Line doubler better than Progressive out?
 

A salesman told a friend of mine that the Pioneer Elite RP HDTV line doublers are so good, that you get a better picture using an interlaced DVD signal and doubling it with the TV than with a progressive signal from the DVD player.

Any thoughts or experiences regarding this?

Well, I have the Pioneer. But I'd have to say my home theater computer with progressive out into the VGA input is very slightly better than a non-progressive Sony player into the component input. I guess it depends on the quality of the player's progressive section.

Maybe on a low end progressive DVD player and assuming that the Pioneer has 3:2 pulldown detection. I doubt it compares to a high end progressive player though.

It does.

According to The Secrets of Home Theater DVD Shootout, the deinterlacer in the Pioneer Elite series is one of the best, beating out those found in even some high-end progressive DVD players.

That test is interesting because the disc I noticed the biggest difference between a progressive and non-progressive source on the Pioneer was the same one they used -- Super Speedway. They say the Pioneer was not as good at deinterlacing as a good progressive player and I agree with that on a couple of scenes.

The ones I noticed having the biggest difference were at the end showing the fall foliage. Not a real big difference, but those scenes were absolutely amazing with a progressive source. But not worth spending the money on a good progressive player just for that in my opinion.

Iveal: I thought that DVD's were recorded progressively. Why would there be any deinterlacing in a "progressive" DVD player?

That is a misnomer.

DVDs are encoded as interlaced. It's the interlacing that can be different.

If it is a transfer from a progressive source like film then the DVD is encoded with interlaced field pairs that can be re-interleaved. A progressive player does the re-interleaving(also called weaving).

If it is a transfer from a interlaced source then the DVD is encoded with the interlaced signal and the line doubler in the DVD player converts it to a progressive signal(also called bobbing).

It's the job of the progressive scan DVD player to determine the signal it is being fed and whether to bob or weave it.

Could you explain that a bit more? What's the difference between interleaving and interlacing?

Thanks!

Interlacing is how a image is displayed on a standard TV. First all the odd lines are scanned and then the even lines are scanned to create the full image at 1/30th a second. Progressive scanning de-interlaces the signal and displays the image as a full frame at 1/60th a second. This produces a much better quality image and less flicker(which is associated with interlacing scan lines).

DVDs are encoded as interlaced but the progressive scan chip determines what type of interlaced signal it is and decides how to de-interlace it. If it is from a progressive source such as film it de-interlaces the signal by re-interleaving. If it is from an interlaced source it de-interlaces by line doubling.

So, would it be fair to say that all things being equal, a progressive-scan DVD player is better than a line doubler, since by definition, a line doubler is only a line doubler.

True. A line-doubler is used for an interlaced source. Almost every HDTV has a built in line doubler which is used on the incoming analog cable/antenna signal so that it looks acceptable on the screen. However putting your DVD through a simple line doubler is not going to give you the full benefit that a progressive scan DVD player will give you.

Sorry for being slow, but I'm still not getting what the difference is between re-interleaving and line doubling.

Also, what makes the "interlaced field pairs" you mentioned earlier different from a "normal" interlaced signal?

Thanks!

Maybe I was a little un-clear in my previous post. All interlacing results in interlaced field pairs. When a frame of film is interlaced it creates 2 fields, one field contains all the odd scan lines the other contains the even scan lines. Where the difference comes in is the source that is being interlaced. A progressive source or an interlaced source.

There is really no HUGE difference between re-interleaving and line doubling. They are basically the same process in the fact that both de-interlace, the interlaced signal, to create a progressive signal. Line doubling is a simpler process.