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One & Only Harry Potter & the Deathly Hallows thread [possible spoilers - duh!]

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One & Only Harry Potter & the Deathly Hallows thread [possible spoilers - duh!]

Old 07-22-07, 08:36 PM
  #101  
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Originally Posted by the big train
I'm just thinking it would be stupid to cast different actors for the main characters. Radcliffe, Grint, Watson and Wright could never pass for people in their mid-thirties.
Makeup works fine. Winona Ryder was an old woman in Edward Scissorhands. She kind of pulled it off, so I see no reason those kids couldn't pull off a wee bit older than they will be at the end of the movie series.

By the time they finish the final movie, Radcliffe will be about legal drinking age in the U.S.
Old 07-22-07, 09:21 PM
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Just finished the book an hour or two ago, what a great ending.
Old 07-22-07, 10:19 PM
  #103  
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Originally Posted by neiname
Just finished the book an hour or two ago, what a great ending.
Agreed, very well done.

Spoiler:
Really marveled at how Dumbledore was playing the "long game". Really made the character grow for me.
Old 07-22-07, 10:40 PM
  #104  
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Originally Posted by the big train
The problem is that the aimless wandering had a point to it. This book, to me, seems so much more difficult to condense than any of those before it. I'd say Goblet of Fire was probably the hardest because it had the most action and most convoluted plot of any of the first six books. Order of the Phoenix was relatively easy because that had a LOT of stuff that was only meant to set the mood of the story. Half-Blood Prince is pretty straight forward and not overly long to begin with.

I think they'd probably want to cut most of the ramp-up to, and possibly the execution of, the raid on the Ministry.
I think what I'd do is just cut the raid on the ministry all together. They should just have Harry collect the real locket at the end of HBP. The RAB stuff is a little convoluted and not really necessary. Plus, given that they've decided to do the Lavender subplot in Prince that movie will already have enough on it's plate with it's five plots (Voldy/Horcruxes, Draco?/Snape?, Harry/Ginny, Who is the Half Blood Prince?, Ron/Hermoine). Adding the RAB stuff at the end is liable to frustrate audiences.

Originally Posted by the big train
But just think of all the high drama:
Spoiler:

Seven Harrys
Coup/wedding attack
Subsequent attempted capture
Raiding the ministry and narrow escape
"Bathilda Bagshot"
Discovering the sword
Mr. Lovegood
Capture/Malfoy Manor
Breaking into Gringotts
The tons of huge events that took place after Aberforth saved them...

Spoiler:
Exactly, there are plenty of action set pieces prior to the climax...the dragon sequence should be a "wow". Honestly in a tradional 3 act movie the end of the second act should probably be the death of Snape...that's like page 650.


Originally Posted by the big train
I was around page 500 and I couldn't believe how much stuff was happening in this thing. It's not like the other books when Harry spends tons of time in classes, which the movies can so easily eliminate.

I can't see how they'd include the epilogue in the movie, but I imagine a lot of people would be glad to see that cut.

Spoiler:
I'd cut the epilogue. The ending of the movie should be something like Harry greeting Ginny (they'll have to show a little more of this in the movie because she's hardly in the book beyond his thinking of her all the time...they have to firmly establish that a possible future with her is what Harry doesn't dare to dream about), then having him go off into the proverbial sunset with Ron/Hermoine. The trio should end the movie.


Originally Posted by the big train
Perhaps the most surprising thing, for me, about this book was how sad I felt when
Spoiler:
Dobby died.
I didn't even like him. Of course, Rowling made a point of pumping the scene full of emotion.
Spoiler:
That was the most emotional moment for me, and I never really cared all that much for Dobby either. He was only character who died who had a real "hero" moment. Malfoy Manor almost has to be in the movie, but I don't know how you can include Dobby. He hasn't been in a movie since COS (and I doubt he'll be in HBP), and there is no real way to reestablish him before he rescues Harry and the gang
Old 07-22-07, 11:15 PM
  #105  
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Possible [minor] plot mistake?

During the final battle, it is mentioned that Fenrir Greyback is attacking people as a werewolf and bit one student. However, Lupin was never mentioned as having transformed during the battle.
Old 07-22-07, 11:26 PM
  #106  
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Can anyone explain why Voldemort needed to fly to get places in this book instead of just apparating?

Thats the only thing that kinda bugged me....that and the very unneeded epilogue.
Old 07-22-07, 11:30 PM
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Spoiler:
I wouldn't be surprised if they did The Prince's Tale via legilimency like they did Snape's Worst Memory in the movie (amusing how they pretty much missed the point of that, eh?) so as to avoid the strangeness of Harry going off and spending half an hour in a pensieve.


It would better emphasize the eyes thing as well.


I don't know if Greyback actually was a werewolf when he attacked Lavender. He kinda always looks like one and he attacked Bill when he wasn't a werewolf.

I don't think Wizards can apparate between countries (and it's probably not a good idea to apparate that far anyway).

The possible mistake I noticed was when Rowle reported back that they had failed to capture Harry. Hadn't Hermione just obliviated him? I could be mistaken. Or maybe it's just that she wasn't good at it.

Last edited by the big train; 07-22-07 at 11:36 PM.
Old 07-23-07, 12:04 AM
  #108  
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Just finished it and really enjoyed it for the most point. Her incredible storytelling far outweighs her competent writing that sadly has grown only a little throughout the series. Snape is the stand out character yet again for me.

Spoiler:
The only stuff that made me tear up at all in this book was the stuff with Snape. When we find out it was his doe patronus, and that he may in fact have cared about Harry, just really struck me. Especially having already learned his fate. Then when we learn Albus Potter's middle name is Severus and exactly how Harry feels about the former Headmaster, I felt my eyes well.

Dobby's death, while said, didn't effect me much emotionally. And I was disappointed by a great many deaths in the book, not because I had a problem with those characters getting killed off, but by how Rowling presented them: Mad-eye's, Lupin's and Tonk's were off-screen, Fred's was confusing, Snape went out like a punk (but his memories are when it really hits anyway), etc.

I though the epilogue was pretty terrible outside of previously mentioned moment. It did not have to be told like a little story. That style worked against it. It was just information spewed out and constrained into a bunch of coincidences. It turned out terribly confusing with all this information being thrown around. I think it would have been better off as a summary, or even Harry just falling back in his memories of the past 19 years as he watched Albus go off to his first year at Hogwarts. Mix nostalgia with a view of the future and one achieves max poignancy.


Still a great book and fitting conclusion to the series.
Old 07-23-07, 12:37 AM
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I honestly wonder how much of Alan Rickman's portrayal in the movies has influenced how Snape ultimately turned out in the books.

I was disappointed in how some of the deaths were handled. A couple of them were mere footnotes, just a kind of "oh, by the way...this and this and this happened", almost as if she was rushing the story.

I felt that at least two of the characters deserved much more than that. The one that was dwelled upon may have ultimately helped in the plot as far as Harry convincing someone to help, but it was irritating to me that the death in question was handled almost reverently when compared to the others.

It even seemed as if Harry cared more for that death than for any of the others.

All in all, an enjoyable read. But bits of it seemed as rushed as the last movie.
Old 07-23-07, 01:54 AM
  #110  
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Originally Posted by mllefoo
I honestly wonder how much of Alan Rickman's portrayal in the movies has influenced how Snape ultimately turned out in the books.

I was disappointed in how some of the deaths were handled. A couple of them were mere footnotes, just a kind of "oh, by the way...this and this and this happened", almost as if she was rushing the story.

I felt that at least two of the characters deserved much more than that. The one that was dwelled upon may have ultimately helped in the plot as far as Harry convincing someone to help, but it was irritating to me that the death in question was handled almost reverently when compared to the others.

It even seemed as if Harry cared more for that death than for any of the others.

All in all, an enjoyable read. But bits of it seemed as rushed as the last movie.
Spoiler:
I think it's more of the timing of Dobby's death. Dobby died during a "break in the action". Lupin, Tonks, and Fred died during the middle of the battle. The book ends later that same night/next morning so we don't really see the aftermath (nor do we really spend time with the Weasley's as they are grieving in the battle break...as callous as it sounds Harry didn't have time to grieve then, he had to worry about winning). I do certainly agree that the Tonks and Lupin deaths specifically could have been handled better. It was almost like it was an afterthought to kill them (I assume they were the two characters that were added to the death list at the end...I also assume Hagrid was the one who got the last second reprieve.) Honestly, I figured at least Lupin would die as soon as Harry was named godfather. Given as pointless as Tonks' death was (Lupin at least got the walk in the forest with Harry) I would have preferred that she live; I don't see what it really added thematically.

As for Dobby being treated reverently...Dobby was as loyal a friend as Harry had in the entire series. He went to a place he never wanted to see again to possibly face people he never wanted to meet again risking his life to save Harry. It was the only truly heroic death that happened on page.

As for Rickman...I tend to think that Snape's ultimate allegiance was planned from the beginning. One thing is certain, the lawn scene at the end of HBP now becomes one of the most pivotal scenes in all the movies. Audiences will hate Snape at that point, his true intentions and motivations will almost have to be blatant in order to establish any kind of ambiguity.

My questions:
1) Given the ministry attacks on muggleborns, how was Colin Creevey at Hogwarts during the final battle? He wouldn't have been allowed in school during the year so unless he learned how to illegally apparate on his own (remember he's a 6th year so even if he was 17 he wouldn't have had the apparation classes at Hogwarts) and showed up like all the other kids in the RoR then he shouldn't have been there at all.

2) How was Snape in the headmaster's office discussing things with Dumbledore's portrait before the ministry fell? Dumbledore gives him the idea for the polyjuice Harrys, but at that point Snape was still a wanted man. He wouldn't have been allowed in the school.
Old 07-23-07, 06:37 AM
  #111  
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Old 07-23-07, 06:51 AM
  #112  
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Does anyone know how long the audiobooks are? Are Fry's and Dale's versions different in length? Are they both unabridged?
Old 07-23-07, 09:39 AM
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Finished reading this Saturday night. I was blown away. Like many, I became really really sad at a certain point, but, was very pleased.

In regards to re-introducing Dobby:

Spoiler:
I think they could easily bring in back in to HBP by having he and Kreacher tailing Malfoy like in the book. Introduce the fact that Kreacher is Harry's and that Dobby works in the kitchen, etc, and he can be available for book 7.
Old 07-23-07, 09:48 AM
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I'm curious...

Originally Posted by Sean O'Hara
Rowling ... said she decided to kill off two people that she'd originally intended to live, and let one live who was supposed to die.
Do we know who these three characters (two who died and the one who lived) are? Any educated guesses from the HP insiders and experts?
Old 07-23-07, 09:50 AM
  #115  
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Here's the question that's kind of stuck in my mind:

Spoiler:
With Tonks and Lupin dead, and basically no family left, and with Harry as godfather to the baby (Ted), who in the world raised the child?

It appears it has not been Harry and Ginny, but would there be anyone else left to do it? Did one of Tonks' parents survive??
Old 07-23-07, 09:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Big Boy Laroux
I definitely liked the book overall, but that epilogue was HORRIBLE. by far the worst chapter of any of the books.

Agreed 110%

My friend actually called me Sunday night to tell me to skip the Epilogue but I had just finished reading the book 20 minutes earlier.
Old 07-23-07, 10:04 AM
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Man a lot of hate on the epilogue.

I really REALLY liked it. Loved seeing the story "continued" albeit briefly. And I loved knowing for sure that everything worked out in the end for everyone.

Just a really touching way to end it, IMHO.
Old 07-23-07, 10:12 AM
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Originally Posted by TheAllPurposeNothing
Here's the question that's kind of stuck in my mind:

Spoiler:
With Tonks and Lupin dead, and basically no family left, and with Harry as godfather to the baby (Ted), who in the world raised the child?

It appears it has not been Harry and Ginny, but would there be anyone else left to do it? Did one of Tonks' parents survive??

Spoiler:
Tonks still had a family member alive. Tonk's left the baby with her mom, Andromeda. Her dad, Ted was killed because he wasn't pure-blood
Old 07-23-07, 10:12 AM
  #119  
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The problem with the epilogue is that it is very unneeded.

You don't need to be told Ginny and Harry will probably get together...thats been established already.

You don't need to know that Ron and Hermoine are getting together...thats established during their "moment" at Hogwarts.

Malfoy gets off waay to easy with the epilogue.

How original...let name our kids after my parents and my favorite professor...very cliched.

It's like Rowling didn't put any thought into it and just wrote it to not have the Potter fans rally with the Sopranos fans. The book should of ended with that last perfect chapter. Next time I read it...I will skip the epilogue.
Old 07-23-07, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by mwbmis
I think what I'd do is just cut the raid on the ministry all together. They should just have Harry collect the real locket at the end of HBP. The RAB stuff is a little convoluted and not really necessary.
They could still keep it in the last movie by moving the locket to Number Twelve Grimwald Place and say it was safely hidden by Kreacher on his original master's (RAB) orders. Harry just has to get it from him rather than visit the MoM. It changes the storyline presented in the book, but would shave a lot of time and remove extraneous locations.
Old 07-23-07, 10:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Draven
Man a lot of hate on the epilogue.

I really REALLY liked it. Loved seeing the story "continued" albeit briefly. And I loved knowing for sure that everything worked out in the end for everyone.

Just a really touching way to end it, IMHO.
I agree with you. I REALLY liked it too.

Last edited by shumway; 07-23-07 at 10:39 AM.
Old 07-23-07, 10:43 AM
  #122  
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Originally Posted by movieking
Does anyone know how long the audiobooks are? Are Fry's and Dale's versions different in length? Are they both unabridged?
The Jim Dale version of book seven is 17 discs and is unabridged. I haven't heard the Fry version of the books, but the Jim Dale versions of all the books are really great.
Old 07-23-07, 10:49 AM
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I liked the epilogue as it sums everything up nicley, provides closure and helps demonstrate exactly how Harry views Snape. I was a bit upset because it meant I was finishing one of the greatest stories ever told.
Old 07-23-07, 11:01 AM
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Originally Posted by mllefoo
I honestly wonder how much of Alan Rickman's portrayal in the movies has influenced how Snape ultimately turned out in the books.
My guess (as both a writer and a reader): very, very much. If you look at his tones and mannerisms in the earlier (pre-movie) books, and then read the last couple, there's a definite shift toward Rickman's treatment. There were a couple of lines in DH that I actually snickered at how spot-on they were to Rickman's (imagined) eventual delivery.

Originally Posted by mllefoo
I was disappointed in how some of the deaths were handled. A couple of them were mere footnotes, just a kind of "oh, by the way...this and this and this happened", almost as if she was rushing the story.

I felt that at least two of the characters deserved much more than that. The one that was dwelled upon may have ultimately helped in the plot as far as Harry convincing someone to help, but it was irritating to me that the death in question was handled almost reverently when compared to the others.

It even seemed as if Harry cared more for that death than for any of the others.
This is projecting somewhat, but I wonder if Rowling found herself, as a writer, unable to face those scenes emotionally. I've seen interviews where she confessed that one of the characters she had planned to kill off ended up surviving - I suspect that having those other significant deaths occur "off-screen" spared her much of the emotional cost...
Old 07-23-07, 11:05 AM
  #125  
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Originally Posted by Jeremy517
The Jim Dale version of book seven is 17 discs and is unabridged. I haven't heard the Fry version of the books, but the Jim Dale versions of all the books are really great.
The Fry version is advertised as unabridged.

I presume he reads more slowly as, from an ebay listing, the set is 20 CDs long.

Either that or they decided to have fewer minutes per CD on the UK version.

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