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What HD players don't decode the audio internally?

Old 04-17-07, 02:44 PM
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What HD players don't decode the audio internally?

I got to wondering about how people are getting hung up on HDMI 1.3 and wondered why it is such a big deal as I don't know of any players that don't decode the audio and then pass it along, ready to go, to the receiver.

But for this to be an issue, surely there must be some. What are they on bothe the HD-DVD side and the BR side?
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Old 04-17-07, 04:10 PM
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People are getting hung up because they have been led in the wrong direction.

Correct me if I am wrong, but if the audio is decoded in the player, the player must decode the signal and then send it through the analog outputs to the analog inputs on the receiver. no decoding is done in the receiver and what you hear is the decoded audio from the player.

my receiver is 1.2a and I think it will do everything I need it to do. I have been out of the loop for a short while and may be getting confused on this confused topic.

the ps3 has no analog output but i think that 1.2a will pass decoded audio.


ok...i just confused myself. i am not deleting because i typed a lot. someone correct me.


edit: i think it must use analog or 1.3.
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Old 04-17-07, 07:11 PM
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The transcoding to high-rez PCM to transfer via HDMI is something that nobody ever talked about before the players came out. I think we all missed it, frankly. all we ever saw was transferring the native Dolby/DTS streams, which needs HDMI 1.3.

Most of the players transcode to PCM, if not all. The real question is the receiver.

Now, decoding to analog is another choice. The A2/D2 HDDVD players do not offer this, nor do the game machines. Most of the other players, both types, have 5.1 analog output. Although 7.1 is what I want, but that is a future need since there aren't hardly any 7.1 discs. Only the Panasonic BDp has 7.1 output at this time.

The other reason for wanting HDMI 1.3 is simplicity. We are simply tired of needing so many wires. My DVDp has around a dozen wires coming out of it. Sick.
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Old 04-17-07, 07:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Spiky
Most of the players transcode to PCM, if not all. The real question is the receiver.
Splain more. What is the real question about the receiver in that scenario? Whether or not it can do with PCM what needs to be done? If so, how does one know?
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Old 04-17-07, 07:34 PM
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The receiver has to (1) accept audio via HDMI at all, (2) decode high-rez PCM. You would have to check the specs, maybe ask here about the specific model. I don't have a list in my head.

All receivers since optical wires existed will decode the old familiar PCM, sometimes known as a CD, also known as 44KHz/16bit digital audio. But they may or may not be able to read 96/24 or higher PCM, which is what should be coming out of the HD disc players. Plus, many low end receivers with HDMI have only had pass-through as a switcher, no audio is pulled out of the signal. Pretty silly if you ask me, but they exist.

If nothing else, your HD disc player can decode down to standard digital DTS or maybe Dolby Digital (like on DVDs) and you can hook up the optical connection. And it should be excellent audio, if not quite as good as HDMI 1.3 or high-rez PCM can do. So there is always a choice available. This would be a good one for short term, til you can/want to afford a new receiver.
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Old 04-17-07, 09:04 PM
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Also what is silly IMHO is the fact that the vast majority of these players that are now coming out that will process the audio thru HDMI, only have two inputs! I mean if your going to the trouble of adding that, you want the receiver the switch everything and be the center of a ht system, three and four would seem to make more sense.

Heck I have three right now (PS3, Voom box for OTA HD, Bravo D1). And I'm considering Dish HD which will add a fourth.

I realize if your TV has multiple HDMI inputs the advantage to running direct is that you can calibrate each item for that source. But many a tv also only have two or three and many a projector only one.
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Old 04-17-07, 11:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Sdallnct
Also what is silly IMHO is the fact that the vast majority of these players that are now coming out that will process the audio thru HDMI, only have two inputs! I mean if your going to the trouble of adding that, you want the receiver the switch everything and be the center of a ht system, three and four would seem to make more sense.

Heck I have three right now (PS3, Voom box for OTA HD, Bravo D1). And I'm considering Dish HD which will add a fourth.

I realize if your TV has multiple HDMI inputs the advantage to running direct is that you can calibrate each item for that source. But many a tv also only have two or three and many a projector only one.
I'm not familiar with the features of the Voom box, but you may be able to just use the Dish HD receiver in its place, as it has an ATSC tuner.
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Old 04-17-07, 11:36 PM
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Another problem is DTS Master Audio. Most/None of the current HD players can decode it so this could be an issue. I know the new Onkyo coming out can decode it, but you must have a player with 1.3 like the PS3 to be able to get it to the Onkyo for decoding.
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Old 04-18-07, 07:35 AM
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Originally Posted by sdcrym
I'm not familiar with the features of the Voom box, but you may be able to just use the Dish HD receiver in its place, as it has an ATSC tuner.
Even if I get Dish HD, I doubt I will give up my OTA HD. The pic on OTA HD is amazing, and I have heard that dish network HD is not as good since they compress so much. Heck that is a main reason I have not switched to Dish HD so far, with free OTA HD I don't know if it is worth the upgrade for the few HD channels that I would watch that are not on local networks.

Tho the Voom box does also have component.
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Old 04-18-07, 08:09 AM
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I was generally right...

from wiki...

HDMI 1.3
Supports output of Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio streams for external decoding by AV receivers.[9] TrueHD and DTS-HD are lossless audio codec formats used on HD DVDs and Blu-ray Discs. If the disc player can decode these streams into uncompressed audio, then HDMI 1.3 is not necessary, as all versions of HDMI can transport uncompressed audio.
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Old 04-18-07, 11:02 AM
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Originally Posted by SoSpacey
I was generally right...

from wiki...

HDMI 1.3
Supports output of Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio streams for external decoding by AV receivers.[9] TrueHD and DTS-HD are lossless audio codec formats used on HD DVDs and Blu-ray Discs. If the disc player can decode these streams into uncompressed audio, then HDMI 1.3 is not necessary, as all versions of HDMI can transport uncompressed audio.

Okay, that is what I thought. And I don't know of any HD-DVD or BR players that don't decode the audio. Maybe it is just looking towards the future, but it seems that they have come up with a solution to which there was no problem.
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Old 04-18-07, 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Sdallnct
Even if I get Dish HD, I doubt I will give up my OTA HD. The pic on OTA HD is amazing, and I have heard that dish network HD is not as good since they compress so much. Heck that is a main reason I have not switched to Dish HD so far, with free OTA HD I don't know if it is worth the upgrade for the few HD channels that I would watch that are not on local networks.

Tho the Voom box does also have component.
What I meant is, it has an OTA tuner. I've got my rabbit ears hooked into the Dish box instead of my TV, since for some reason my TV only passes 2 channel audio through the optical out. You can scan for locals with the dish receiver just like you can with a TV. It then adds the channels it finds to the guide.
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Old 04-18-07, 09:58 PM
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You still want the Voom box since your Dish DVR may be busy recording 2 things and you can watch something else on the Voom.
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