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pietrop
02-22-02, 05:27 PM
After making me wait 5 weeks before they would consider my order lost, they tell me that their policy is NOT to refund OR replace lost orders shipped via the US Postal Service. Then they offer to replace the shipment -- as a special favor to me! -- if I will pay the shipping. Well, I'm sorry, but 5 weeks is too long to wait for an order, and then to suggest that replacement is a FAVOR, and to ask me to pay for reshipment :grunt: .... If USPS Media Mail service is as bad as they imply, they should not use it in the first place.

bigjim25
02-22-02, 05:35 PM
They warn you on their site. Thankfully I upgraded to priority mail. I had one lost also out of about 9 orders from them. They replaced right away with no problem. :D

pietrop
02-22-02, 05:52 PM
They do NOT say that they will not replace orders, or that the waiting period is five weeks. It is just plain bad business to treat paying customers this way. I repeat: If the service is that bad, it should not be offered in the first place.

dvde
02-22-02, 06:06 PM
Originally posted by pietrop
They do NOT say that they will not replace orders, or that the waiting period is five weeks. It is just plain bad business to treat paying customers this way. I repeat: If the service is that bad, it should not be offered in the first place.

Actually it does on their site. It states "Not Insured", plain as day on the shipping page. Why don't you upgrade to UPS, it's insured.

pietrop
02-22-02, 06:19 PM
"Not insured" is NOT the same as "will not replace". It's a little late now to suggest alternatives. Thanks for being so helpfu.

Deke Rivers
02-22-02, 06:22 PM
you have the option of using Proiority and they even warn you ahead of time they will not replace anything lost media mail....so I woudlnt be slamming them after you were warned..they continue to be one of the best e-tailers out there..I use media mail all the time form them and havent had anything lost yet but if i do I certainly wouldnt blame them..

Easy
02-22-02, 07:01 PM
Originally posted by Deke Rivers
.they continue to be one of the best e-tailers out there..I use media mail all the time form them and havent had anything lost yet but if i do I certainly wouldnt blame them..
They are certainly not "one of the best" if they have a policy this stupid. I am no lawyer but as far as I am concerned the item is theirs until I take possession of it. If it gets lost in transit it is their problem... not mine. I have no way of knowing for sure that they even shipped it. I was considering using them for a few orders but I will be sure to avoid them now. Thanks for the warning pietrop.
Oh, an buy the way bigjim25, priority mail is not insured either. According to their site:
"USPS Priority Mail - Package NOT Insured. Delivery within an average of 2 - 4 business after order is shipped (Mon - Sat). Instances of "Lost" Shipments are reviewed on a per case basis and may require a four week waiting period for processing delays."
Reviewed on a per case basis? I guess if their CSR has a bad day you're just screwed. Either that or they think pietrop is trying to rip them off so he/she is getting a hard time. Honestly, I can't think of one other reputable etailer who won't promptly replace lost shipments - regardless of shipping method. If you can think of any others, name them. It would be a good list of merchants to avoid.

Cornfed
02-22-02, 09:05 PM
So who are some of the best? Deepdiscountdvd seems to be pretty popular, I've used them in the past but have received pre-orders up to 2 weeks after the release date. DDD also hurts me with the tax.

Josh-da-man
02-23-02, 04:17 AM
Originally posted by Cornfed
So who are some of the best? Deepdiscountdvd seems to be pretty popular, I've used them in the past but have received pre-orders up to 2 weeks after the release date. DDD also hurts me with the tax.

Deepdiscountdvd has been very good to me. Great prices, free shipping. They're about the only online DVD store I've been using for quite a while.

Josh-da-man
02-23-02, 04:19 AM
Originally posted by pietrop
After making me wait 5 weeks before they would consider my order lost, they tell me that their policy is NOT to refund OR replace lost orders shipped via the US Postal Service. Then they offer to replace the shipment -- as a special favor to me! -- if I will pay the shipping. Well, I'm sorry, but 5 weeks is too long to wait for an order, and then to suggest that replacement is a FAVOR, and to ask me to pay for reshipment :grunt: .... If USPS Media Mail service is as bad as they imply, they should not use it in the first place.

I've never used DVDEmpire before. Do they offer the option of insuring your orders at a fee? Seems like a strange policy. Most places seem to replace lost orders without insurance because A) it keeps the customer happy, and B) insurance from USPS is rather costly and it's probably cheaper to replace the odd lost package at their cost than it would be to buy insurance for everything.

dp20957
02-23-02, 07:32 AM
I placed 2 large pre-orders with DVDEmpire, so I hope I don't have a problem.
Deepdiscountdvd also ships by media mail. When, after 3 weeks, I didn't receive my copy of Fawlty Towers they sent a replacement with no problem. Over 2 months later I received the original package. I emailed them to send me a postage paid label so I could send the duplicate back (hey, I'm honest). They did.

I only order from Empire if they are cheaper. Otherwise I use DeepDiscount. If I should have a problem with Empire, the best thing to do is contact your chargecard company. Most major chargecards have some type of protection for lost/stolen purchases. I had to do this with DVDWAVE and CDUniverse and was given credit each time.

Note: Every site should have a pre-order manager as great as Empire.

Phibes
02-23-02, 09:04 AM
Please note DVD Empire and DVD Express are two different animals ;). As far as I'm aware Empire is in solid business shape. DVDExpress is another story completely.

Funk
02-23-02, 11:40 AM
I've never had one problem (other than the Leon screwup by CTHV that wasn't their fault) when dealing with DVD Empire. I don't order much over the 'net any more, but when I do, it's usually through them.

stevevt
02-23-02, 12:49 PM
I spun off the DVD Express posts from this thread, where they clearly didn't belong, into a new thread called "Watch out for DVD Express!" (http://dvdtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=186473) .

I'm not sure if this was intentional or not, but I'd ask that members keep to the topic at hand in situations where 2 stores might be easily confused (i.e., not bring up problems with Store Y in a thread dedicated to Store X).

-stevevt

Groucho
02-23-02, 12:53 PM
It's all about reading the policies before ordering. I noted their policy on Media Mail, and I'll pay the extra bucks for an insured form of shipping. It's worth it for Empire's awesome pre-order manager.

jonathan.e
02-23-02, 02:23 PM
I had exactly the same problem with the Universal Monsters misprice waaay back. A whole bunch of international people never got their sets (because IMO DVDEmpire never shipped them) and when I contacted them they gave me the BS line about as a "special one off favour" they would re-ship but I had to pay the shipping again. I bit the bullet and did so but I never ordered from them again as they are not an honest etailer in my opinion. Too many International people did not get their sets - Coincidence? I dont think so. BTW, I had to wait 3 months before theyd even consider replacing the order!!!

Id rather deal with good etailers like DeepDiscount.

mjgardenia
02-23-02, 08:43 PM
I was not aware of the no replacement for lost items policy - don't the credit card companies protect consumers on this type of situation?

I never had a problem with DVD Empire using Media Mail so far. Something to consider, however, is that DVD Empire allows one to add onto or delete DVDs on an open order - I received 10 titles last week and kept on adding to the list throughout the prior month whenever a new pre-order was announced and each add-on only cost an additional 35 cents media mail shipping (how many times does one place an order with a vendor then another a week later and have to incure duplicate shipping costs?).

Deke Rivers
02-26-02, 07:48 AM
Originally posted by Josh-da-man


Deepdiscountdvd has been very good to me. Great prices, free shipping. They're about the only online DVD store I've been using for quite a while.
Deep Diso**** uses Media mail too for the free shipping

Deke Rivers
02-26-02, 07:50 AM
Originally posted by Easy

They are certainly not "one of the best" if they have a policy this stupid. I am no lawyer but as far as I am concerned the item is theirs until I take possession of it. If it gets lost in transit it is their problem... not mine. I have no way of knowing for sure that they even shipped it. I was considering using them for a few orders but I will be sure to avoid them now. Thanks for the warning pietrop.
Oh, an buy the way bigjim25, priority mail is not insured either. According to their site:
"USPS Priority Mail - Package NOT Insured. Delivery within an average of 2 - 4 business after order is shipped (Mon - Sat). Instances of "Lost" Shipments are reviewed on a per case basis and may require a four week waiting period for processing delays."
Reviewed on a per case basis? I guess if their CSR has a bad day you're just screwed. Either that or they think pietrop is trying to rip them off so he/she is getting a hard time. Honestly, I can't think of one other reputable etailer who won't promptly replace lost shipments - regardless of shipping method. If you can think of any others, name them. It would be a good list of merchants to avoid.
Then pay the extra buck for better shipping ..they give you a choice with a disclaimer then you take that choice and get mad when something they warn you aout actually happens? wow..maybe you are best off going to a brick and mortar

rdodolak
02-26-02, 09:28 AM
Below is from their shipping disclaimer from checkout. Notice that it doesn't state anything about not replacing lost or nondelivered packages. Nor does it state that they are not insured.


Shipping Method - Disclaimer

A notice regarding the selection of Media Mail as method of shipping:

We at DVD Empire continue our efforts to improve the shopping experience of our customers by offering Media Mail as a shipping option for domestic orders. Many of our customers have requested this method due to its exceptionally low cost. While we appreciate our customers desire to save money, we do offer a few considerations regarding the selection of this shipping method:

Media Mail is a less efficient method of shipping than all other methods available on our site.
While we are in the process of adding delivery confirmation to our Priority Mail Service, and such confirmation is already available with our FedEx services, Media Mail does not offer Delivery or Signature confirmation.
We have recently surveyed our customers who have selected the Media Mail shipping method and have found that roughly 7% of all orders have taken longer than 14 days.
Geographic proximity to our shipping location in Pennsylvania does have an effect on delivery time, and should be considered when placing orders with Media Mail.

With these things mentioned, we hope you make and understand your selection of Media Mail as your shipping method of choice, and wish you a pleasant experience with DVD Empire.


However, below is from their shipping definitions page which does state the following:


Definition of Shipping Methods

USPS Media Mail - Package NOT Insured. Delivery within an average of 6 - 15 business days after order is shipped (Mon - Sat) for the Continental United States. Other states delivery times may vary. Media Mail includes no provision for tracking or insurance and has proven to be a less reliable shipping method than USPS Priority Mail. Instances of "Lost" Shipments are reviewed on a per case basis and may require a four week waiting period for processing delays.

Definition of Shipping Terms

Package NOT Insured - If the package is lost, damaged, or vandalized in shipment DVD Empire can not be held liable for the merchandise or cost of shipment.


In my opinion it would help if DVDEmpire would add this statement to the shipping disclaimer section. As I must admit, I didn't see this at first either.

Easy
02-26-02, 10:03 AM
Originally posted by Deke Rivers

Then pay the extra buck for better shipping ..they give you a choice with a disclaimer then you take that choice and get mad when something they warn you aout actually happens? wow..maybe you are best off going to a brick and mortar
The extra buck?
From the site:
USPS Media Mail $0.95 + $0.35 per item.
UPS Ground (cheapest insured) $4.00 + $.95 per item.
You'll have to explain your math yourself... I sure can't.
B&M? No. Thanks for your suggestion but I think I'll stick with Deep Discount where the prices are cheaper, the shipping is free and they replace lost shipments.

Deke Rivers
02-26-02, 10:12 AM
uuuuhhh...the etra buck would be for priority mail which is trackable and which dvdempire reccomends..ups is anot a mail company..nothing wrong with my math..and I use Deep Discount as well ..they are both good e-tailers

Josh-da-man
02-26-02, 10:27 AM
Delivery Confirmation is available for media mail.

Easy
02-26-02, 10:28 AM
Originally posted by rdodolak
Below is from their shipping disclaimer from checkout. Notice that it doesn't state anything about not replacing lost or nondelivered packages. Nor does it state that they are not insured.[i]
Shipping Method - Disclaimer
A notice regarding the selection of Media Mail as method of shipping:
Media Mail is a less efficient method of shipping than all other methods available on our site.
While we are in the process of adding delivery confirmation to our Priority Mail Service, and such confirmation is already available with our FedEx services, Media Mail does not offer Delivery or Signature confirmation.

Wow. Is this false information really presented at checkout? Anyone who cares to check with the Post Office can easily confirm that delivery confirmation IS available for media mail. I use it all the time. Cost - $.50 for packages sent media mail.

yiinhc
02-26-02, 10:39 AM
Originally posted by Deke Rivers
uuuuhhh...the etra buck would be for priority mail which is trackable and which dvdempire reccomends..ups is anot a mail company..nothing wrong with my math..and I use Deep Discount as well ..they are both good e-tailers

From DVDEmpire:
Definition of Shipping Methods:
USPS Media Mail - Package NOT Insured. Delivery within an average of 6 - 15 business days after order is shipped (Mon - Sat) for the Continental United States. Other states delivery times may vary. ... Instances of "Lost" Shipments are reviewed on a per case basis and may require a four week waiting period for processing delays.

USPS Priority Mail - Package NOT Insured. Delivery within an average of 2 - 4 business after order is shipped (Mon - Sat). Instances of "Lost" Shipments are reviewed on a per case basis and may require a four week waiting period for processing delays.

Definition of Shipping Terms:
Package NOT Insured - If the package is lost, damaged, or vandalized in shipment DVD Empire can not be held liable for the merchandise or cost of shipment.

DVDEmpire says 'Media Mail includes no provision for tracking or insurance and has proven to be a less reliable shipping method than USPS Priority Mail', but I don't see how the extra buck would give you more protection.

yiinhc
02-26-02, 10:45 AM
p.s. DVDEmpire dosen't say they use trackable Priority Mail. And, as stated above, media mail is trackable via dilivery confirmation.

kzoghbi
02-26-02, 03:42 PM
That is the reason why i stopped to buy from them. I bought a lot of DVDs from them in the past, but I have two big errors on the past, one was an order missed and the other one was some adult movies that I never order.

I was very painful obtain a straight answer from them. The only way that I solve my problem was when I post here, they reach me right away, but this is not fair, they were concerned about the bad publicity.

I WILL NEVER BUY FROM THEM

Deke Rivers
02-28-02, 09:57 AM
Originally posted by yiinhc


From DVDEmpire:
Definition of Shipping Methods:
USPS Media Mail - Package NOT Insured. Delivery within an average of 6 - 15 business days after order is shipped (Mon - Sat) for the Continental United States. Other states delivery times may vary. ... Instances of "Lost" Shipments are reviewed on a per case basis and may require a four week waiting period for processing delays.

USPS Priority Mail - Package NOT Insured. Delivery within an average of 2 - 4 business after order is shipped (Mon - Sat). Instances of "Lost" Shipments are reviewed on a per case basis and may require a four week waiting period for processing delays.

Definition of Shipping Terms:
Package NOT Insured - If the package is lost, damaged, or vandalized in shipment DVD Empire can not be held liable for the merchandise or cost of shipment.

DVDEmpire says 'Media Mail includes no provision for tracking or insurance and has proven to be a less reliable shipping method than USPS Priority Mail', but I don't see how the extra buck would give you more protection.
Priority is trackable..media is not

yiinhc
02-28-02, 10:39 AM
Originally posted by Deke Rivers

Priority is trackable..media is not
Your proof is?

Let me say this one more time. Both media and priority mail are trackable, as long as you pay extra for delivery confirmation or other services. I believe delivery confirmation is 50 cents extra for media and 40 cents for priority.

cineman
02-28-02, 12:45 PM
I've never had a problem with DVD Empire. I did have a package arrive with missing DVD's, but they promptly sent replacements without any more charges or problems.

I usually get my pre-orders before street date.

They are tops in my book.

Mike Myers
02-28-02, 01:57 PM
Originally posted by yiinhc

Both media and priority mail are trackable, as long as you pay extra for delivery confirmation or other services. I believe delivery confirmation is 50 cents extra for media and 40 cents for priority.

These rates are correct.

However, Delivery Confirmation is NOT a tracking service. You just get a standard info containing the delivery date, time and ZIP.
Only Express Mail provides a FedEx-style full tracking service with en route scans.

It is obvious that the info on Empire's website is incorrect. They could purchase Delivery Confirmation and even Signature Confirmation with media mail shipments to make them more secure.

However, they don't and their shipping terms are very clear: the customer is fully responsible for lost or vandalized media mail shipments, while Empire assumes liability for priority mail shipments "on a case to case basis". It is your choice - you choose.

BTW, I always used media mail with Empire from the moment they started offering it. It is fast because of my location, and I never had a package go missing.

yiinhc
02-28-02, 04:53 PM
Originally posted by Mike Myers
However, they don't and their shipping terms are very clear: the customer is fully responsible for lost or vandalized media mail shipments, while Empire assumes liability for priority mail shipments "on a case to case basis". It is your choice - you choose.
Mike, you're right. Delivery confirmation just shows if the package has been delivered.
I only placed order with Empire once and I too chose media. I didn't see where Empire assumes liability for lost priority mail shipments. I think "Lost" Shipments are reviewed on a per case basis and may require a four week waiting period for processing delays for both methods.
Did they really say 'the customer is fully responsible for lost or vandalized media mail shipments'? I think my CC compnay would disagree.

Mike Myers
03-01-02, 06:32 AM
Originally posted by yiinhc

I didn't see where Empire assumes liability for lost priority mail shipments. I think "Lost" Shipments are reviewed on a per case basis and may require a four week waiting period for processing delays for both methods.

I wrote 'Empire assumes liability for priority mail shipments "on a case to case basis". ', which is exactly what they say on their website, and what you quote in your post.

I once inquired about this, and a CSR told me that they normally reship or refund priority mail shipments after these four weeks waiting period. However, if the number of shipments reported lost by one customer becomes excessive they reserve the right to refuse liability.

They don't want to scare you away by letting you pay for merchandise you didn't receive, but they don't want to be cheated either.

Did they really say 'the customer is fully responsible for lost or vandalized media mail shipments'? I think my CC compnay would disagree.

Right. You could dispute the charge then, and there would be nothing for Empire to do against it (except for getting rid of you as a customer...).

yiinhc
03-01-02, 08:19 AM
Originally posted by Mike Myers
They don't want to scare you away by letting you pay for merchandise you didn't receive, but they don't want to be cheated either.

Originally posted by Mike Myers
Right. You could dispute the charge then, and there would be nothing for Empire to do against it (except for getting rid of you as a customer...).

Cheating? getting rid of? those are very offensive words. As I said, I have only placed one order with them, and I have yet to receive the pre-order due in March. I am simply discussing their policies here.

Lost media shipments are reviewed on a case to case basis also, and I fully understand their right to refuse liability if the number of shipments reported lost by one customer becomes excessive.

mrowley
03-01-02, 09:10 PM
I had a friend who told me of an instance where his DVDEmpire international shipment was lost.

They kept asking him to be patient and used delaying tactics.

They told him that international shipments would not be considered lost until after 60 days had elapsed.

In the end my friend decided to have VISA reverse the charge because of non delivery.

Unfortunately because 60 days had elapsed VISA would not reverse the charge. **** BEWARE OF THIS LITTLE KNOWN FACT****

DVDEmpire neither re-shipped his order nor did they give him a refund, but just referred to their policy that they are not liable for lost shipments.
(Upgrading to Courier shipping options is just prohibitively expensive for international customers)

In my opinion DVDEmpire knows this fact and this is why they delay resolving the issue of lost shipments.

Both he and I will no longer deal with this company.

Josh-da-man
03-02-02, 12:18 AM
Originally posted by Mike Myers


Right. You could dispute the charge then, and there would be nothing for Empire to do against it (except for getting rid of you as a customer...).

When I have to file a complaint with my credit card company over a retailer, they've already lost me as a customer.

Low RG
03-03-02, 04:10 PM
I've spent thousands of dollars with DVD Empire and have never had a lost shipment. I do use Priority shipping which cost a little extra (even though they ship without delivery confirmation!), but I feel it's worth it.
All of my pre-orders arrive to me out here on the West Coast on the Monday before street date without fail.

Mike Myers
03-05-02, 05:19 AM
Originally posted by Low RG

All of my pre-orders arrive to me out here on the West Coast on the Monday before street date without fail.

This is one of the reasons why I always pre-order from Empire. I get most shipments on Saturday before street.

@mrowley: International customers should order from Amazon. AFAIK this is the only company that does refund customers for lost international shipments. Empire clearly states on the website that they are NOT responsible for those shipments (which I can understand given the unreliability of international mail services and the issues after 9/11). By placing an order your friend agreed to these terms. If he wanted to have his money back, he should have disputed the charge right away (within the timeframe his CC company allows this), because he already knew from the website that Empire would NOT reship or refund the order in any case.

@yiinhc: I didn't mean to offend you. Sorry if you got me wrong. But you certainly agree that there are customers reporting shipments lost just to get their money back, although they did receive the package. What I was not saying is that you are one of these. Of course you aren't. But Empire has to take precautions against such people.

yiinhc
03-05-02, 08:17 AM
Originally posted by Mike Myers
@yiinhc: I didn't mean to offend you. Sorry if you got me wrong. But you certainly agree that there are customers reporting shipments lost just to get their money back, although they did receive the package. What I was not saying is that you are one of these. Of course you aren't. But Empire has to take precautions against such people.

I don't agree what you said about customers intentially reporting lost packages. There are other reasons that a package got lost. Bad luck? or bad neighborhood. I said that DVDEmpire could refuse the liability, but they didn't 'take precautions against such people'. They are against all the people, because lost shipments are reviewed on a case to case basis. From what I read here, people are treated the same way for lost shipments, even it was their first case and they had ordered a lot of DVDs from them before. You are lucky that you received all your media shipments. You might have different opinions if someday one of your packages got lost and you had to wait 4-6 weeks for nothing (no refund or reshipment).

mrowley
03-05-02, 04:54 PM
Mike Myers

I do not believe that a company such as DVDEmpire should completely abrogate responsibility in the case of lost shipments the way they do.

There are many reasons why shipments may be "lost", including:

Never having been shipped in the first place
Misaddressed
Insufficient Postage

and the obvious one of the postal service shortcomings.

I would have to say that I have been ordering shipments internationally ever since DVDs came on the market.

I've ordered thousands of DVDs, in the last 5 years or so, from such places as:

Amazon.com
Amazon.co.uk
Amazon.de
Blackstar
Bensons
DVDPlanet
AB Sound
Digital Eyes
CDNow
DirectDVD
Deep Discount DVD
North American DVD
DVD BoxOffice
Reelcom
DVDExpress
The Movie Store
Checkout.com (Remember those deals: :)
DVDNorth
Music Boulevard
Laser's Edge

I have always received all shipments sent via USPS Air from the above companies, apart from DVDBox Office, in which case I could get no satisfaction and had VISA reverse the charge.

As far as I am aware DVDEmpire is the only company that has this blanket "no responsibility for lost shipments" policy on their website.

kzoghbi
03-06-02, 02:35 PM
I was a DVD Empire customer and I was theur customer for two years, every month I spent approximately 300 dollars, you made the math and you can see that I was a good customer. Everything was perfect until I have an order that I did not receive and they keep me waiting for like 1 month to receive a replacement. The customer service was very bad, like I stole the package.

One of the worst thing is that they send me a package with some adult movies and they denied, the order was not in their system, but I have the movies and the invoice. They requested that before that they send me any replacement I need to return the movies, they believe when I send a fax with the Invoice, but they never give me an answer why this happen and they never refund the shipping charges.

Now for me it is very simple, I am not buying anything from them.

DVD Empire is the best store when you do not have a problem, if you have one, good luck in try to solve this problem.

pietrop
05-13-02, 10:35 AM
In case anybody's still interested, I did get a refund through my credit card company. I'd advise anybody having this type of problem to go that route instead of beating your head against the wall with customer service. (I finally wrote them a detailed snail mail letter, to which they didn't even reply.)

A final observation: All the parsing of the fine print from various locations on the company's website misses the point. If they are having so many shipping problems that they can't afford to cheerfully replace lost shipments, then I submit that there is something wrong with their fulfillment process.

I have NEVER encountered a reputable company that takes this kind of attitude toward its customers. In my experience, very few shipments by ANY method are lost in transit. It would be in their own best interest to replace the missing merchandise in these relatively rare cases, rather than fighting with their customers.


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