HD-A3 HD DVD Player and 10 Movies - $199
11-21-07, 04:07 PM
#26
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Originally Posted by Lunatikk
which one of the 3 players is best?
The A30 adds the 1080p output (but it may not do it very well, as I said in my post above) and reportedly has a better scaling chip for SD DVDs than the A2/A3. However, the A2/A3 have been widely reported to do a superb job of upscaling SD DVDs.
The A35 adds analog outputs, for compatibility with older, non-HDMI receivers and, I believe, the ability to send DD+ and Dolby TrueHD as a bitstream to a new HDMI 1.3 receiver with on-board decoding. The other higher end player, the XA2, is similar to the A35. If you want to know more about the specific differences between these machines, check out player reviews.
Onkyo is reported to be working on its own high-end HD DVD player. It can be expected to have all the bells and whistles.
Last edited by lizard; 11-21-07 at 04:21 PM.
11-21-07, 04:26 PM
#27
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lizard - good summary, just a few clarifications:
see my previous comment about 7.1 channel output being another difference.
The 1080p60 output definitely has a bug that slightly degrades the picture quality for some specific kinds of images. The 1080p24 output, on the other hand, is flawless and always preferable if you have a display capable of accepting it. The A30/35 do have a more sophisticated upscaling chip for SD, the ABT1018. As is always the case with subtle image quality differences, whether or not the improvement is noticeable depends on how big your tv is and how close you sit.
in addition to bitstreaming DD+ and TrueHD, the XA2 and A35 can also bitstream DTS-HD MA, which is found on some HD DVD import titles and appears to be the hi-def audio format of choice for New Line, beginning with Pan's Labyrinth next month.
Originally Posted by lizard
If you are talking about the various HD DVD players, the A2 and A3 are essentially identical except for a minor difference in the codec used for audio output over optical (A2>DTS vs. A3>DD) and cosmetics (the A3 has a "shinier" look and is slightly thinner).
The A30 adds the 1080p output (but it may not do it very well, as I said in my post above) and reportedly has a better scaling chip for SD DVDs than the A2/A3. However, the A2/A3 have been widely reported to do a superb job of upscaling SD DVDs.
The A35 adds analog outputs, for compatibility with older, non-HDMI receivers and, I believe, the ability to send DD+ and Dolby TrueHD as a bitstream to a new HDMI 1.3 receiver with on-board decoding. The other higher end player, the XA2 is similar to the A35. If you want to know more about the differences between these machines, check out player reviews.
11-21-07, 04:40 PM
#28
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Originally Posted by JimRochester
Sure now you tell me 
I have the A3 hooked up to a 47" Philips and the picture is every bit as good as my SONY BluRay outputting 1080p. Hopefully it will be that good for my next TV here in Rochester.
I have the A3 hooked up to a 47" Philips and the picture is every bit as good as my SONY BluRay outputting 1080p. Hopefully it will be that good for my next TV here in Rochester.
Go post that heresy over on Blu-Ray.com and see how long it takes them to ban you for being a troll! :-)
Seriously some of the funniest stuff I have read lately is on there. They take it all so personal as if any of those major companies gives a rats a$$ about their little battle against the hated HD DVDers
11-21-07, 05:14 PM
#29
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Originally Posted by kefrank
i assume you mean audio over optical - all third gen players handle it the same as the HD-A3: downmix to DD@640. that being said, the HD-A3 supports 7.1 channel audio over HDMI, while the HD-A2 does not, so if you have an HDMI receiver (supporting 7.1 channels), the A3 is definitely preferable to the A2. if you're limited to optical, it's really up to how much stock you put in [email protected] being better than DD@640k.
11-21-07, 06:36 PM
#30
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Originally Posted by lizard
But what wasn't said is that at least one report says that the A30 also doesn't do a good job of 1080p output:
http://review.zdnet.com/video-player...-32563583.html
The A30 converts the 1080p/24 information on the disc to 1080i/60, for reasons having to do with the chip used, and then de-interlaces it to 1080p/60. It apparently doesn't do this correctly. Whether or not this can or has been fixed by a firmware update, I couldn't say. But for a display that does a good job of de-interlacing, one might get a better picture by feeding it a 1080i input than the 1080p from the A30.
http://review.zdnet.com/video-player...-32563583.html
The A30 converts the 1080p/24 information on the disc to 1080i/60, for reasons having to do with the chip used, and then de-interlaces it to 1080p/60. It apparently doesn't do this correctly. Whether or not this can or has been fixed by a firmware update, I couldn't say. But for a display that does a good job of de-interlacing, one might get a better picture by feeding it a 1080i input than the 1080p from the A30.
It's worth pointing out the difference between 1080p/24 and 1080p/60. 1080p deals with the quality of resolution on every frame. 24 and 60 deal with the frames displayed per second. TVs normally display 60 frames per second but most film sources are recorded in 24 frames per second, meaning they have to converted to display on most TVs. Movies literally have their frames multiplied to fill out the 60 fps in order to display them on television. This adds imperfection, which I believe is a slight jitteriness to the image, simply because 24 does not divide into 60 evenly and the multiplication of frames is done unevenly. Almost no HDTVs could handle 24 fps before this year. More this year are able to do it and of course more will be on board in the future.
So to watch films in their purest quality, you'll want a player that can output 1080p/24 and a television that can display the same. The HD A30 player will output in 1080p/24 and the review says it does an excellent job of that. As lizard stated, there appears to be a problem with the A30 when it converts from 1080p/24 to 1080p/60 (something I didn't realize it would even have to do), which is what the vast majority of TVs out there now support.
So if you're planning on buying a new HDTV in the next couple years, or you're lucky enough to already have one that displays 24 fps, I would get the A30 player or a higher end model and make sure you buy a TV later that can display 24 fps. In the meantime, you can set the player to output 1080i/60 if your current TV does a better job of converting to 1080p/60 than the player does.
I think you'd want to get the cheaper A3 player only if your current TV can't display 1080p/24 and you don't plan on upgrading your TV within the next few years. On the other hand, if your TV ranks low on those charts for 1080p conversion, then the A30 may still do a better job for you. I guess the only real way to tell is to get an A30 and test how it looks on your TV using both 1080p output or 1080i output (which would let your TV handle the 1080p conversion).
Last edited by JediJones; 11-21-07 at 06:45 PM.
11-21-07, 08:05 PM
#31
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Price on the player is now $184.07. You can call Amazon and get a price adjustment ($11.96) for the difference. I just did it and it took only 2 minutes to get my Mastercard credited...
11-22-07, 11:35 AM
#34
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JediJones, while I agree with everything you say, I didn't want to get into the whole 1080p/24/72/120 thing because it is for videophiles who want and are willing to pay for the very best.
For most people, the plain old A3 will provide a superb picture that is much better than SD DVDs, even when well-upscaled. And for $184, plus a bunch of discs, it is a bargain. This is especially true for the many, many folks who have 768p displays.
Those who think that there will be a new display in their future that accepts a 1080p/24 input might, indeed, want to consider the A30, A35, or even the coming Onkyo player. But feeding a 1080i signal to a 1080p display that does de-interlacing correctly will give an outstanding picture, and I don't want that fact to get lost in the discussion.
For most people, the plain old A3 will provide a superb picture that is much better than SD DVDs, even when well-upscaled. And for $184, plus a bunch of discs, it is a bargain. This is especially true for the many, many folks who have 768p displays.
Those who think that there will be a new display in their future that accepts a 1080p/24 input might, indeed, want to consider the A30, A35, or even the coming Onkyo player. But feeding a 1080i signal to a 1080p display that does de-interlacing correctly will give an outstanding picture, and I don't want that fact to get lost in the discussion.
11-22-07, 12:11 PM
#35
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For people in the New England area, Bernies will have the A3 for $99.99 from 8 AM until Noon tomorrow. Here's a link to their site with the ad-
www.bernies.com
www.bernies.com
11-22-07, 12:47 PM
#39
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Ugh, yeah, I didn't notice I added one that wasn't sold by Amazon.com. I just clicked the big "Add to Shopping Cart" button like I always do, and they added the other one... Sorry for any confusion.
11-22-07, 01:14 PM
#42
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Amazon's cart is fucked for everyone on this deal. The free HD's aren't being discounted properly at all. I'm sure a quick e-mail would fix it, though.
11-22-07, 05:47 PM
#44
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Originally Posted by wewantflair
Amazon's cart is fucked for everyone on this deal. The free HD's aren't being discounted properly at all. I'm sure a quick e-mail would fix it, though.
11-22-07, 06:07 PM
#46
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^
It's likely that it will ship before that. I had a plasma TV in my cart that said that it would be in stock in 2 to 4 months. The very next day, it was back in stock.
It's likely that it will ship before that. I had a plasma TV in my cart that said that it would be in stock in 2 to 4 months. The very next day, it was back in stock.
11-22-07, 07:29 PM
#49
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Originally Posted by lizard
Those who think that there will be a new display in their future that accepts a 1080p/24 input might, indeed, want to consider the A30, A35, or even the coming Onkyo player. But feeding a 1080i signal to a 1080p display that does de-interlacing correctly will give an outstanding picture, and I don't want that fact to get lost in the discussion.
The links I originally posted should help people determine if their HDTV passes the deinterlacing test.
BTW, Amazon dropped prices on the higher end models too. $280 for the A30 and $360 for the A35.
11-22-07, 09:17 PM
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Originally Posted by JediJones
Hey, lizard, I appreciate you pointing that out. I only starting researching this issue this week because this will be my first HD (or Blu-Ray) player. So if anything I posted is off the mark I definitely want to hear other opinions. I'm not a videophile but I don't mind paying an extra $100 if it will get me better quality for years to come.
The links I originally posted should help people determine if their HDTV passes the deinterlacing test.
BTW, Amazon dropped prices on the higher end models too. $280 for the A30 and $360 for the A35.
The links I originally posted should help people determine if their HDTV passes the deinterlacing test.
BTW, Amazon dropped prices on the higher end models too. $280 for the A30 and $360 for the A35.