Unspeaked

Thanks for the help!

Apone

I would recommend between Kino and Image. It's a hard choice.

DVDBeaver

DVDcompare

Personally I would get Kino since it is presented with less cropping and it is an amaray case. However I watched the Image version at campus but didn't notice the "translucent line" at the time (maybe because the TV was so small).

MechanicalMan

I recommend the Kino DVD. But as you can see from the images at DVDBeaver, the first few minutes of the film are in really bad shape on Kino's DVD.

edit: There is another good comparison of the DVDs at silentera.com

Carcosa

There are no superior transfers available...the Kino and David Shepard editions both have good and bad points...get them both is my answer.

Carcosa

Late response...

Long story short...there are no quality prints existing; most were destroyed as the result of being on the losing end of a legal battle. We are really lucky to have it at all.

Drop

Hmm, I was going to reply to the topic of this thread, but I realized it's old now, and I'm sure the person made there person.

Well, here's my two cents anyway: If you only get one copy, get the Kino version. The first segment looks bad, but you get used to it quickly, it's atleast consistent for that segment. The line on the Image edition is much more jarring. Although I believe the Image disc has better special features (it doesn't but apparantly the music is better).

It's a shame there isn't a definitive answer.

caiman

I'm still needing some opinions on this. I've been wanting this for a while, but can't decide on which version. I've seen the Image version and thought the picture was ok, but hated the horizontal line. BUT, the music was great. I hear that the Kino version uses a different soundtrack, which I hear is subpar to the Image orchestral soundtrack. Yet the Kino has better picture quality (the first 5 minutes notwithstanding).

So my question is, how much worse is the soundtrack on the Kino version? Is it worse enough to warrant choosing the Image release?

Carcosa

Correction....I DON"T know what I was thinking....NOSFERATU is the title I was refering to above, NOT Caligari. What a DOOFUS I am.

caligulathegod

Are you thinking of the right movie? You seem to be describing Nosferatu. Caligari's trouble was that it was filmed with the line between frames centered on the sprocket holes on either side while current standard puts the line between the two sprocket holes on either side. The best quality 35mm dupe we have was transferred by someone not paying attention which caused a line running through the image at the top of the frame. All other prints are 16mm reduction prints in shabby states of repair. We're lucky to have any film from the nitrate era, especially silents.




EDIT** Oops, ninja'd

Carcosa

No...I was ABSOLUTELY thinking of the wrong movie. See the post just before yours.....

I know NOTHING about the backround of the making "Caligari"...that is interesting stuff there. I love this kind of backround info....

Drop

The music is fine on the Kino. You get two options, music composed by Donald Sosin (which I think is the default) and a contemporary orchestral score by Rainer Viertblock.

It's down to preference because there it's not like there is an original score to go with. Can't really remember the Image soundtrack, so I can't compare, but I liked both of the scores on the Kino. They're pretty different.

You can always use music you like, like they did in the old days.

Ultimately I find the picture to be much more important in this case, and in every way, the Kino matches it much closer to the original than the Image. I actually like the five bad minutes on the Kino edition, somewhat adds to the atmosphere, and just looks cleaner than the Image.

caligulathegod

Yeah, that's what my "Ninja'd" comment was about. You sneaked in and beat me while I was researching the details.

Zodiac_Speaking

I once owned the Image version. On silents, I don't complain too much about pic quality since most of these we're lucky they've survived all these years, so the issue to me on the Image picture is minor. It featured a really good scholarly audio commentary, which I believe is a must for silents (especially classics).

Get the Kino for the best possible a/v, if that's your biggest concern, but they don't have much in terms of extras.

Image's Nosferatu is the one to get, again for extras. I recently watched Kino's The Golem and as good as the A/V is, I really wished for the price, it featured a com track. But the Kino version of Man Who Laughs is amazing (origin of The Joker!!).

Drop

I disagree entirely about the picture. It's a pretty big deal, especially when one is much better. If you don't care about extras at all, then the Kino is the one to get on both of those films (and Kino's extras are better on the Caligari disc, aside from the commentary track on the Image disc). Kino's Noferatu is also longer than Image's and has proper tinting (which is highly important). The version they show of Nosferatu in the theatres now is the one on Kino's disc.

Seriously check out the dvdbeaver comparison and tell me it doesn't make a difference. Notice how Orlock's head his cut off in one capture on the Image disc and that it's improperly tinted. Without the blue tint it ruins the illusion of nightime.

The commentary is worth it on the Image disc though. Althought I don't think just because a film has an informative and scholarly track that makes it a better disc (if it's a fun one, however...). All of that is information you can read about somewhere else anyway, but if you buy just one disc you're stuck with that transfer. So it's not even a question for me.

Anyway, If your going to get those two films might as well just spring for the German Horror Classics box set by Kino (has the Golem and Waxworks). Get it on one of those Deep Discount or DVD Planet sales, and the price is perfect.

Zodiac_Speaking

I always forget about dvdbeaver.

Seeing that makes me want to own both. It's really a toss up; Kino has a sharper detail and does look like its a better restoration, but I don't like their color tinting (if its the correct-as in they showed it like that in the 20s, then okay).

Guess I'm gonna get both-in time. But for me personally i like to have audio comms on my silent films. It offers another chance to learn more.

Looks like if you have both, you would have 4 audio optins, not including the audio com. Wowzers!

Drop

Yea I really wish they could just work together and give the best possible presentation. I'm sure when they get to high-def they'll do even better.

Carcosa

I'm surprised that Photoplay Productions haven't tackled this film. I just checked their list of restored films and it is not among them that I can see.

I wonder why so many of their restorations are not available on home video....