Kinski

Hi, I'm new to the forum and am looking for some advice on buying a projector. I know nothing about projectors so really need the help. What I’m passionate about is films, and now I’ve got to the stage where I may be able to start watching them on a better setup.

However, the budget still needs to be as low as possible. So I’ll give you as much specifics as I can and hopefully you’ll be able to tell me whether it’ll be financially feasible to have a working setup. If you need any specific information for what requirements I might want or need, feel free to ask.

Okay. Here’s what I have to work with. The room that the projector can be put in allows the projector to be placed 13-14 feet away from the screen. The screen can be any size up to around 7x5 feet. What sort of picture quality/size could I expect from these dimensions? Also, the room that the projector will be placed in is a relatively light room with a window placed directly behind where the projector will be positioned. Will this be a problem, are there affordable projectors that can cope with these conditions?

There are the obvious requirements that it would be better for the projector to have; as long lamp life as possible, as bright as possible, as clear/well defined as possible. It also has to have outlets for video and dvd (obviously) and ideally could be put into my NAD amplifier to use my hifi speakers. It has to be mounted from the ceiling as well, or at least from some wall mount.

From what little I’ve heard, some of the lower budget projectors (DLP to be specific – the type I’m probably after) suffer from some sort of motion trouble and have a hard time projecting movement and colour. Is this a serious noticeable problem? Also, is it completely necessary to have a screen, or is a good, relatively flat white wall nearly as good?

Thanks for any help you can give me. Lord knows I need it. Don’t forget to ask me questions for more specific requirements as well, or if you need any more information.

Cheers.

Kinski

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention. It has to be able to project in every aspect ratio imaginable (or as many as possible). I cannot afford to spend this much money and have parts of the picture missing!

Also, when I said 13-14 feet from the screen, I meant that as the maximum. Of course it can be placed closer.

DthRdrX

Sanyo Z3 is what I have and it would probably work perfect for you. LCD 16:9 720p projector that can be found for around 1200-1300 right now. I also have a window behind mine and I suggest just covering it up when you use the projector. I don't think there are any 720p DLPs in this price range yet.

I can tell you that the Z3 is really quiet, easy to use and the colors are incredible.

broadwayblue

projectors generally come in one aspect ratio. most newer model lcd or dlp projectors are 16:9. if you want to project a different ratio you can, but you will have bars on the sides (for 4:3) or top and bottom (for 1.85 or 2.35:1) if you can't deal with bars you can use masking to cover them. you didn't state the lighting conditions in the room, but assuming it will be mostly controlled (dark) with minimal ambient light you should be fine with the newer models. personally i think the 720p lcd projectors give the best bang for the buck...and can be had for around $1500. others prefer the deeper blacks of DLP, but that's gonna run you an extra grand (assuming you don't drop down to a 480p model.) at 13 or 14 feet your 7' wide screen will be a little on the small side, but you didn't state what your actual viewing distance will be. both my throw distance (lens to screen) and viewing distance (eyes to screen) are nearly identical (about 12 feet) and i'm projecting a 112" diagonal image with my panny AE700 (last year's model.) i pity everyone who doesn't have a projector...they really have no idea what they are missing!

Kinski

Viewing distance and throw distance will be equal.

Thanks for all your help guys.

Slayer2005

"Low as possible" isn't enough to go on. That could be $500 or $2,000 for all we know. What is your budget for the projector?

The InFocus 4805 can be had for about $500-$700 and looks almost like a 9ft diagonal Plasma TV.

A flat white wall will work ok enough, but a screen is best. The main problem with all digital projectors is black level, but most will find a DLP like the 4805 to have a good enough black level.

It would also help if you gave us a percentage of your expected viewing habits (ie DVD, HD, Video games, etc) and how often you will view in ambient light and how much ambient light. Or if you are looking for a projector that provides the best quality in the dark.

Here's some screenshots of my 4805 at 9ft diagonal on my Silver Torus screen. The colors are more saturated in person btw and even better in the dark. These were taken to show off my screen's ambient light ability, but they give at least an idea of what to expect (the darker pieces are matte white samples I used for comparison against my screen):







The photos above were taken with a camcorder, so it can't always produce what I see. Here's a more accurate picture of what I saw on the second picture (even better with the light off):



Note though that my ambient light performance with my 4805 is because I am using a high gain silver torus screen, so don't expect quite as good ambient light performance on your wall should you get the 4805.

Kinski

Okay, lets say that I want to keep the price in the hundreds. $500-700 is ideal.

My viewing habits will be pretty much exclusively DVD, with the occasional video, or very very occasional bit of TV maybe.

I will be using the projector predominantly at night. Maybe during the daytime on weekends. With summer coming it's going to stay light quite late though. I've got some pretty thick curtains up and there doesn't have to be any ambient light at all.

Those pictures you showed look absolutely fantastic! What sort of screen size can I expect with a throw distance of 14 foot on this projector? Can it cope with all aspect ratios? I don't really mind if there are bars as long as it can project everything in OAR.

That looks like unbelievably good value for money though.

P.S. Do you reckon this is worth bidding on? Is it the same model as yours?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...MEWA%3AIT&rd=1

Thanks!

Josh Z

In addition to what others have said, I recommend you read some reviews at www.projectorcentral.com and do more research in the projector and screen forums at www.avsforum.com.

DthRdrX

The 4805 is a terrific value. Just check on projectorcentral to make sure the throw distance matches the screen size you want to use. Also, I'll suggest before buying the 4805 you should first find out how sensitive to rainbows you are. Some people can't see them, others get headaches watching them.

Dlp vs LCD

onabudget

Kinski,
I have the 4805 at 14' from the screen and also have my seatting position below it. I project onto an 88" Carada, only because the width of a 90"+ screen could not fit in my apartment.

You can use Infocus' projection calculator to figure out the general numbers. Just keep in mind that with this PJ it is best to seat at a distance equal to 2x the width of your screen.

For more advanced numbers, use their Excel calculator

Kinski

So what image size can I expect from the 4805 from 13 foot away? I was hoping for around 7 foot at least. Could someone who owns one please tell me, because none of the calculators have it, as I don't believe they're still made.

I'm not sure how I'll check whether I'm sensitive to rainbows either, as I don't have access to a DLP.

Keep the good advice coming.

Sdallnct

Slayer2005, you have a link for your screen material? Would like to read up on it...

X

74 to 88 inches wide.

Slayer2005

I discovered this material a couple years back, but the material isn't intended or marketed for projection screen use.

It's called Silver PVC and it won't work as a flat screen. It needs to be curved though to work. The material is very reflective with a gain of probably around 10 or so (way higher than even most high gain screens), therefor it needs to be curved to get rid of the servere hot spot. It can be found at www.mjtrends.com.

I'm glad I found it though, because even when I had it flat I saw great potential in the screen that took me two years to finally realize. I always could see that had fantastic colors and good ambient light performance for a front projection screen, but when the screen is flat it literally reflects a bulbs light quite harshly. Curving also helps get rid of a bulb's reflection on the screen.

Slayer2005

Most people do not see rainbows and most people that do rarely see them. When you see it it's a slight rainbow trail on part of the image that last for a fraction of a second. Generally it's caused by rapid eye movement like darting your eyes. I can usually only see them if I try really hard. Occassionally I'll dart my eyes and see a quick flash. Hardly a problem.

Some that are sensitive to them have said they diminish or go away with time. I believe overly sensitive people dart their eyes more than they realize.

BTW, most people don't know this, but you can use a wide angle camera lens to increase picture size by 40-60% (depending on the lens) without needing more distance.

You need not worry about the aspect ratio. It can do 16:9, 2.35:1 with bars and it can stretch 4:3 to fit 16:9 or crop 4:3 to fill the 16:9 ratio (I prefer usually because it doesn't stretch the picture).

It's a great little projector. I'll probably be selling mine in the near future, because it's just not at the same level as my $700 CRT front projector, but that's to be expected. Still, very nice for a digital. Besisde the picture quality advantage and massive black level advantage with CRT I don't have to worry about buying expensive replacement lamps.

Sdallnct

+10! WOW that is bright. Since I use digital right now and likely will stay with it, I would really lose blacks on something that bright. Very interesting though...

onabudget

Sorry that the first link didn't work. Try this one . According to that calc, at 13' throw distance, you can project 84" to 101". Again, keep in mind that you have to seat at 2x the screen width. Also download the IF excel calc to figure out all the measurements you need to deal with for this PJ (

Sdallnct

I have my X-1 right at 13 feet from my DIY 94" WS. My front row is 11.5 feet and my rear row right under the PJ at 13.5 feet. The front row is fine for DVD and HD, but to close for SD. The rear row is perhaps a touch better on DVD, maybe a touch better on HD (but hard to say both are excellent) but SD is still not that good. But I think that is more a case of the X-1 not handling SD well at all AND I'm really getting use to the HD

The calculator at PJ has recommended seating distances.

X

Your numbers are diagonal, mine were width. I don't know what Kinski's 7' reference applied to but it looks like he can achieve it either way.

Remember, the 2x rule for SDE is based on width, not diagonal measure.

Kinski

The 7' was for diagonal. So yeah, hopefully I'll be able to achieve that.

Thanks for all your help everyone.

Kinski

Just a couple more questions.

Will I be able to put headphones into the projector and/or be able to hook it up to my amplifier easily?

Also, how much should I be prepared to pay for one of these second hand (with 200 hours used)? I don't want to be ripped off, so I need to have a cut off point, where I say to myself that I'm not going to spend any more.

Thanks.

Spiky

No, the headphones would need to go into your amp.

Kinski

Ok that's not a problem. It's just that my amp is at the opposite end of the room to where the projector will be. So either I'll have to move it (which I didn't really want to do and am not sure whether I'll be able to) or I'll have to use a great deal of wire, which will be almost impossible to conceal.

Slayer2005

Kinski, if you buy one with hours on the lamp already get one with at least 50-100 hours, because some people may be resetting the lamp after racking up hundreds or thousands of hours. If you can buy a refurb. They sometimes offer extended warranties for a small fee.

Kinski

One more question before I hopefully get my projector.

I'm looking for ceiling mounts now and have just wondered about something. My ceilings are really high and I've decided to have my screen relatively high as well.

All the mounts that I've looked at don't come down very far from the ceiling. Is the projector going to be able to project properly if it's suspended a foot and a half above where the top of the screen begins? By my calculations, this will mean that it'll be dipped and therefore the light wont be meeting the screen square on. Is this usual?

Thanks for the help.