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Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
I do think it's a bit messed up that the movies (and cartoons)take so many cues from classic comic book stories and don't credit the creators. Like X Men 2 and God Loves Man Kills.
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Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
Originally Posted by The Valeyard
(Post 12467366)
I don't know if Ditko gets any royalties on his comics but he has said that he gets nothing from the Spider-Man movies even tho he's credited as co-creator.
I have also read (in Back Issue, IIRC) that Dikto left Marvel because he was pissed that he was not getting writing credit on Spider-Man and Dr. Strange, since all Stan was doing at that point was filling the word balloons. So there was a time when he had at least some desire for more credit, perhaps back before he completely fell into the Randian abyss. |
Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
True. That documentary also mentions how Ditko had an issue with how Stan worded his involvement as Spider-Man's co-creator - "I have always considered Steve Ditko to be Spider-Man’s co-creator." Steve did not like the word "considered."
http://i59.tinypic.com/mskgmq.gif |
Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
Part of the problem with early comics is one person comes up with the idea and another person fleshes out the look and design of the character. A lot of the Marvel characters were probably initially thought of by Stan, then he writes down the idea and the artist creates the visuals from the description. So I guess it depends on what you consider "created" to mean. Does it mean just the "idea" or also the "implementation" of the idea.
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Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
For Spider-Man, the story goes....
Stan had an idea for a teenaged hero named "Spider-Man." He pitched it to Jack Kirby who revamped his old Fly idea (while at Archie during the 50s) and drew up a few pages. Stan didn't like it and asked Ditko for his version of the idea. Ditko pretty much did everything else. |
Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
Originally Posted by majorjoe23
(Post 12467029)
I feel like if this was the case, Vertigo properties would have been taken advantage of a lot more. Y The Last Man has been in development hell for years, as was Preacher until the AMC series got moving. Sandman and Death have both been in "in the works" for about 20 years.
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Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
Originally Posted by John Pannozzi
(Post 12467630)
DC/WB doesn't own the movie/TV rights to Y the Last Man or Preacher. I think the rights to Vertigo titles vary on a case-by-case basis.
I think that the Vertigo contracts have become less favorable to creators in recent years, which is why we're seeing so few Vertigo titles from a-listers, with most of them taking their stuff to Image or Avatar. |
Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
I consider Ditko the true creator of Spider-Man as we know him, at least much more than Stan Lee.
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Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
That's why I don't like buying DC products. They screw over their artists and writers and as a result no one wants to create anything new for them, which is why we get "new" characters like Blue Beetle IV an Uncle Sam III. The company just regurgitates the same material on a monthly basis, with 20 different variations.
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Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
Originally Posted by PhantomStranger
(Post 12467778)
I consider Ditko the true creator of Spider-Man as we know him, at least much more than Stan Lee.
Originally Posted by brayzie
(Post 12467812)
That's why I don't like buying DC products. They screw over their artists and writers and as a result no one wants to create anything new for them, which is why we get "new" characters like Blue Beetle IV an Uncle Sam III. The company just regurgitates the same material on a monthly basis, with 20 different variations.
To be fair, Marvel does the exact same thing when it comes to creators and regurgitation. Look at Miles Morales (Ultimate Spider-Man II) or the female Thor. And Jack Kirby's heirs had to sue just to get his credit on the books, something Marvel should have done a long long time ago. The disrespect Marvel has shown to Jack Kirby lasted for decades. Not to mention all the other Marvel creators who weren't lucky enough to be Brian Michael Bendis. |
Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
I think Marvel knew that Kirby had a legitimate claim to a lot of their intellectual property as at least co-creator. Their lawyers probably told them over the decades to minimize Kirby's credit so it wouldn't be used against them in a lawsuit.
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Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
Originally Posted by The Valeyard
(Post 12467929)
To be fair, Marvel does the exact same thing when it comes to creators and regurgitation. Look at Miles Morales (Ultimate Spider-Man II) or the female Thor. And Jack Kirby's heirs had to sue just to get his credit on the books, something Marvel should have done a long long time ago. The disrespect Marvel has shown to Jack Kirby lasted for decades. Not to mention all the other Marvel creators who weren't lucky enough to be Brian Michael Bendis. But I still watch some of their movies so I'm going to stop that too. |
Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
Originally Posted by PhantomStranger
(Post 12467778)
I consider Ditko the true creator of Spider-Man as we know him, at least much more than Stan Lee.
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Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
Originally Posted by Spiderbite
(Post 12468799)
I don't necessarily disagree with you but it is said that Stan's idea was to make him a teenager with real world problems which is what really pushed that character into the stratosphere, at least popularity-wise, at the time.
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Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
Originally Posted by PhantomStranger
(Post 12467778)
I consider Ditko the true creator of Spider-Man as we know him, at least much more than Stan Lee.
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Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
Neil Adams chimes in: http://www.bleedingcool.com/2015/05/...-gerry-conway/
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Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
Just reed this article about the creator of Gordon's wife, used on Gotham. He states that the check is only like 45 an episode anyway, but they still wouldn't pay:
http://comicbastards.com/comics/77685/ Mark Waid on the topic of royalties, and also brings up Levitz: http://thrillbent.com/blog/how-dc-contracts-work/ |
Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
Roy Thomas recently stated this:
You've said you actually didn't want to create too many things for Marvel. Why was that? I knew I wouldn't own any of it. I accepted the work for hire, and as a result I didn't want to create characters that much because I knew I would get resentful if they ever made movies and TV shows and merchandising out of it that I didn't get money and credit for. I was never going to sue over it or anything like that, I just knew what I was doing when I did it, and I wasn't going to claim otherwise later. Even if you don't try, you have to make up a few heroes here and there, and you have to make up villains. You can't keep using the same characters all the time. |
Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
It's definitely why Marvel and DC haven't come up with a lot of new characters in the past twenty or thirty years.
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Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
Originally Posted by fujishig
(Post 12471009)
Just reed this article about the creator of Gordon's wife, used on Gotham. He states that the check is only like 45 an episode anyway, but they still wouldn't pay:
http://comicbastards.com/comics/77685/ Later on they were going to have a Vulcan engineer named Taurik who had been in another episode of TNG, but they changed it to his twin brother Vorik for the same reason. |
Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
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Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
Maybe reason for optimism, but I'll believe it when I hear it from the creators.
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Re: Gerry Conway on creators rights and DC's twisted logic.
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