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Old 03-01-07, 10:54 AM   #51
Michael Corvin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Hinkle
And I see nothing wrong with reviews knocking the controls for being too complicated, especially given the focus of the entire fucking console on offering an easier, more intuitive control scheme.
That doesn't mean that every single game released needs to be simplified to kiddie levels like WiiSports. Variety is the spice of life. If a developer wants to push the envelope to get more out of the Wiimote but requires a steeper learning curve, who am I to complain? If it is right for the game, then so be it, I'll give them the benefit of the doubt and give it a shot.

Like I said above, there is no difference between taking the time to master comlex button combinations and timing on a traditional controller and taking time to learn the same moves with motion. It is all a matter of if you want to break that 20 year grip on the traditional controller to try something new.

What the article above and varying scores actually shows is which reviewers go all out with the sweeping motions and got the most out of the game vs. the armchair reviewers that try getting the game to work with the most basic motions.

The article and varying scores has actually piqued my interest in the game. It sounds a lot more interesting now vs. a traditional SSX that I would have little to no interest in. My gaming plate is full, but Blur will definitely be going on my "buy it cheap" list.
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Old 03-01-07, 10:57 AM   #52
KurrptSenate
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totally agree...


You have to take into consideration the amount of time spent playing with traditional controls, as well as your background using them

Obviously, given the newness of such controls that the wii uses, it would take some time to get acquainted with brand new control schemes

From what I've read, the most basic controls in SSX are easy to master in less than 10 minutes
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Old 03-01-07, 10:59 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Corvin
That doesn't mean that every single game released needs to be simplified to kiddie levels like WiiSports. Variety is the spice of life. If a developer wants to push the envelope to get more out of the Wiimote but requires a steeper learning curve, who am I to complain? If it is right for the game, then so be it, I'll give them the benefit of the doubt and give it a shot.
That's fair I suppose. My issue isn't so much with the learning curve on its own, but the fact that it seems that even with practice the controls will never be as consistent or precise as a traditional pad. What's the point of investing the time to learn if the end result is still less than the normal way of playing?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Corvin
Like I said above, there is no difference between taking the time to master comlex button combinations and timing on a traditional controller and taking time to learn the same moves with motion. It is all a matter of if you want to break that 20 year grip on the traditional controller to try something new.
That's fair as well. I'm willing to put in the time if it seems like an improvement over the traditional method. So far to me it doesn't. I like it when it's used to complement traditional controls like in Zelda, but I don't know that I'll ever like the full on motion controls in many games unless they find a way to get it much closer to real 1:1 accuracy.

I had huge hopes for the Wii, and still do. I've just been severely underwhelmed so far. Part of that is probably just due to lack of 1st party games since Zelda was just a GC port and Warioware just a half assed version of a tired series IMO.

I'm very excited to see how they use it in games like Mario Galaxy.
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Old 03-01-07, 11:01 AM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KurrptSenate
From what I've read, the most basic controls in SSX are easy to master in less than 10 minutes
Exactly. The only point of contention seems to be the uber tricks. Which would be the equivalent of pulling of a master level fighting move in your first couple of hours in a fighting game. It just doesn't happen without a learning curve.
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Old 03-01-07, 11:02 AM   #55
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How would they know if games worked with difficult, more realistic controls? They haven't tried tackling it nearly and enough, and honestly, I'm the people that went out and bought the game are more than happy to spend the needed time to get a deeper appreciation of what the developers were looking for, and how to reproduce those motions with any sort of precision.

Obviously, that's going to deter people from picking up the game, but I think the inverse would also be true.

I'm not a fan of the series, really, but considering that I've snowboarded countless times in real life, the steep learning curve of the controls (supposedly) is getting me more interested in the title.

Obviously you have to make the call whether or not to pull the trigger on this title, but I will ask you this : would you have purchased the game if the controls were easier/ less intuitive, or are you just venting about the system in general?
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Old 03-01-07, 11:07 AM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KurrptSenate
Obviously you have to make the call whether or not to pull the trigger on this title, but I will ask you this : would you have purchased the game if the controls were easier/ less intuitive, or are you just venting about the system in general?

I would have given it a rental and maybe a purchase after a price drop. I'm dying for something to play on my Wii besides GC games.

I was hugely excited for the system for a good year before launch and thus far it's just been a huge piece of shit for me.

-It cost $50 too much
-The controls have underwhelmed me as I was expecting 1:1 accuracy
-The game library is probably the worst of any launch console I've bought in my gaming career, and there's not much on the first year slate that has me excited
-The VC games cost 2x what I'd pay for them
-The OS is glitchy and freezes too often
-The online doesn't look like it will ever be anything special
-Though I'm not a graphics whore, the games looking no better than GC games thus far is dissapointing

I still have faith in Nintendo as I was similarly disenchanted with the DS at this point in its life and that has turned out to be phenomenally great. I just regret jumping on board at launch.
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Old 03-01-07, 11:23 AM   #57
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Slop101 I read your impressions on the trick controls and have one question. Are you pressing the A button before you land? This is important or you will indeed crash on many tricks. Don't press it when you are about to hit the ground. Maybe 15-20 feet before you would hit the ground depending on the trick. It's a good idea to do this after each trick so you can fit more into a single jump.
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Old 03-01-07, 11:37 AM   #58
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I have no problem with the learning curve on the controls because when you get the hang of the way the game plays, i feel the controls add to the game.

I also think that some reviewers don't learn the controls before they publish a lot of Wii reviews. I find that most Wii reviews are tough to follow because there is a huge level of bias on the part of the reivewer regaurding the controls.

As for nintendo, they did claim that this system would be more friendly to non-gamers, but you didn't honestly think that translated into every game released?
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Old 03-01-07, 11:42 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huh?
As for nintendo, they did claim that this system would be more friendly to non-gamers, but you didn't honestly think that translated into every game released?
No, of course not.

But I did expect every game to be easier/more intuitive (or at least equal) to control vs. traditional controls.

Of course stuff like Zelda isn't going to appeal to hard gamers, but the controls were more natural and intuitive than the GC version, especially the aiming.

SSX they've made much more complicated and hard to pick up than the traditional versions, and I wasn't really expecting to see games that took that design approach.
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Old 03-01-07, 11:47 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Hinkle
I would have given it a rental and maybe a purchase after a price drop. I'm dying for something to play on my Wii besides GC games.

I was hugely excited for the system for a good year before launch and thus far it's just been a huge piece of shit for me.

-It cost $50 too much
-The controls have underwhelmed me as I was expecting 1:1 accuracy
-The game library is probably the worst of any launch console I've bought in my gaming career, and there's not much on the first year slate that has me excited
-The VC games cost 2x what I'd pay for them
-The OS is glitchy and freezes too often
-The online doesn't look like it will ever be anything special
-Though I'm not a graphics whore, the games looking no better than GC games thus far is dissapointing

I still have faith in Nintendo as I was similarly disenchanted with the DS at this point in its life and that has turned out to be phenomenally great. I just regret jumping on board at launch.
Then just sell the system and be done with it dude. You seem to have your mind made up that you don't, and won't ever, like it.
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Old 03-01-07, 11:51 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by steebo777
Then just sell the system and be done with it dude. You seem to have your mind made up that you don't, and won't ever, like it.

Not at all, as I said I have great faith in Nintendo as I had the same opinions of the DS (minus cost and OS complaints) at the same point in its life span.

I'm sure I'll be singing a different tune when Metroid, Mario Galaxy etc. are out. Plus I've been a long time Nintendo fan, so I don't have it in me to sell it just yet.

It's just had a slow start.
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Old 03-01-07, 12:05 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Hinkle
But I did expect every game to be easier/more intuitive (or at least equal) to control vs. traditional controls.

Of course stuff like Zelda isn't going to appeal to hard gamers, but the controls were more natural and intuitive than the GC version, especially the aiming.

SSX they've made much more complicated and hard to pick up than the traditional versions, and I wasn't really expecting to see games that took that design approach.
The series needs a breath of fresh air. Sure, it might take you longer to master the controls but when you do the game is much more immersive than the previous entries. Not every game on the Wii is going to be a simple tech demo. We've certainly had enough of those and I'm glad we now have a game that has been designed to make the experience as engaging as possible without worrying if peoples grandparents are going to be able to play. The Wii has shown that it can indeed make games that just about anyone can pick up and play but why limit all games to that? It's a versatile system and after spending several hours with the game, I do feel that Blur's controls are exactly what this series needed to make it fun and interesting again. If you want super simple snowboarding that anyone can master in a matter of seconds, play Super Monkey Ball: Banana Blitz.
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Old 03-01-07, 12:22 PM   #63
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I don't want all games to be that simple--hell I don't like Wiisports because it is too simple.

This just sounds overly convoluted, and the apparent fact that the uber tricks can't be done consistently even with a ton of practice is disconcerting.

There needs to be a happy medium in between. Zelda hit the nail on the head IMO, and I'm dying for some more games that do such a great job of blending traditional controls with neat use of the motion controls to make the game more immersive.

Stuff like this just isn't for me as I have zero patience to learn complicated controls. At the same time, the tech demo crap isn't for me as I don't like games that simplistic, much less for the $50 launch game prices.

Again, I need a happy medium between the two and I expect to get it with stuff like Metroid and Mario Galaxy and I can't wait to play those games.
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Old 03-01-07, 12:23 PM   #64
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The guy in the gonintendo article says how he had no problem drawing an ubertrick in the practice mode - I can't even seem to do that, so how can I even hope to do it while playing?
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Old 03-01-07, 12:26 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarthMarino
Slop101 I read your impressions on the trick controls and have one question. Are you pressing the A button before you land? This is important or you will indeed crash on many tricks. Don't press it when you are about to hit the ground. Maybe 15-20 feet before you would hit the ground depending on the trick. It's a good idea to do this after each trick so you can fit more into a single jump.
Yeah, I try, but it takes a steady hand, because even the slightest shift of the remote starts a new trick, so even though I hit A, I sometimes start another trick after that. I'm getting better at it though.
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Old 03-01-07, 12:31 PM   #66
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I found the best way to get good at tricks is just to go on a half pipe and keep practicing until you've mastered it. Try just hitting A several times before you land so just in case your hand does move, you'll land anyway. I find the trick to landing Ubers more often is to make the motion fairly large and not to rush. Also, make sure that the final direction is kind of exageratted. For example, if you are making the "Z" shape from top to bottom, move your arm about 2 feet from left to right before you release the button.
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Old 03-01-07, 01:14 PM   #67
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I remember Tony Hawk 1 was a B(*CH to learn at first. But after what took maybe hours of training and practice, I got much MUCH better. I have the feeling this will become the norm for games like SSX, which rewards for the time spent on it. Anyone who has actually PLAYED the games have thoughts towards this opinion?
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Old 03-01-07, 01:26 PM   #68
huh?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Hinkle

SSX they've made much more complicated and hard to pick up than the traditional versions, and I wasn't really expecting to see games that took that design approach.
you haven't even played it yet. i found the controls (except for pulling uber tricks) to be very easy to pick up. some of the reviewers found them hard, some didn't. you haven't played it. how do you know?
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Old 03-01-07, 01:47 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huh?
you haven't even played it yet. i found the controls (except for pulling uber tricks) to be very easy to pick up. some of the reviewers found them hard, some didn't. you haven't played it. how do you know?
seriously, play it then come back, don't parrot reviews when the reviews are split on the controls

and why bother poo-pooing Wii every other post? we get it, you're unimpressed. i can sum up every recent Josh Hinkle post - "I'm disappointed with my Wii."
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Old 03-01-07, 01:50 PM   #70
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honestly, if you compare the Wii titles to the PS3 ones that aren't out for other systems, the Wii would beat the pants off of it
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Old 03-01-07, 01:53 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keit2208
seriously, play it then come back, don't parrot reviews when the reviews are split on the controls
Fair enough. I'm just pretty sure I'd be more inclined to agree with the negative reviews as every game that's gotten knocked for controls thus far on the Wii I've agreed with the complaints. That and the description of how the controls work for uber tricks (drawing motions that don't seem to have much to do with what the trick involves) isn't appealing to me in general.


Quote:
Originally Posted by keit2208
and why bother poo-pooing Wii every other post? we get it, you're unimpressed. i can sum up every recent Josh Hinkle post - "I'm disappointed with my Wii."

There's a great ignore user feature, use it if you don't like my posting. The Wii the only next gen system I own, and I'm going to post about it pro and con a lot. It's going to be con-side heavy until we get out of this post gaming drought.

Pretty funny to be getting bashed for this, when before I used to get bashed for being a Nintendo Fanboy.
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Old 03-01-07, 01:55 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by KurrptSenate
honestly, if you compare the Wii titles to the PS3 ones that aren't out for other systems, the Wii would beat the pants off of it
Oh, the Wii is definitely much better than the PS3. You just don't here me bitching about the PS3 as I had enough sense to not shell out $600 for a fucking game console.

If only I'd had sense to wait a year or two on the wii.
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Old 03-01-07, 01:56 PM   #73
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umm.....

to the point about "drawing motions that don't seem to have much to do with what the trick involves".... have you played an SSX game? Those moves, in no way, are even possible, let alone mimic any sort of movement that could be reproduced IRL
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Old 03-01-07, 01:59 PM   #74
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As far as bashing the current Wii titles, I'm sort of in the same ball park, and I hated Zelda with a passion...

I totally realize I purchased way too many games for the sytem that I'll never play, but thats standard practice for a new game system, and I'm that trend will continue.

Waiting is ALWAYS the more intelligent thing to do, but then, how could we be the "cool" kid on the block without having the newest toys?
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Old 03-01-07, 02:13 PM   #75
Michael Corvin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KurrptSenate
Waiting is ALWAYS the more intelligent thing to do, but then, how could we be the "cool" kid on the block without having the newest toys?
Well it is hard to pass up when it's only $250. So even if you get 2 games you like, that is still pretty good for a launch. So $250, an extra controller and a couple games is still $50 cheaper than a premium 360 with 1 game an no extra controller.

In essence, it is easier to swallow because of price.

I'm looking forward to seeing more DVDtalker's impressions on it.
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