DVD & Home Theater Gear Discuss DVD and Home Theater Equipment.

Help! Can't decide between RP/tube TV

Old 11-04-02, 09:08 AM
  #1  
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Miami, FL
Posts: 139
Help! Can't decide between RP/tube TV

I'm close to deciding on which HDTV to buy, but my wife and I are stuck in the age old RP vs CRT TV debate. After telling her that the picture on CRTs are generally better, she is convinced that buying a RPTV would be a mistake, since she didn't like how the RPTVs looked in the stores.

I tried explaining to her that the CRT we saw, the Panasonic 34" CT-34WX52, had it's own DVD player directly connected to it (with Atlantis:The Lost Kingdom playing), while the RPTV I want to buy, the Hitachi 43FWX20B was poorly configured in the store display, and suffered from a poor satellite feed.


Is the picture from this direct view really THAT much better than the RP, or is the picture quality close enough to just get the larger RPTV? I can't really make a sound decision based on my observations since I haven't seen a properly configured (not to mention ISF calibrated) RPTV, so I wonder what I'd be missing here.


Because I'm getting this from an awards program at work, Sonys are not an option since they aren't available with this promo.

This TV will be used almost exclusively for DVDs (85-95%), with the occasional DirecTV viewing when I get my DTV HD receiver. HD cable is also a possibility if they give me a free tuner, but even with the tuner, it'll be mostly for DVDs. The room is a fairly small 2nd bedroom with an adjustable 6-9 feet of viewing distance.


If anyone living in the Miami, FL area has a nicely configured or calibrated RPTV, mind if I drop by? My wife makes a great chicken cacciatore.
Gioman is offline  
Old 11-04-02, 06:17 PM
  #2  
Uber Member
 
Join Date: Mar 1999
Location: Overlooking Pearl Harbor
Posts: 16,232
Rear Projection TVs tend to be more about size than picture clarity.

But that doesn't mean they can't look very good too.

The problem with TV signals is not just an issue of how good the set looks, but the number of lines of information coming in. DVD has around 480 lines of resolution. I don't know how much TV signals display, but it's less and trying to show fewer lines of resolution on a much bigger screen is going to result in poor picture quality. We have "digital" cable at my house, and the picture on our 19" tube TV in the bedroom looks much sharper than on the 50" RPTV in the living room. But DVDs look very nice on this RPTV too, and it's not even anamorphic.

Another factor is lighting. RPTVs tend to be much more light sensitive than tube TVs. And the flourescent light used in most stores is not really good for RPTV viewing. I personally turn off most of the lights when I watch movies at night (during the daytime with the sun coming in, the picture tends to look a little darker, but I can live with it as I don't watch much during the day, and it's only dark scenes that are really affected).

Also, your viewing angle plays a much more important role with RPTVs, but vertically and horizontally. Make sure you aren't looking down at the TV, or too far off to one side or the other. Depending on the setup, you may need to bend or squat down a bit to see the screen at it's proper angle (that is to say, you want your head to be in the same place it would be when you're sitting on your sofa at home).

Finally, I've heard that a good ISF tech with the right tools can make quite a difference with an RPTV. I've never had it done (I'm very happy with the picture on my RPTV and would rather spend the money on more DVDs) personally though, so you might want to take that with a grain of salt.

Personally, I think the bigger the picture the better, so I recommend the RPTV. You might consider asking the store to hook up a DVD player to the screen so you can see what it looks like too.

Good luck.

-David
Blade is offline  
Old 11-04-02, 07:12 PM
  #3  
DVD Talk Special Edition
 
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 1,518
I'd say go with the tube. I have yet to see a RPTV that satisfies me.

I have an open mind about it, I just haven't yet seen one that is good enough. They do tend to be cheaper (HD ready sets anyway) however.

I'd rather have a 30" or 34" inch WS display with a great picture than a 50" or 60" that isn't as clear. Plus, I hear RPTVs are more prone to burn in when watching in 4X3 mode.
Steve Phillips is offline  
Old 11-06-02, 01:28 PM
  #4  
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Miami, FL
Posts: 139
Thanks for the info!


Looks like I'm getting the tube after all. My other room is a bit small for a RPTV, and she promised to let me get a bigger one once we move into our house.


Now to take care of audio.....
Gioman is offline  
Old 11-06-02, 03:19 PM
  #5  
DVD Talk Special Edition
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: USA
Posts: 1,953
Let me make a couple comments about RP/HDTV's. First off the comments that Tubes are MUCH better then RP/HDTV's is just a load of BS! Those who make such comments have yet to see a properly setup RP/HDTV (or see them only in stores with improper lighting). Yes, you may need more light control but if that can be accomplished then a RP/HDTV will be just as clear as a tube TV will (except for the real low-end RP/HDTV stuff). I think to many people equate brightness with clarity which of course the tube HDTV's have more of. But if you properly setup your HDTV (whichever kind) with DVD's like AVIA you will end up with the same brightness levels, just more forgivingness of external lighting by the tube HDTV's.

Also if you are into films then a RP/HDTV will give you a much better film look then a tube HDTV. And when it comes to a more enveloping feel the RP/HDTV's over 50" are head and shoulders above tube HDTV's.

So basically if you want a theater feel/look go RP/HDTV. If you want small size and less need for light control go with tube HDTV.
Frank S is offline  
Old 11-06-02, 04:23 PM
  #6  
Htd
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 45
if i was getting a new tv

i would get me the 40" Sony Wega (tube)

i am not a big fan of projection tv's (well i've never owned one, as i have been very happy with my 32"and 20" Sony trintrons )
Htd is offline  
Old 11-06-02, 05:40 PM
  #7  
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Miami, FL
Posts: 139
if i was getting a new tv........i would get me the 40" Sony Wega (tube)


Yeah, the Wega's are top of the line tube TVs, but then again, a 34" Panasonic HDTV that I won't have to spend a single dime on kinda gives me more bang for my buck, don't ya think? If Sony was available, they'd definitely be considered, but it's not an option with this particular program.


For the record, despite not ever seeing a well calibrated RPTV, I really do think they can have great PQ, especially for watching film. In this case, I'm agreeing with my wife now as leverage to get a much bigger, better RPTV when we have more living space for it.
Gioman is offline  
Old 12-01-02, 03:44 PM
  #8  
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Miami, FL
Posts: 139
Still haven't made a decision on what set to get, so any additional opinions would be greatly appreciated.
Gioman is offline  
Old 12-01-02, 05:58 PM
  #9  
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: I left my heart in.....South Plainfield, NJ
Posts: 2,998
I strongly prefer tube to RP. I have yet to see a really good RPTV.
John Sy is offline  
Old 12-01-02, 10:10 PM
  #10  
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 85
I agree with Frank S in saying that RPTV can look just as good as a Tube tv. If we just talk quality, it all depends on what comes in. If you are in an are where HDTV is available and you watch lots of dvd's, i'd suggest a RPTV. Its hard to get the effect of what HDTV can really do, unless you buy at least a widescreen rptv.

I took the jump from a 36 in sony wega to a 65 inch mits rptv. (viewing distance being around 9 feet) i still have both, but for film and HDTV i definitely prefer the mits. (i just replaced my alarm clock with the wega - set to turn to mtv at 5:00 in the glorious morning).

I think the 43 inch would be perfect for the bedroom. Since its free, you can't go wrong either way. But since its for 85/95 percent dvd viewing, i'd go with the rptv.

Good Luck.
Darthkim is offline  
Old 12-01-02, 11:41 PM
  #11  
DVD Talk Special Edition
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Alotoffuffin
Posts: 1,636
man I wish that 40" sony would fit in my entertainment center. I'd buy it in a heartbeat (pesky speakers on the sides make it too wiiiiiiide for my ent center...)
heavywear is offline  
Old 12-02-02, 01:51 AM
  #12  
DVD Talk Gold Edition
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,973
Fortunately, rear projection widescreen TV's have gotten quite good lately.

I've seen the Sony KP-51WS500 and Toshiba 50H82 units and their picture quality is nothing short of outstanding.

You really want a 16:9 TV because that's the best way to see widescreen DVD movies. And both RPTV models I've mentioned support the 480p progressive video output found on better-quality DVD console players.
RayChuang is offline  
Old 12-02-02, 02:42 AM
  #13  
DVD Talk Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Ruling Misfit Island with his [BAN] stick.
Posts: 12,315
I have 2 VVegas, and 1 rear projection 50 inch here at the house.

If I was going to pick up a new tv, I'd go w/ another VVega (and yes, I've seen 'properly calibrated' RPTVs).


-k
###
Keyser Soze is offline  
Old 12-02-02, 03:59 AM
  #14  
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 1,053
Is there such thing as a 16:9 Wega?
William Wallace is offline  
Old 12-02-02, 08:24 AM
  #15  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Posts: 253
I just went through the same thing and went back and forth between a 36" HDTV and the RP HDTV. I ended up going with a 50" and I'm very glad I did. Set it up with Video Essentials and the quality is excellent. My wife, who was VERY skeptical, commented last night that she thought the new TV justified our investment in DVDs. She said she didn't care if she ever went to a movie theater again. I don't go that far, but with a good surround system and the big screen (and my overstuffed leather recliner...) I'm a happy movie nut. 8^>

BTW: you won't believe how much a direct view 40" TV weighs! I helped a friend move his Sony and it was incredible... If you get one, don't get a rinky dink stand!
tonyj is offline  
Old 12-02-02, 12:03 PM
  #16  
DVD Talk Limited Edition
 
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: New York City
Posts: 5,233
Just another opinion, as I currently own a 65" WS and a 50" 4:3 (bedroom) rptv, and I've seen several tube HTs (incl. the larger Wegas). I hate to burst some bubbles, but rptv's can llok just as good (resolution, contrast) as tubes these days. And as noted above, most folks think an excess of contrast and color level constitutes a 'better' picture. I have my sets properly calibrated and they look great. Yes, tubes give a nice sharp picture as well (esp. flat screens).

BUT... the biggest difference is that a large tube tv (42" or so) looks like a big tv, whereas a large rptv looks and feels like a small movie screen. *Big* difference in the experience IMO.
drmoze is offline  
Old 12-02-02, 12:54 PM
  #17  
DVD Talk Special Edition
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
Posts: 1,086
I chose to go with a 34" Widescreen HD Toshiba tube TV because of the size and layout of the room. The main seating area is about 6' from the screen and can accomodate 3 people comfortably. The rest of the seating is on the sides. I have not seen a RPTV with a good side viewing angle. I love my TV, but if I had a bigger room I would have considered a RPTV or even a front projector.

Also, what is the proper viewing distance of an HDTV? On my Sound & Vision DVD it says the viewing distance for standard sets is about 3 times the diagonal size of the set. For example 34" x 3 = 102" or 8.5 feet. Any closer and you may begin to see the scan lines that make up the picture. But it says you can sit closer to HDTVs. I have to get really close (about a foot) before I can see any dots that make up the picture on my TV. How far away do you have to sit from an HD RPTV to not see the scan lines? Say 42"-65".
karnblack is offline  
Old 12-19-02, 11:38 AM
  #18  
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: New Ipswich, NH, USA
Posts: 71
What does calibration involve

I have flip-flopped between direct view and RPTV for so long it's sad. I'm still using my 27" Sony that I bought back when folks thought of a 27" set as huge. Yet, I dread the thought of spending serious dough on one type or the other only to be convinced later that I made the wrong choice.

Everyone promoting RPTV qualifies their recommendation with the phrase "properly calibrated.'' Well, what specifically does this mean? What does one do to ensure his RPTV is "properly calibrated?" And how often must one re-calibrate?

Thanks,
Ricco

Last edited by Ricco; 12-19-02 at 05:15 PM.
Ricco is offline  
Old 12-19-02, 01:46 PM
  #19  
X
Administrator
 
X's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 1987
Location: AA-
Posts: 10,740
Re: What does calibration involve

Originally posted by Ricco
[B]Everyone promoting RPTV qualifies their recommendation with the phrase "properly calibrated.'' Well, what specifically does this mean? What does one do[\B] to ensure his RPTV is "properly calibrated?" And how often must one re-calibrate?
"Properly calibrated" is merely running a test/calibration DVD such as Avia and setting brightness, contrast, sharpness, and color. It might take an hour or so the first time you do it. You'll also want to do a convergence from your set's menu.

Some sets are better than others at holding these settings, particularly convergence, but in general the major calibration work seldom needs to be repeated, maybe after getting a new player, deciding you want to watch in different lighting situations, relocating the set, etc. Subsequent calibrations can be done in minutes once you know what you are doing. If you watch sources other than DVD and your set has different settings for different sources you will need to use your DVD settings as a guide and then tweak to what looks good.

Of course really properly calibrated means having an expert come in and spend hours tweaking picture geometry low-level color, and other service menu settings. While it can significantly improve your picture most people are very happy with the results of their own calibration, me included.
X is offline  
Old 12-19-02, 03:05 PM
  #20  
DVD Talk Special Edition
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Alotoffuffin
Posts: 1,636
"You'll also want to do a convergence"

can you elborate please? convergence of what? (newbie alert)
heavywear is offline  
Old 12-19-02, 03:17 PM
  #21  
X
Administrator
 
X's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 1987
Location: AA-
Posts: 10,740
Convergence is the alignment of the red, blue, and green beams from the individual color tubes hitting the screen. RPTVs have a menu function that you can get into to see a set of grid lines. You then make adjustments from your remote to get the signals as close together as possible over multiple locations on the grid so that the lines look white with minimal color leakage around them. Some sets have 9 convergence locations, some have up to 72. And some sets can do it automatically.
X is offline  
Old 12-19-02, 04:31 PM
  #22  
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 61
Gioman


Another vote for a RPTV. I have a Toshiba 50HX81. If you are predominantly watching DVD's it will give you a much more film-like picture. As for the size, it is better to have and not need, than need and not have. Go to a decent store bring your own DVD and compare it on both sets. Make sure the contrast, and brightness levels are similar. I think you'll find the RPTV more to your liking. The Avia disc will work fine for a basic calibration. I had a professional ISF calibration done and the image went from very good to breathtaking. Good luck.

James
kngelv is offline  
Old 12-19-02, 05:00 PM
  #23  
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Missouri
Posts: 65
The picture on my Philips 55 widescreen is awsome. I have a 36" RCA DTV and the pictures are about the same on cable. I much rather watch on my widescreen than my tube.
Shon is offline  
Old 12-19-02, 05:14 PM
  #24  
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: New Ipswich, NH, USA
Posts: 71
Locating ISF Tech.

First of all, it's good to know that calibration -- at least at some level -- can be done via Avia and a TV remote. And of course, the same calibration (sans convergence, perhaps) is necessary on a new direct view set as well.

Now, if I do get a RPTV, and if I do want to have it professionally tweaked, is there a "Big Book of ISF Technicians" I would turn to to find a qualified professional in my area?

Ricco
Ricco is offline  
Old 12-19-02, 05:47 PM
  #25  
X
Administrator
 
X's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 1987
Location: AA-
Posts: 10,740
I guess you could start here: http://www.imagingscience.com/
X is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.