Easy

I am debating if I should take a chance on season 4. I should state that I own and enjoy the first three seasons. However, I recently watched an episode of the current season and honestly thought it sucked. The quips were gone or simply not funny. Character interplay seemed very strained and fake where it seemed natural before. The good writing was just gone. It was just a crappy soap with vampires. Yuck. Bleh. So when did it take a sudden nosedive into the toilet... or was it a slow painful decline? Anyway, is season 4 better than the current season? Thanks.

ChemDoc

IMO, season four is the weakest of the seasons. I do not own any of the sets, but I am planning on picking up Season 3 and then season 5 when its out.

-doc

Josh-da-man

Opinions vary greatly on the subject, but it's generally considered that this is the order of the Buffy seasons from "best to worst":

3-2-1-4-5-6 (with the verdict still out on 7)

Most people seem to think the series went downhill after season five and the move to UPN. You'll frequently find people saying that the series should've ended with what happened at the end of season five. There was a pretty heavy tone shift between seasons five and six, as the series took on a darker edge.

However, each season has its detractors and apologists.

I will be buying all seven seasons as they come out.

sfsdfd

Moving to TV Talk Forum.

- David Stein

MrX

It's a pretty average season. Their was one great episode, "Hush". If you plan on watching after season 4 their are some things that happen in it that carry on into later season's


I'd rate the seasons as
5-2-3-1-4-6

Doughboy

I was never a big fan of Season 4. It's better than Season 6 and(if things don't pick up soon) Season 7, but is inferior to every other year of Buffy.

One obvious reason a lot of Buffy diehards were down on that season was the cast changes. With Angel getting his own show, the loss of David Boreanaz and Charisma Carpenter affected Buffy greatly. Plus, Seth Green split after 6 episodes(although he would return 2 more times before leaving for good).

My biggest complaint has always been the Initiative story arc. It just never did anything for me. And the Big Bad(I won't say who or what it is) sucked hard. A far cry from previous villains like the Mayor and Angelus. Plus I hated how key characters like Xander and Giles were given almost nothing to do the entire season. As far as Willow's "metamorphosis", all I'll say is that her special new friend annoyed the piss out of me until Season 6. And of course, we all know what happened that year...

All that being said, I'd still recommend getting it if you liked the first 3 years. At least half of the season is enjoyable and despite the Initiative storyline being crap, there are several excellent standalone episodes. "Hush", "Restless", "Something Blue", "This Year's Girl", "Who Are You", "Fear Itself", "The Yoko Factor", and "New Moon Rising" are all terrific. Just stay the hell away from "Beer Bad" which along with Season 2's "Bad Eggs"(similar titles, hmm!) represents the worst two hours in Buffy history.

Another reason you should get it is because the show bounced back in a big way in Season 5. All of my earlier complaints were addressed. Xander and Giles came back into the fold, the Initiative was no longer a nuisance, the Big Bad was much better and like in Season 2 had a close connection to Buffy, everyone grew up in ways they never could've expected(until Season 6 when nearly everyone regressed), and the ending to the season still gets me everytime I see it.

WiccanPagan

season 4, imo, was the worst one so far. i'd go 3 2 1 5 6 4. one of the characters introduced was very unlikableto me and the story lines were not up to par with the other seasons. let's say it went to a technical level instead of the fable/lore/myth that it had been focused on prior.

adamblast

My personal order for season quality (based on only a partial Season 7, of course):

3 2 1 4 5 7 6

The latter seasons are still good in my opinion, but they're definitely not as funny in general, and much more context-heavy.

I haven't decided yet whether I'll buy beyond S3... I'm buying more TV boxsets than I can afford, or watch...

WiccanPagan

that's my boat. but i am kinda hooked in since i decided to wait to watch my angel season 1 ntil buffy season 4 is out. oh well.

nny

My order:

5 3 7(hopefully) 4 6 2 1

Season 6 was really good for the first several episodes, but I'm expecting season 7 to have a great ending. Season 4 has my 3rd favorite episode of Buffy, Restless. Restless is basically a prelude to season 5. If I could replace the season 5 premiere with Restless, it would be so far ahead of any other season of Buffy. Season 5 also has the 2 best episodes of Buffy ever, The Body and The Gift.

So basically, I'm saying you have to get season 5 and if you don't want to miss anything you should grab season 4 too. Season 4, 6, and 7 are all good, but not absolute must-haves. That being said, I'd also like to mention that I think there's going to be more extras on all the later seasons than the earlier seasons. I think season 4 has twice as many commentaries as season 2 and 3, plus I think it's a little cheaper than the previous 2 season also.

P.S. I just wanted to mention I put 7 so high because I expect at least 1 (probably 2) of the remaining episodes of Buffy to be as good as any of my top 10 favorite episodes of Buffy. Who knows, maybe Joss was saving the best for last.

cartman

If you are a REAL big fan of Buffy, then yes, get season 4. Otherwise, just try to catch them on reruns. I'll agree with what others said here that Riley and the Initiative (with big bad) were terrible terrible TERRIBLE things. I will disagree with the quality of seasons, though. Mine would be: 2 3 1 5 7 4 6 (OMWF and the last 4 episodes just don't make up for the rest of S6 IMO. Of course depending on how the rest of S7 pans out, it may move up or down one slot.).

WiccanPagan

i don't doubt this, but can i ask where this info is coming from? the price of the last 2 seasons was great, imo, but a lower price is always

tasha99

Season 4 wasn't my favorite, but it had several of my favorite episodes in it (Hush, Something Blue, Doomed and a few others).

My ranking of seasons is:

3,2,5,4,1,7,6

I disagree that there is any consensus of what the season rankings are, so those are just mine.

tasha

Rypro 525

Well hopefully for all you season 6 haters, they will release the musical episode on its own, but I am the rare one who likes season 6 and even 7.

nny

I think the retail is going to be the same, but the online stores seem to have it for like $1 cheaper.

http://www.dvdtalk.com/forum/showthr...ighlight=buffy

Also, I just decided to look at epguides.com and was shocked to see Whedon is only writing and directing 2 episodes this season, the season premiere and series finale. Maybe I should move season 7 down a slot. I thought he'd done more episodes this season and I thought he'd be doing at least 2 of the final 5 episodes.

Doughboy

That's another reason to get Season 4. The extras on the R2 set I've got are plentiful. Lots of commentaries and the featurettes are terrific. And with the R1 set, you actually get an additional commentary plus a new featurette on Oz. The only downside is you lose a great documentary on the scoring of the show.

Mourn

Season 4 was one of the worst; . I'm still going to buy it because it's Buffy, but if you arent a big fan you might want to stay away. That being said, if u're gonna want 5,6 or 7 you might as well get 4 since its part of the overall story arc.

My order from best to worst 3-2-1-5-7-6-4.

DRG

My order as of right now...

5 3 2 7 4 1 6

My justifications...

5: Best overall story arc. Each episode had a place in the arc (even if it wasn't immediately known) and builded to SOMETHING. Even the 'throwaway' eps established a character development or put a weapon out there for the finale. Which was also the best season finale in the show's history. The Body provided the series' best human moments and acting.

3: A very close second. Faith! And is a great big bad. This also has many of my favorite standalone eps. My only gripes are a horrible season opener and a finale which wasn't QUITE as powerful as it could've been.

2: The Spike/Drusilla/Angelus stuff is great. I would've placed this season higher, except it has more 'filler crap' episodes than any other season. Too many silly monsters of the week... 'Bad Eggs', 'Go Fish', 'Incan Mummy Girl'...

7: The jury's still out, but they have done a good job building the story arc throughout the season. A few episodes have been so-so, but I didn't find them to be awful. We'll see...

4: I has this below season 1, but I remembered I liked many of the individual eps. The big bad was the big weakness here. After the previous bad he couldn't compete. Besides,

1: An okay beginning, but the season's too short to do the Master justice. Plus it suffers from the same cheezy monster of the week episodes as season 2.

6: I've said it in another thread, but this season is so unbalanced. Not enough time is spent with the stuff. They take too long to get there. Rewatching these on FX right now, I've come to an awful conclusion: this season would be insufferable without This season does have some fine episodes amongst the mess of melancholy eps and some that match the cheezy badness of some of the first two seasons (Doublemeat Palace).

Balah

I have a special place in my heart for season 4 because that is when I started watching Buffy. True, it has some eps that are not up to par, but I enjoyed it on a whole. And some of the episodes are standouts, like the aforementioned "Hush" and one of my all-time favories, "Superstar."

Your mileage may vary, I just wanted to weigh in on the positive side. By the way, i rank the seasons like this: 3, 4, 2, 5, 7, 1, 6.

Jlbkwrm

My ranking: 2/3 (two is more emotional, three has a better story), 1, 4/5, 6/7

The thing with Buffy is that you can actually treat the finale of any odd-numbered season as a series finale, and it'll work. If you want the series to go out on a high point, then I'd advocate stopping with season 3. I've decided I'll be stopping with season 5.

Season 4 is not very good.

However, having sat through seasons 6 and 7, I now have a newfound respect and admiration for it. The overall story-arc sucks, I dislike one of the new characters, and this season started the tradition of Ignoring Xander.

That said, the individual episodes are usually okay. Some suck, but some of the standalones (Hush, Something Blue, Superstar) are pretty entertaining, and there's one excellent two part episode that's well worth watching.

Problem is, season four has no real resolution. No sense of ending. So if you get four, you're probably going to want five. Five is sort of... eh, for me. The story arc is great, in concept, but I dislike the execution (I think it was sloppy, and the final resolution is ripped out of thin air.) It's been revealed in interviews that the way season 5 played out was not completely the way it was planned, and the story suffers for it. It's missing a whole character arc (which shows up as the end to season 6), and things do feel a little chaotic and rushed towards the end. Like they were having to stretch out a plot further than they'd initially expected. Season 5 also contains the last episode in which Buffy was happy and quippy. Then, something happens, and she loses her spark. It stays lost.

However, there is some good there. Early season 5 has the last completely Xander-centric episode of the series thusfar. The final moments of the season finale are pretty emotional. The overall story is better than season four, but the characters aren't quite as well realized. Season 5 is better if you don't think about it, but it can work... if you accept it as the end of the show.

Season 6 is, IMO, when it all goes to hell. Dark and depressing, joyless characters, and just all-around craptacularness.

Season 7 is doing little to redeem it. The characters still aren't having any fun, and by now we've forgotten that these are supposedly real people, with real motivations. The plot is derailed, and we wind up with a series of four episodes that really should have been two. Also, I've recently found out that the only part of the season I considered fairly cool was something that was made up at the last minute. The last new episode has me hating the main character.

In a perfect world, the show would have ended with season 3. It doesn't. There's a lot of good in seasons 4 and 5, but a fair amount of suck, too. Most people didn't really hop onto the "There's no hope for this show." train until season 6. Problem is, it's hard to predict where any one person will fall on the scale.

wendersfan

I know I'm in a distinct minority here, but I think season 4 was the first good season for Buffy, and that the show has improved with every season (season 7 not included). My view:

Season 1 - absolutely unwatchable. At least half the episodes were complete embarassments.

Season 2 - Bad, but an improvement in every respect. Series still marred by cliched high school stereotypes and plotlines.

Season 3 - a continuing improvement, especially as the introduction of Faith makes the Buffy character more defined. The last few episodes of this season were quite good.

Season 4 - The first good season, but marred by several defects, specifically the . What saves this season and makes it good are the following: excellent character development especially with Giles and Willow, no more Angel and Cordelia, the introduction of Tara, and the fact the characters are no longer in that ridiculous high school environment. "Hush" is the best episode of the series up to this point, and the season 4 finale is also fantastic.

Season 5 - Same plusses as season 4, with a better villain and no truly lame episodes. The development of Spike's character is also a plus. Final episode was great, too.

Season 6 - one of the great seasons for any show. After five years of being surrounded by death and destruction, the chickens finally come home to roost. all contribute to making this season so very memorable for me. That, and "Once More, With Feeling", the greatest single episode in television history.

Season 7 - don't know about this one yet.

slop101

Buffy is like pizza, or ice cream: even when it's bad, it's still pretty good.

costanza187

Exactly!

WiccanPagan

mmmm pizza. mmmm ice cream. mmmm ice cream on pizza.

clemente

Season 4 in large part is what lead me to partially abandon the series. I like to call it mopey/whiny Buffy. Riley and his band of goons just seemed sub-Buffy material combined with the Angel/Cordy exodus left a show with little support to carry the strength of season 3.

I jumped in and out of season 5 and was ready to jump back into the Buffy pool, and then season 6 happened. Bad stuff....though going back and watching them on FX, they're not horrible, but against 3 and 5, they lack.