Chew

What, no thread on this episode? Considering the topic, I thought for sure by now.

Creationism vs. Evolution

Although evolution is the scientific reasoning for the current state of mankind, how many other scientific reasonings throughout history ended up being wrong when more modern facts were found?

Not saying I don't believe evolution, but the whole show seemed rather arrogant in its position. The opposing opinion was always shown as "crackpots".

But, certainly find Penn & Teller more fun to watch than Bill Maher's new show.

Red Dog

Too hot a topic for the TV Talk forum.

movielib

If you put all eight of the P&T shows so far together, it would be obvious that one of them stands out as atypical. There was almost no humor in this show where all the others have me practically falling down hysterical. There was almost no language that could not have been shown on regular TV (a couple things which could easily have been omitted without changing the show at all).

They tried to stress a couple of things: creationism is religion, not science and religion should not be taught in public schools. I totally agree with them on the first point; on the second, I don't think the government should be in the school business to begin with and a free market in education would develop the types of schools parents of all sorts of differing beliefs would want.

For the most part, I just think it's way too big a subject and the concepts are way too complex for any kind of 25 minute treatment. This is, IMO, not the best type of topic for them to do.

Here's their upcoming schedule which should get them back on track:

http://www.sho.com/ptbs/schedule.cfm

I wonder about the Environmental Hysteria show (again, possibly a topic way too broad and complex) but I had been hoping they'd tackle this very subject so I'm looking forward to it.

das Monkey

I'm a religious person, and I certainly didn't have a problem with this episode. I also thought the episode was quite funny and possibly on par with the others in terms of humor. The humor comes from mockery, so if you weren't laughing ... Their approach is a bit one-sided, but that's fine with me. Hell, I was probably more bothered with the bottled water segment than this one.

In this episode, the other people were shown as crackpots because they are, and living down the street from Cobb County, I'm a bit embarassed. Religion as a science? Please. The hallmark of Christianity is faith in something that cannot be proven; it's the fundamental basis of the entire religion, and to claim there is any scientific merit to faith undermines the very concept of faith in the first place.

This topic wasn't about which is right -- creationism or evolution -- it was about which should be taught in a science class in a public school. All the crap about giving your kids "both sides of the story so they can make up their own mind" was silly. If you as a parent are so convinced in the false nature of evolution science, then you get 16 hours a day plus weekends when your children are not in school to fill their minds with whatever crackpot schemes you may have. There's no need to force your religion on the rest of the community. If you teach one religion in science class, you need to teach them all; and that's not science ... it's religious studies.

das

Numanoid

Well, as I predicted last week, and as Chew pointed out, they only showed religious "crackpots". Every single person they gave camera time to was a "Young-Earth Creationist", which means they believe in the literal, English, translation of Genesis and that the world is ony ~6000 years old. I'm a Christian and I laugh at that. There is an entire division of believers ("Old-Earth Creationists") who believe that the Earth is just as old as science says it is and who also believe that evolution (to some degree) does indeed occur. Where were those folks?

The problem with this show is that it was not an honest discussion of Creationism v. Evolution, rather it was an expose on a group of small-town folks who are fighting their school board. And I don't think they used the word "Bullshiznit" until the very last sentence, which was odd.

das Monkey

I see your point; I guess I just don't have a problem with it. The show is about exposing people who are full of ****, and those whom you refer to as "Old-Earth Creationists" -- whether their belief is accurate or not -- do not particularly fall into this category. I didn't see the episode as Creationism v. Evolution nor do I think it fits the concept of the show. I do, however, see how this completely applies to crackpots who think we should teach the literal, English, translation of Genesis in public school Science classes. The people guilty of "bullshit" are those who are trying to convince the schoolboard that there is no proof of evolution and that young-Earth creation is a valid "science."

By relation, a viewer could draw the conclusion that all religious people who believe in some form of creation are crackpots just like those shown in the episode, but I don't think that was the point Penn & Teller were trying to make, and I'd put the blame on the viewer if he can't see the difference between the two.

The mere fact that these "small-town folks" (which, btw, Cobb County isn't what I'd call "small-town") were successful in their cause IMO makes the topic worthy enough to devote an episode to. They do a disservice both to those who don't believe in any form of "creation" and those who believe that creation and evolution go hand in hand by distorting religious faith into science and forcing it into public schools.

Like I said, I see your point about it not being an honest discussion of Creationism v. Evolution ... I just don't think that was the intent of the episode, nor am I sure it should be. That's a topic for something else, since I'm not sure I'm ready to call either reasonable Creationists or Evolutionists "bullshit."

das

CharlesC

Well P&T never claimed to be unbiased. At least they have that going for them, they are honest and tell you that you're only seeing the worst of the worst.