TGM

My AV receiver supports two additional speakers called REAR (not to be confused with the rear surrounds)... to my knowledge, no DVD, HD-DVD or BluRay is encoded in 7.1 ... my question is this, what sort of stuff comes out of these REAR two speakers... is it worth me getting some additional speakers and using them, or does it just muddy up the already pretty good surround setup I currently have using my existing 5.1 setup... and if it is worth using them, in a perfect world, where should these rears be placed? ie: directly behind the couch? 10 feet behind the couch, what?

thanks.

Groucho

7.1 is two more, isn't it?

TGM

yes, it is two more... but, my question is, without DVD's actually being coded for 7.1, what actually comes out of those two additional speakers? voice like the center channel? the same stuff that comes out of the rear surrounds? the same stuff coming out of the front R & L speakers, or something totally different that is worth enhancing the sound quality rather than muddying the sound distrubition?

JZ1276

basically, 7.1 is a 6th ch matrixed into 2 channels. IMO, it's not worth it at all. I have a 6.1 setup and out of my 400+ DVD's maybe 3 of them are encoded in 6.1. If you do decide to go with the 2 additional rear speakers, it'll just me more surround. nothing from the fronts will come out of them.

Mr. Salty

You must have a limited taste in movies. A lot of big-budget or action-type DVDs have Dolby Digital EX or DTS-ES, and HD DVD and Blu-ray are likely to grow that number.

The "Star Wars" and "Lord of the Rings" films account for nine such discs in my collection. "Terminator 2," "Fight Club," "Gladiator" and the Austin Powers films are in there, too. That's just off the top of my head, so it's not a rare occurrence.

If you already have the receiver, I wouldn't think picking up an inexpensive pair of speakers at some point would be that big a deal.

JZ1276

actuallu, yeah you're right...i guess I have more 6.1 discs than I thought. However, i would not consider a 7.1 setup. I think 6.1 would sound better than 7.1. If he s using a small room, 5.1 would be good enough.

Mr. Salty

Based on what?

JZ1276

based on nothing. i've never heard a 7.1 system but i'm assuming since the 6th ch is is matrixed to create 7.1 that 6.1 would sound better.

Mr. Salty

Well, you'd be wrong. But at least you're honest.

If we're talking about 7.1 from DVD, the seventh channel isn't matrixed from the sixth channel. It's simply the sixth channel split between two speakers, which allows the sound to be better dispersed behind the listener so that it isn't so directional. (A caveat to this is that, with Dolby Digital EX the sixth channel itself is matrixed from the rear surround channels. DTS-ES can be either matrixed or discrete 6.1 channels.)

I believe the advanced audio formats available on HD DVD and Blu-ray can be fully discrete, but perhaps someone else can weigh in on that.

DVD Polizei

I'd say with HD movies, you have a better chance of hearing a definitive difference in soundtracks which contain more than 5.1 channels. I have to agree with JZ1276 on principle.

First, the channels have to be discrete, truly discrete, and second, the recording has to use the discrete channels. We all have 5.1 DVDs where the soundtrack could've been mixed in 2.1 for all we could've cared because the extra channels weren't used at all, except for a few seconds where a glass broke.

And third, just how many movies use more than 5.1 channels. I never upgraded my Denon AVR-5700 just because of this fact--although it does have a significant amount of independent inputs which could technically be created for a 7.1 system. I never really was captivated by 6.1 or other offerings. Few DVDs supported it out of my 1000+ DVD collection, so I just sat back and watched the frenzy of everyone scrambling to get the latest receiver with the most channel capability.

This is just my own personal experience, and it's certianly a YMMV, but I've just combined the two rear channels and put them behind me. Sounded great to me.

Mr. Salty

I don't see why. Whether the soundtrack is 6.1 or 7.1, either matrixed or discrete, there will be a benefit to using the two rear channels --- especially in this case, where the OP already owns a receiver with 7.1 capabilities. He doesn't have to use expensive speakers to enjoy some benefit.

Out of my 343 DVDs, 23 have Dolby Digital EX, four have DTS-ES matrixed, and four have DTS-ES discrete. As a percentage, not a lot, but most of them are among my most-watched titles, so they get a disproportional amount of play.

I agree, I wouldn't upgrade a perfectly good receiver just for 7.1. But if I already owned a receiver capable of 7.1, I'd probably drop a couple hundred dollars at some point to take advantage of it.

TGM

The reason I ask, isn't really because of the money to get some inexpensive rear speakers, its primarily the hassle with figuring out a way to run the wires. We had the room re-done last year, and I had the foresight to wire in for surround sound, but not for these additional rears, so I'd have to do some creative drilling, perhaps pull up a little bit of the carpet, etc...

Mr. Salty

Oh hell, that's the fun of being a homeowner ... and a guy. This is the kind of project I do to keep my girlfriend from asking me to do real work.

TGM

True. Now, can anyone recommend some small, good, but relatively inexpensive speakers with stands that I can put directly behind the couch?

E Unit

For those who do have Blu Ray players, the movie Waiting is mixed in 7.1. It's Waiting....so I'm not sure how great that movie would benefit with this kind of mix.

http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/movies.php?id=341

I think there are a couple of other movies already in 7.1, but nothing worth playing as demo material.

BSTNFAN

I know I should know this, but is there a good reference of exactly where to place speakers in a 5/6/7.1 setup? Does it vary for music vice movies?

E Unit

Dolby.com has a section that shows preferred speaker setup. But it all comes down to personal preference, room layout, etc. I think most people have theirs setup on variations of what Dolby suggests.

http://www.dolby.com/consumer/home_e...oomlayout.html

BSTNFAN

Thanks!

Spiky

Hah!! I call bullshit!

Nothing can stop the female from asking you to do real work.

Spiky

The same ones you have for channels 4, 5.

orion1998_1

AV receiver, Surround Sound, 770 Watt, 20 - 20000 Hz, DTS 96/24, DTS Neo:6, DTS decoder, Dolby Digital, Dolby Pro Logic II, DTS-ES Discrete 6.1, Dolby Digital Surround EX,

good features in a ht receiver?

BSTNFAN

Assuming you don't need/want 7.1 .

Mr. Salty

I'd also want to know the number and types of video inputs (component and HDMI especially) and whether it converts video formats, and I'd also want to know the number of optical and coaxial digital audio inputs. The wattage rating is meaningless without knowing the brand of receiver, because some are less honest than others when it comes to power ratings.

TGM

Kinda tough, as the two fronts, to rear surrounds and center channel are all from a Sony "in a box" system, which I upgraded the receiver, but kept the speakers...

JZ1276

just look at the model number on the back of the speaker and search on e bay