Tonight's Buffy *spoiler*

[Vryce]

Just thinking, another angle to get her back may be in the following way.

Buffy's mother was brought back from the dead, though we never actually saw if she was normal or a zombie like representation.

Now that Willow has much stonger powers, due to the dark magic book, maybe she will attempt to bring Buffy back via a spell.

[12thmonkey]

Great episode. Totally entertaining.

As for the return of Buffy, we all know it's going to happen. It's just a matter of how. I'll go with either the vamp theory or a Dawn/Key-induced resurrection. I wouldn't mind a dark, evil Buffy for a while.

The X-Files had Mulder dead and buried, and he was brought back, so expect the unexpected.

It's TV.

[elektra]

SPOILERS SPOILERS SPOILERS

DON'T READ PAST THIS IF YOU HAVEN'T SEEN THE SEASON FINALE. I DON'T BLACK OUT MY POSTS.



Okay, first let me say that Buffy will be back. I find it hard to believe that the UPN is paying 2.3 million per episode only to have the lead character/actress leave the show. How they will do it is anyone's guess. Maybe there's a part of Buffy that's in another dimension and she has to get back somehow. I can't see them vamping her because she's dead and buried. Although bringing her back will be interesting in itself, particularly if she's been enbalmed.

As for the show going down hill, I happen to think that this show is better than anything else out there. It's all a matter of opinion. I felt that her jumping in to stop this was kind of lame because the whole build up was that Dawn's energy as the key had to stop it and her blood. Granted, their blood was mixed and the blood was the key, I just felt it should have been Dawn.

As for how easily Glory was beaten, when Willow got Tara back, she weakened Glory and I think the Daggonsphere helped as well. The hammer worked in their favor at that point. Good point about them not thinking of those two things earlier on.

What Giles did, did not surprise me in the least. It was established that in his "ripper" days, he was much more dangerous and may have crossed the line a few times. It was also established that he loves Buffy as a daughter and would do anything (that we're aware of) to protect her. This was proven when he went against the watchers council during the trial for her 18th birthday. So that, to me, was right in character for him.

I can see them maybe bringing Faith back for a bit to deal with things; or starting up a new slayer. As for Buffy and Faith rematching, I can't see it. They have not really patched up their differences, but Buffy clearly saw that when Faith turned herself in, she had changed.

I do find it a bit overdone to kill the character again. Been there, done that. But overall, I liked the episode. The emotional responses, particularly Spikes, was great. I read, I think on scifi.com that the show will have a two hour premiere in August. I liked the fact that they had Willow show up on Angel in the end and he just knew that something was wrong. From what I've read, Fred will be a regular on Angel.

[Goldberg74]

Originally posted by elektra
Okay, first let me say that Buffy will be back. I find it hard to believe that the UPN is paying 2.3 million per episode only to have the lead character/actress leave the show.

Well you know... that Scooby Doo movie could re-jumpstart her movie career...

[renaldow]

All in all I thought it was a good finale. Sure, they killed Buffy off before and they may even do it again. Here are just some thoughts on the ep and on the previous postings:

I've been watching Buffy since day 1, and during the first couple seasons I used to read the boards and articles about it. Whedon originally killed off Buffy as the finale of season 1 because he didn't know if there would be a season 2, and decided that it would be a good finale if the show never came back. During the 2nd season he said that when Buffy left WB he would definitely kill her off to end the show. So, it looks like he's staying true to that even if the show's just moving networks.

I liked the finale quite a bit. I don't feel cheated or think it was contrived in any way, Whedon is good at making excuses and I thought they held up here. There's been criticisms about the dagonsphere and hammer. Well, I agree the dagonsphere was put away without thought and brought out (it wasn't very powerful anyways, so it's not like it was the key to stopping her all along or anything lie that), but the hammer's power is something only Anya would have known about. It belonged to the ogre/giant she used to date and no mention of it being 'forged by the gods as a gods weapon' or whatever was mentioned during that episode. It just went up on the shelf. No one would've thought to use it before due to it's weight, and the fact everyone else thought it was pretty much just a big hammer.

If you look back upon previous episodes you'll see that Anya is the first to panic, but she's also the only one who can think under pressure. Having been a demon for so long she's the only one that can really wrap her mind around some situations and put everything in perspective for everyone else. She also thinks a lot of things that are common knowledge to her are common knowledge to everyone, so doesn't speak up about things. I thought her orb/hammer idea & speech was very much in character. I still want to know what's up with her and the bunnies.

I didn't think the battle between her and Glory was lame, it was not the apex of the finale, Buffy dying was. We all knew Glory was fallible, it's not like she was invincible or anything. She was just dang tough. All you had to do was catch her by surprise or when she was weakened. Also, I agree that Buffy just pushing Doc off the catwalk was pretty good. That's happened a few times on Buffy. Remember the bad ass demon the frat boys accidentally raised at their halloween party? Everyone was freaked out and he turned out to be 6" tall and they just smashed him.

Yeah, Buffy died, boo-hoo. She'll be back, we all know it. She's got a contract and the show is named after her. I was very surprised that they showed the grave though. A good choice on Whedon's part, IMHO. We all know she's dead and buried, very final. How will she come back? Probably in one of 2 ways: 1. Some way lame and contrived that will cause us to roll our eyes or 2. Some way we never thought of and will impress us.

She won't be vamped. It could be an interesting plot twist for next season, and unvamping her could be the vehicle to unvamp Spike as well. We don't know what happened between the last 2 scenes, and really there could be a week or more in that time frame. A lot can happen. She had ample oppurtunity to be vamped as she was laying there dying. I say dying because she didn't necessarily have to be dead yet. No brains on the floor, eh? Spike wouldn't have vamped her, possibly some other vampire could've for the irony of it all, but I doubt it. I don't think she was vamped.

Likewise, Willow or Dawn will not zombify her. We know it's possible but we also know that it's not right. Things come back different.

She jumped through a portal, and is more than likely in another dimension. I would bet her body fell through, but here spirit or soul or whatever is in another dimension. I believe the scoobies will realize this somehow next season, open up a doorway and out she walks. She'll come back a lot more powerful and wise from her experience.

Sorry for the long post! Could anyone tell me what the 'crossover' at the end of Angel was? I don't watch Angel very often so I didn't see it.

[Vryce]

I didn't catch Angel either yesterday, as I have 6 weeks on my Tivo to go through.
But from what I have read. Willow showed up in LA to give the bad news to Angel.
I think they cut out on Angel seeing Willow and the look in his eyes he knew something serious was wrong.
I will ahve to wait until I watch it or someone posts if she actually told him, or they just ended it after he saw Willow.

[das Monkey]

Originally posted by renaldow
Sorry for the long post! Could anyone tell me what the 'crossover' at the end of Angel was? I don't watch Angel very often so I didn't see it.

Re: the first part of your post ... agree on most counts. People just want to complain, but the finale was quite good.

Re: Angel ... first off, you should watch this show, as it's getting quite good. It'll never be Buffy, and it took itself a while to figure that out. But now that it knows its place, it's fun to watch. As for the "crossover," I don't see why everyone is in a hissy about it. You can judge for yourself, but it didn't lend me to believe there was a crossover in the future. Here's what happened:

After a thoughtful but humorous episode, Angel and Co. return from The Host's dimension laughing and joking. As they arrive at the door to their hotel, Angel pauses and smiles and says something to the effect of "Wait... I've always wanted to do this." As he opens the double-doors wide he grins "there's no place like ..." and trails off as this look comes over his face. Camera pans to Willow sitting on his couch with a look of dispair. Angel realizes the extent of the dispair and whispers "Buffy" to himself. Cut to credits.

My interpretation of this is not any kind of crossover (while that may happen anyway), but a reminder. After Buffy dies, we sit through an hour of light-hearted Angel fun. The lasting image of this season should not be Angel and Co. laughing; it should be Buffy's death. And this final scene serves as a smack in the face to the audience ... "why are you laughing? Don't you remember ... Buffy's dead."

Hope that helps.

das

[renaldow]

Thansk das, that did help. I agree, it probably wasn't anything and I doubt it signifies a future crossover. I think it was probably put there as a reminder too.

[Hoc]

In the whole "Buffy's dead" frenzy, did anyone else remember that a ton of bricks fell on Anya, and she wasn't moving? Also, we didn't see her in the final scenes. She could be dead.

[12thmonkey]

Originally posted by Hoc
In the whole "Buffy's dead" frenzy, did anyone else remember that a ton of bricks fell on Anya, and she wasn't moving? Also, we didn't see her in the final scenes. She could be dead.

She was there, in Xander's arms, very much alive,with the obligatory cut on her head.
How is that a ton of bricks fall on a person, and all they get is a cut on the head??

[sabre]

i have watched every episode of buffy from day one.
spoilers


the season finale was okay, not great but had its moments. giles taking out ben was cool, buffy taking out the doc cool, but he is probably not dead, considering xander and spike stabbed him and he lived. glory's ending was not great but decent. she was not that great a villian. scooby gang needs someone to go evil, either spike or willow. less concentration on dawn and spike for next season would help the show tremendously. and willow is getting a little too powerful, either make her evil or chill the powers. dump anya, i like xander but he really has had nothing to do on the show the last couple of years since the characters went to college, which began the slide of the show. i guess we can expect another slayer next year to be called upon and be on the show, also a return of faith my favorate character whould be appreciated. by the way angel stinks as a show, any uniqueness of angel being good is lost when angel is running around helping other demons who are good, demon should be evil. plus gunn adds nothing to show except the african american demographic.
i am sure whedon has a story planned to bring back buffy but killing her off again is kinda lame, its been done before, and kinda shows that the show is in decline as the original ideas are gone. by the way dawn was not a real person, she's energy for buffy to sacrifice herself and the world and threatening her friends for dawn just didn't ring true to me. imho

[Slumbering Fist]

I’m not bothering with spoilers since it was given up by quite a few people many posts ago.

Well everyone just remember that its fantasy so, Buffy will come back in some way plausible in the whole Slayer world mythology. Dead and buried, so the whole vamping thing is out, it may be The Fates, or something that allow her to come back, or I figure with Buffy getting a two hour season premiere, maybe the whole gang goes into the afterlife to bring Buffy back. elektra and renaldow summed it up pretty well, get your heads out of fantasy land and remeber that Buffy will be back for the UPN reason alone that they aren’t going to kick-start the series as a signature show and spend 2+ million an episode without Gellar as the Slayer.

About Giles, to Dr. DVD and strangelove, respectively. Giles actions only reinforced what has been hinted about him in the past (The Ripper) and his approach to the whole Dawn situation solidified that he is a man capable of doing what’s necessary, even if it is morally gray and harsh. And as far as Giles possible spin-off, it is only a spin-off in the limited sense, a short run British show, allowing the actor to go home to his family for awhile, but not permanently having his own show and leaving Buffy.

As far as Glory’s easy defeat. Did they not show her in the last two episodes becoming increasingly weaker and looney? Didn’t they also show her a few times this season be all out of it because she just needed that one extra psyche to keep her level? Maybe I’m the only one that caught that?

As far as the crossover, and I echo this in the Angel post too, Boreanez was asked about crossovers last week at a WB press conference, and he said there wont be any more Buffy crossovers, and joked that they told him he could be on Felicity.

[Dr. DVD]

Originally posted by Hoc
Didn't you guys hear all the talk about how Dawn was made from Buffy? It would not be at all out of the realm of possibility to have Buffy cloned from Dawn.

I did think it was a very emotional ending, and I did like the way she took care of "Doc" so easily.

This might be a possibility, since Joss Whedon penned the sci-fi great Alien:Resurrection and used that ploy to bring back Ripley. Anyone else notice similarities between the ending of this episode and the ending of Alien 3?