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Review request: L`appartement and La Haine Region 3

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Review request: L`appartement and La Haine Region 3

Old 10-12-03, 04:52 PM
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Review request: L`appartement and La Haine Region 3

Just wondering if anyone could comment on the quality of these releases ( video, sound, etc). I was thinking about grabbing these along with the Korean releases of a Short Film about Killing and a Short film about Love. Thanks.
Old 10-12-03, 08:25 PM
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I once owned the R3 of La Haine. The subs were a little quirky in their translation at times, but it did not deter from the viewing of the film. It is a 16/9 transfer if I remember correctly and I thought it was of a good, clear quality with very little artifacts or other interferences taking away from it; sound was also fairly good. The trailor and extra scene also are added. But from discussions that have gone over the last year or so on this title, it is supposedly cut, but what was cut I don't remember ever hearing....I liked it and was happy with its quality...L'appartement, I own the R2 French edition, which you may want to get along with the French La Haine since it is superior to the R3.
Old 10-12-03, 11:25 PM
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Originally posted by lostatmidnight
L'appartement, I own the R2 French edition, which you may want to get along with the French La Haine since it is superior to the R3.
Agreed. Anamorphic, DTS sound, and best of all, English subs!

By the way, a Hollywood remake of L'Appartement is due next year. Retitled Wicker Park and starring ....... Josh Hartnett. UGH.
Old 10-14-03, 03:20 AM
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I've got the French R2 of La Haine and can vouch for a very good anamorphic transfer and an even better film... with English subs.

As for the R3 though, don't know, sorry.
Old 10-14-03, 07:08 AM
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Originally posted by Rusty James
Agreed. Anamorphic, DTS sound, and best of all, English subs!
Any idea where I might be able to get L'appartement?
Old 10-14-03, 12:42 PM
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www.alapage.com still has a copy. amazon.fr and other French DVD sites are apparently out of the title. I think the UK version of L'Appartement is inferior to the French one.

A region 1 version may come since the remake "Wicker Park" is due for a spring 2004 release.

Last edited by peter07; 10-14-03 at 12:59 PM.
Old 10-14-03, 02:26 PM
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keep an eye here:
http://www.machiaveldvd.com/main.cfm...&CAT_ID=&type=

and here as well:
http://www.cinestore.com/html/fiche_...ts.php?id=1659

I own both the L'appartement and La Haine and they are years ahead of their British counterparts.

review of the French L'appartement (which unlike the British/Australian verison includes a DTS track) here:
http://www.dvdtimes.co.uk/content.php?contentid=4860

La Haine (French, old cover):
http://www.dvdtimes.org.uk/reviews/region2/lahaine.html

and another one with some screen shots in French:
http://www.dvdrama.net/fiche.php?44

Bottom line-
After Girl on the Bridge and Peau d'ange this is one of the best films (L'appartement)in my collection.

ps
If you do a search...we had a thread awhile ago regarding the differences between La Haine(R3) and R2(French).

as to any possible US remake....
Old 10-14-03, 09:54 PM
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pro-bassoonist,
Thanks for the tip about Machiaveldvd.com- it looks like my kind of place. It looks like I will have to pony up for the French discs .

Thanks to everyone for the input.
Old 10-15-03, 08:37 AM
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You're welcome.

By the way I have to pass on my biass along so if you do not own Girl On the Bridge...please consider it! (your significant other will thank you later).

The Australian version (identical to the British one) is availbale here (the cheapest one):
http://www.ezydvd.com.au/item.zml/222431 or you could pick it up from Michael.

Cheers!

Last edited by pro-bassoonist; 10-15-03 at 08:40 AM.
Old 10-15-03, 12:18 PM
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Originally posted by pro-bassoonist
You're welcome.

By the way I have to pass on my biass along so if you do not own Girl On the Bridge...please consider it! (your significant other will thank you later).
I love this movie...When one say's it is beautiful, it really is.
I cringe at the remake of L'appartement...*shivers*
Old 10-15-03, 10:28 PM
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I guess I have to add another title to my wish list, you are costing me a fortune pro-bassonist
Old 10-15-03, 10:38 PM
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Old 10-16-03, 06:26 PM
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Originally posted by pro-bassoonist
If you do a search...we had a thread awhile ago regarding the differences between La Haine(R3) and R2(French).
Why do you keep perpetuating this rumor that the Korean disc is cut? There is no thread regarding the differences between the R3 and the R2 and there never has been, because nobody who's seen both has ever stepped forward to give a definitive answer. You, however, have repeatedly claimed that the R3 is cut without giving any evidence at all. You even went so far as to make the unfounded assumption that the deleted scenes presented on the Korean disc were actually cut from the film and were presented in the body of the movie on the French disc. This is completely false. Until somebody offers proof, you need to stop saying that the Korean disc is cut. You've repeated it so many times that people here are starting to believe it without questioning the claim.

Here's a link to that earlier thread:

http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showthr...ighlight=haine

Last edited by SpinnerX; 10-16-03 at 06:29 PM.
Old 10-16-03, 08:54 PM
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Ok here we go again (though I had decided not to pursue this matter for a few reasons I have stated in older threads regarding La Haine). I am going to answer your inquires (again!!) so people could make their own decision and not be influenced by my "false" information.

1. First of all …the very first “assumption” that I would actually call a “claim” that the Korean disc was cut and missing footage was made by Dazza-a forum member from England. I repeatedly pointed this out to you yet you still claim that I was the one that instigated this entire issue. Strange!!!

2.Nevertheless- PLEASE point out to the forum members where have I stated that I own/or have ever owned the Korean disc. PLEASE.....and based my conclusisons on personal observations made after comparing the two.
In a thread I started awhile ago (not the more recent one you have linked but the one before that to which there is a link in the second thread you have posted now) you can find some information regarding my emails to POKER INDUSTRIES. Yet, you always somehow miss to point out that my information in that thread is based on what I got in the email that was sent to me by them and hence my decision to go with the French disc which I currently own. I do believe that this is the BEST PAL release out here as I have owned the Tartan release as well.

3. Another factor- Dazza was the first one to imply that the Korean disc might be missing something..NOT PRO-BASSOONIST!!!! PLEASE TRY TO REMEMBER THIS!!!..only after his statement did I inquire about La Haine and questioned POKER INDUSTRIES whether or not there are any differences. Yet, for whatever reason you like to get in "verbal" disputes with me that I have changed the mass opinion on this board....perhaps you have something personal against me...or simply like to avoid the "little details" from the threads you have linked.

4.Furthermore, I WILL STILL RECOMMEND THE FRENCH disc as it has been noted already about the awkward translation on the Korean disc (you could call this another “assumption” of mine) in other threads and forums (HTF).

5."There is no thread regarding the differences between the R3 and the R2 and there never has been, because nobody who's seen both has ever stepped forward to give a definitive answer. "-
IF THOSE 2 THREADS are not to be considered as valuable information regarding the differences between R2/R3 then I do not know what you could call them....perhaps pointless “assumption”!!! I wish you would step up and clear this fiasco…prove that the Korean disc is identical (or not). I did try with my inquiry to Poker Industries…yet all I see from you is criticism that some of the info might be incorrect. NEVER DID I SAY THAT MY INFO IS 100% correct but I confirmed that "something" is missing! I did point out that I have confirmed from another source (not Dazza)that the disc is cut (and I stand behind my statement as this is the information I received by Poker Industries). As their email saved me money, since I did NOT purchase the Korean disc, I can not point out to you exactly what shots/frames are missing. However I decided that this is a valuable enough info that needs to be shared with the forum. You can call it “assumption” if you wish….up to you.

6."Why do you keep perpetuating this rumor that the Korean disc is cut?"
- one more time to you- Dazza was the first forum member to imply that there might be any differences/cuts in the Korean disc. In the email that I received from POKER INDUSTRIES I was also told that there are cuts. So, for the record I would like to make it as clear as possible- I DID NOT START THIS ISSUE!!

7.Now I have done my part as to claim that the Korean disc is inferior (even more so considering the fact that it is a PAL/NTSC port of the French disc…but that’s another “assumption” and that there might be some "ghosting" issues for people with 16/9 TV's. Since you do not appear to own the Korean disc either I would also like to know (or you could step up) and assure the forum members that the disc is 100% identical to the French release and there are not cuts made.

Hope this makes it clear for all members that consider a purchase of La Haine…regardless of the region coding.

Last edited by pro-bassoonist; 10-16-03 at 09:05 PM.
Old 10-17-03, 12:03 AM
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Originally posted by pro-bassoonist
First of all …the very first “assumption” that I would actually call a “claim” that the Korean disc was cut and missing footage was made by Dazza-a forum member from England. I repeatedly pointed this out to you yet you still claim that I was the one that instigated this entire issue. Strange!!!
Anyone can look at this thread to see for themselves who it was that made the claim that the Korean disc was cut:

http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showthr...ighlight=haine

Dazza only brought up the PAL-speedup issue, but even he qualified that by saying, "if Poker Industries' info is correct." You were the one who wrote, "In fact I have been able to confirm that the Korean version is indeed cut," but then later refused to explain how exactly you confirmed this. Dazza even called your claim into question later in the thread.

Originally posted by pro-bassoonist
Nevertheless- PLEASE point out to the forum members where have I stated that I own/or have ever owned the Korean disc. PLEASE.....and based my conclusisons on personal observations made after comparing the two.
You haven't, which is why I called your claims into question. (And your attempts to confuse me with this sort of circular debate haven't worked in the past, so there's no reason to think that they'll work now.) As a matter of fact, I now question whether or not you even owned the French disc at the time. You praised it to the high heavens, but then I noticed that you recently requested a copy from a fellow poster in the DVD Trades forum. Maybe you bought it as a gift, but it did make me call some of your earlier comments into question.

Originally posted by pro-bassoonist
In a thread I started awhile ago (not the more recent one you have linked but the one before that to which there is a link in the second thread you have posted now) you can find some information regarding my emails to POKER INDUSTRIES. Yet, you always somehow miss to point out that my information in that thread is based on what I got in the email that was sent to me by them and hence my decision to go with the French disc which I currently own.
And yet you still won't say exactly what that "information" was. All you said was, "I sent an email to POKER......let's see what they say," and then you started saying that it was cut. I'm assuming that they merely confirmed the running times for you, which, as we've been through before, proves nothing.

Originally posted by pro-bassoonist
I do believe that this is the BEST PAL release out here as I have owned the Tartan release as well.
That's great, but that has nothing to do with whether or not the Korean NTSC release is cut.

Originally posted by pro-bassoonist
NEVER DID I SAY THAT MY INFO IS 100% correct but I confirmed that "something" is missing! I did point out that I have confirmed from another source (not Dazza)that the disc is cut (and I stand behind my statement as this is the information I received by Poker Industries).
Why can't you just tell us what they said? I'm sorry, but, "They said there were cuts," just isn't good enough. That's the same thing you've been saying all along and there's no still no proof. Back in that first thread you even got specific enough to say that "close to ten minutes" was cut. Did Poker tell you this?

Originally posted by pro-bassoonist
Now I have done my part as to claim that the Korean disc is inferior (even more so considering the fact that it is a PAL/NTSC port of the French disc…but that’s another “assumption” and that there might be some "ghosting" issues for people with 16/9 TV's.
If you know that's an assumption, then why are you saying it? You're just throwing more misinformation out there and judging a disc's quality without having seen it. And then you wonder why I find this all so frustrating. I can hardly believe that you're now claiming that the Korean disc is a port of the French disc. If it's a port of the French disc, then how could it be cut?! Why can't you just admit that you have no idea what you're talking about?

Incidentally, ghosting isn't a problem exclusive to 16:9 sets. In fact, it seems to be more prevalent on 4:3 sets, and even then it's dependent on what type of player you're using. This is just more of your misinformation and more evidence that you don't know what you're talking about. The fact is that you don't even know if the Korean disc is struck from a PAL master, let alone the very master that you're also saying is superior and more complete. You're just undermining your old baseless claims with new ones.

Originally posted by pro-bassoonist
Since you do not appear to own the Korean disc either I would also like to know (or you could step up) and assure the forum members that the disc is 100% identical to the French release and there are not cuts made.
You really are too much, man. I've already told you that I own the Korean disc. I recommended it in a past thread and you told me it was cut. How do you think we got to this point?

Last edited by SpinnerX; 10-17-03 at 02:05 AM.
Old 10-17-03, 10:09 AM
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...WOW...!...

. . . . . .
Old 10-17-03, 10:50 AM
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I intend to address your statements one more time and then will conclude that you are simply too dim-witted to realize what has been told to you. You begin to sound like a broken record that never stops spinning (your name truly fits you).

“Anyone can look at this thread to see for themselves who it was that made the claim that the Korean disc was cut”

How can you continue restating the same (false) statement over and over again- the thread begins with a question ASKING whether or not someone is aware if the disc is cut. The very first assumption that footage might be missing was made by Dazza. He believed that it might be due to the PAL speedup and time indications on the Poker site. Much later I emailed Poker and inquired about this. Here’s Dazza’s post from the same thread:

“... I assume that the Korean disc is NTSC? Keep in mind the PAL speedup factor, which would mean that if Poker Industries' info is correct, then the Korean disc has even more missing than you may initially have thought...


In the third post following Dazza’s assumption anyone could see that I have indicated that I have sent an email to Poker to see whether or not this is their fault (time-wise):

“.....honestly I am getting really tired with this flick....whatever I come up with there's always a problem......Thank's for the info DAZZA.

I sent an email to POKER......let's see what they say.....maybe it's just a mistake......”

Almost a week later I received an email from them indicating that indeed the disc is missing footage. Whether or not their source was based only on time indications comparison I do not know. But this was enough of an evidence for me (having an official email from the vendor indicating that footage is missing) not to purchase the Korean disc. I wish I kept the email so I could post it but I don’t believe anyone keeps emails dating back to 10/2002.

Furthermore you claim that I “refused to explain how exactly you confirmed this”.

Once again a lie! In the second post I pointed it out to you- it is clearly stated that I have emailed Poker Industries. How else do you need this to be spelled out for you so you could figure out HOW EXACTLY I OBTAINED MY INFO?

Spinner-X
“As a matter of fact, I now question whether or not you even owned the French disc at the time. You praised it to the high heavens, but then I noticed that you recently requested a copy from a fellow poster in the DVD Trades forum. Maybe you bought it as a gift, but it did make me call some of your earlier comments into question”

You could question whether or not JFK was assassinated by our own government but we will never know, will we?

I have owned now a total of 3 versions of La Haine. The initial French disc (which is now discontinued) and the newer Kulte re-release (and a British Tartan disc). Currently I own the Kulte series disc.

It seems to me that you have been keeping track of what I order or look for- both in the exchange forum and the International forum. Perhaps you could look harder and find out why I was trying to buy a second copy of La Haine together with (hint) a number of Korean discs. Your answer whether or not I own the French disc is right there.

In the original request by Grizzly (A Swedish forum member) regarding the quality of the French disc:

"La Haine (the french R2 release)
i'm really dying to get this on DVD but it doesn't seem like Universal (who own the US rights) are about to release it in R1 anytime soon.. does anyone have the french R2 release? if so.. please tell me what you think of it.
thanks!"

…yet without having the French disc you favor the Korean disc and in fact recommended it to the forum.

Spinner X-“Get the Korean all region NTSC disc instead. The subtitle translations aren't flawless, but the picture and sound quality is fantastic. There are also some deleted scenes among other extras.

…based on what information did you decide that the Korean NTSC disc is more suitable for a person that lives in R2 PAL Sweden? You never compared the French or British for that matter releases yet you recommended the Korean disc. Did you ever own any of these releases (French specifically) so you recommended a secondary source? Especially when Grizzly unequivocally asked about the French disc!!!!!

My understanding is, and it has been my prerogative to recommend other region releases (if the person inquiring about it does not live in the same region) ONLY if the alternative version (in this case NTSC Korean version) is proven to be better.
It is clearly NOT.



Further proof of your ridiculous logic of saying things:

“Originally posted by pro-bassoonist
Now I have done my part as to claim that the Korean disc is inferior….”

Spinner-x
“If you know that's an assumption, then why are you saying it? You're just throwing more misinformation out there and judging a disc's quality without having seen it.”

….and….

Spinner X:
“And yet you still won't say exactly what that "information" was. All you said was, "I sent an email to POKER......let's see what they say," and then you started saying that it was cut. I'm assuming that they merely confirmed the running times for you, which, as we've been through before, proves nothing.”

Correct me if I am wrong however you are making an even bigger assumption that “they merely confirmed the running time for me”. HAVE YOU SEEN THE EMAIL THEY SENT ME AND THE INFO SUPLLLIED WITH IT?

NO!!!

How could you accuse me of misinforming the forum based on an assumption I have made and then proceed to back up your argument with the same form of evidence- AN ASSUMPTION!!

THIS IS MORE EVIDENCE THAT YOU DO NOT KNOW WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT!!

Have you emailed anyone to try and find out what the status of the disc is? Have you had any sort of information pointing out that my info is incorrect.All your claims come from the fact that you own the Korean disc (which I could also question as you seem more and more confused in your attempts to disprove something you know nothing about).

Spinner X
“The fact is that you don't even know if the Korean disc is struck from a PAL master, let alone the very master that you're also saying is superior and more complete. You're just undermining your old baseless claims with new ones”

What fact are you talking about? I only see another one of your unsupported claims. If you knew the policy that Korean companies follow in regard to French releases you would notice that in 99% of the time their domestic releases are direct ports of the existing French disc (as sometimes they only add up Korean/English subs….though not always).

As to La Haine- I am not aware of another NTSC version of this film (if there is a Brazilian or Japanese versions then I have not seem them). Hence, given the past and existing practice of Korean companies to “borrow” French masters the Korean disc is PAL sourced. I do not need an additional evidence for this statement. Therefore as a secondary source this is another reason to be pointed out that the Korean disc is indeed inferior.

Originally posted by pro-bassoonist
Now I have done my part as to claim that the Korean disc is inferior (even more so considering the fact that it is a PAL/NTSC port of the French disc…but that’s another “assumption” and that there might be some "ghosting" issues for people with 16/9 TV's.

Spinner x
“Incidentally, ghosting isn't a problem exclusive to 16:9 sets. In fact, it seems to be more prevalent on 4:3 sets, and even then it's dependent on what type of player you're using. This is just more of your misinformation and more evidence that you don't know what you're talking about”


Why do you continue your false insinuations adding up words, mistreating the initial posts I have made….that I have said “exclusive”? Do you see the word “exclusive” anywhere in my post?
Just another evidence that you do not know what you’re talking about, trying to disprove, simply show off your deductive skills which mind you are pretty poor, or argue for the sake of having something to type on this forum.



This is the last time I am responding to your pathetic attempts to prove something that you know nothing about. I do not wish to turn this into a timeless debate with you either. Anyone that could put two and two together could see the difference between the existing versions of La Haine and figure out what the best product for their money is.

Cheers.

Last edited by pro-bassoonist; 10-17-03 at 02:45 PM.
Old 10-17-03, 07:06 PM
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You should really enroll in a few debate classes at Indiana University because your logic is making my head hurt. I give up. At least the one point that hasn't been lost in all this is that we still don't know whether or not the Korean disc is cut. Anyone with half a brain can look back on this and the other threads and confirm that the jury is still out on whether or not this disc is cut. Until we know for sure, I'm through arguing with you about this title.
Old 10-18-03, 09:49 AM
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Attempting to get this thread back on track...

Does anyone know about Tartan's UK disc? It's PAL region 0, as some of their releases are, and has English subs. It's listed at 97 minutes, but I assume that's the PAL running time.



[edit] Ah wait, is this the French version? I just noticed the "France" text up in the top corner... Blackstar doesn't typically carry French discs, so I assumed this was a different one.

Last edited by Cosmic Bus; 10-18-03 at 09:51 AM.
Old 10-18-03, 02:42 PM
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Ah wait, is this the French version? I just noticed the "France" text up in the top corner... Blackstar doesn't typically carry French discs, so I assumed this was a different one.
Tartan puts the country of the film's origin in the upper-left corner of most of their covers. If it was from Hong Kong (for example) it would say "Hong Kong." It's most definitely a UK disc since a) Tartan is a UK distributor and b) I doubt a French disc would have a BBFC rating and a bunch of English text on the cover
Old 10-18-03, 03:10 PM
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...the big (and ugly) red circle (which indicates the age limit for the film, and which also appears on the spine and back of the DVD - thus marring, in effect, even the classiest cover design) indicates that this is indeed a UK release...

...fyi the choice of languages on the French disc's menu can be seen here...

. . . . . .
Old 10-18-03, 03:18 PM
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Originally posted by Cosmic Bus
Attempting to get this thread back on track...

Does anyone know about Tartan's UK disc? It's PAL region 0, as some of their releases are, and has English subs. It's listed at 97 minutes, but I assume that's the PAL running time.
In those earlier threads, Dazza said that the Tartan UK disc was "sub-VHS quality" with "terrible" subtitles, and Walter Sobchak called it "a disaster."
Old 10-18-03, 10:16 PM
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:lol Well, I guess I'll be avoiding that one. The French DVD is quite a bit cheaper, to boot.

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