New DVD Player : Coaxial vs Optical output? Please Help (long post)
05-19-01, 09:47 PM
#1
DVD Talk Godfather & 2020 TOTY Winner
Thread Starter
Hi, I finally upgraded from my steam-powered (well, almost) Panasonic A-105 to a Sony DVP-C670D. The main reason I did this was so I could finally use my DTS discs (at last, Sonic would be so proud).
Here's my question. I have only two inputs into my receiver (which is DTS compatable, but has no DTS decoder), one optical and one coaxial. I currently have my PS2 plugged into the optical port (it has no coaxial output). I plugged the new DVD player with the coxial digital output and it worked fine. Is this comparable to using the optical output, or would the sound be a lot better if I unplugged the opical cable from the PS2? Is there any way to get an optical cable switcher, like I do with the S-video cables?
And if anyone is in the know, as far as I can tell, my system works in DTS surround if I have my receiver in the "Pro Logic" mode, which is normally used for Dolby Surround. There is no indicator like when I use DD 5.1 and the Dolby Digital message comes on. If I make sure DTS is on and I hear surround effects from the rear speakers, it must be working (ie not just Dolby Suround), right???? Anyone have a good way to test DTS 5.1? On my Steely Dan DVD, in DTS, I clearly hear horns and background singers in the rear channels, so I assume it's working properly.
[Edited by Decker on 05-20-01 at 06:00 AM]
Here's my question. I have only two inputs into my receiver (which is DTS compatable, but has no DTS decoder), one optical and one coaxial. I currently have my PS2 plugged into the optical port (it has no coaxial output). I plugged the new DVD player with the coxial digital output and it worked fine. Is this comparable to using the optical output, or would the sound be a lot better if I unplugged the opical cable from the PS2? Is there any way to get an optical cable switcher, like I do with the S-video cables?
And if anyone is in the know, as far as I can tell, my system works in DTS surround if I have my receiver in the "Pro Logic" mode, which is normally used for Dolby Surround. There is no indicator like when I use DD 5.1 and the Dolby Digital message comes on. If I make sure DTS is on and I hear surround effects from the rear speakers, it must be working (ie not just Dolby Suround), right???? Anyone have a good way to test DTS 5.1? On my Steely Dan DVD, in DTS, I clearly hear horns and background singers in the rear channels, so I assume it's working properly.
[Edited by Decker on 05-20-01 at 06:00 AM]
05-19-01, 10:30 PM
#3
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Albany, NY
Posts: 4,097
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I use the co-axial digital cable. I don't really hear a difference with optical, but I just find that the co-axial is sturdier and more realiable cable for myself.
05-19-01, 11:10 PM
#4
DVD Talk Legend
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: In a place without the cursed couch
Posts: 20,590
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Originally posted by briank
I use the co-axial digital cable. I don't really hear a difference with optical, but I just find that the co-axial is sturdier and more realiable cable for myself.
I use the co-axial digital cable. I don't really hear a difference with optical, but I just find that the co-axial is sturdier and more realiable cable for myself.
05-20-01, 05:49 AM
#5
Cool New Member
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 28
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hello, coaxial is better and this is the reason why:
An optical connection is an electrical connection that is converted to "light" en than back again to an electical signal. This proces takes time (few nano seconds). This delay, and slower slew rate of the signal (the time it takes to get from 0 to 1 in a digital domain) can cause clock jitter in the receiving digital to analog convertor in your receiver, therfore degrading the audio quality.
An coaxial system is already electrical and isn't converted. It is important to use the correct RCA cable for the connection. Usually a cable with an good 75 Oms impedance. This is to match the impedance of the transmitting and receiving source (75 Ohms), otherwise the signal can reflect back (signal loss)to the source and that is also bad for sound quality.
An optical connection is an electrical connection that is converted to "light" en than back again to an electical signal. This proces takes time (few nano seconds). This delay, and slower slew rate of the signal (the time it takes to get from 0 to 1 in a digital domain) can cause clock jitter in the receiving digital to analog convertor in your receiver, therfore degrading the audio quality.
An coaxial system is already electrical and isn't converted. It is important to use the correct RCA cable for the connection. Usually a cable with an good 75 Oms impedance. This is to match the impedance of the transmitting and receiving source (75 Ohms), otherwise the signal can reflect back (signal loss)to the source and that is also bad for sound quality.
05-20-01, 09:14 AM
#6
DVD Talk Legend
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: In a place without the cursed couch
Posts: 20,590
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Originally posted by vwmaniac
Hello, coaxial is better and this is the reason why:
An optical connection is an electrical connection that is converted to "light" en than back again to an electical signal. This proces takes time (few nano seconds). This delay, and slower slew rate of the signal (the time it takes to get from 0 to 1 in a digital domain) can cause clock jitter in the receiving digital to analog convertor in your receiver, therfore degrading the audio quality.
Hello, coaxial is better and this is the reason why:
An optical connection is an electrical connection that is converted to "light" en than back again to an electical signal. This proces takes time (few nano seconds). This delay, and slower slew rate of the signal (the time it takes to get from 0 to 1 in a digital domain) can cause clock jitter in the receiving digital to analog convertor in your receiver, therfore degrading the audio quality.
05-20-01, 12:38 PM
#7
DVD Talk Gold Edition
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 2,167
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I hate referring people away from Geoff's site, but you can find good info here:
http://www.hometheaterforum.com/uub/...ML/036879.html
I went with optical, because I have a million wires behind my system. Each one is giving off EMW (RF). Some doing it more than others (I dont know how many "good" shielded wires I have anymore).
I figured an optical link is one less RF interference source that I have to deal with.
Hope this helps.
-Taco
http://www.hometheaterforum.com/uub/...ML/036879.html
I went with optical, because I have a million wires behind my system. Each one is giving off EMW (RF). Some doing it more than others (I dont know how many "good" shielded wires I have anymore).
I figured an optical link is one less RF interference source that I have to deal with.
Hope this helps.
-Taco
05-20-01, 01:25 PM
#8
Member
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 159
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Normally if your DVD player decodes (not just passes) the DTS signal (or DD5.1) it'll have have 6 RCA output jacks on the back, along with optical and/or coaxial connectors.
If you use the decoder in the player you connect 6 separate cables from the player outputs to the 6 inputs on your receiver. Most DVD players just pass the DTS signal (or DD5.1) through the optical or coaxial outputs. I may be wrong, but I believe any signal through the optical or coaxial outputs of your player will not be the decoded signal but will have to be decoded by the receiver. I think Dolby Surround is just the default mode of the receiver, I don't think you're getting real DTS.
[Edited by steve f on 05-20-01 at 11:28 AM]
If you use the decoder in the player you connect 6 separate cables from the player outputs to the 6 inputs on your receiver. Most DVD players just pass the DTS signal (or DD5.1) through the optical or coaxial outputs. I may be wrong, but I believe any signal through the optical or coaxial outputs of your player will not be the decoded signal but will have to be decoded by the receiver. I think Dolby Surround is just the default mode of the receiver, I don't think you're getting real DTS.
[Edited by steve f on 05-20-01 at 11:28 AM]
05-20-01, 10:48 PM
#9
DVD Talk Godfather & 2020 TOTY Winner
Thread Starter
Steve,
With all due respect, I think you're wrong about the DTS signal. I bought this particular DVD player SPECIFICALLY because it has the built-in DTS decoder (which was the only way I could listen to DTS short of getting rid of my 18 month-old receiver). The manual clearly states that you can use the DTS decoder IF AND ONLY IF you use the optical or coaxial cable. It will not work if you hook the speakers to the six RCA outputs. I tried out the system today playing a few of my DTS/DD discs in the DTS mode. I was very impressed with the pie machine scene in Chicken Run, where the gas jets turn on, one by one, all around you much more than in the DD mode; also I noted in my Sheryl Crow DVD that the subwoofer was actally playing music instead of just the occasional thump. I have to conclude that it is now decoding DTS correctly (I think).
As far as the coaxial cable vs optical cable, thanks everyone for the input
It sounds like the difference is negligable. In that case, I'll keep my current set-up so I don't have to unplug a cable every time I want to play my PS2.
...One other question: The DVD player has 2 S-video outs, but the manual makes no explanation why. Is it to run an increadibly long S-video cable into another room and watch the DVD on a second monitor, or is it for something else?
With all due respect, I think you're wrong about the DTS signal. I bought this particular DVD player SPECIFICALLY because it has the built-in DTS decoder (which was the only way I could listen to DTS short of getting rid of my 18 month-old receiver). The manual clearly states that you can use the DTS decoder IF AND ONLY IF you use the optical or coaxial cable. It will not work if you hook the speakers to the six RCA outputs. I tried out the system today playing a few of my DTS/DD discs in the DTS mode. I was very impressed with the pie machine scene in Chicken Run, where the gas jets turn on, one by one, all around you much more than in the DD mode; also I noted in my Sheryl Crow DVD that the subwoofer was actally playing music instead of just the occasional thump. I have to conclude that it is now decoding DTS correctly (I think).
As far as the coaxial cable vs optical cable, thanks everyone for the input
It sounds like the difference is negligable. In that case, I'll keep my current set-up so I don't have to unplug a cable every time I want to play my PS2....One other question: The DVD player has 2 S-video outs, but the manual makes no explanation why. Is it to run an increadibly long S-video cable into another room and watch the DVD on a second monitor, or is it for something else?
05-20-01, 11:17 PM
#10
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Albany, NY
Posts: 4,097
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by Decker
Steve,
With all due respect, I think you're wrong about the DTS signal. I bought this particular DVD player SPECIFICALLY because it has the built-in DTS decoder (which was the only way I could listen to DTS short of getting rid of my 18 month-old receiver). The manual clearly states that you can use the DTS decoder IF AND ONLY IF you use the optical or coaxial cable. It will not work if you hook the speakers to the six RCA outputs. I tried out the system today playing a few of my DTS/DD discs in the DTS mode. I was very impressed with the pie machine scene in Chicken Run, where the gas jets turn on, one by one, all around you much more than in the DD mode; also I noted in my Sheryl Crow DVD that the subwoofer was actally playing music instead of just the occasional thump. I have to conclude that it is now decoding DTS correctly (I think).
As far as the coaxial cable vs optical cable, thanks everyone for the input It sounds like the difference is negligable. In that case, I'll keep my current set-up so I don't have to unplug a cable every time I want to play my PS2.
...One other question: The DVD player has 2 S-video outs, but the manual makes no explanation why. Is it to run an increadibly long S-video cable into another room and watch the DVD on a second monitor, or is it for something else?
Steve,
With all due respect, I think you're wrong about the DTS signal. I bought this particular DVD player SPECIFICALLY because it has the built-in DTS decoder (which was the only way I could listen to DTS short of getting rid of my 18 month-old receiver). The manual clearly states that you can use the DTS decoder IF AND ONLY IF you use the optical or coaxial cable. It will not work if you hook the speakers to the six RCA outputs. I tried out the system today playing a few of my DTS/DD discs in the DTS mode. I was very impressed with the pie machine scene in Chicken Run, where the gas jets turn on, one by one, all around you much more than in the DD mode; also I noted in my Sheryl Crow DVD that the subwoofer was actally playing music instead of just the occasional thump. I have to conclude that it is now decoding DTS correctly (I think).
As far as the coaxial cable vs optical cable, thanks everyone for the input
It sounds like the difference is negligable. In that case, I'll keep my current set-up so I don't have to unplug a cable every time I want to play my PS2....One other question: The DVD player has 2 S-video outs, but the manual makes no explanation why. Is it to run an increadibly long S-video cable into another room and watch the DVD on a second monitor, or is it for something else?
05-21-01, 11:05 AM
#11
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Section 529, Wrigley Field
Posts: 884
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
See below for info on the decoder straight from Crutchfield's site for your Sony model. The only way to get DTS is to connect the six outputs to the six inputs on your receiver. I imagine that all you are getting from your receiver using the coax is DD 5.1.
"Dolby Digital/DTS Decoder: This unit has a built-in Dolby Digital/DTS decoder with bass management features. When a Dolby Digital or DTS encoded disc is played, the decoded signals are output through the 5.1 channel outputs on the back of the unit. The 5.1 channel outputs are for use with Dolby Digital "ready" receivers and preamps. See "Speaker Setup" section below for more info on bass management."
"Dolby Digital/DTS Decoder: This unit has a built-in Dolby Digital/DTS decoder with bass management features. When a Dolby Digital or DTS encoded disc is played, the decoded signals are output through the 5.1 channel outputs on the back of the unit. The 5.1 channel outputs are for use with Dolby Digital "ready" receivers and preamps. See "Speaker Setup" section below for more info on bass management."
05-21-01, 11:11 AM
#12
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Albany, NY
Posts: 4,097
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by jpalm
See below for info on the decoder straight from Crutchfield's site for your Sony model. The only way to get DTS is to connect the six outputs to the six inputs on your receiver. I imagine that all you are getting from your receiver using the coax is DD 5.1.
"Dolby Digital/DTS Decoder: This unit has a built-in Dolby Digital/DTS decoder with bass management features. When a Dolby Digital or DTS encoded disc is played, the decoded signals are output through the 5.1 channel outputs on the back of the unit. The 5.1 channel outputs are for use with Dolby Digital "ready" receivers and preamps. See "Speaker Setup" section below for more info on bass management."
See below for info on the decoder straight from Crutchfield's site for your Sony model. The only way to get DTS is to connect the six outputs to the six inputs on your receiver. I imagine that all you are getting from your receiver using the coax is DD 5.1.
"Dolby Digital/DTS Decoder: This unit has a built-in Dolby Digital/DTS decoder with bass management features. When a Dolby Digital or DTS encoded disc is played, the decoded signals are output through the 5.1 channel outputs on the back of the unit. The 5.1 channel outputs are for use with Dolby Digital "ready" receivers and preamps. See "Speaker Setup" section below for more info on bass management."
Trust me I only have one digital cable from my Toshiba 5109 to my SONY 333ES and I am getting DTS no doubt about it.
05-21-01, 11:43 AM
#13
DVD Talk Godfather & 2020 TOTY Winner
Thread Starter
While I don't doubt anything printed here, I'm sure that it is possible to get the decoded DTS signal without using the 5.1 outputs. This is straight from the user's manual:
SETUPS FOR THE PLAYER WHEN USING THE DIGITAL CONNECTING CORDS
If your receiver does not have a built in DTS Decoder:
To listen to the sound through speakers connected to a receiver which has a digital connector, set the "Audio Setup" items in the setup display as shown below
DTS: D-PCM
So you must be able to get DTS this way, don't you think? I would like to see that website you took that from, could you post a link?
Thanks again to everyone who posted here!
---------
Edit: OK, after checking out that site and re-reading my manual, I think I've figured everything out better. I guess I was just getting PCM stereo through my coaxial cable using the DTS mode. I need to go buy more cables, I guess for those 5.1 outputs. I assume that's the "Multi-Channel" input selection on my receiver. Great, more cables!!! Do these cables have to be really good, or will basic RCA cables do? Will the sound be comprable to using an optical cable and then a DTS decoder in the receiver, or will this set-up be sub-optimal ?
[Edited by Decker on 05-21-01 at 12:08 PM]
SETUPS FOR THE PLAYER WHEN USING THE DIGITAL CONNECTING CORDS
If your receiver does not have a built in DTS Decoder:
To listen to the sound through speakers connected to a receiver which has a digital connector, set the "Audio Setup" items in the setup display as shown below
DTS: D-PCM
So you must be able to get DTS this way, don't you think? I would like to see that website you took that from, could you post a link?
Thanks again to everyone who posted here!
---------
Edit: OK, after checking out that site and re-reading my manual, I think I've figured everything out better. I guess I was just getting PCM stereo through my coaxial cable using the DTS mode. I need to go buy more cables, I guess for those 5.1 outputs. I assume that's the "Multi-Channel" input selection on my receiver. Great, more cables!!! Do these cables have to be really good, or will basic RCA cables do? Will the sound be comprable to using an optical cable and then a DTS decoder in the receiver, or will this set-up be sub-optimal ?
[Edited by Decker on 05-21-01 at 12:08 PM]
05-22-01, 10:02 AM
#14
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Section 529, Wrigley Field
Posts: 884
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by briank
NOT necessarily true. IF your receiver decodes DTS then your dvd player passes the one signal through the ONE cable and your receiver can decode it.
Trust me I only have one digital cable from my Toshiba 5109 to my SONY 333ES and I am getting DTS no doubt about it.
Originally posted by jpalm
See below for info on the decoder straight from Crutchfield's site for your Sony model. The only way to get DTS is to connect the six outputs to the six inputs on your receiver. I imagine that all you are getting from your receiver using the coax is DD 5.1.
"Dolby Digital/DTS Decoder: This unit has a built-in Dolby Digital/DTS decoder with bass management features. When a Dolby Digital or DTS encoded disc is played, the decoded signals are output through the 5.1 channel outputs on the back of the unit. The 5.1 channel outputs are for use with Dolby Digital "ready" receivers and preamps. See "Speaker Setup" section below for more info on bass management."
See below for info on the decoder straight from Crutchfield's site for your Sony model. The only way to get DTS is to connect the six outputs to the six inputs on your receiver. I imagine that all you are getting from your receiver using the coax is DD 5.1.
"Dolby Digital/DTS Decoder: This unit has a built-in Dolby Digital/DTS decoder with bass management features. When a Dolby Digital or DTS encoded disc is played, the decoded signals are output through the 5.1 channel outputs on the back of the unit. The 5.1 channel outputs are for use with Dolby Digital "ready" receivers and preamps. See "Speaker Setup" section below for more info on bass management."
Trust me I only have one digital cable from my Toshiba 5109 to my SONY 333ES and I am getting DTS no doubt about it.
