Numanoid

I'm sure this has probably been asked and answered before, but it must be buried in a related thread.

I have a co-worker who is a big Babylon 5 head, and tells me that I shouldn't just watch the first and second season DVDs as they come, rather I should watch the pilot, which is NOT in the season one DVD set (?!) first, as well as some other movie which was made later but is actually a prequel.

So now I'm totally confused. Can anyone tell me the order they think would be most appropriate for a new viewer (please give names of movies and specials that don't exist in the DVD box sets).

Thanks!

Patman

http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showthr...hreadid=299855

das Monkey

With all due respect, your co-worker is a jackass.

He's telling you to watch In the Beginning (which is incredibly cool, and tells the formations of the saga, but also spoils all the fun of the early seasons) before you're supposed to watch it.

Here's a post I made recently on this topic (that doesn't appear to have any spoilage):

http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showthr...hreadid=299855

While, in some respects, it is chronologically first, In the Beginning is told in flashback from the perspective of characters that know all the events of the first 4 seasons. Not only do those seasons unfold better when you don't know what's going to happen, but I believe the telefilm works better after having experienced those events as a viewer over a long duration and then revisiting them with the telefilm.

Everyone is certainly entitled to his own (informed ) opinion on this, but I honestly fail to see why anyone would recommend watching In the Beginning first (except in the case where you need to quickly convince a skeptic that this show will rock his world). If you're already convinced to give the show a fair shake, I wouldn't go screwing with the order and missing out on the fun the way the rest of us got to experience it.

Welcome aboard. Enjoy the ride.

das

And so it begins ...

Edit: Damn you, Patman. Serves me right for typing lots of words.

Chew

Only if you want a big portion of the backstory ruined for you all at once rather than have it unfold during the series as it was meant to.

Patman

Muhahahahaha!

Chew

You sure you don't mean "Heh heh heh"?

Patman

Or better yet, the Scooby snicker.

[scooby]hee hee hee hee hee heee [/ scooby]

El-Kabong

In the Beginning comes first, chronologicaly speaking. It was made about halfway through season 5, so all cats were out of the bag by that point. I think it's a pretty strong story and a great jumping in point - much better than the pilot - but others will disagree.

If you were wondering, here is what the Great Maker JMS has to say about the matter:

Chew

I see JMS is a Hitchcock fan. I believe Hitch used the very same example in an interview back in his day.

Numanoid

Thanks for the link. I'll go with das' recommended order from the other thread. It's against all my instincts to watch something made years later, even if it's the starting point chronologically. I've already been warned, here and elsewhere, to hold out past season one and that's what I'll do. Should be fun!

Josh-da-man

Here's the proper order, (which is broadcast order):

1. The Gathering (Pilot movie, on its own DVD with "In the Beginning" BUT DON'T WATCH "IN THE BEGINNING" YET!)

2. Season One

3. Season Two

4. Season Three

5. Season Four

6. In the Beginning

7. Thirdspace (Not on DVD at this time, but not essential, either)

8. Season Five

9. River of Souls (Not on DVD)

10. Call to Arms (Not on DVD)

11. Crusade (Not on DVD)

12. Legend of the Rangers (Not on DVD)

abintra

Glad I saw this thread. Doubt it will be anytime soon before I can afford to get any of the seasons but I assumed that they contained everything so will add the movies to my wish list.

Apologies for the newbie question (I know some people hate questions when they think the answer should be obvious or that one should use other means to find the answer rather than asking within a conversation).. were River of Souls, Call to Arms, Crusade, and Legend of the Rangers episodes not included in the season sets or movies seperate from the seasons?

I recently saw a couple episodes of Crusade when Sci-Fi aired them by accident as I never heard of it before but didn't know if the aforementioned Crusade was referring to that or not.

das Monkey

• Quoth abintra •<HR SIZE=1>Apologies for the newbie question (I know some people hate questions when they think the answer should be obvious or that one should use other means to find the answer rather than asking within a conversation).. were River of Souls, Call to Arms, Crusade, and Legend of the Rangers episodes not included in the season sets or movies seperate from the seasons?<HR SIZE=1>

River of Souls was a telefilm that takes place after the main series (although not completely, but I won't go into further detail and risk spoilage). It's based on one of the first season episodes and is surprisingly good IMO (considering how average the inspiring episode was). It's kind of just extra content for fans of the show and doesn't have anything to do with the main arcing 5-year story.

A Call to Arms is also based on an episode but has larger intentions. It's another telefilm made after the main series that bridges the gap and sets the stage for a spin-off show in the same universe called Crusade.

Crusade, then, is the spin-off series that only aired 13 episodes and showed signs of kicking all sorts of figurative ass, but TNT wanted it to literally kick ass as well as show lots of tits and ass, and since jms was plagued with this nagging thing called integrity, he didn't allow his vision to get ruined by jackasses, so the show disappeared and the episodes we have got pretty screwed up in the process.

When the Sci-Fi (sic) Channel purchased the original series and aired a first level of syndication, they were astonished to find it the most popular thing their network had ever aired. So they ran it again, and again it performed incredibly well for syndicated programming. So they commissioned another telefilm (like A Call to Arms) that would launch another spin-off series. This was Legend of the Rangers. If it received good ratings, they claimed a new series would be launched based on this telefilm. Unfortunately, a nasty chain of events prevented this from happening. First, some jackasses believing they'd get to hump virgins for eternity flew some planes into the WTC, which changed around the NFL playoffs such that the most incredible playoff game in the last 20 years was going into overtime ... in the snow ... when Legend of the Rangers aired. Of course, the game was over when it aired on the West Coast, and the numbers at that time were staggeringly high and more than enough to order the series, but ... secondly, this was about the time that Bonnie Hammer decided the Sci-Fi (sic) Channel shouldn't be bogged down with anything remotely resembling science fiction, which meant the cancellation of The Invisible Man, the dropping of the series based on Legend of the Rangers and the formations for a plot to sabotage their contract for Farscape.

And there you have it. Just the beginning of the tortured tale of this incredible television series.

das

abintra

Thank you kindly das. Very much appreciated.

I wish the season sets weren't so expensive as I know I would be looking at either getting all 5 or nothing given the show but they like to price certain shows at that level. Think I may be pretty much limited to trying to get them through the freedvd type sites.

I gather that In the Beginning and The Gathering should be picked up also if one wants to complete the main portion of the B5 saga then correct?

Also, Thirdspace, what's the story behind that production? Made as a way to draw more viewers into the series or a seperate story line within the series?

Any rumours of the other movies not currently available and Crusade finding their way to dvd eventually?

elektra

das - re: Hammer, has exorcism been tried yet?

Chew

http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showthr...5&pagenumber=2

abintra

I found this episode list also which is pretty much the order that das mentions in the other thread and changes the order of a couple others.

http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/countr...er/eplist.html

das Monkey

• Quoth abintra •<HR SIZE=1>I gather that In the Beginning and The Gathering should be picked up also if one wants to complete the main portion of the B5 saga then correct?<HR SIZE=1>

Yes, and as discussed, conventional wisdom is to watch The Gathering first and save In the Beginning until its time. See the linked thread for specific order.

• Quoth abintra •<HR SIZE=1>Also, Thirdspace, what's the story behind that production? Made as a way to draw more viewers into the series or a seperate story line within the series?<HR SIZE=1>

Sort of. When TNT picked up the show (after the 4th season and the collapse of PTEN), they made In the Beginning and Thirdspace. If I recall correctly, Thirdspace was actually made first, but when they (re)launched the series on TNT, they showed In the Beginning, then a retooled version of The Gathering, then the first 4 seasons, and were supposed to do Thirdspace and ultimately the 5th and final season, but ended up just going through to the 5th season and dropped Thirdspace in the mix when episodes were held for the NBA playoffs that year. It's a stand-alone story of little consequence, but it's a nice addition to the overall universe.

• Quoth abintra •<HR SIZE=1>Any rumours of the other movies not currently available and Crusade finding their way to dvd eventually? <HR SIZE=1>

Yes. WB is apparently very pleased with (and shocked ... because they hate B5) sales of the DVDs and is rumored to be preparing to go forward with getting all the stuff out there, including Crusade.

das

Edit: Connection troubles trying to submit this ... some stuff may be duped above me.

garmonbozia

I was going to ask about the ordering of the films since the airdates I found on http://www.epguides.com/Babylon5/ showed Thirdspace and River of Souls as being aired in the middle of Season 5, so was just curious if the airdates are the best order to watch them in.

I think this thread and the links in it has answered most of my questions. I know nothing about this show, but am considering have it be the next show I watch on dvd.

My question is this.....I'm not a big fan of sci-fi tv shows or anything, but it just seems that many people that like the same tv shows I do praise this show so much. Are most fans of this show also into other sci-fi shows? or are there fans of this show who typically aren't into sci-fi shows?

Thanks for any input.

Curious to see what all the fuss is about, but too scared to take the plunge.

If I just start off with "The Gathering" will I know if this is for me?

I think I've read somewhere that "The Gathering" was a re-edited or remastered version of the original pilot or something? What exactly is different and does it change anything in the story?

Thanks!

das Monkey

I wouldn't worry about the differences between the two versions of The Gathering. There are no major changes to the story itself, just tweaks in the way some stuff is revealed. Discussing what that means, though, could get spoilerific, so don't worry about it.

What types of viewers does the show have? That's hard to say. I would have to be honest and suspect that a large portion of the viewing audience would be considered science fiction fans, but I'd guess that's more because science fiction fans are typically more open-minded when it comes to their entertainment and can appreciate a high level of drama in a not-so-typical setting. The best comparison I can make with this show is to Lord of the Rings. Sure, it has a sizeable audience that simply likes the fantasy nature of the tale, but the story itself is the driving force behind its success, and it should have massive cross-over appeal. The strengh of B5 isn't in space battles or special effects or anything like that (in fact, the special effects are pretty average at best) but in its story. While I think science fiction fans are more open to approaching this show without foreknowledge of its ass-kicking nature, I don't see it as the type of show that will only appeal to that crowd. Not sure if that answers your question or not.

As for The Gathering, I'm sorry to say that it likely won't let you know if the show is for you or not. The first season is absolutely essential viewing to understand the characters and their motivation, but it's also far weaker than the others. People disagree how much weaker it is, and upon rewatching the first season with the knowledge gained from seeing the other 4, most people find it significantly better than they remember it, but suffice to say, it doesn't hook everyone from the get go. The viewer has to show some patience, but it is well rewarded.

I know it's scary, but my advice is that you commit to watching the whole thing before starting ... or at least commit to the first couple of seasons. Watching a few episodes and then giving up would be tragic. If you absolutely cannot bring yourself to trust the greater forum wisdom on this show , then I'd painfully recommend watching In the Beginning, which is on the disc with The Gathering. It will give away much of the mysteries of the show (it will leave still quite a bit unanswered and not totally ruin the experience), but you'll be hooked. Kind of a catch-22.

Anyway, hope that helps. The series really is incredible. I'd give it a chance.

das

dstrauss

Technically, of course, "Sleeping in Light" should probably be watched as the very last B5 thing you view, but I dare anyone who sits through all 5 seasons to have that kind of self control after "Objects At Rest."

abintra

FWIW, I generally like Sci-Fi or atleast always go into it with an open mind (atleast something of decent quality whereas some people just dislike the genre from the get go like me with country music).

I had never read the LotR books or knew anything about it at all but was looking forward to seeing it and yet didn't like it at all nor thought much of it. I can slightly recall when Babylon 5 first came out and remember this. It was either Babylon 5 or another show that came out the same time and was also shown on UPN (probably just syndicated) that upon first viewing didn't like at all. I found it to be very cheesy, melodramatic, etc. but at some point (if my memory is even correct that this was Babylon 5) I got involved in the story line.

I haven't gotten any of the seasons yet due to cost but I would give it a shot of you are intrigued by it. Can you rent the first season? If not, you probably would be able to trade it away for something else if by chance you didn't care for it.

Eric F

So are there any plans to release the standalone movies on DVD? How about Crusade?

Chew

Both questions somewhat answered earlier in this thread.

garmonbozia

Thanks for your opinion. While I am not big on sci-fi (usually because I find it rather dry, and that's only how I like my comedy) I do enjoy drama in unusual settings. I'm a huge fan of Buffy and Angel for example.....and it seems a lot of fans of those shows on this forum also like Babylon 5...thus why I have an interest in the first place. I'll probably give this show a go at some point. I really need to go through my dvd collection and sell a bunch of stuff. I am quickly running out of storage space. Then I can use that $ to buy the Babylon 5 dvds (I also need to make room for all those Dark Shadows dvds that will be coming and coming and coming, lol).