Kickstarter: Tropes vs. Women in Video Games
#1
DVD Talk Hero
Thread Starter
Kickstarter: Tropes vs. Women in Video Games
You guys heard about the whole Tropes vs. Women in Video Games debacle that happened recently?
A blogger from Femenist Frequency wanted to do a six part series of the portrayal of women in video games. She was asking for $6K to fund the project. Apparently a lot of folks got pissed (presumably 4chan was where the flames were fanned) and they hijacked the comments section of her video on youtube, wrote a lot of nasty stuff on her wikipedia entry, etc.
Long story short, despite all the attacks (or perhaps because of said attacks), supporters flooded in droves and the project has now been funded by a total pledge of $158,917.
It sounds like an interesting series. It's not a burning topic (sexism in videogames is well known) but if, handled well, could make for an interesting series. I just hope it doesn't end up a whiney/preechy mess as such anti-discrimination documentaries usually end up.
I hope she ups her game to make the most out of so much support. Also, I hope she gives a passing mention at least to the fact that there are gender stereotypes for male characters as well (either musclebound He-Man types of metrosexual himbos).
A blogger from Femenist Frequency wanted to do a six part series of the portrayal of women in video games. She was asking for $6K to fund the project. Apparently a lot of folks got pissed (presumably 4chan was where the flames were fanned) and they hijacked the comments section of her video on youtube, wrote a lot of nasty stuff on her wikipedia entry, etc.
Long story short, despite all the attacks (or perhaps because of said attacks), supporters flooded in droves and the project has now been funded by a total pledge of $158,917.
It sounds like an interesting series. It's not a burning topic (sexism in videogames is well known) but if, handled well, could make for an interesting series. I just hope it doesn't end up a whiney/preechy mess as such anti-discrimination documentaries usually end up.
I hope she ups her game to make the most out of so much support. Also, I hope she gives a passing mention at least to the fact that there are gender stereotypes for male characters as well (either musclebound He-Man types of metrosexual himbos).
#4
DVD Talk Legend
Re: Kickstarter: Tropes vs. Women in Video Games
And looking at the descriptions of her planned videos, these two seem to contradict each other.
The Sexy Villainess - Video #4
Unattractive Equals Evil - Video #9
I do want to see this series, although I'm mainly interesting in the final one about the female representations she does find acceptable. Also I'm curious if she'll address the fact that many of the worst offenders (going off her title card collage) come from Japanese games, and if she'll go into how the differences in cultures likely contribute to the level of objectification, if you will.
Last edited by DRG; 06-18-12 at 10:49 AM.
#7
DVD Talk Hero
Thread Starter
Re: Kickstarter: Tropes vs. Women in Video Games
Yeah, this is really where I think her arguments could live or die... If her argument just boils down to "Women can't be strong, capable heroines without being sexy and idealized" then she's missing the point that almost all player-controlled human characters are idealized, male or female. If you're going to complain about Lara Croft's Barbie body, then you should also complain about Marcus Fenix's hulking roid physique.
This would be a facinating documentary all to itself. Hopefully that's what the episode "Man with Boobs" is about. Since that description sounds like something I've seen in quite a few JRPG's and Japanese cartoons.
#8
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Re: Kickstarter: Tropes vs. Women in Video Games
Plus, it's feminist frequency. I imagine that is the agenda and they don't much care about the way that men are portrayed.
#9
DVD Talk Hero
Re: Kickstarter: Tropes vs. Women in Video Games
I think the recent controversy over the new Tomb Raider was the vulnerability of Lara and the fact that the trailer focused on her being tied up, with rape threats, and then the creators basically saying something akin to that's what makes her into the strong woman she became or something to that effect. Let's be honest, the main target for videogames is men, who like their superhero fantasies and attractive females. I mean, I cringe at stuff like the character designs for Lollipop Chainsaw (and I realize it's on-purpose over the top) but that's what the demographic is.
I would argue that 99% of all videogame main character designs are either "super hot" or "grotesque" with no middle ground. Who wants an ordinary, pudgy protagonist?
I would argue that 99% of all videogame main character designs are either "super hot" or "grotesque" with no middle ground. Who wants an ordinary, pudgy protagonist?
#10
DVD Talk Hero
Thread Starter
Re: Kickstarter: Tropes vs. Women in Video Games
As for Elena, it's interesting that when a female character artist got to work on her in Uncharted 3, the artist's first instinct was to "make her more feminine" and "pretty". It would be a gross oversight if the series doesn't discuss this as well since gender stereotypes are not exclusively enforced by men.
#11
DVD Talk Legend
#12
Moderator
Re: Kickstarter: Tropes vs. Women in Video Games
I'm fine with her focusing on the portrayal of women in video games. Seems like a legit topic, and I don't understand the rage. I wish I knew about this before funding ended so I could throw in a few bucks.
Hopefully she can explain how metal bikinis are able to serve as adequate armor in RPGs.
Hopefully she can explain how metal bikinis are able to serve as adequate armor in RPGs.
Last edited by Groucho; 06-18-12 at 05:36 PM.
#13
#14
DVD Talk Hero
Thread Starter
Re: Kickstarter: Tropes vs. Women in Video Games
I'm not saying everyman characters are nonexistant rather that they are rare compared to the hulking and/or ridiculously toned badasses and spikey haired emo douches with huge swords (very prevalent in JRPG's and Japanese games in general).
The fact is, gender stereotyping in games is not one sided. And female gender stereotypes are oftentimes encouraged/enforced by women themselves (and likewise by men for male characters).
My point is that there are two sides to this, like the extremes fujishig pointed out and the ridiculousness that does indeed befall female characters that Groucho pointed out.
Thank goodness that plumber hasn't fallen out of favor with the general public.
The fact is, gender stereotyping in games is not one sided. And female gender stereotypes are oftentimes encouraged/enforced by women themselves (and likewise by men for male characters).
My point is that there are two sides to this, like the extremes fujishig pointed out and the ridiculousness that does indeed befall female characters that Groucho pointed out.
Thank goodness that plumber hasn't fallen out of favor with the general public.
#15
DVD Talk Hero
Thread Starter
Re: Kickstarter: Tropes vs. Women in Video Games
You know, the cynic in me is starting to wonder if this whole campaign was just a ruse to buy herself a ton of games and call it "research".
#16
Re: Kickstarter: Tropes vs. Women in Video Games
If, Bayonetta, isn't in that pile, she's failed. Everything that is wrong with women in games exists in that tacky, hollow, cliche of a character.
#17
DVD Talk Hero
Thread Starter
Re: Kickstarter: Tropes vs. Women in Video Games
You know, that post reminds me that I never got passed the prologue in that game. In all fairness my PS3 fatty had died shortly after I got it. But I have not been inspired to play it on my slim for some reason.
Last edited by RocShemp; 08-30-12 at 11:21 AM.
#18
Re: Kickstarter: Tropes vs. Women in Video Games
Well now I don't feel as bad about my pile of shame.
And how the hell is she going to play Diablo 3 and Starcraft? Is she going to buy a gaming rig too?
And how the hell is she going to play Diablo 3 and Starcraft? Is she going to buy a gaming rig too?
#19
DVD Talk Hero
Re: Kickstarter: Tropes vs. Women in Video Games
Hope Ms Splosion Man is on her list. Since that one is all about, you know, 'sploding... and shoes. This kind of shit reminds me while they make plenty of games for adults, a majority of the gaming population is made up of 13 year old boys.
Last edited by RichC2; 08-28-12 at 08:12 AM.
#20
DVD Talk Hero
Re: Kickstarter: Tropes vs. Women in Video Games
This thread is really about what I expected.
Certainly men are stereotyped in games. They are idealized power fantasies. And men generally don't find that the stereotypes of supernaturally strong, capable men create a hostile space for them.
Women are stereotyped as sexual objects and that portrayal generally creates a hostile environment for women who play videogames.
This is kind of a difference.
Certainly men are stereotyped in games. They are idealized power fantasies. And men generally don't find that the stereotypes of supernaturally strong, capable men create a hostile space for them.
Women are stereotyped as sexual objects and that portrayal generally creates a hostile environment for women who play videogames.
This is kind of a difference.
#21
#22
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
Re: Kickstarter: Tropes vs. Women in Video Games
This thread is really about what I expected.
Certainly men are stereotyped in games. They are idealized power fantasies. And men generally don't find that the stereotypes of supernaturally strong, capable men create a hostile space for them.
Women are stereotyped as sexual objects and that portrayal generally creates a hostile environment for women who play videogames.
This is kind of a difference.
Certainly men are stereotyped in games. They are idealized power fantasies. And men generally don't find that the stereotypes of supernaturally strong, capable men create a hostile space for them.
Women are stereotyped as sexual objects and that portrayal generally creates a hostile environment for women who play videogames.
This is kind of a difference.
#23
DVD Talk Hero
Thread Starter
Re: Kickstarter: Tropes vs. Women in Video Games
That is true. I know plenty of female cosplayers that adore the skimpy outfits of videogame and cartoon characters. But, on the other hand, I know many who also like the more "modest" (albeit rather flamboyant in terms of ornamentation) attire as well.
Looking at the Feminist Frequency FaceBook page, I'm sure there will be a "us poor subjugated women" slant to the series but I want to watch it nonetheless. Stereotypes tend to be such because they're often true so it'll be interesting to hear what she has to say about the games she'll be playing.
Looking at the Feminist Frequency FaceBook page, I'm sure there will be a "us poor subjugated women" slant to the series but I want to watch it nonetheless. Stereotypes tend to be such because they're often true so it'll be interesting to hear what she has to say about the games she'll be playing.
#25
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Re: Kickstarter: Tropes vs. Women in Video Games