellent (not $100 million budget excellent, but for a straight to DVD movie based on a cancelled TV series they were fantastic).

Finally, the resolution of the story is what they've been setting up for the last two years of the series. No major surprises, but it was carried off very well.

I'd have to give the "content" of this DVD a 4 star (and HIGHLY recommended) rating for those familiar with the series and a 2 1/2 star (skip it until you've seen seasons 9 & 10 of the series) rating for those who aren't.

Chew

I just think this review proves they should've wrapped up the series storyline in the series and done completely standalone movies for DVD.

IIRC, they knew the end was coming and could've wrapped up the Ori storyline but chose to go the DVD route for the finale.

John Sinnott

As Jeffrey said, reviewers aren't paid for their work, and they are penalized for not submitting a review in a timely fashion.

This title was on Justin's wish list, and I assigned it to him based on that. Truth be told, I assumed that he had seen the series, but he may have assumed that it was a stand alone film like the Star Trek movies.

When I read his review before posting it to the site I knew that a discussion would be started, but that's not a bad thing. I thought Justin made some fair comments, and though I think his outlook on the series would have been different had he seen the show first, I don't think the review was a waste.

mifuneral

I have to go with the camp that is perplexed that Justin reviewed this title at all. Confusion due to lack of context is not a valid criticism when the context is available in another form. Also, is a screener really a valid source from which to judge A/V, which in this review was given absolutely no stars?

I think DVDTalk failed us more with this review than the actual reviewer.

JamesDFarrow

I actually think there is some merit to the review. I haven't seen any of the last two seasons of SG1 so the review, and the reaction to it, tell me I should do so first, or I will not like the DVD. There are probably many others like me that will also be more infomed now.

James

mrpeavey

Well, to be fair, the A/V were not evaluated - hence no stars. This is a practice that I've seen other reviewers do with advanced screener copies on DVDTalk. My brief comments in the audio and video sections specifically state that I'm not rating either.

I tried to be careful in my review since I'm sympathetic to fans of cult series. My guess, however, would be that the vast majority of DVDTalk readers are not fanatic Stargate viewers - like myself and JamesDFarrow - and would appreciate a heads up that this isn't the place to start. Storyline aside, I didn't think it was well-acted or well-staged.

I feel like I've said everything I have to say about this review and like Yakuza Bengoshi, I'm dropping out of this conversation now.

jayntampa

I think it's a pretty simple thing to fix - someone that has seen all the seasons needs to review it, then the two should be linked together so that readers that are both familiar and unfamiliar have a review to correspond with their status.

I hope the reviewer doesn't view all the posts as an attack, I just feel the review was a disservice to audience, as it really can't speak to whether the DVD serves as an appropriate conclusion to the last two seasons.

I did 100 something reviews for a popular anime site, and I received a screener from Bandai for a series I hadn't seen, so I had to find another reviewer to do it for me; I didn't feel comfortable starting in the middle.

nemein

One would think that would be the normal approach but I guess not.

WRT my criticism of Justin, nothing personal is meant by it and hopefully he's not taking it as an attack. It just seems odd to try and start at the end of something and expect it to make sense...

mifuneral

Yeah, I wasn't really faulting the reviewer for that so much as whoever gave him his copy of the movie, be it the site or the production company itself. When it comes to A/V the only thing that should limit a reviewer is his or her own equipment. There's no excuse for the software being faulty.