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juanmgonzalez
11-19-07, 10:22 AM
I found my wife's xmas present - 1 minute away from ordering the Sony Reader last night but decided not to at the last minute:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000FI73MA/ref=amb_link_5873612_2?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=gateway-center-column&pf_rd_r=02JW3GNGRK0BGKMMXFAB&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=329252801&pf_rd_i=507846


Product Overview

* Revolutionary electronic-paper display provides a sharp, high-resolution screen that looks and reads like real paper.
* Simple to use: no computer, no cables, no syncing.
* Wireless connectivity enables you to shop the Kindle Store directly from your Kindle—whether you’re in the back of a taxi, at the airport, or in bed.
* Buy a book and it is auto-delivered wirelessly in less than one minute.
* More than 88,000 books available, including 100 of 112 current New York Times® Best Sellers.
* New York Times® Best Sellers and all New Releases $9.99, unless marked otherwise.
* Free book samples. Download and read first chapters for free before you decide to buy.
* Top U.S. newspapers including The New York Times, Wall Street Journal, and Washington Post; top magazines including TIME, Atlantic Monthly, and Forbes—all auto-delivered wirelessly.
* Top international newspapers from France, Germany, and Ireland; Le Monde, Frankfurter Allgemeine, and The Irish Times.
* More than 250 top blogs from the worlds of business, technology, sports, entertainment, and politics, including BoingBoing, Slashdot, TechCrunch, ESPN's Bill Simmons, The Onion, Michelle Malkin, and The Huffington Post.
* Lighter and thinner than a typical paperback; weighs only 10.3 ounces.
* Holds over 200 titles.
* Long battery life. Leave wireless on and recharge approximately every other day. Turn wireless off and read for a week or more before recharging. Fully recharges in 2 hours.
* Unlike WiFi, Kindle utilizes the same high-speed data network (EVDO) as advanced cell phones—so you never have to locate a hotspot.
* No monthly wireless bills, service plans, or commitments—we take care of the wireless delivery so you can simply click, buy, and read.
* Includes free wireless access to the planet's most exhaustive and up-to-date encyclopedia—Wikipedia.org.
* Email your Word documents and pictures (.JPG, .GIF, .BMP, .PNG) to Kindle for easy on-the-go viewing.

Groucho
11-19-07, 10:33 AM
Looks pretty cool. But I want to read some customer reviews before I'd consider spending $$$ on this thing.

juanmgonzalez
11-19-07, 10:53 AM
Looks pretty cool. But I want to read some customer reviews before I'd consider spending $$$ on this thing.

True - I hated the fact on buying another Sony product and we buy so much from Amazon already. Our closet is looking like the Library of Congress with all of her books in there that we buy from Amazon.

I'm usually an early adopter on technology like this...

Goldberg74
11-19-07, 11:01 AM
Pretty sweet idea.

I'd like to test it out before committing that much money to it.

Tracer Bullet
11-19-07, 01:58 PM
I don't see the need for it. Any ebook reader has really tough competition, with a killer UI and experience- the book. If all I'm getting out the deal is the ability to carry 200 books around with me, I'll pass.

Flay
11-19-07, 07:11 PM
You know what this would be badass for?

College textbooks.

Tommy Ceez
11-19-07, 08:44 PM
You know what this would be badass for?

College textbooks.
I tend to really treat my paperbacks well and then never re-use them, but I highlight and bang the shit out of my textbooks

Im really flip flopping on this thing

No one I ever lend a book to actually reads them, and thier starting to take up alot of spots on the shelf....this could be a big plus for me....only problem, selling it through amazon makes it hard to get a HANDS ON

JohnSlider
11-19-07, 09:59 PM
I tend to really treat my paperbacks well and then never re-use them, but I highlight and bang the shit out of my textbooks

Im really flip flopping on this thing

No one I ever lend a book to actually reads them, and thier starting to take up alot of spots on the shelf....this could be a big plus for me....only problem, selling it through amazon makes it hard to get a HANDS ON

I didn't bother to read the features/watch the video, but a highlighting feature would be badass on this thing.

Drop
11-19-07, 10:00 PM
Seems really great, but the price is limiting. I am anticipating its (cheaper) successors a lot though. This is what will become of books it just makes sense.

You can d/l books directly to it, you can get subscriptions to international papers, it doesn't need a computer at all, and there's even a web browser. The only big drawback is the black and white nature of it.

I would love this if just for traveling (which I do enough for this to be a problem), I always take 5-10 books with me, no matter how long the vacation, because I never know exactly what I want to read. This would save a lot of space, and be so much more convenient.

Tommy Ceez
11-19-07, 10:20 PM
Seems really great, but the price is limiting. I am anticipating its (cheaper) successors a lot though. This is what will become of books it just makes sense.

You can d/l books directly to it, you can get subscriptions to international papers, it doesn't need a computer at all, and there's even a web browser. The only big drawback is the black and white nature of it.

I would love this if just for traveling (which I do enough for this to be a problem), I always take 5-10 books with me, no matter how long the vacation, because I never know exactly what I want to read. This would save a lot of space, and be so much more convenient.


But would you use this on the beach/pool?

Buckleyesque
11-20-07, 03:21 AM
1. I think the price on this will fall drastically in the coming months. There is no way they can sustain the $400 pricetag without making it a losing proposition

2. MOST people will NOT go for this. Its a hard sell. Real Books are one of the few artifacts that have survived through centuries - I don't think the Kindle is meant to replace them, but even I, who am not that conservative about technology, think that theres something un-charming about this device.

3. It looks very outdated and clunky from whatever pictures Amazon has put up on the website. Like something in a doctors' lab that he uses for medical transcription.

4. While I agree that carrying many books around on one device SOUNDS nice, is there really a need for it? Other than if you're getting an education and have college textbooks on it. I cant read more than one book at a time, and prefer seeing an already read book on my shelf rather than knowing its on my hard drive.

5. While I think there may be some sort of market for this, considering that this is the launch edition, its already tiring to think of the V1.1 and V3.2s that we're going to be seeing (haven't we learnt anything from Apple?).

Just a few thoughts...

DJLinus
11-20-07, 09:15 AM
:thumbsup: to all of Buckleyesque's points.

This looks like a nifty gadget, but my eyeballs spend way too much time staring at a screen (computer, TV) as it is. There's just something about holding a book, amassing a "library"...

I'm not saying that I will never get one of these. I'm just not in a rush to buy one anytime soon at the current price. I've come along on online newspapers, though (I still prefer the old school paper version, but...free is free).

RayChuang
11-20-07, 09:22 AM
Interesting idea, but too expensive.

What may drive e-book reader sales is the possibility that Apple's iPhone is almost there for an e-book reader. Increase the size slightly, put in a better quality display, and buy e-books through iTunes; the device could act as an e-book reader in addition to full iPhone functionality. :up:

WallyOPD
11-20-07, 09:45 AM
I'd consider picking one of these up at about half the price. A few questions I didn't see answered on the main product page (though I may have missed them). What happens when you reach capacity on the device? Is there any way to transfer books to your computer and then load them back on later? What happens to all of the books you've purchased if you break/lose your device and need to get a new one?

Tracer Bullet
11-20-07, 10:24 AM
What may drive e-book reader sales is the possibility that Apple's iPhone is almost there for an e-book reader. Increase the size slightly, put in a better quality display, and buy e-books through iTunes; the device could act as an e-book reader in addition to full iPhone functionality. :up:

It'll never happen. People will not abandon books for a backlit LCD screen. It's simply too hard on the eyes. That's why the Sony ebook reader and the Kindle both use eink.

Tracer Bullet
11-20-07, 10:25 AM
I'd consider picking one of these up at about half the price. A few questions I didn't see answered on the main product page (though I may have missed them). What happens when you reach capacity on the device? Is there any way to transfer books to your computer and then load them back on later? What happens to all of the books you've purchased if you break/lose your device and need to get a new one?

From what I understand you can store books on an SD card.

Drop
11-20-07, 12:18 PM
But would you use this on the beach/pool?

Most definitely.

I think this will replace books someday, the e-ink technology is not like looking at a screen at all, it's very similar to looking at piece of paper.

I think the device is the perfect size, about the size of your average book, any smaller and I wouldn't want it. I like the size of a page, not the size of an ipod touch screen.

If you run out of space, you can transfer them to a computer or delete them and download them whenever you please. Your purchases are all stored online, so should you lose it or upgrade to a better model you don't have to rebuy everything, just redownload it.

Groucho
11-20-07, 12:23 PM
You know what this would be badass for?

College textbooks.I heard an interview with the Amazon CEO on NPR yesterday, and they mentioned highlighting as a feature.

I could see this catching on with the college textbook industry. After all, their bread and butter is forcing people to buy new books each year at outrageous prices. This way they can offer a "discount" that keeps their profit margin intact, and still forces people to buy the new editions.

Tracer Bullet
11-20-07, 01:42 PM
I think this will replace books someday, the e-ink technology is not like looking at a screen at all, it's very similar to looking at piece of paper.

So I'm going to spend $400 for a device that is "very similiar" to reading off paper? Why? Unless I'm in college and have to lug around heavy textbooks, what advantage am I getting?

Groucho
11-20-07, 01:51 PM
So I'm going to spend $400 for a device that is "very similiar" to reading off paper? Why? Unless I'm in college and have to lug around heavy textbooks, what advantage am I getting?1. Up to 200 books on one device.

2. Daily newspapers

3. Done with your book? The ability to order a new one right from the device.

bryce0lynch
11-20-07, 01:53 PM
I can speak with respect to the Sony Reader (I think the Kindle is a POS)


I can read a trash paperback in less than 1 day, so on a multi-day excursion the ability to hold more than 1 book is nice. In addition, the availability of multiple book son the device makes it realistic to haul around a large number of short stories.

In addition, the electronic delivery of the books makes things very nice. The ability to go from 'I want this' to readying it is very short. No driving to the bookstore, or hoping that the bookstore has it, or waiting for the bookstore to order it.

Finally, it has reduced the clutter in my library a great deal. I can now store my books on my hard drive (properly backed up, of course) and no longer have overflowing shelves of books and piles scattered everywhere. My Analog/Asimov magazine subscriptions are great on my Reader.

The Kindle has problems. It looks terrible, it's has DRM out the wazoo, and you have to mail amazon to convert books, and wait awhile until the book is available.

E-ink is awesome; it's nothing like using an LCD.

I'm reading MUCH more in the last year thanks to my Reader.

Drop
11-20-07, 02:01 PM
Tracer Bullet, this device is obviously not for everyone yet. 400 dollars is a big hurdle.

Personally, I don't really have the room for anymore books. I previously stated when I travel I take 5 - 10 books with me (even if it's just for a weekend), because I never know exactly what I'm in the mood for. This takes more space than I would like.

When I am at home I have to dig through my shelf to find the books I want, and don't find some because they're misplaced.

But I really dislike reading books on a computer screen, I just can't get into them, so I'm not just going to d/l them, and certainly will not waste my paper and ink printing them. The e-ink screens are a huge improvement for reading.

Kindle also offers web surfing, direct downloads of 88,000 books (ranging from 1.99 to 9.99), plus subscriptions to U.S. and international newspapers and magazines (auto-delivered), Wikipedia access, a dictionary, and it's all in one small device, where I can hold 200 titles, and there's no service plans.

It's about convenience. That's all it is, that's all technology is, for some people Kindle isn't, for others it is. I fall into the latter category, but I will not be an early adopter, it needs to drop in price first. But in the future I will own a device like this, and even further than that, many people will.

RayChuang
11-21-07, 07:03 AM
It'll never happen. People will not abandon books for a backlit LCD screen. It's simply too hard on the eyes. That's why the Sony ebook reader and the Kindle both use eink.

I understand your concerns, but if you look at the display for the current iPod nano, it has very high pixel density for its display size, with surprisingly clear and readable text. Expand that pixel density to a full-screen device a tad larger than the iPhone (technologically possible within the next 2-3 years), and that makes it a very nice e-book reader.

The Bus
11-21-07, 08:26 AM
Interesting idea, but too expensive.

What may drive e-book reader sales is the possibility that Apple's iPhone is almost there for an e-book reader. Increase the size slightly, put in a better quality display, and buy e-books through iTunes; the device could act as an e-book reader in addition to full iPhone functionality. :up:

Do you read regular books that are the size of the iPhone?

bryce0lynch
11-21-07, 09:06 AM
I've seen several reviews of the Kindle that suggested that the iPhone or iPod would be a better reader. Those fanboys are smoking crack. Ages ago I used to read on a Palm, but it was NOT enjoyable at all, and the iPhone and iPod are going to be the same way. The new e-ink devices are much better than the LCD-based micro-sized devices.

Tracer Bullet
11-21-07, 10:37 AM
1. Up to 200 books on one device.

Not an advantage for me. I don't carry around multiple books.

2. Daily newspapers

Eh. Websites are fine for this.

3. Done with your book? The ability to order a new one right from the device.

For more than a paperback, DRMed to hell, and non-permanent. No thanks.

aintnosin
11-21-07, 12:56 PM
So I'm going to spend $400 for a device that is "very similiar" to reading off paper?
By the time these are commonplace A) they will not be $400 and B) they will be much closer to reading off paper than they are now.

juanmgonzalez
11-21-07, 05:11 PM
I received my wife's Kindle yesterday and she's already started buying books in Kindle format and will likely start using it full time starting tonight.

All I see is complaints here and there concerning this, and most of you have not even held the device!

The purpose for us is to minimize storage space by not having physical books.

My wife usually carries 2-3 books with her most of the time and this is exactly what we need.

I'll snap some pics later of the device if anyone is interested

boredsilly
11-21-07, 11:34 PM
Having seen it in action, can you give any instant impressions of the thing? I don't see myself ever switching over entirely to an ebook reader (I just love the feel of a book in my hand too much), but I am interested in how this works.

Drop
11-22-07, 11:45 AM
For more than a paperback, DRMed to hell, and non-permanent. No thanks.

I don't understand the DRM arguement. They have to make money. People would just copy them over and over, that isn't fair. You can't just copy a whole book and give it to your friend, why should you be able to do the same just because it's digital?

And it is permanent in a way. Your book will always been in the Amazon database, so if you lose your kindle or upgrade you do not have to pay for the books again.

And the prices range from 1.99 to 9.99, I wouldn't call that more than a new paperback.

This device is not for you Tracer, but there is a (growing) market out there. As proven by the device being sold out.

Tracer Bullet
11-22-07, 12:50 PM
I don't understand the DRM arguement. They have to make money. People would just copy them over and over, that isn't fair. You can't just copy a whole book and give it to your friend, why should you be able to do the same just because it's digital?

So what? Piracy is going to be rampant anyway. DRM causes problems for legitimate users and doesn't affect pirates at all. I guarantee you these Kindle books will be pirated.

Dusty Bottoms
11-22-07, 01:03 PM
For those of you using an e-book reader, where do you use them? There just seem to be a lot of places where it would seem less convenient to me than a regular book. When you are flying, I assume you can't turn these things on during take-off or landing. I like being able to open up a book as soon as I find my seat on a plane. Also, there are just some places I'm probably not going to feel comfortable taking a $400 device unless I'm going to be able to watch over it all the time.

I agree that there needs to be a way to prevent illegal copying, but I hate giving up the option of loaning, giving away, or selling books that I've purchased if I decide I don't want them. That seems to be the biggest problem with the DRM. Unless I'm missing something, I'm not sure how you would be able to do any of these with the Kindle.

I wouldn't rule out owning some type of e-book reader in the future, and I understand some of the reasons why others may be excited about them. I just can't imagine them replacing regular books for me.

boredsilly
11-23-07, 05:51 AM
I agree that there needs to be a way to prevent illegal copying, but I hate giving up the option of loaning, giving away, or selling books that I've purchased if I decide I don't want them. That seems to be the biggest problem with the DRM. Unless I'm missing something, I'm not sure how you would be able to do any of these with the Kindle.

That isn't so much a problem with the DRM as it is just a condition to consuming digital media. You can't sell the albums you buy off of iTunes or videogames you download from a digital distribution services (with a few exceptions) when you're through with them. In that regard, Amazon's ebook service is falling right in line.

Buckleyesque
11-23-07, 06:04 AM
I must say - when I travel I like to read an actual book. Many times they don't let you turn on your electronic devices at various points of the whole airline boarding procedure. Thats why a book is still the safest, nicest and easiest way to pass ones' time while traveling. I choose a book over an Ipod, because an Ipod is obviously an electronic device and I need to turn it on/off depending on the stewardess' commands. A Book bypasses ALL of the above - you can enjoy it anywhere.

The Kindle won't work in the above scenario for me, and I can only imagine by 2015 how many of these gadgets we're supposed to be carrying around (Blackberry, Iphone, Ipod, Laptop, Kindle - all a bit much)

Dusty Bottoms
11-23-07, 10:13 AM
That isn't so much a problem with the DRM as it is just a condition to consuming digital media. You can't sell the albums you buy off of iTunes or videogames you download from a digital distribution services (with a few exceptions) when you're through with them. In that regard, Amazon's ebook service is falling right in line.

This is true. It's one of the reasons that I still prefer buying a physical CD over using iTunes unless I'm just looking for a specific song. Most of the time, there is not enough incentive, financial or otherwise, for me to give up the benefits of physical media.

The comparison to digital music is a good one, and I was thinking about it after my last post. At least with an iPod or other MP3 player, consumers have the option of purchasing a physical CD and using a computer to put their music on the digital player at no extra charge. With a Kindle, if I want to have access to my exisiting library, I have to buy the books a second time.

One of the Amazon reviewers mentioned that Amazon should give a free or discounted Kindle version of the book to anyone who purchases a physical edition from them. I understand why Amazon and publishers wouldn't want to do this though.

Having said all that, I watched the demonstration video on Amazon last night and spent a little more time reading about the Kindle. It has some features I like. I wouldn't mind playing around with one, but not at that price.

Drop
11-23-07, 02:11 PM
I can only imagine by 2015 how many of these gadgets we're supposed to be carrying around (Blackberry, Iphone, Ipod, Laptop, Kindle - all a bit much)

Most of those will just be one item, so it won't be an issue (some all ready are). Plus adding kindle there is irrelevant, you'd still be caring around a book, which could be heavier and/or bulkier.

The only time I was told on plane or boarding not to use my electronic device was when I didn't want to use it anyway, take offs and landings.

I see no reason in the future that buying a physical copy won't have a digital version come free. And by then it would be economically sensible.

Why do so many people not understand that things change and evolve. Some of things people are saying is like 30 years ago people going, "I'm gunna need a computer and a TV and a record player and a cassete player, plus a videogame system in my house, well that's too much clutter, who would want all that?"

Technology has always been about convenience, but at first they have a certain degree of inconvenience, but they become refined and combined.

If there weren't a ton of cons to the present Kindle I'd be shocked.

Nick Danger
11-23-07, 09:10 PM
It has possibilities. But I love paper. Paper is easy to read, it boots up and goes straight to my page in under two seconds, and I can lend it to someone.

The last three books I've read were two loaners and a used $0.50 paperback. The Kindle is trying to prevent people from doing that.

kurupt
11-24-07, 08:11 AM
I agree with most people on here in the regard that I love the feel of an actual book in my hands, but the instant digital delivery appeals to my laziness too. There's no way that I'm going to pay $400, but if it were to drop a couple hundred (and I'd be willing to bet that within a year or two there will be drastic price drops), I'd probably pick one up. I think that if this model becomes standard on college campuses (and I don't see why it wouldn't one day), the book binding industry would take a huge hit.

bloopbleep
11-24-07, 08:50 AM
I received my wife's Kindle yesterday and she's already started buying books in Kindle format and will likely start using it full time starting tonight.

All I see is complaints here and there concerning this, and most of you have not even held the device!

The purpose for us is to minimize storage space by not having physical books.

My wife usually carries 2-3 books with her most of the time and this is exactly what we need.

I'll snap some pics later of the device if anyone is interestedyes I would expect lots of interest.
also people are afraid of change, just like now people are complaining that Marvel Comics jumps into the digital age.it`s called progress. maybe we should go back to the Pony Express lol.

davidh777
11-24-07, 01:47 PM
I'm tempted by this.

My wife takes four or five books on vacation, and also goes from here to there on appointments. Is the screen durable enough to ride around in a purse all the time?

innocentfreak
11-24-07, 10:53 PM
I would consider it, but a strong selling point for me would be if I buy a physical book from Amazon I get the kindle version for free. This way you get the best of both worlds.

Jay G.
11-24-07, 10:57 PM
Is the screen durable enough to ride around in a purse all the time?
The Kindle comes with what they call a "book cover," essentially a little carrying case with a front cover that flips open, similar to that for Palm or other handheld devices.

davidh777
11-24-07, 11:40 PM
The Kindle comes with what they call a "book cover," essentially a little carrying case with a front cover that flips open, similar to that for Palm or other handheld devices.

Interesting, thanks

maingon
11-26-07, 12:28 PM
its cool but looks outdated already. PLus the screen looks outdated, It cant produce color images either, so what would it be like looking at magazines etc.

Aaron Campagnone
11-26-07, 04:15 PM
Here is my 2 cents on the whole ebook thing and the kindle specifically...

I switched over to almost exclusively ebooks about 4 years ago. I read mainly sci fi, fantasy, military fiction and mystery. I have had little trouble finding LEGAL versions of the books i want, and those I can't I buy the dead tree version, and find a slightly less kosher ebook version (i really do believe in paying the author for the books i read!). I have even had a few cases where I have inquired as to ebook versions from particular authors (who have web pages) and received what I assume are personal word documents from the author since they do not have ebook versions of the books I was looking for. (to be honest, this was a single author, who I had had a lively discussion with in a forum, so it was not that out of the blue!!)

I read on my PALM TREO phone. Someone above mentioned all the electronic items they have to carry, but having a separate gadget for each activity seems pointless to me. My Treo covers books, music, light web surfing, email, and phone. There are many other devices that can do all of that as well. Add a laptop to that and I can not thing of any other electronic items I need.
As far as the use of an electronic reader on a plane, I have never had trouble with my Treo outside of the actual take off and landing. For those 10-15 minutes, I either sleep, or if I am really bored read the inflight mags.

I think the downfall of the Kindle will be that it is a single purpose device. I have played with the Sony ereader in person and did not like its size. One of the best things about the treo is i can pull it out and read ANYWHERE!!! In line at the store, sitting in a meeting, on the john, etc. It fits in my pocket, and it goes everywhere with me. Yes, the screen is slightly smaller that I would like, but I am a very fast reader. I can read a normal pulp paperback...think "mens adventure" or your typical dungeons and dragons novel from 10 years ago (fluff books!!) in a 2 day span. I typically read 2-3 books in a given week, depending on how good it is. (if its good, I will find myself reading at every spare moment). I have never had an issue with back-lit screens and actually really enjoy the fact that I can read in the dark with no issues, or read at the pool on summer afternoon on the same device!!!

Rather than new reading devices, I would rather see some standards come to ebooks, as well as less DRM, or at least more platform independent DRM so I can choose what I want to read on. I like MOBIPOCKET, since I can take almost any plain text, word, or htm document and create my own mobi version with cover art etc.

Well, just my $0.02

DRG
11-27-07, 05:27 PM
Pros
- I love the idea of the incorporated dictionary and Wikipedia support.

Cons
- I love the idea of e-ink, but I wish there was an option to switch it to backlight if it got dark.
- The lack of flexibility in data conversion... it sounds like you have to run everything through Amazon's site to convert. I'd prefer a standalone app and just to transfer via SD card.
- The wireless mode is cool, but I wish there was a cheaper option without it, because I'm waaay out of the coverage area. The nearest spot I can even pick up the EVDO is a 4 hour drive away.

Jay G.
11-27-07, 08:51 PM
- I love the idea of e-ink, but I wish there was an option to switch it to backlight if it got dark.
The idea of e-ink is that it's as reflective as regular paper, making it as easy to read in normal light conditions. A backlight wouldn't work very well, think of trying to read a piece of paper lit from behind. I would think a standard booklight might work well with it though. Also, a backlight would eat up the battery time very quickly, not making it feasible as an e-book reader for many.

- The lack of flexibility in data conversion... it sounds like you have to run everything through Amazon's site to convert. I'd prefer a standalone app and just to transfer via SD card.
There already is a standalone app that you can use to convert, it's called Mobipocket Creator:
http://www.mobipocket.com/en/DownloadSoft/ProductDetailsCreator.asp

I believe you can transfer to the Kindle via USB.

DJLinus
11-28-07, 12:37 PM
Slate magazine's review: http://www.slate.com/id/2178594/nav/tap3/

If you go by the wisdom of the blogs, however, the Kindle is less the iPod of books than the Apple IIc of books. Early adopters have groused about the oversized PREV PAGE and NEXT PAGE buttons, which make it tough to pick up the device without accidentally paging through the book you're reading. They've also sneered at Amazon's copy protection, which is so crippling that you can't even buy an e-book for a Kindle-owning pal.

My first six days with the Amazonian e-reader have confirmed that these criticisms are on target. I'd be startled if, at least in the pricey gizmo's initial incarnation, this is the product that gives e-books iPod-like ubiquity. Still, unless Amazon caves quickly, it will probably be the closest thing to a mainstream e-reader yet. For everything Kindle isn't, it remains the best attempt so far at making e-books make sense. To borrow the famous left-handed compliment that Alan Kay gave the original Macintosh, it's the first e-book reader that's good enough to criticize.

I didn't realize that you had to pay for newspaper, magazine, and blog access on the Kindle.

Jay G.
11-28-07, 11:34 PM
I didn't realize that you had to pay for newspaper, magazine, and blog access on the Kindle.
The pay subscriptions for newspapers and magazines really isn't surprising, as these are designed to replace people's paper subscriptions, not online access. The prices for blogs are likely just enough to cover the cost of transmitting them to the Kindle automatically. As the Slate article points out, the Kindle does have rudimentary web access, so the blog subscriptions are a case of paying for convenience.

I really don't see the DRM being as big an issue as people are playing it out to be. Sure, you can't "buy a Kindle book for a friend," but you can't buy an album download for a friend on iTunes either, although you can get a gift certificate for either.

Tracer Bullet
12-02-07, 05:37 PM
I really don't see the DRM being as big an issue as people are playing it out to be. Sure, you can't "buy a Kindle book for a friend," but you can't buy an album download for a friend on iTunes either, although you can get a gift certificate for either.

Sure you can, if they're iTunes Plus. There are also other DRM-free music options such as... Amazon.

Jay G.
12-02-07, 05:52 PM
Sure you can, if they're iTunes Plus.
iTunes Plus is a relatively new development, the iTunes store was already incredibly popular with its restrictive DRM for years before that. That was my point: that the DRM isn't really an issue in regards to the Kindle gaining iPod-like ubiquity.

Tracer Bullet
12-03-07, 10:15 AM
iTunes Plus is a relatively new development, the iTunes store was already incredibly popular with its restrictive DRM for years before that. That was my point: that the DRM isn't really an issue in regards to the Kindle gaining iPod-like ubiquity.

If this were five years ago, I'd agree with you.

Jay G.
12-03-07, 10:27 AM
If this were five years ago, I'd agree with you.
Why's that?

Tracer Bullet
12-03-07, 03:22 PM
Why's that?

The trend is to move away from DRM. This isn't five years ago when all digital content had it.

Pointyskull
12-04-07, 09:45 AM
Kindle: Amazon's New Wireless Reading Device

Isn't a book already a "wireless reading device"?


I do like the idea of being able to store 200 books, but I think I prefer the heft weight, texture of one single, solitary book to this device. And I don't need to spend $400 on it, either.

orderandlaw
12-05-07, 11:30 AM
Interesting idea, but what happens to those people who finish their 200 books. Do they lose what they pay for (by deleting them) and then can't read them after they go for more?

aintnosin
12-05-07, 04:46 PM
Interesting idea, but what happens to those people who finish their 200 books. Do they lose what they pay for (by deleting them) and then can't read them after they go for more?
You can always download a deleted book again (unless, of course, Amazon goes out of business).

darkside
12-05-07, 06:16 PM
I've been a fan of ebooks for nearly a decade. I've read hundreds of books on my PDA and laptop. Most of those newer releases I paid for and not just public domain free books. I like the idea of eink screens, but honestly the prices Sony and Amazon charge just turn me off. I don't mind ebooks as an added feature to a device I'm already using, but to pay $300 - $400 just to read ebooks is insane.

The DRM is also a pain in the ass if you want new releases. I had hoped that since Amazon owns Mobipocket all of my ebooks I have purchased would work on the Kindle, but Amazon decided to use a different DRM for the Kindle.

I'm one of the few people in the world that would actually want an ebook reader, but they keep driving me away with high hardware prices and DRM. One of the reasons I bought books in the Mobipocket and eReader format was the large number of devices they work with. Palm, Windows, Mac, Blackberry and Sybian. However, these new dedicated devices have to have their own DRM and who wants to tie up a large library in something that only works on a single device? Sony or Amazon stop making their devices and you have books that are basically useless when your device finally craps out.

They need to either drop DRM or come up with a universal ebook standard that works in all devices.

drmoze
12-09-07, 02:57 AM
Some comments (Disclaimer--I own a Sony Reader):

1) e-Ink display is awesome. I like real books (and spend too much time on a computer screen). e-Ink looks like a real book, with a slightly lower contrast in dimmer light, which is easier on the eyes than any lcd display. Personally, I think anyone who reads books regularly on a Treo or the like is setting themselves up for major eye strain.

2) Best resource for these ebook devices is www.mobileread.com . Great discussions on all devices, format conversion utilities, hacks, free book uploads, etc.

3) Personally, I think the Kindle looks clunky, and have not wanted wifi or direct download capability on my Sony Reader (which has the same display). The Kindle also loses in battery life because of the extra features.

4) There are tons of free/cheap book resources out there. (See forum above.) Plus silkpagoda.com has a dvd with 10,000 books (some are stories, but it has all the classics) in native format for $10. Baen books has some free sci-fi. Lots more out there. That alone justifies (to me) the price of an excellent ebook device.

5) These devices are more like a book than you might think. (No ipod or treo comes close.) The display is about the size of a paperback, and is reflective like a real book. Battery life is great (Sony - just about 2 weeks with fairly regular daily reading.) Just bring it along on a trip or vacation or commute--recharging is rare, unlike most other electronics. And bringing 20-30 books along to suit your mood is easy. (OK, you can fit a lot more, plus memory cards are an option for even more storage.)

6) After having a Sony for a few months now,I can say it feels more like reading a book. I never got that 'reading' experience from any computer or phone display. So for those who read and enjoy real (i.e., paper) books, an e-ink device is worth a look imo. (I realize many people these days do almost all their reading on computer screens and never sit down with paper and ink. But even they might find the e-Ink easier to read.)

[Update] Just thought of number 7) Some people here say they like regular, paper books, so why go electronic? I love books, and have a ton of shelves full of them. But, I can take my Sony Reader into the steamroom with me. (In a ziplock bag.) Works perfectly. Could never do that with a paper book. And I love reading in the steamroom now! (It's in our guest bathroom, btw.)

Deke Rivers
01-22-08, 11:29 AM
its also perfect for those with limited shelf space that do not hold on to books after reading them

Scarecrow
01-30-08, 11:13 AM
Some comments (Disclaimer--I own a Sony Reader):
Me too & I love it so far (after about 90 books).


1) e-Ink display is awesome. I like real books (and spend too much time on a computer screen). e-Ink looks like a real book, with a slightly lower contrast in dimmer light, which is easier on the eyes than any lcd display. Personally, I think anyone who reads books regularly on a Treo or the like is setting themselves up for major eye strain.
e-Ink is great. I did a little with ebooks on my Treo before getting the Sony & it was fine for a quick 15 min. time killer, but for longer reading my eyes didn't like it at all.


2) Best resource for these ebook devices is www.mobileread.com . Great discussions on all devices, format conversion utilities, hacks, free book uploads, etc.
Definitely the place to be if you're interested in these devices.



These devices certainly aren't for everyone (heck most people don't read, or don't read enough books to care), but they certainly fill a growing niche. Book availability is getting better & better, but there are still tons of things that unfortunately aren't available in e-format.

DRM stinks, but thanks to certain tools I can buy MS Reader versions of the books I want & easily break the DRM & convert them to Sony's format.

GatorDeb
01-30-08, 08:03 PM
I have a Kindle so if anyone has any questions, ask :)

ceeece
01-31-08, 11:24 AM
I have a Kindle so if anyone has any questions, ask :)

Do you get the same warm, cozy feeling using the kindle as you do when holding a book?

RayChuang
01-31-08, 12:55 PM
Amazon Buying Audible.com for $300M
Associated Press via MyWay.com
January 31, 2008

Read the full article here (http://apnews.myway.com//article/20080131/D8UGVHC00.html)

NEW YORK (AP) - Internet retailer Amazon.com Inc. (AMZN) said Thursday it will buy online audiobook provider Audible Inc. (ADBL) to expand its reach in digital audio content.

Amazon expects the deal, valued at about $300 million, will help bring to a broader audience Audible.com's more than 80,000 programs, which include audiobooks and spoken-word audio content from news outlets such as The New York Times and The New Yorker.

You have to wonder once Amazon.com owns Audible.com, will this mean that when you buy an e-book for the Kindle you will also get the audiobook version for only a small price premium? Does this preview a second-generation Kindle that includes full audiobook support where you can plug in a headphone to listen to the audio book?

GatorDeb
01-31-08, 07:13 PM
Do you get the same warm, cozy feeling using the kindle as you do when holding a book?
I never get a warm, cozy feeling from a book, I get it from soft covers and hot chocolate :D

drmoze
02-10-08, 08:29 PM
Do you get the same warm, cozy feeling using the kindle as you do when holding a book?

Dunno about 'warm' but I get the same comfortable reading experience that I do with a paperback on my Reader. And NO active display (lcd/led/etc.) comes close to being book-like. Whoever said they liked reading *books* on their *Treo* is nuts IMO. The Reader/Kindle displays are very booklike. And a simple booklight takes care of dark places, just like a real book. The Treo (or any other pda) has a tiny backlit display that is not good for the eyes long-term. As for size, the Kindle/Reader is slightly larger than a paperback but thinner, and holds dozens if not hundreds of books.

Of course, these devices are for people who like to read books. If you can't imagine why anyone would want a device with no color display, no web browsing capability, no animations, etc. (which is a majority of the younger generation, I suspect), then these electronic books are clearly not for you. For those of us who can appreciate a good book (or several), these are awesome gadgets. My leisure reading has probably more than doubled since I got my Reader back in August.

al_bundy
02-10-08, 09:38 PM
when you get a free book reader with an Ipod or a cell phone is when i'll have one

no way i'm paying $400 just to pay more for books and carry around another device

Ranger
02-10-08, 10:21 PM
It has possibilities. But I love paper. Paper is easy to read, it boots up and goes straight to my page in under two seconds, and I can lend it to someone.

The last three books I've read were two loaners and a used $0.50 paperback. The Kindle is trying to prevent people from doing that.
Yes, one of the best things about reading a paperback is getting away from the computer or some electronic gadget.

I think it's a great idea for some magazines and newspapers, but not for an entire book. If the e-reader had video/tv out for presentations, the price would seem more reasonable.

drmoze
02-10-08, 11:46 PM
Have you even used one? It is completely comfortable and book-like for reading, unlike any active display. I've read thousands of (paper) books in my lifetime, and can tell the difference. And these devices fell more like a book than a 'device' -- you mostly turn pages and read, occasionally switch books via a menu. And the Reader does start up in a second or 2, right where you left off. One button push takes you to a menu of bookmarks which you can set in each book you're reading, and one more button punch takes you to the page you bookmarked in any book.

It's like a book in terms of reading comfort (something a computer or pda is *not*), and there are tons of great free books available from many sources.

ds6161
02-11-08, 12:38 AM
I read somewhere that someone is developing one that has two screens and opens just like a book..
I'll wait for that & a lower $$ like $150.. $400 is just for the "got to have" it group

drmoze
02-11-08, 01:37 PM
I read somewhere that someone is developing one that has two screens and opens just like a book..
I'll wait for that & a lower $$ like $150.. $400 is just for the "got to have" it group

Actually, the Sony Reader (new model) is $300, and you can find the older model for $200. (I read that Costco has some for sale.) I picked up my reader for $60 as part of a Sony Style deal when I signed up for a credit card. Personally, I would rather have the thinner profile and longer battery life (plus cheaper price) of the Reader than Amazon's Kindle. With 50+ books on my Reader, I really do not need wifi at all.

The priciness is due to the costly e-ink displays, which are also what makes it such a great device for reading. They will probably get cheaper soon, but who knows how much the cost will come down. I agree they're expensive for the typical consumer, but for people who love to read, the convenience, comfort and huge amount fo fre books available makes it worthwhile. (Check the $10 DVD with 10,000+ books in Reader format available at silkpagoda.com, the Baen library, and manybooks.net for examples. Reading these e-books on an active display just doesn't cut it--bad enough I have to use a computer screen all day at work to work on documents! Reading novels on a computer screen would fry my retinas.)

A 2-display model would be cool, although almost twice as costly to make, larger, and redundant. One screen 'works' just fine, with page 'turns.' You only read one page at a time anyway. Although sometimes with the new 505 model (which pivots at the hinge in the supplied cover), I start to physically 'page turn' the device in the cover!

jack999
02-29-08, 06:45 PM
I like the idea of electronic paper and reading a book this way. Though I've never seen one, I believe the posters who say e-ink is very much like paper. I've two problems with these devices. The first is the price. It's got to come down to $100 or even less. Second, if I get one, what the heck do I do with all the paperbacks I've got that I've never read? I know some would be free, but most, I'd have to buy again. I've already replaced VHS tapes with DVDs, now when I go Blu, I'll be replacing DVDs. Now books....aaarrgh!:)

Lastyear
02-29-08, 08:44 PM
I read 2 to 4 books every week.A friend of mine has a kindle and I gave it a try.Hated it.Just does not feel right to me.Just does not feel comfortable to me.Give me paper .It feels more intimate..I've also never been able to read books off a computer screen.

The Bus
03-06-08, 09:37 AM
I would buy Kindle just for its always-on Wikipedia feature. That alone is worth something to me.

Not $400 though.

drmoze
03-07-08, 01:28 PM
If you want Wikipedia access, a decent cell phone/pda with browser would be better. The main reason for getting a more expensive e-ink display device is if you'll be reading longer texts. It's great for books, not good for 'browsing.'

Jay G.
03-07-08, 08:30 PM
If you want Wikipedia access, a decent cell phone/pda with browser would be better.
A cell phone/pda would require either a free wifi access point, or a per-month data charge on their cell account (if they have one). The Kindle's data access is always free, which is what I think he meant by "always on."

xraybies
04-03-08, 10:09 PM
I've read ebooks on every device I have, desktops, laptops, Pocket PC's. I love the convenience of having a ton of books at my disposal depending on my whim at the moment. I wouldn't buy the current readers due to price but when they come down I'd probably snap one up. I think all this "soft and fuzzy" feeling from touching paper is kind of silly, if you feel the need to touch paper while you're reading an ebook just keep a token book nearby and fondle it whenever you get the urge.

bloopbleep
04-07-08, 08:14 PM
when was the last time Amazon had them in stock? I actually am thinking of getting one when I get my stimulas rebate.

davidh777
04-24-08, 12:35 AM
Looks like they're in stock now. Considering it....

Deke Rivers
04-29-08, 08:41 AM
I like mine..as long as you use it as its intended (a book reader) you wont be disappointed.

The Bus
04-30-08, 03:18 PM
<img src="http://g-ecx.images-amazon.com/images/G/01/digital/kindle/letters/jeff-letter._V257953935_.png">

<a href="http://g-ecx.images-amazon.com/images/G/01/digital/fiona/general/2007letter.pdf">Letter to Shareholders</a>

Looks like it is "permanently" in stock now. This needs to be cheaper than $399 though.

CloverClover
05-17-08, 06:53 PM
I recently bought a kindle, it is okay, I wish the screen was better for images and in color (to view comics / graphic novels) and it doesn't have a night reading option... but overall I will probably keep it. I was surprised that it has a web browser and not just wikipedia, I didn't know it had free internet so that was definitely nice.

Mitchforth
05-21-08, 02:13 PM
I've been playing with one of these for a few days. I think the most valid complaint about it is the design decision on the page turn buttons. Because they are so big, there's no way to grip the device by the side of the frame without accidentally turning the page.

This could be fixed, however, with a firmware option that locks the page button unless you hold down the "alt" key when you press it, similar to the hibernate feature.

The lack of color or animation on the screen is definitely a worthwhile sacrifice for the e-ink display. For those who don't fully understand what this is, the screen seems to "print" the text and then switch off. There's no flickering, there's no light shining in your eyes. It's very much like reading a book.

The ability to change the font size is also really nice, and this thing is probably easier to read on at the gym than a regular book, especially since it's difficult to turn pages and keep your place on a cardio machine.

Also, the library is constantly upgraded. I wanted to read a book that came out in hardcover immediately, and it was on kindle shortly after midnight on the release day.

kaze0
05-23-08, 01:27 PM
Theres definate issues with the page turn buttons, but honestly I'd rather have the buttons the way they are instead of having less accessable buttons. With the cover on and folded back i can perfectly hold the kindle.

ds6161
06-12-08, 09:28 AM
I recently bought a kindle, it is okay, I wish the screen was better for images and in color (to view comics / graphic novels) and it doesn't have a night reading option... but overall I will probably keep it. I was surprised that it has a web browser and not just wikipedia, I didn't know it had free internet so that was definitely nice.

CloverClover how does the web browser work? Other than Java & moving ad's does it display normal web pages?

I mainly visit web forums just like dvd talk, can you login and use like normal?
Thankz for any info..

otto24
07-21-08, 05:34 AM
The kindle looks good but there are so many sites out there i never know which one to go for. I buy second hand books ofebay (http://www.ebay.com/) too and sells student books (http://www.sellstudentstuff.com/) , hitflip (http://www.hitflip.at/books/)(for swapping) as well as online bookshops like blackwells (which are some cheaper than specific online stores). Its good as a travel around a lot so just need to find the right stores depending on where i am located. Although it doesnt help when i lug an entire suitcase of books back home!

drmoze
07-24-08, 10:21 PM
I have a Sony Reader (not a Kindle--same screen and basic idea though). I have a little over 100 books on it as my current 'to read' list, and the internal memory isn't even full. It's great for so many situations, like quick reads while commuting by subway, weekend trips, a recent stay in the hospital, etc. Always a lot of reading options at my fingertips (novels, short stories, various genres) and a charge lasts 2-3 weeks so no need to deal with a charger and plugging it in all the time. It acts more like a real book, with instant on from sleep mode. Been doing a lot more leisure reading since I got it. (And I already have tons of stuffed bookshelves.) It's nice to go on a trip or pass a bookstore and not even be tempted to buy more books! I occasionally surf a few sites or visit the e-book stores to see if anything catches my fancy. I've found tons of free ebooks (both recent and classic), and obtaining them is cheaper and faster than even the used/trading sites.

josuff247
08-01-08, 11:48 AM
I saw a thread, but it was so old (2001) that i decided to start a new one.
I have a strong urge to buy a kindle.
Please either talk me into it or out of it. or just discuss the topic.

drmoze
08-03-08, 07:35 PM
Get a Sony Reader if you like reading stories and novels. Sleeker, better battery, now supports ePub and pdf reflow,and cheaper to boot. Tons of free books out there, old and new. And who really needs the wireless and a cheap plastic housing? Even without using memory cards, you can load up at least 100-200 novels on the Reader's internal memory for lots of reading variety. No need to impulse-order books wirelessly.

I've been doing a lot more leisure reading since I gotmine, both new authors and some classics.

dtcarson
08-03-08, 07:42 PM
That 360 bucks on the Kindle would buy you quite a few books at a used bookstore or even through a book club (QPB, SFBC, LitGuild, that book-a-month club, etc). Not to mention the library late fees it would cover. (I'll admit I'm spoiled, I get 100-400 books once a year for 20 bucks from the library booksale, so it's hard for me to spend 8 bucks on a new paperback, much less 350 on a device then ten bucks a "book".)
I like cool tech toys, and I love to read, but I personally don't really have an interest in Kindle or ebook readers. There's very few places I go that I can't bring a regular book if I want to read, and lots of places I can take a book but not a kindle (I would not dare take it to the beach or the pool or leave it in my car, but I don't mind getting a paperback a bit sandy.) Plus one great thing about books saying "I just finished this great book, here, borrow/keep it, pass it on when you're done."
Unlike mp3 players, where I might decide I want to listen to AC/DC then a few Pet Clark songs, I don't really need access to hundreds of books at the same time in an expensive device (again, if I'm at home, I'll walk out to the garage and pick a book from the seven bookcases.)
I can definitely see ebook readers in certain venues--law schools/offices, doctors, etc, where being able to quickly access thousands of pages is a great asset.

BigPete
08-03-08, 08:37 PM
For the convenience of an e-book, it seems like you are sacrificing an awful lot. It's a publisher's dream - no 2nd hand market, built-in obsolescence, no marginal cost of production, no competition. For that kind of a windfall, they should be giving these things out and begging people to adopt the technology, not charging the same price as a bestselling hardcover.

josuff247
08-11-08, 12:06 PM
My decision just got harder, the sony 505 is $250 at frys, plus no tax (amazon now charges tax in NY). However the book prices are so high on sony. And the selection is less.

Is there anywhere I can get current books for the sony at kindle prices? Legally of course.

I am thinking the extra money for the Kindle may still be worth it.

DJLinus
08-11-08, 02:02 PM
This is interesting:

Esquire to geeks: hack our e-paper magazine cover
Posted by Joel Johnson, July 30, 2008 1:20 PM | permalink

E-paper cover a "stupid gimmick"? No way, Brian. Esquire's animated 75th anniversary cover is the flashing, squawking future of magazines.

It's pretty easy to see the far future. Cheap, disposable e-paper magazines on subway newsstands and on the racks of your airport's Hudson News. Each one thin, flexible, disposable. Just a couple of pages, with bright, glossy color, wirelessly updated with the latest issues of your favorite rag. Need something to read? Buy a new e-mag — or press a button to refresh your virtually dog-eared copy to this month's edition.

That's about five years away, just like it has been for the last decade.

But deputy editor Peter Griffin can tell you what magazine stands will look like this October, when then the 75th Anniversary issue of Esquire with an e-paper cover will be unloaded from refrigerated vans and slotted into the rack. For the first time ever, one of the magazines will be animated.

It's not too flashy yet. "The order of the words will change," says Griffin. "There will be images that will turn on and off." The images are black-and-white in four shades of grey; a murky newspaper image, at best, but colored by a sheet of transparent, tinted plastic that will be fixed over the top.

It's the same e-paper that's inside Amazon's Kindle e-book reader, except this sheet of e-paper — two, actually; there's a second sheet on the inside cover that advertises the Ford Flex crossover SUV — will cost just a few bucks, not $350.

Esquire can sell the e-paper covers at the standard cover price because of the Ford advertisement, which has "defrayed a lot of the cost," explains Griffin. That's not the cop-out it might at first glance seem: should the Esquire cover make a splash, other advertisers will be willing to underwrite the use of e-paper in other magazines.

As long as they're Hearst magazines, that is. Hearst, Esquire's publisher (and one of my employers; I'm a contributing editor at Popular Mechanics), has brokered a one-year exclusivity with eInk, the e-paper manufacturer.

But on to the question most of the geeks have been asking: Can you rip out the cover and use it for your own projects?

Griffin says it should be possible — "We look forward to seeing what people do it" — although there isn't any discrete input on the custom-designed circuit board that will control the e-paper. The data will be baked into the circuitry. Figuring out how to reprogram the e-paper controller or installing an entirely new one will be up to the hackers.

Good news about the battery, though: it should be trivial to replace.

"The batteries are pretty standard, small batteries," says Griffin, some sort of coin cell battery that can be purchased from a variety of retailers. That means when the soldered-in battery dies after an estimated ninety days, replacing it shouldn't be too much of a challenge.

The cover itself isn't going to be completely stiff, having some of the give and bend of real paper.

Griffin says the cover is "like a really heavy magazine stock, but not like cardboard," about three millimeters thick. He thinks they could have gotten it even thinner.

"The thickness in the cover has nothing to do with the circuit or the technology; it's the protection we had to build into magazine for the binding. If we were to create a demonstration cover without worrying about the padding needed for the printing process it would be not much not thicker than a regular magazine cover."

http://gadgets.boingboing.net/2008/07/30/esquire-to-geeks-hac.html

I figured that since the issue will use the eInk technology and it may signal the magazine industry's shift away from paper (though no time soon), I'd put the article in this thread. But mods move it to where you see fit.

DeputyDave
08-13-08, 01:22 AM
This is interesting:



I figured that since the issue will use the eInk technology and it may signal the magazine industry's shift away from paper (though no time soon), I'd put the article in this thread. But mods move it to where you see fit.
I hope it's a shift for a cheaper Kindle. I'd buy one for under $100.

I'd also like to agree with an earlier poster. Why is Amazon (or publishers in general) charging so much (or anything at all)?

If they gave away a basic unit with no wireless (downloading books via USB over a computer) they would sell countless "units" of eBooks.

Deke Rivers
08-13-08, 09:35 AM
I like my kindle..I like being able to buy books at the touch of a button at prices close to paperback price if not cheaper without waiting for the paperback to be released(also lots of free stuff out there).
I like the wireless..means I can buy a book any time anywhere without a computer.
I dont have to invest in bookshelves or have my house cluttered up with piles of books (read and unread). My whole library fits right on the kindle
I dont have to deal with short checkout terms from the library.
I dont have to waste precious gas driving to the bookstore only to pay full price for a book that several people have already thumbed through in the cafe of the bookstore .
Only issue I have is when I find a book that hasnt been put out in kindle form..I find it hard reverting back to traditional books now :)
in any event I find I have read more books now after owning a kindle than I have before

Deke Rivers
08-13-08, 09:39 AM
For the convenience of an e-book, it seems like you are sacrificing an awful lot. It's a publisher's dream - no 2nd hand market, built-in obsolescence, no marginal cost of production, no competition. For that kind of a windfall, they should be giving these things out and begging people to adopt the technology, not charging the same price as a bestselling hardcover.

Kindle books are a whole lot cheaper than the hardback..9.99 for a new release in most cases..your average paper back is close to 9 bucks now Kindle prices are even cheaper for older books

ds6161
08-13-08, 06:01 PM
If they really want to become a player in the book market the Kindle needs to be below $100 and e-books need to be $5 or less.
Once you get to the point of shipping the script of to a printer, in e-book form there is no more cost other than bandwidth costs.

But this is coming from a guy who never understood paying $1 for an Ipod song..

innocentfreak
08-13-08, 06:20 PM
If they really want to become a player in the book market the Kindle needs to be below $100 and e-books need to be $5 or less.
Once you get to the point of shipping the script of to a printer, in e-book form there is no more cost other than bandwidth costs.

But this is coming from a guy who never understood paying $1 for an Ipod song..

I am the same way, never understood paying $1 for an mp3 which is why I have never bought an mp3.

For the Kindle to grab me it would have to be max $200 with books less than $2 and also have library support as an option where I could actually check books out for free. I read way too many books and even more through the library to justify buying every book even at the supposed discounted rate of the kindle edition. At the same time as it has been said I have no option to resell the book when I am done with it if I don't want to keep it.

The only other way I would possible be interested is if every book I bought through Amazon included the Kindle version for free. I would probably buy a Kindle just to have in case I traveled if this was the case. As of now their is no incentive for me to try it.

Deke Rivers
08-13-08, 07:04 PM
well they seem to be selling well the way it is right now.
They really seem to be geared toward people who normally would buy new books..not used book store bargain hunters or library people..
asking for free books on the kindle is a bit much if you ask me..just becausee its another form of a book does not mean it should be free

drmoze
08-15-08, 08:06 PM
I like my kindle..I like being able to buy books at the touch of a button at prices close to paperback price if not cheaper without waiting for the paperback to be released(also lots of free stuff out there).
I like the wireless..means I can buy a book any time anywhere without a computer.
I dont have to invest in bookshelves or have my house cluttered up with piles of books (read and unread). My whole library fits right on the kindle
I dont have to deal with short checkout terms from the library.
I dont have to waste precious gas driving to the bookstore only to pay full price for a book that several people have already thumbed through in the cafe of the bookstore .
Only issue I have is when I find a book that hasnt been put out in kindle form..I find it hard reverting back to traditional books now :)
in any event I find I have read more books now after owning a kindle than I have before

I have a Sony Reader (similar screen to Kindle, no wireless) and agree with all the above apart from the wireless feature. I have found tons of free e-books online (new and classic), and have discovered many new authors. Most importantly, I'm reading a whole lot more than before.

Some folks balk at the price (the Readers can be found for about $250 now). Yeah it's a lot, but the convenience is incredible. I have about 150 books on my Reader (internal memory, not even using a memory card, and more memory to spare still) which is why I don't need wireless. I have many months' worth of reading at my fingertips. Lighter and thinner than a single "p-book"! And I love the battery life--lasts 2-3 weeks, so no need to drag yet another charger when going out or on a short vacation.

A new wrinkle--the Sony Reader now handles books in Adobe Digital Edition format. Many libraries have electronic catalogs with Adobe DE books. I just picked up a NY Public Library card (free for residents, $100/year for 'foreigners') and they have tons of e-books available for checking out. You download the book from the library website, and it 'expires' in 21 days. You can check out up to 12 books at a time--from the comfort of your own home!

As if I didn't have enough to read already, I can now check out books whenever I want, free, and have them on my Reader!

darkside
08-15-08, 09:11 PM
I'm happy that the Kindle and eReader coming to iPhone will continue to boost the ebook market. I've been a customer of eReader since 1998 when it was called Peanut Press. I understand electronic books are not for everyone, but I have always loved the fact I can have a book with me on my PDA, Laptop or phone whenever I want to read. I've probably only bought 3 or 4 paper books the last 10 years compared to several hundred digitally. I don't have books cluttering shelves and I can take most of them with me at all times.

I have been turned off by the standalone readers like the Kindle and Sony models because they are so expensive and have no backlight. I read mostly at night so this is a great option since it illuminates perfectly without being too bright and disturbing the person trying to sleep next to you. The upside though are those great looking eink screens. Another downside I see for the Kindle and Sony is you can only read on them so if those devices break or get discontinued you are out of luck. With programs like eReader that support Windows, Mac, iPhone, Palm, Windows Mobile, Symbian and Blackberry you have a ton of options for reading devices.

I'm reading mostly now on my laptop and my T-Mobile Dash and its great these apps have the stores built in so you can buy a book wirelessly whenever you need to. I don't think they will replace paper books, but at least now they are becoming a stronger second option.

drmoze
08-26-08, 11:54 PM
The upside though are those great looking eink screens. Another downside I see for the Kindle and Sony is you can only read on them so if those devices break or get discontinued you are out of luck.

eink is great. Feels just like a reading a p-book! Also, don't know about Kindles, but Sony does have a reader program (the Library) that works on any Windows pc, including those nifty lightweight netbooks that I've been eyeing lately.... And the Sony program alsohas their ebookstore built in for downloading.(How else would you buy books for the Reader?) Although these days most of the ebooks I have in my reading list were free or borrowed from an online library.

GatorDeb
09-03-08, 06:10 AM
I have a Sony Reader 505 and a Kindle, and I never use them. I'm always afraid that I'm going to break them AND Vegas is so damn dusty that there's always a big speck of dust on the screen, stuck enough that I can't blow it away. And I hate touching the screen with my fingers so I end up not reading until I get home where I have my solution/cloth.

So I've gone back to the library.

Tygan
09-03-08, 01:53 PM
I have a Sony Reader 505 and a Kindle, and I never use them.

But you only filed for citizenship because the fees were increasing...

for someone who comes across very cheap - you sure do have a lot of electronic equipment that sits unused.

Gizmo
09-04-08, 02:08 AM
The $259 Amazon deal is very tempting...

GatorDeb
09-05-08, 12:37 PM
Well, well, well, my Sony Reader might just get a little bit more use after all.

I just learned that as of July 2008, it supports PDF Digital Edition (PDF DRM), and my library uses that format for downloadable eBooks (which expire three weeks after checkout). That means that I have a host of books to download and read now. It's convenient because I skip the trip to the library and the wait for an available book to get to my library (there a certain # of copies for each book available, but if it's available, you can get it immediately) and I can check out 35 at a time. The only bad part is that once I check one out, I can't return it... I have to wait the three weeks. I don't read 10 books a week, though :D Just got Blink and am looking for a good fiction one now.

Gizmo
09-05-08, 12:45 PM
GatorDeb,

let me know if you want to sell your Kindle in the near future.

GatorDeb
09-05-08, 12:59 PM
I'm not selling it for $259 ;)


By the way, I have to comment on how cool PDF DE support is. I go to my library and check books out, then click on the download button. I double click the downloaded file which loads the book into Adobe's PDF DE organizer program. Then I drag and drop the book(s) into the Sony Reader icon in the Adobe PDF DE program and it loads it into the reader. It even shows how many days I have left.

:up:

Also wanted to mention that the latest firmware update added epub support (whatever that means) but more importantly, regular PDF books are VASTLY improved, and I can now increase the font to a size I can read (and the text flows, no scrolling necessary). Along with PDF DE, this is a great addition. And there's no news on the Kindle getting PDF DE, so this would be a huge plus for the Sony.

benedict
09-08-08, 04:22 AM
Tygan, you don't seem to post much in Book Talk but, when you do, half the time you are demonstrating your fascination for GatorDeb in a somewhat unfortunate manner (http://forum.dvdtalk.com/showpost.php?p=8359306&postcount=22). I'd strongly suggest that you control any future temptation to continue along similar lines. If clarification is required, please PM or email to avoid taking this thread further off-topic i.e. into the realm of the unwanted personal comment.

GatorDeb
09-08-08, 05:27 AM
For Sony owners:

By the way, if anybody likes RSS Feeds, check out Calibre (http://calibre.kovidgoyal.net/). It comes loaded with quite a bit of feeds (i.e. New York Times, Newsweek, The BBC, The Economist, etc.) and there's an option to add more (which I haven't figured out, but I'm not that good with RSS Feeds in the first place). The ones preloaded are enough to last for a while (and I think most if not all of them are dailies).

You pretty much connect the Reader, click a drop down arrow, select the feed, and it's imported into your Reader automatically. It used to be called libprs.

"calibre is a e-book library management application. It is free, open source and cross-platform in design and works on Linux, OSX and Windows. calibre is meant to be a complete e-library solution and thus includes, library management, format conversion, news feeds to ebook conversion as well as e-book reader sync features. "

Mordred
09-08-08, 07:31 PM
Calibre is a far better book management system than the Sony one. Unfortunately, you can't have both installed on your system at the same time.

DeputyDave
09-08-08, 07:35 PM
I am so close to buying A Kindle. I'm swinging either way.
Quick someone convince me to jump!

How is the price $259? Is that with the $100 of with a Amazon CC?

GatorDeb
09-09-08, 12:22 AM
I have both the Sony Library software and Calibre on the PC :shrug: Also had both Libprs and the Sony Library software installed at the same time. I use Calibre for feeds and the Sony software for everything else.

Having both, I would go for the Sony if I were buying a new reader. Just because of the PDF DE Support. Check out if your library offers book checkouts for digital files.

DeputyDave
09-09-08, 12:20 PM
I have both the Sony Library software and Calibre on the PC :shrug: Also had both Libprs and the Sony Library software installed at the same time. I use Calibre for feeds and the Sony software for everything else.

Having both, I would go for the Sony if I were buying a new reader. Just because of the PDF DE Support. Check out if your library offers book checkouts for digital files.I checked last night and it looks like the two libraries near me (City of San Diego and City of Chula Vista) do not offer PDF downloads.

I might just make the big jump to Kindle if they offered credit towards eBooks. I can't imagine why they wouldn't in order to hook people in. I would have to add $100 to the initial cost in order to cover the books I'd want.

Mordred
09-09-08, 12:56 PM
I have both the Sony Library software and Calibre on the PC :shrug: Also had both Libprs and the Sony Library software installed at the same time. I use Calibre for feeds and the Sony software for everything else.

Having both, I would go for the Sony if I were buying a new reader. Just because of the PDF DE Support. Check out if your library offers book checkouts for digital files.I could swear that when I was checking the calibre forums the author said you had to uninstall the Sony Library software first. My wife just has the Sony Library on her laptop and I have calibre on my PC. I never tried to put both on the same computer. :shrug:

GatorDeb
09-09-08, 03:36 PM
I -have- heard that before. I paid it no mind ;) PC runs fine and it has to be at least a year since I discovered libprs.

GatorDeb
09-09-08, 07:26 PM
i'm on a hotel bed in Primm, NV posting from my kindle with built in internet access :)

GatorDeb
09-10-08, 02:44 PM
Well, I'm back on being torn between both, but now I'm using both of them :D This thread reinvigorated my interest in them. I love the built-in Internet access - didn't have to carry around and worry about my laptop and skipped the $11/day Internet hookup fee (third-rate hotel). I also think the Kindle attracts less dirt. The keyboard is awesome but I hate having to press the symbol sign, scroll down, and press another button just to include a '. Why couldn't they have a symbol button and symbols superimposed on the regular keys like every cell phone out there.

DeputyDave
09-12-08, 09:34 AM
GatorDeb, how is the internet on the Kindle? I mean what are the limitations? Certain sites only?

I heard someone mention (maybe earlier in this thread) that Amazon would be cutting it eventually.

GatorDeb
09-12-08, 11:59 AM
Internet is close to perfect. The only site I haven't been able to use was my University's online course (WebCampus). It does images, links, everything.

The thinking is that Amazon has to cut down the Internet sooner or later because of cost, but Amazon hasn't said anything about it. They HAVE promised that Wikipedia and Whispernet will always be free. Who knows if they'll ever cut it down or they want people on the device because that means buying books. Cut the Internet, people move away from it to their phones/etc., and buy less books. Pay for the Internet, have people use it more because of the added benefit = more books. Maybe they'll leave a certain amount of Kb per month free and anything else will be charged. Maybe they'll charge a flat monthly fee for usage or maybe they'll charge per Kb. Maybe they'll cut it off altogether.

Amazon hasn't said anything about it and all these months later, still free Internet. For me it's not necessary - I had my phone with me, it was a bigger screen. And I didn't get on the Internet long.

Duran
09-23-08, 02:27 PM
GatorDeb, how is the internet on the Kindle? I mean what are the limitations? Certain sites only?

I heard someone mention (maybe earlier in this thread) that Amazon would be cutting it eventually.

It's not a great browser by any stretch, but it is adequate. No flash support. It is nice if you don't have a smart phone and data plan.

GatorDeb
09-24-08, 06:37 AM
Well because of this thread I got back into ereaders, and now my Kindle never leaves my side. Reading The Story of Edgar Sawtelle on it. Through Mobipocket Reader I have tons of newspapers, magazines, and blogs autodelivered daily to my kindle while it charges, full of up-to-the-minute news. I am totally in love with it now.

DeputyDave
09-25-08, 09:00 PM
Well because of this thread I got back into ereaders, and now my Kindle never leaves my side. Reading The Story of Edgar Sawtelle on it. Through Mobipocket Reader I have tons of newspapers, magazines, and blogs autodelivered daily to my kindle while it charges, full of up-to-the-minute news. I am totally in love with it now.

You almost got me convinced.

GatorDeb
09-25-08, 11:44 PM
How about this: You can add the Kindle PID to Fictionwise and buy books from there in Mobipocket format to read :D

You can also run a Python script (easy to install) to ADD your Kindle PID to library books that you check out so that you can read them on the Kindle. So go to your library and look at their Mobipocket collection - you can borrow and read those! After the checkout time expires, the Kindle won't open them anymore.

I needed to have some documents on hand this past week so I loaded them onto the Kindle and took them with me everywhere. Curiously, not -one- person asked me what it was. A couple of people at work have, though.

Duran
09-30-08, 02:55 PM
You almost got me convinced.

It really is cool. I travel by commuter train, and it's great to be able to have a ton of boosk with me without carrying them. And I haven't played with Mobireader RSS feed functionality, I did use a similar function from Feedbooks.com (also free). It's awesome. Basically, get all the latest news in an easy-to-read format over the cell network for nothing.

GatorDeb
09-30-08, 04:28 PM
I hated Feedbooks because for the full feed, you have to use EVDO. Mobipocket collects all the feed content and places it in a file to be read later.

Liver&Onions
09-30-08, 05:27 PM
Does the browser support Javascript? Also is there any info on the browser that Kindle has on it?

Duran
09-30-08, 08:48 PM
I hated Feedbooks because for the full feed, you have to use EVDO. Mobipocket collects all the feed content and places it in a file to be read later.


So does Feedbooks. Perhaps you're confusing it with Bloglines or Feedburner?

Does the browser support Javascript? Also is there any info on the browser that Kindle has on it?

No support for Javascript. It's definitely not a full-function browser, and frankly the e-book format doesn't really lend itself to one. It's adequate, though, and free to use, which is a big plus for me.

Liver&Onions
09-30-08, 09:57 PM
So does Feedbooks. Perhaps you're confusing it with Bloglines or Feedburner?



No support for Javascript. It's definitely not a full-function browser, and frankly the e-book format doesn't really lend itself to one. It's adequate, though, and free to use, which is a big plus for me.

but Deb said it's perfect. ;)

Thanks!

Duran
09-30-08, 10:27 PM
I hated Feedbooks because for the full feed, you have to use EVDO. Mobipocket collects all the feed content and places it in a file to be read later.

I understand what you were getting at. Feedbooks gives you the full feed, but links to additional content for feeds that only include teasers wouldn't work unless you are on Whispernet.

I'm playing with Mobipocket now - how do you generate the file to put on the kindle?

GatorDeb
09-30-08, 11:39 PM
Definitely thinking Feedbooks when it comes to incomplete feeds.

To create a feed from Mobipocket: Download version 6.0, which recognizes the Kindle. Right click the news feed(s) wanted, Send eNews to, Kindle. Alternative, get the latest version, put your memory card in the PC, Right click news feed(s) wanted, Send eNews to, Removable Storage (Drive Letter).

Duran
10-03-08, 08:57 AM
Got it - thanks. Stupid Mobireader 6.2!

Gizmo
10-04-08, 05:03 PM
New Amazon Kindle pictures have been leaked...
http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.engadget.com/media/2008/10/amazon-kindle-2-rumor-bgr.jpg

Looks pretty cool. Will wait now for the new version. It has 1.5GB of space.
http://www.engadget.com/2008/10/03/amazons-kindle-2-in-the-wild/
http://www.boygeniusreport.com/gallery/devices/amazon-kindle-2/

GatorDeb
10-04-08, 06:38 PM
There is a good chance that the picture is a fake. I myself do not believe that's a real Kindle 2.0.

Gizmo
10-04-08, 07:40 PM
The site has a dozen other photos as well. I doubt someone would go through so much trouble.

GatorDeb
10-04-08, 07:57 PM
It's 10 pictures of the same device. The number of pictures does not add to its credibility.

Gizmo
10-05-08, 01:33 AM
$5 say's it is ;)

GatorDeb
10-05-08, 03:38 AM
$5 say's it is ;)

How about just public humiliation and ridicule on this forum for a week for the loser? :D

Gizmo
10-05-08, 11:33 PM
How about just public humiliation and ridicule on this forum for a week for the loser? :D

Ok! Could be fun!

drmoze
10-06-08, 08:42 PM
Just FYI, the Kindle (and other e-ink devices) are best suited for people who like to read books. The Kindle is *not* a very good tablet-pc replacement, nor is it intended to be a mobile browser device.

The main attraction of an e-ink device is that it is very easy on the eyes compared to LCDs and other active displays. They also have great battery life (weeks), except that the Kindle eats more battery because of the built-in wireless. They are great for reading novels and 'feel' like a book to the eyes.

If you like to read lots of books, there are tons of free ones online. The Sony Reader is easier to get books for than the Kindle (it takes lots of formats, incl. Adobe Digital Editions) and file conversion is pretty easy (including MS Reade--.lit--files). The Adobe DE lets you borrow ebooks from online libraries.

Check out mobileread.com for lots of info on e-ink devices (and other ebook stuff), incl. many sources of books, hacks, file conversions, etc.

GatorDeb
10-07-08, 12:34 AM
Hey DrMoze are you also DrMoze at mobileread? I've been there since December :D

Josh-da-man
10-07-08, 12:43 AM
I'm still not sold on eBooks yet.

Seems like there are too many competing formats out there, many of them proprietary, and I also don't like the idea of these things being DRMed. For example, Amazon could kill my account (and they've lately been killing people's accounts for various reasons like making too many returns) and effectively brick your Kindle. Or we've also seen Microsoft stop selling music and also effectively rendering people's DRMed music collections unable to be transferred to a new machine.

GatorDeb
10-07-08, 01:36 AM
You can buy from Fictionwise.com and use in your Kindle. Also I've decided I like Amazon's selection so I'm staying with the Kindle line and its future iterations, so I don't mind being "locked" to it.

P.S. the more I find out about those pictures, the more I'm convinced they're fake ;) They're saying that those picture are probably a very early Kindle prototype that ultimately led to the current iteration.

Deke Rivers
10-08-08, 09:11 AM
.

The main attraction of an e-ink device is that it is very easy on the eyes compared to LCDs and other active displays. They also have great battery life (weeks), except that the Kindle eats more battery because of the built-in wireless. They are great for reading novels and 'feel' like a book to the eyes.


just an fyi - you dont have to have the wireless on all the time. I only turn it on when I want to dl a book .

Gizmo
10-09-08, 09:36 PM
I just want it to do ebooks. I don't care about web browsing or any of that other stuff.

GatorDeb
10-10-08, 12:01 AM
I would really really recommend mobileread.com ... there's a lot of information there that's worth a read :D (I'm GatorDeb there also).

Gizmo
11-30-08, 01:56 PM
How about just public humiliation and ridicule on this forum for a week for the loser? :D

http://www.engadget.com/2008/11/25/amazon-kindle-2-no-longer-rumored-for-this-holiday-season-accor/

So we heard from Amazon back in August not to expect that rumored Kindle 2 anytime this year... but then there were those leaked photos of the new device, so people kind of went back to expecting it again, but, apparently we should stop doing that now (again). According to unnamed sources talking to TechCrunch, the Kindle 2, will arrive in a vaguely termed "early next quarter." The source says the device has been 'delayed' by Bezos himself, that the leaked photos we saw a while back are the real thing, and that a student version of the reader, which will ironically have a larger screen and be better than the standard one, will hit in the first half of 2009 as planned (rumored). Hard-copy of Wuthering Heights, your execution has been stayed another few months.

So when can I start :)

GatorDeb
12-01-08, 07:56 PM
http://www.engadget.com/2008/11/25/amazon-kindle-2-no-longer-rumored-for-this-holiday-season-accor/



So when can I start :)

When it's confirmed :D

Gizmo
12-02-08, 07:47 PM
When it's confirmed :D

*rubs hands together*

innocentfreak
12-04-08, 12:47 AM
They had a Sony ereader on display at Target. It was the first time I have seen an ereader in person. It was decent looking though and easy to read but I found the flash annoying from flipping pages. I still don't get the draw though then again I don't get the draw of services like Itunes for buying albums.

I understand being able to carry a large number of books with you especially if you travel or if you do most of your reading away from home. This doesn't apply to me since I rarely if ever take vacations anymore and all my reading is done at home. My library also has a pretty slim ebook selection based off their website so that doesn't help me either. Obviously the Kindle or any other ereader isn't for everyone, but short of carrying most of your collection with you I don't get it.

My biggest gripe with ebooks are the cost. They are not significantly cheaper than the paper alternative and in some cases cost even more or the same as the paperback. You don't have the option to do anything with the electronic book once you are done reading it so no trading, lending, or selling the book. I doubt you can even donate it to the library.

I could understand, which I have probably said before, if Amazon had some deal where every book you purchased came with the Kindle edition for free or maybe a $1 more. You would have access to the Kindle edition anytime so you could choose to buy only the ones you wanted if say you knew you had a trip coming up. Or you could buy any Kindle book for 50% or more off the current price of the physical book.

At $2-3 dollars per kindle book currently in paperback, it starts to make sense to me but not at 6.39 when the paperback is 6.99. Obviously there is a better deal in buying the Kindle book versus a new hardback but at that point I couldn't justify more than 6.99-7.99 for the Kindle edition. At the same time when you can pickup the hardback for $4-$5 on clearance, I doubt we will see the Kindle edition drop in price.

xmiyux
12-04-08, 08:56 AM
I could understand, which I have probably said before, if Amazon had some deal where every book you purchased came with the Kindle edition for free or maybe a $1 more. You would have access to the Kindle edition anytime so you could choose to buy only the ones you wanted if say you knew you had a trip coming up. Or you could buy any Kindle book for 50% or more off the current price of the physical book.


This is really what would get me to buy into the whole thing and would pretty much end me buying used books. If I could buy a new book from Amazon and also get the DRM-filled Kindle edition for a small fee then I would be all over it. It would allow me to keep a big hardback at home and have the same thing on a Kindle for going to work, traveling, etc. I would absolutely buy into the whole thing at that point.

movieking
12-05-08, 02:28 PM
eReaders have just popped into my radar, and I am seriously thinking about getting one for Christmas (or asking Santa for one). Being in Canada, the Kindle isn't available, so I was looking at the Sony eBook readers, the PRS-505 and the PRS-700. Since the 700 just came out recently, it's $100 or so more expensive than the 505, and from a couple of reviews that I've read, it has more issues with glare. Are there any other eReaders that should be on my radar, or are these pretty much the best out there? I've read about some others, but they seem to be a bit more obscure.

Larry C.
12-05-08, 02:38 PM
Alright whick one of you kindle buying bastards kidnapped Deb?

__________
<i><font color=blue>If this is intended to be a witty continuation of an earlier thread in Other.... let's just leave it. I believe that thread was already closed and we don't really need a "part two" IMNSHO.</i> [Benedict]</font>

Gizmo
12-09-08, 05:57 PM
If the Kindle (or any eBook reader) was Backlit I'd own one by now.

Deke Rivers
12-10-08, 11:13 AM
it doesnt need to be backlit unless you plan on reading in the dark

Gizmo
12-17-08, 08:41 PM
it doesnt need to be backlit unless you plan on reading in the dark

I do.

darkside
12-17-08, 09:57 PM
If the Kindle (or any eBook reader) was Backlit I'd own one by now.
This has always been my issue with them and why I have stuck with PDAs and my laptop. I read mostly at night and need light up screens. I'm now using my iPod Touch and eReader. That said though the new version of the Sony ebook reader is supposed to include a side lit screen though I have no idea how well that will work with the eink screens.

My one complaint with the iPod Touch is no Mobipocket reader. The Mobipocket forums have users that say the program was done and Amazon blocked Mobipocket from releasing it. They don't want the iPod as a Kindle competitor I guess. However, the wonders of Linux made using the Mobipocket books on my iPod possible and on a Kindle or Sony reader if I ever decide to get one.

Deke Rivers
12-18-08, 05:47 AM
I do.
then i guess a real book is out of the question too then..:)

Deke Rivers
12-18-08, 05:52 AM
This has always been my issue with them and why I have stuck with PDAs and my laptop. I read mostly at night and need light up screens. I'm now using my iPod Touch and eReader. That said though the new version of the Sony ebook reader is supposed to include a side lit screen though I have no idea how well that will work with the eink screens.

My one complaint with the iPod Touch is no Mobipocket reader. The Mobipocket forums have users that say the program was done and Amazon blocked Mobipocket from releasing it. They don't want the iPod as a Kindle competitor I guess. However, the wonders of Linux made using the Mobipocket books on my iPod possible and on a Kindle or Sony reader if I ever decide to get one.

Personally I flat out cant read on little screens like on a PDA or Ipod ..the e-readers at least are the same size as real book page and more closely emulate reading a book .I do see people at work reading on PDA's though The small size lets them get away with reading instead of working :)
as far as reading at night i have a small lamp on my nightstand that works just fine with my kindle and and regular books..

stp115
12-18-08, 09:41 AM
I do.

I have a sidelit accessory for the Sony 505 and it works great. I've used it to read while waiting on poublic transportation, and waiting between sets at concerts, as well as in bed at night.

darkside
12-18-08, 08:37 PM
Personally I flat out cant read on little screens like on a PDA or Ipod ..the e-readers at least are the same size as real book page and more closely emulate reading a book .I do see people at work reading on PDA's though The small size lets them get away with reading instead of working :)
as far as reading at night i have a small lamp on my nightstand that works just fine with my kindle and and regular books..

My wife and I don't always go to sleep at the same time so a lamp is completely out of the question. We both use our iPods and those are dim enough not to bother the sleeper.

I totally understand the screen size complaint, but I have been using PDA size screens for so long I am completely used to it. I bump up the font to a comfortable size and read away. I never notice the small screen once I'm in the grove of reading. My big complaint with a kindle is its too big to easily carry with me. An iPod or PDA can go in my pocket, but with a Kindle I need a backpack. Might as well carry the laptop. I take a quick read whenever possible and that works great with a pocketable device.

stp115
12-18-08, 09:04 PM
My big complaint with a kindle is its too big to easily carry with me. An iPod or PDA can go in my pocket, but with a Kindle I need a backpack. Might as well carry the laptop. I take a quick read whenever possible and that works great with a pocketable device.


To each his own I guess. I can't stand the eye strain using a palm device. I have the Sony ereader and carry it easily in either my cargo pants or coat pocket. I have 1200 books on a 2 GB SD card, and have nothing but nice things to say about it. It has been my favorite gadget of the last 3 years.

ds6161
12-19-08, 12:51 AM
I have a sidelit accessory for the Sony 505 and it works great. I've used it to read while waiting on poublic transportation, and waiting between sets at concerts, as well as in bed at night.

can you post a link or picture of the light??

stp115
12-19-08, 12:12 PM
can you post a link or picture of the light??


Sure...

http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10551&storeId=10151&langId=-1&productId=8198552921665480080

drmoze
12-19-08, 01:48 PM
Hey DrMoze are you also DrMoze at mobileread? I've been there since December :D

I've been DrMoze everywhere online since the early-mid 90's (back in the days of text-based bb's). :)

And yes, mobileread is a great site!

Also, the Sony Reader (which is extremely thin and fits easily in coat/cargo pants pockets) has an optional cover with built-in frontlight (a light wedge) that works great. [EDIT: this is the one linked in the previous post; the 'sidelit' description threw me, because light wedges provide light from the front onto the screen, even if the original source is off to the side.] The new 700 has a built-in frontlight and touchscreen, but I've read that the touchscreen makes the text slightly more blurry. I don't need/want a touchscreen, personally.

Ocelot
12-30-08, 12:56 PM
i think i'm gonna go ebook soon... i lost my balance again this morning on the subway car when turning to the next page :mad:

drmoze
12-30-08, 02:06 PM
Check out mobileread.com for LOTS of info on the different ebook devices, sources of books (many free!), hacking, issues, file conversions, etc. It is THE ebook website.

As a bonus, you can put a Reader/Kindle/Cybook in a large ziplock and read in a steambath. :up:

movieking
01-06-09, 10:34 AM
Check out mobileread.com for LOTS of info on the different ebook devices, sources of books (many free!), hacking, issues, file conversions, etc. It is THE ebook website.

Definitely a great site, but I find it a bit overwhelming. As a new PRS-505 owner, is there any links in particular that you can direct me to? I've been using calibre and have been in the various forums, but if you have anymore specific suggestions, let me know.

As a bonus, you can put a Reader/Kindle/Cybook in a large ziplock and read in a steambath. :up:

I would not have the guts to do that.

So I got the PRS-505 for Christmas and I love it. I've already read about 4 or 5 books on it, and it's only been a couple of weeks. So what other accessories are available, besides the one from above, especially in terms of cases/protection? I've read on mobileread I think that some have had issues with the book cover/light, as the placement of the light can damage the screen, so I am a bit nervous to use it. I can't seem to find a thread or page that details all of the accessories that can be purchased for the reader (the forum on mobileread seems to be all over the place).

Also, what can be used to clean the screen? I am nervous to touch the thing. I've also got to decide on the warranty, but I am leaning towards getting it.

drmoze
01-08-09, 09:31 PM
I've had no problem with the Sony lightwedge cover, and it works great. I also have a "Z-light" which is very thin and clips on. (It is used with the old 500 mostly these days.) I use the stock Sony cover, and just put the Reader in my backpack, coat pocket, cargopants pocket, etc.

As for Mobileread, yeah, there is a lot there! The subforums are pretty well organized. Check the Sony Reader Uploads subforum for tons of free books.The main Deals and Freebies forums has lots of good stuff, much of it for the Reader. And then there's the Troubleshooting (obv) and Developer (for hacks/mods) subforums.

One goodplace tostart might be the wiki at the top of the page: go to 'dedicated ebook devices' under 'technology'and the Sony 505will have a good overview of info.

Don't forget to check out e-library options (thru the Adobe Digital Editions format/software).

I guess there's no real shortcut.Just search for what interests you!

Gizmo
02-06-09, 11:06 PM
How about just public humiliation and ridicule on this forum for a week for the loser? :D

$5 say's it is ;)

http://i.gizmodo.com/5148568/kindle-2-official-images-and-price-leak-359-on-february-24

PWNED?

ds6161
02-06-09, 11:51 PM
Kindle 2

http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/06/amazon-kindle-2-launching-on-monday-well-be-there-live/

Cory02
02-08-09, 03:30 AM
I'm eagerly awaiting the official announcement Monday from Amazon about the Kindle 2. I think I may have to break down and order a Kindle 2 whenever it becomes available. It might not be the prettiest eReader but its good enough (at least for me). I love the idea of being able to buy a book whenever I want to via Whispernet (and at $9.99 for most books that I've seen) and switching to ebooks will cut down on the clutter around the house with books piling up. Being able to put RSS feeds on it is an added bonus. Hopefully, no big disappointments in the official announcement.

Gizmo
02-09-09, 11:06 AM
I was right. Deb, when can we start the week of fun?

rabbit77
02-09-09, 12:06 PM
I was right. Deb, when can we start the week of fun?

Start? Deb's threads have been the source of ridicule for years now...

UncleGramps
02-09-09, 12:35 PM
I'll buy an e-reader when I can get a high quality one for $100 and ebooks for $5. Until then it's easier and cheaper to buy used paperbacks on Amazon or used book stores.

xmiyux
02-09-09, 12:39 PM
I'll buy an e-reader when I can get a high quality one for $100 and ebooks for $5. Until then it's easier and cheaper to buy used paperbacks on Amazon or used book stores.

This is also my opinion. I would also like to be able to check out books from the library electronically (like i can now with audio books).

The price point for the books is more important to me. I would be willing to have a more expensive buy-in if the books were then 5$ or under.

note: I expect academic texts/textbooks and things to be more expensive. I just want a less than 5$ price point for your average novel or non-fiction book.

UncleGramps
02-09-09, 12:50 PM
Do you guys think that e-books and e-readers will ever become mainstream? I wonder if they'll be a footnote in the history of media (like MiniDisc or HD-DVD) or if they'll catch on. That'll determine if and when the pricing becomes more reasonable. I have to imagine that they'll catch on eventually, but it might take a while.

moviezzz
02-09-09, 01:43 PM
I'll buy an e-reader when I can get a high quality one for $100 and ebooks for $5. Until then it's easier and cheaper to buy used paperbacks on Amazon or used book stores.

Well considering that it is $3.99 shipping for most used books on Amazon, and at least in my area, most of the used book stores are gone, I don't have a problem with the $9.99. Especially when trade paperbacks are normally $12 or more, and the hardcovers are upwards of $30.

I still haven't gotten a Kindle, as I still am a fan of regular books. But I am getting closer to it. The $9.99 is one of the main reasons I would get it. Especially if you are a big reader of new releases, it pays for itself rather quickly.

Drop
02-09-09, 01:49 PM
Do you guys think that e-books and e-readers will ever become mainstream? I wonder if they'll be a footnote in the history of media (like MiniDisc or HD-DVD) or if they'll catch on. That'll determine if and when the pricing becomes more reasonable. I have to imagine that they'll catch on eventually, but it might take a while.

I do, and I think it's a matter of a few years. The tech just needs to be cheaper. Amazon's self-contained service is a big breakthrough. There's rumors they might put it into other devices. The e-ink tech is just so good, that eventually people won't miss paper. I know I'd read more if I had an e-reader. There's just so many public domain books that I would get, and reading them off a monitor is not something I like doing.

Once it gets further ingrained in mainstream I think you'll start to see real discounts on the books too. There is no competition for Amazon's service so there is no need to discount, which turns many off.

I think another thing that will help is the reader being more than just for books. The additon of wikipedia and basic interent browsing plus MP3 use is another reason the Kindle is the most known reader. Plus just being and Amazon product goes a long way.

I hope I gets popular anyway, because I love the tech but it's just out of reach for me from a financial point, and popularity will only drive the price down.

UncleGramps
02-09-09, 02:25 PM
Well considering that it is $3.99 shipping for most used books on Amazon, and at least in my area, most of the used book stores are gone, I don't have a problem with the $9.99. Especially when trade paperbacks are normally $12 or more, and the hardcovers are upwards of $30.

I still haven't gotten a Kindle, as I still am a fan of regular books. But I am getting closer to it. The $9.99 is one of the main reasons I would get it. Especially if you are a big reader of new releases, it pays for itself rather quickly.
I can see your point if you're the type of person who prefers to buy a lot of newly released books. Otherwise, you can get older paperbacks on Amazon and probably elsewhere for a buck or two. Even with shipping factored in, it's cheaper than an e-book. Besides, e-books should be much cheaper than physical books since there's no costs for printing, shipping, etc.

I agree that a Kindle is a good deal for someone who reads a ton of new books, but otherwise I don't think it makes sense. When you add libraries to the equation, a Kindle makes even less sense for someone trying to save money.

The tech is very cool, though, and I'm exited for the day when these things are more affordable for the everyday consumer.

xmiyux
02-09-09, 03:53 PM
I do, and I think it's a matter of a few years. The tech just needs to be cheaper. Amazon's self-contained service is a big breakthrough. There's rumors they might put it into other devices. The e-ink tech is just so good, that eventually people won't miss paper. I know I'd read more if I had an e-reader. There's just so many public domain books that I would get, and reading them off a monitor is not something I like doing.

Once it gets further ingrained in mainstream I think you'll start to see real discounts on the books too. There is no competition for Amazon's service so there is no need to discount, which turns many off.

I think another thing that will help is the reader being more than just for books. The additon of wikipedia and basic interent browsing plus MP3 use is another reason the Kindle is the most known reader. Plus just being and Amazon product goes a long way.

I hope I gets popular anyway, because I love the tech but it's just out of reach for me from a financial point, and popularity will only drive the price down.

I'm a huge library user and supporter so 10$ seems like a good bit of cash to me for something i can't loan out to a friend. Some of my favorite books were loaned to me and i gift books rather frequently when people express interest in something i enjoy. Not being able to do those things with an electronic version makes me want a little cheaper price.

I would however, love to have my groaning bookshelves lightened because i buy things digitally. I just want to make sure i have some kind of backup service on the cloud somewhere in case my ebook reader fails or my HDD where i store the books fail. I lost a bunch of family photos in a HDD failure several years back and i felt like such an idiot. I would want something that would let me re-download once i purchased the item.

E-ink though is pretty hot imo. I love the way it looks and will be all over it when a couple things happen.

1. Price Drops.
2. Larger screens w/color e-ink.

#2 is because i want to get my magazine subscriptions on a device. I would absolutely love to not have the paper magazines delivered. Instead, beam them to my Kindle (or whatever device) and let me read the issue then delete it (or archive it for later).

Even more than magazines though... This would totally get me back into comic books. I would swoon over being able to subscribe to some monthly comics and have them autodownload for reading and not require any bags, boards, and long boxes.

Drop
02-09-09, 05:19 PM
I'm a huge library user and supporter so 10$ seems like a good bit of cash to me for something i can't loan out to a friend. \

But not everything is 10 dollars. You can get 50+ works of Edgar Rice Burroughs for about 5 dollars. Someday the libraries will have no choice but to support digital books. I hope we start to see experiments with it.

I'm more or less in the same boat as you. I want to support it but the pros and cons are evenly matched right now.

As far as backup, the product page says you can redownload any book you purchased for free. That sounds great to me.

And I agree about the color e-ink, even though it's of little use to me. It will only help mainstream these devices. I definitely see Weekly publications ditching the paperback and going pure download someday, especially because of how great e-ink is.

GatorDeb
02-09-09, 06:23 PM
I was right. Deb, when can we start the week of fun?

Announced today and here I am, just for you :D

I'll tale the pwned. They DID go with the fugly design.

Cory02
02-10-09, 04:52 AM
I'm probably going to break down and pre-order a Kindle 2 in the next few days. I'm disappointed it doesn't include removable memory like the Kindle 1 but the design is OK and the convenience is too good to pass up (plus the value, long-term, if $9.99 or less stays the prevalent price point for Kindle books).

al_bundy
02-10-09, 01:38 PM
But not everything is 10 dollars. You can get 50+ works of Edgar Rice Burroughs for about 5 dollars. Someday the libraries will have no choice but to support digital books. I hope we start to see experiments with it.

I'm more or less in the same boat as you. I want to support it but the pros and cons are evenly matched right now.

As far as backup, the product page says you can redownload any book you purchased for free. That sounds great to me.

And I agree about the color e-ink, even though it's of little use to me. It will only help mainstream these devices. I definitely see Weekly publications ditching the paperback and going pure download someday, especially because of how great e-ink is.

$359 is still way too much just to read books. rumor is that Apple is going to come out with a larger iPod Touch or some kind of tablet this year and it will probably be a better buy than the Kindle.

Drop
02-10-09, 03:20 PM
$359 is still way too much just to read books. rumor is that Apple is going to come out with a larger iPod Touch or some kind of tablet this year and it will probably be a better buy than the Kindle.

If it isn't e-ink I'm not interested. And the last thing and Ipod touch needs to be is bigger, the size is perfect for what it does.

I agree the Kindle is too much, but only a little. Even 40 bucks cheaper and I'd find it hard not to puchase the thing. 359 is just an intimidating number, I know it'd be worth it, but spending that much on one item it just seems like a lot. The main draw of these e-readers is all the free books I can read, they're are tons of public domain titles I want, but it's impossible for me to read them on a PC.

al_bundy
02-10-09, 08:16 PM
if they make the touch and the iphone as big as the kindle it will be interesting. no need to buy multiple devices, cheaper and easier to buy one device to carry around.

movieking
02-11-09, 08:27 AM
Quick question for you PRS-505 owners - do you have to completely drain the battery before recharging? Last night, I noticed that the battery was getting low, so I tried to recharge it via USB, but when I woke up this morning, it was completely dead. Only then when I retried to charge did it work. Maybe I had a loose cable last night? I only got the orange light, and not the red light.

Speaking of which, what does the orange light symbolize? I know that red means charging, but I think that i've had a solid orange or a flashing orange before, and I don't have the manual anymore. Just curious.

Deke Rivers
02-11-09, 01:57 PM
im sticking with my original Kindle..this one looks like someone sat on an original Kindle and flattened it out..

Deke Rivers
02-11-09, 01:58 PM
$359 is still way too much just to read books. rumor is that Apple is going to come out with a larger iPod Touch or some kind of tablet this year and it will probably be a better buy than the Kindle.

since when does Apple price anything cheaper than anyone else? :)

story
02-11-09, 03:36 PM
I wonder if they'll be a footnote in the history of media (like MiniDisc or HD-DVD) or if they'll catch on.I really, really miss MiniDisc. :(

Mordred
02-11-09, 06:10 PM
Quick question for you PRS-505 owners - do you have to completely drain the battery before recharging? Last night, I noticed that the battery was getting low, so I tried to recharge it via USB, but when I woke up this morning, it was completely dead. Only then when I retried to charge did it work. Maybe I had a loose cable last night? I only got the orange light, and not the red light.

Speaking of which, what does the orange light symbolize? I know that red means charging, but I think that i've had a solid orange or a flashing orange before, and I don't have the manual anymore. Just curious.Sometimes the PRS-505 is a bit touchy on the charging. It doesn't have to be completely dead to charge though. I know sometimes I've plugged it in and nothing happened, then I unplug the cable and replug it in and the red charge light comes on.

I think the orange light is for when it's turned on, but also plugged in. It ought to charge in that position though.

Mordred
02-11-09, 06:13 PM
As far as the Kindle 2 goes, it looks better than the Kindle, but still doesn't do much for me. I think the design on the Sony's are far nicer. One thing I don't understand is why there's no talk about the Sony PRS-700. That seems to be the coolest reader out there with it's touch screen and everything, even if it is the priciest one. For $30 more than a Kindle 2 it seems like a no brainer to me... although I'm sure some people find WhisperNet invaluable.

moviezzz
02-12-09, 01:45 PM
I finally broke down and pre-ordered a Kindle.

What did it for me is all the "complete works" collections. For only $5 you can get the complete works of authors like Dickens, Melville, Mark Twain, and others. Hard to beat that.

Jay G.
02-12-09, 03:56 PM
What did it for me is all the "complete works" collections. For only $5 you can get the complete works of authors like Dickens, Melville, Mark Twain, and others. Hard to beat that.
*ahem*

http://www.freekindlebooks.org/

movieking
02-13-09, 09:05 AM
Yeah, the Sony eReader comes with "100 free classics", all of which (I believe) are easily available for free (legally) online through Gutenberg, etc.

meglet
02-15-09, 04:16 PM
*ahem*

http://www.freekindlebooks.org/

Thanks for the link. Any idea how good the formatting is? I've seen complaints that quite a few of the public domain books available through Amazon for the Kindle aren't very well formatted, and therefore kind of difficult to read.

After contemplating a Kindle 1 for a while, but not liking the page buttons, I pre-ordered a Kindle 2 the day it was announced. Besides the ability to get books instantly, and carry lots of books with me, I'm looking forward to putting some of my technical books on it. Quite a few of my Microsoft Press books (I'm a sysadmin for Windows servers, MS books work for me) come with PDF versions that I can convert and put on my Kindle, so I don't have to carry 10lbs of books with me on the days I think I'll need them somewhere else. Unfortunately, my favorite non-MS tech books do NOT come with electronic versions, and the Kindle versions cost almost as much as the dead-tree versions.

Jay G.
02-15-09, 05:00 PM
Thanks for the link. Any idea how good the formatting is?
I don't have a Kindle, so I can't say. However, the site mentions that they use the HTML versions of books from Project Gutenberg (http://www.gutenberg.org) when available, or convert the plain-text versions with GutenMark (http://www.sandroid.org/GutenMark/). You can check out the Project Gutenberg site and their HTML downloads for an idea. Project Gutenberg also has PDF files available that you could convert yourself.

Here's a link for some other sites that carry Kindle-compatible content:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon_Kindle#Summary_of_content_availability

drmoze
02-16-09, 08:40 PM
Someday the libraries will have no choice but to support digital books. I hope we start to see experiments with it.

There already exists an extensive selection of e-books for checkout at many online libraries (at least for the Reader). Lots of mainstream and current releases, available free.


Quick question for you PRS-505 owners - do you have to completely drain the battery before recharging? Last night, I noticed that the battery was getting low, so I tried to recharge it via USB, but when I woke up this morning, it was completely dead. Only then when I retried to charge did it work. Sometimes the PRS-505 is a bit touchy on the charging. It doesn't have to be completely dead to charge though. I know sometimes I've plugged it in and nothing happened, then I unplug the cable and replug it in and the red charge light comes on.


The "trick" for charging any Sony Reader (not really a secret but it might as well be, because so few people seem to get it) is to NEVER USE A USB CABLE TO CHARGE THE READER. Use a Sony PSP charger and charge thru the round POWER PORT, not the mini-usb port. Tons of stores sell many varieties of PSP chargers.You can also get a PSP charge/data cable that lets you connect the Reader or charge via the power port from any computer or USB power source. The power port charges faster and more reliably.Sometimes, connecting a Reader by usb to a charger or even a pc w/o the Sony software will DRAIN the Reader. The power port will ALWAYS charge it.

I finally broke down and pre-ordered a Kindle.

What did it for me is all the "complete works" collections. For only $5 you can get the complete works of authors like Dickens, Melville, Mark Twain, and others. Hard to beat that.


Free beats $5. Someone mentioned the Gutenberg project stuff, forthe Kindle or Reader. You can also get a zillion (OK, 12,000) classic/pd books formatted for the Sony Reader for next to nothing at silkpagoda.com (from the Blackmask project), or individual ones with good formatting at mobileread.

I think another thing that will help is the reader being more than just for books. The additon of wikipedia and basic interent browsing plus MP3 use is another reason the Kindle is the most known reader. Plus just being and Amazon product goes a long way.

I think Amazon's online visibility and marketing of the Kindle right with their regular books is the main reason for the Kindle recognition. Wikipedia access would be the one reason I might want a Kindle, but blackberry access works well enough. (OK, the Kindle 2 redesign is a step in the right direction.) MP3? Meh. Never listen to audiobooks, and don't want an electronic reader for music. I still prefer my Reader, with much sleeker design, 3-week battery life, and easy e-library checkout of all the books I want, free.

moviezzz
02-17-09, 01:58 PM
Free beats $5. Someone mentioned the Gutenberg project stuff, forthe Kindle or Reader. You can also get a zillion (OK, 12,000) classic/pd books formatted for the Sony Reader for next to nothing at silkpagoda.com (from the Blackmask project), or individual ones with good formatting at mobileread.

Although as someone else mentioned, with the Kindle, and others, it looks like you get what you pay for.

The $5 Complete Works collections get great reviews, as they are indexed and allow you to jump to a specific story. They have all sorts of other features.

Others that are free don't have that. You have to page by page go through the entire library.

Ocelot
02-17-09, 02:36 PM
i pre-ordered a K2.0 for myself... i'm tired turning pages on the Subway. I love hardcovers, but seriously, they're really taking up the space and damn hard to carry around. Never a fan of paperbacks (only borrow, never buy if there's a choice, unless it's instructional books).

The damn jacket for the Kindle is $30 :eek: Sorry, my Kindle just gonna be naked until there's a cheaper jacket (if it's on on back order that is).

Anybody know any cheap alternatives to Kindle jackets? It doesn't have to be pretty, good enough to cover up the Kindle so that it doesn't get banged up in the backpack.

Ocelot
02-17-09, 02:39 PM
Although as someone else mentioned, with the Kindle, and others, it looks like you get what you pay for.

The $5 Complete Works collections get great reviews, as they are indexed and allow you to jump to a specific story. They have all sorts of other features.

Others that are free don't have that. You have to page by page go through the entire library.


Exactly... Complete Sherlock Holmes, carry that around with you all the time, priceless (not that people care, but just one example).

Ginwen
02-17-09, 04:45 PM
I preordered a K2.0. I bring a ton of books anytime I go on vacation even a short one so hopefully this will have a positive impact on the weight of my luggage. Anyway, that's my excuse, but I also just want it.

Jay G.
02-17-09, 06:14 PM
Although as someone else mentioned, with the Kindle, and others, it looks like you get what you pay for.

The $5 Complete Works collections get great reviews, as they are indexed and allow you to jump to a specific story. They have all sorts of other features.

Others that are free don't have that. You have to page by page go through the entire library.
Although I don't have a Kindle, I just downloaded "The Adventures of Sherlock Holmes" from www.freekindlebooks.org and opened it with Mobipocket Reader in Windows. This is a collection of short stories, and has an index that allows you to jump to a specific story. So depending on which free book you download, they can have indexes and possibly other features.

Also, I think a lot of the reviews for the "Complete Works" collections are cross-referenced from the print editions, as has happened with this Sherlock Holmes collection:
http://www.amazon.com/Complete-Sherlock-Collection-adventures-Volumes/dp/B0013XW2F4/

I will say, however, for Sherlock Holmes specifically, this Illustrated Kindle edition may be worth the $4, considering most of the the free versions won't include the original illustrations.
http://www.amazon.com/Sherlock-Holmes-Arthur-Conan-Doyle/dp/B0012D1CMY/

Jay G.
02-17-09, 06:27 PM
Just browsing the Kindle Store on Amazon, I see that there's a number of free books offered via their service.

For one, you can likely find a free version of public domain books published by "Public Domain Books", like this version of Dracula:
http://www.amazon.com/Dracula/dp/B000JQUBRM/

However, if you check the "Customers Who Bought This Item Also Bought" section, you'll see a number of non-public-domain books that are currently free, such as The Idiot Girl and the Flaming Tantrum of Death by Laurie Notaro
http://www.amazon.com/Idiot-Girl-Flaming-Tantrum-Death/dp/B00125JO6I/

And The Foreign Correspondent by Alan Furst
http://www.amazon.com/The-Foreign-Correspondent-A-Novel/dp/B000GCFW00/

There's also some romance novels floating around in there.

drmoze
02-18-09, 09:19 PM
Although as someone else mentioned, with the Kindle, and others, it looks like you get what you pay for.

The $5 Complete Works collections get great reviews, as they are indexed and allow you to jump to a specific story. They have all sorts of other features.

Others that are free don't have that. You have to page by page go through the entire library.

Not true at all. Most of the free collections I have for my Reader are nicely formatted, with illustrations, a clickable table of contents (to go directly to different stories), etc. I have a bunch of these collections, like the Wizard of Oz books, Sherlock Holmes, a few Edgar Rice Burroughs series, etc. The mobileread site has many of these ebooks posted in their forums that have been formatted even more nicely by various contributors.

movieking
02-23-09, 10:51 AM
Another question for any PRS-505 owners: do any of you use a storage card, and if so, how successful are you? I know that the specs say that it can handle a 16G card, so I tried mine in it. It takes forever to load anything. I probably only have 2 gigs of stuff on the card, and I've yet to see it load. It actually ran out of power at one point when I decided just to let it go until it loaded. What is the realistic limit that you should have on a card if you really want it to load?

Cory02
02-23-09, 07:24 PM
Just ordered a Kindle 2 today and it should be here tomorrow (splurged for the $3.99 one-day shipping). I know its sounds odd, but as someone that reads quite a bit going to e-Books will be a huge change.

Ocelot
02-24-09, 11:14 AM
Although I don't have a Kindle, I just downloaded "The Adventures of Sherlock Holmes" from www.freekindlebooks.org and opened it with Mobipocket Reader in Windows. This is a collection of short stories, and has an index that allows you to jump to a specific story. So depending on which free book you download, they can have indexes and possibly other features.

Also, I think a lot of the reviews for the "Complete Works" collections are cross-referenced from the print editions, as has happened with this Sherlock Holmes collection:
http://www.amazon.com/Complete-Sherlock-Collection-adventures-Volumes/dp/B0013XW2F4/

I will say, however, for Sherlock Holmes specifically, this Illustrated Kindle edition may be worth the $4, considering most of the the free versions won't include the original illustrations.
http://www.amazon.com/Sherlock-Holmes-Arthur-Conan-Doyle/dp/B0012D1CMY/

thanks for the free books link, got all of them :)

Ocelot
02-24-09, 11:19 AM
For the Sherlock Holmes, i went with this one:

http://www.amazon.com/Complete-Sherlock-Collection-adventures-Volumes/dp/B0013XW2F4/ref=pd_sim_kinc_2

Simply b/c it got more rating than the Illustrated one.

Ocelot
02-24-09, 11:19 AM
Just ordered a Kindle 2 today and it should be here tomorrow (splurged for the $3.99 one-day shipping). I know its sounds odd, but as someone that reads quite a bit going to e-Books will be a huge change.

You can order eBooks while the Kindle is in transit :)

Ocelot
02-24-09, 11:26 AM
IMO, the following free books should be added to your Kindle :)

A Dangerous Man: A Novel [Kindle Edition], Price: $0.00
Six Bad Things: A Novel [Kindle Edition], Price: $0.00
Caught Stealing [Kindle Edition], Price: $0.00

Cory02
02-24-09, 01:53 PM
You can order eBooks while the Kindle is in transit :)

One step ahead of you. Ordered a couple books yesterday after I ordered the Kindle.

Jay G.
02-24-09, 09:05 PM
For the Sherlock Holmes, i went with this one:

http://www.amazon.com/Complete-Sherlock-Collection-adventures-Volumes/dp/B0013XW2F4/ref=pd_sim_kinc_2

Simply b/c it got more rating than the Illustrated one.
Note that the majority of those ratings are for either the paperback or hardcover editions, so the fact that it has more ratings doesn't actually tell you much about the Kindle Edition specifically.

M Polo
02-24-09, 09:17 PM
Gave in and just ordered myself a Kindle 2 w/ the leather cover. I love having the actual books but I travel 5 days a week all year long and I just figure this will be the best way for me to read books, news, etc.

I look forward to it getting here on Thursday. Also I second picking up those free books by Charlie Huston. Excellent books, excellent writer.

Deke Rivers
02-25-09, 09:41 AM
Just ordered a Kindle 2 today and it should be here tomorrow (splurged for the $3.99 one-day shipping). I know its sounds odd, but as someone that reads quite a bit going to e-Books will be a huge change.

actually the convenience of it along with the clear crisp type has caused me to read more than I ever have

Ocelot
02-25-09, 12:14 PM
i just loaded the thing with enough free books to last me an entire year... I don't think Host for $10 is a good deal. Just pay few more bucks and you can have the hardcover. Of course, few bucks is few bucks, still a better buy on the Kindle, just that lending your copy to a friend after you're done is tricky...

Ocelot
02-25-09, 12:15 PM
Note that the majority of those ratings are for either the paperback or hardcover editions, so the fact that it has more ratings doesn't actually tell you much about the Kindle Edition specifically.

i know.. damn, bad impulse buy... shoulda went with the illustrated one :(

meglet
02-25-09, 12:32 PM
Just ordered a Kindle 2 today and it should be here tomorrow (splurged for the $3.99 one-day shipping). I know its sounds odd, but as someone that reads quite a bit going to e-Books will be a huge change.

actually the convenience of it along with the clear crisp type has caused me to read more than I ever have

My first Kindle arrived yesterday, and e-books are such a huge change for me that I still have 3 paperbacks on order, out for delivery today. :confused:

And Deke is right about the benefits of the nice clear e-ink. I tend to read cheap paperbacks, and the print always looks fuzzy to me (yes, I've had my eyes checked.) The type on the Kindle is perfect, plus you can increase the font sized if the default size is too small for you.

Web
02-27-09, 05:20 PM
I got my kindle 2 yesterday. I wish it wasn't so wide. I thought it would be the size of a paperback but it's bigger. Not a big deal, just a wish. I'm finding it hard to get used to. What I like in a book is being able to see how much more I have to read or when the chapter ends. Can't really do that with this. It's kind of lifeless. And because all books look the same on here, it's like all one big book to me. Sometimes I like reading different editions of the same novel. The print is different, the feel is different, etc. But that would be pointless on this. And I don't like that. I don't get the same sense of accomplishment after reading that I do with books. But I'll keep trying.

JimJ
02-28-09, 03:46 AM
Ordering a Kindle as soon as my tax check gets here (probably Monday, shouldn't be later than Tuesday). I'm just hoping it's still in stock by then.

meglet
02-28-09, 05:31 PM
I got my kindle 2 yesterday. I wish it wasn't so wide. I thought it would be the size of a paperback but it's bigger. Not a big deal, just a wish. I'm finding it hard to get used to. What I like in a book is being able to see how much more I have to read or when the chapter ends. Can't really do that with this. It's kind of lifeless. And because all books look the same on here, it's like all one big book to me. Sometimes I like reading different editions of the same novel. The print is different, the feel is different, etc. But that would be pointless on this. And I don't like that. I don't get the same sense of accomplishment after reading that I do with books. But I'll keep trying.

Can't help you with the chapter thing, but the bar across the bottom when you're reading a book is the indicator of how far along you are.

The little row of dots under each title in the home page is also an indicator, although I haven't quite figured out how to interpret that one yet. Something to do with how long Kindle thinks that book is compared to the other books, and then how far along in that book you are.

I have to admit, after 4 days I'm still not quite adjusted to reading on Kindle. I was able to change the font and line spacing to get more words on one page, which helps it look more familiar to me, since I'm used to paperbacks where 2 pages worth of words are visible at once. The width of Kindle doesn't bother me, but after a while I find it's too thin to hold comfortably in one hand and hit the page buttons with that thumb. I picked up the Amazon Kindle cover on a coworker's recommendation, and with the front flap folded back, it's now the perfect size for comfortable one-handed use.

My plan for this weekend is to spend as much time as possible reading my Kindle so I get very used to it. Sounds like a hardship, really. :)

darkside
02-28-09, 07:02 PM
Exactly... Complete Sherlock Holmes, carry that around with you all the time, priceless (not that people care, but just one example).

I have the eReader version of this with me at all times. A must have for me. I've probably read it through a dozen times the past 10 years or so.

Ginwen
03-02-09, 01:26 PM
It has taken me a few days, but I'm getting adjusted to mine and now I think it's pretty cool. Mobileread.com was a big help for things like library books (which require some tools to use on your kindle) and free books. I got a couple of "books" on Mobileread that basically consist of links to hundreds (or thousands maybe) of free books and stories you can get wirelessly on your kindle (including the complete sherlock holmes, with illustrations and well-formatted).

meglet
03-04-09, 04:01 PM
The Kindle app for iPhone was released today. No Kindle required, you can send samples and Kindle books straight to the iPhone. (Currently you can't purchase directly from the iPhone app, unless you are buying from the end page of a sample.)

As a Kindle owner, I find this little app a great compliment to my Kindle. Thanks to Whispersync both devices remember my place in my book, and it's nice for the times I don't have my Kindle with me, such as when I was only supposed to be running some quick errands and then ended up stuck at the pharmacy for an hour without my Kindle.

Ocelot
03-09-09, 11:29 AM
^ same here... it's value added :D

oh, those of you got the kindle 2.0, please don't buy any of the price bloated jackets? The Amazon one cost $30 and can't close. The latest ones cost $100 :eek:

Anyhow, i got my Kindle 2.0 jacket for $8 from Target. All you need to do is rip out the blank journal pages and use mounting tapes. Well, i won't be able to take out the Kindle w/o remounting, but hell, i don't see any reason why i ever need to take it out of the jacket... Oh yeah, like open the back cover and put a SD card. But why? I'm not gonna use it for pictures, mp3...

Between now, the free books i got before are no longer free, but a new set of books are free :D I'm building a quite library in my Kindle for free.

meglet
03-09-09, 02:28 PM
I do have the Amazon cover for the Kindle 2, and they've done a very nice job with it. The hinge clip system works very well, and I have no problems with the cover falling open when it shouldn't.

There are other covers available besides the $100 Cole Haan covers and the $30 Amazon cover, some of which have very nice closure systems, some of which use the hinge system. Any of which I personally would prefer to cutting apart a cheap journal cover and gluing my Kindle to it permanently.

Ocelot
03-10-09, 10:57 AM
^^^ obviously you never saw my $8 Kindle 2.0 jacket :D

Trust me, it's much much much more professional looking than one of those insanely priced jackets ($30 is the lowest). I have a magnetic button to keep the jacket closed ;)

Oh, it's not glued to the jacket permanently... i guess some people don't have or like crafty hands?

I think the term is "inexpensive" not "cheap." Trust me, a good looking blank journal books is not CHEAP. I happen to find one that was on clearance. The material is very good, black leather, no nasty residues like one of the jackets they sell on Amazon. The magnetic button is a big bonus. As for the spine and overall size, it holds the Kindle 2.0 perfectly!

So yeah, that's a saving of $22 for books (discount from $30 Amazon jacket). I feel sorry for those buying the $100 jacket, but then again, they got money to burn... Remind me again why some people need to be bailed out?

Ocelot
03-10-09, 11:25 AM
The Babysitter's Code (Kindle Edition) is FREE, FYI... the author got 4 stars ratings.

The other free books are:

Assassin's Apprentice (Kindle Edition)
by Robin Hobb
Kindle Price: $0.00

Red Mars (Kindle Edition)
by Kim Stanley Robinson
Kindle Price: $0.00

His Majesty's Dragon (Kindle Edition)
by Naomi Novik
Kindle Price: $0.00

Blood Engines (Kindle Edition)
by T.A. Pratt
Kindle Price: $0.00

Settling Accounts Return Engagement (Kindle Edition)
by Harry Turtledove
Kindle Price: $0.00

Ocelot
03-10-09, 12:06 PM
Free Kindle Books (http://www.amazon.com/s/qid=1234454875/ref=sr_st?keywords=-domain&rs=154606011&page=1&rh=n%3A154606011%2Ck%3A-domain&sort=price)

Sorted by price, the free ones first and then the penny ones...

stp115
03-10-09, 11:26 PM
The Kindle books are also free on Sony's website too. FYI...

movieking
03-11-09, 07:33 AM
Yeah, I saw those on the sony website, but after reading the description, they really don't seem like my type of thing so I haven't downloaded them yet. I've still got 7 or 9 free books from the last time they had some free stuff, and haven't gotten around to those either.

Ocelot
03-11-09, 11:18 AM
I played around with the Mobiopocket creator software a bit and wow, all of sudden, more books for my Kindle! Granted that the imported books will not show up in my Kindle account (i.e. my registered iPod touch will not see the imported title), but still, totally awesome!

I've been testing Chinese pdfs using both the software and Kindle's document conversion service (free, if you use your Kindle e-mail account), but that didn't go well... Kindle can't do Chinese for the moment :(

meglet
03-11-09, 01:28 PM
I played around with the Mobiopocket creator software a bit and wow, all of sudden, more books for my Kindle! Granted that the imported books will not show up in my Kindle account (i.e. my registered iPod touch will not see the imported title), but still, totally awesome!

I've been testing Chinese pdfs using both the software and Kindle's document conversion service (free, if you use your Kindle e-mail account), but that didn't go well... Kindle can't do Chinese for the moment :(

Mobipocket creator is great. I've converted a bunch of the PDFs that come with my technical manuals, the manual for my camera, Word documents that I've created from technical websites. . . .

I just wish it worked on Macs, as that's mainly what I use at home, and where most of my documents are stored.

For more free books, check out the Baen Free Library (http://www.baen.com/) if you are a sci-fi/fantasy fan. They even have an option for emailing directly to the Kindle if you don't want to have to load the file via USB, and don't mind the $.10 charge. (Note that I have not seen ANY reports of Amazon charging anyone yet.) If you get a book from Baen that is missing some metadata-the one I downloaded didn't have the author listing-you should be able to fix that using mobi2mobi software.

Ocelot
03-12-09, 10:51 AM
^ yeah, the missing or incorrect metadata bugs me to no end :mad:

i have to fix it whenever i see the wrong title, author on the Kindle (even though the reading material is fine). i guess i'm being anal...

Ocelot
03-12-09, 11:06 AM
p.s. i'm loving my Kindle more everyday, it's truly an awesome reading device :)

no more bookmarks (i don't know how many bookmarks l lost over the years, not a deal breaker, but from time to time, i do search for the damn bookmark when i have to get off the train)

no more flipping pages to find my place (don't happen all the time, but annoying when it does happen)

no more carrying multiple books in series because i'm almost done with one and don't wanna go home to continue my reading (oh, i hate it when i have to carry two Twilight hardcovers with me).

dictionary, just place the cursor on the word!

no more numb hands/arms from holding a hardcover on the train (usually i don't get a seat) i can turn the page w/o losing balance too!

no more disappointing trips to the library, hooray!

i can jump between books with ease, it was a new experience, totally! i can read a short story if the time is short and savor the long novel later.

book conversations, did you read this or that? oh, not yet, but i'm sending a sample to my Kindle now ;) (totally wow'd people)

best of all, i have my favorite books with me all the time (well, if i carry the Kindle or iPod touch that is)!

i haven't use the MP3, audio book portion of the Kindle, but it's a bonus i don't praise much (Text to speech is horrible).

i haven't use memos and highlighters yet, but they can be very handy later on.

Deke Rivers
03-12-09, 12:19 PM
p.s. i'm loving my Kindle more everyday, it's truly an awesome reading device :)

no more bookmarks (i don't know how many bookmarks l lost over the years, not a deal breaker, but from time to time, i do search for the damn bookmark when i have to get off the train)

no more flipping pages to find my place (don't happen all the time, but annoying when it does happen)

no more carrying multiple books in series because i'm almost done with one and don't wanna go home to continue my reading (oh, i hate it when i have to carry two Twilight hardcovers with me).

dictionary, just place the cursor on the word!

no more numb hands/arms from holding a hardcover on the train (usually i don't get a seat) i can turn the page w/o losing balance too!

no more disappointing trips to the library, hooray!

i can jump between books with ease, it was a new experience, totally! i can read a short story if the time is short and savor the long novel later.

book conversations, did you read this or that? oh, not yet, but i'm sending a sample to my Kindle now ;) (totally wow'd people)

best of all, i have my favorite books with me all the time (well, if i carry the Kindle or iPod touch that is)!

i haven't use the MP3, audio book portion of the Kindle, but it's a bonus i don't praise much (Text to speech is horrible).

i haven't use memos and highlighters yet, but they can be very handy later on.
Glad to see you "get it" instead of complaining that you cant make phone calls..text ..or take picture with it...
its an awesome e-reader for all the points you have mentioned

Ocelot
03-12-09, 03:42 PM
Why the hell people want the Kindle to make phone calls or taking pictures? It's too bulky and unnatural for that! Well, it's not a Transformer you know ;)

Actually, the #1 reason for me is "easy on the eyes." People say i'll miss the fresh smell of inks from the real books. Well, i told them "i don't know about you, but i don't like the smell of my books let along the inks." Who the hell smell their books, seriously :lol: I collect hardcovers and i really enjoy reading them and looking at them, but never smell them...

Deke Rivers
03-13-09, 08:32 AM
Why the hell people want the Kindle to make phone calls or taking pictures? It's too bulky and unnatural for that! Well, it's not a Transformer you know ;)

Actually, the #1 reason for me is "easy on the eyes." People say i'll miss the fresh smell of inks from the real books. Well, i told them "i don't know about you, but i don't like the smell of my books let along the inks." Who the hell smell their books, seriously :lol: I collect hardcovers and i really enjoy reading them and looking at them, but never smell them...

exactly..that was the main reason I got one last year (I have a kindle 1). The e-ink technology makes reading a pleasure again..my eyes seme to get worse every year..plus i dont like tryign to find more room for bookshelves..
yea you know people..since its 300 some bucks they expect it to do everything up to and including making morning coffee for them :)

Ocelot
03-13-09, 01:22 PM
wow, i'm impressed with your reading attitude :)

Both Kindle 1.0 and 2.0? So do you use both (can you?) or you detached the 1.0 from your Kindle account and give it to somebody else?

If there's a Kindle 3.0, i wish Amazon have some kind of trade-in promotion, so that those of us want to upgrade can get it cheaper... I'm surprised that they didn't offer this for the 1.0 users.

Deke Rivers
03-13-09, 03:09 PM
wow, i'm impressed with your reading attitude :)

Both Kindle 1.0 and 2.0? So do you use both (can you?) or you detached the 1.0 from your Kindle account and give it to somebody else?

If there's a Kindle 3.0, i wish Amazon have some kind of trade-in promotion, so that those of us want to upgrade can get it cheaper... I'm surprised that they didn't offer this for the 1.0 users.
no I dont have a Kindle 2..just a Kindle 1..

Ocelot
03-13-09, 03:37 PM
oh, gotcha... sorry, i misread your earlier post. Well, it was difficult to secure a Kindle 1.0 in the beginning... As a matter of fact, people on the Kindle 1.0 waiting list were automatically upgraded to Kindle 2.0 (duh, they don't make Kindle 1.0 anymore).

Ocelot
03-16-09, 04:19 PM
i just find out that the Kindle is an excellent manga reader :)

http://foosoft.net/mangle/

Deke Rivers
03-17-09, 08:59 AM
i just find out that the Kindle is an excellent manga reader :)

http://foosoft.net/mangle/

the Kindle 2 is..the Kindle 1 did not do graphics all that well

Ocelot
03-17-09, 09:21 AM
^ didn't know that, but the mangle program is for Kindle 1.0 as well. Well, BW manga pages should be fine. Before the mangle thing, i just couldn't get the pages "max'd" up. They're centered and "fit" to screen with plenty of white spaces to pan out.

Anyhow, it's great... The screen is not perfect, but way better than the PSP and Touch,

Ocelot
03-24-09, 02:59 PM
I just learned another cool thing to do on the Kindle. This, by far, the best "feature." It's truly remarkable when it's used with the free Whispernet :)

Credit goes to mobileeread of course...

On your Kindle's browser, just enter the following:

http://www.feedbooks.com/kindleguide


Save the file... Once that's done, go to the Main Home menu, you'll see the new Feedbooks document. Viola, more free books for your Kindle, download them virtually anywhere, no computer required :)

Ginwen
03-25-09, 01:36 AM
I just learned another cool thing to do on the Kindle. This, by far, the best "feature." It's truly remarkable when it's used with the free Whispernet :)

Credit goes to mobileeread of course...

On your Kindle's browser, just enter the following:

http://www.feedbooks.com/kindleguide


Save the file... Once that's done, go to the Main Home menu, you'll see the new Feedbooks document. Viola, more free books for your Kindle, download them virtually anywhere, no computer required :)


Mobileread also has it's own list that also allows you to download straight to your kindle: http://www.mobileread.com/mobiguide

Feedbook's list has some good organization and categories (so it's pretty easy to find stuff). Mobileread's list big advantage is tons of books, and they get new ones every day.

Once you've got them, each list also contains a link so you can get the latest version of the list (and just delete the old one).

The only reason for me to actually connect my kindle to my computer now is for library books.

Ocelot
03-25-09, 09:45 AM
oh, thanks! Even better :)

i'm years behind my reading now...

As for library ebooks, i don't know how that works (i know they expire after certain date), where can i get more info? Thanks in advance...

drmoze
03-29-09, 12:44 AM
oh, thanks! Even better :)

i'm years behind my reading now...

As for library ebooks, i don't know how that works (i know they expire after certain date), where can i get more info? Thanks in advance...

Sorry, AFAIK you'll need a Sony Reader to take advantage of free online borrowing from electronic libraries. :shrug: I don't think the Kindle handles the formats required (secure Adobe or Mobipocket). So, no trips to the library with the Kindle, but no access to online libraries either! :P

Ocelot
03-30-09, 11:22 AM
^ thanks DrMoze, i have enough reading materials for now, so i can wait for the library thing (it's a matter of time).

anyhow, i just had my first real frustration with the Kindle 2... Helps appreciated!

It seems that there's a picture bug in the Kindle 2. Any pictures in the full display format will not be displayed properly (i.e. blank screen). However, if you press the Home or Menu button, the picture mysteriously appears... Then again, if you press the next page button, nothing! This is annoying since the picture part of the Kindle is very useful. Home made picture books, family photo slides, and of course, manga...

The solution was to reset the Kindle and try not to press any text buttons while browsing the pictures (and try not to do it full display mode too). It's a lot to remember and the part not to use Full Display is a killer!

Anyway, do any of you ever reset the Kindle 2? You know, hold the slide button for 15 secs or so? What happens if you do a reset? Do you lose all of your bookmarks, footnotes and such?


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