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Old 03-16-01, 10:42 PM   #1
phantom_azazel
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will any ram work with my computer?
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Old 03-16-01, 11:06 PM   #2
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no
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Old 03-17-01, 01:15 AM   #3
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too general
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Old 03-17-01, 01:40 AM   #4
gcribbs
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assuming the computer is new it probably uses dimms but it could use rdram or ddr dimms and even dimms have some different types. let us know what type of computer you have or motherboard if you have a home built or clone.
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Old 03-17-01, 10:20 AM   #5
phantom_azazel
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it think it has sdram
this is a pionex i dont know waht kind of mother board it has. this is a 2 year old computer

p3 500
96 mb ram


[Edited by phantom_azazel on 03-17-01 at 09:14 AM]
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Old 03-17-01, 10:45 PM   #6
Nocturnal
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Restart your computer and hit DEL during boot to get to the bios. The name/make of your motherboard may be listed there (or on the bootup screen).
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Old 03-18-01, 01:22 AM   #7
gcribbs
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well what i would do is pull out the memory chip from your computer- put it in a ziplock bag and go to your local computer store and ask them to tell you what type of memory you need for your computer- the p3 500 uses pc 100 dimms i think. if the price is good i would get pc133 dimms since they should work anyway at the slower pc100 speed.

if you do not know how to change the ram then bring the whole computer less monitor and stuff to the computer shop and let them do it
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Old 03-18-01, 03:21 AM   #8
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PC133 CAS3 will run (slightly) slower than PC100 CAS2, if it is on a motherboard with PC100 ram. It will run the same speed as PC100 CAS3. Most of the time you won't even notice the difference between CAS3 and CAS2 though. Since your next computer will probably be using Rambus or DDR ram, there's really no point in getting PC133 just because the number is capable of going faster, even if the prices for PC100 and PC133 are very close.
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Old 03-18-01, 05:00 AM   #9
gcribbs
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Quote:
Originally posted by raytseng
PC133 CAS3 will run (slightly) slower than PC100 CAS2, if it is on a motherboard with PC100 ram. It will run the same speed as PC100 CAS3. Most of the time you won't even notice the difference between CAS3 and CAS2 though. Since your next computer will probably be using Rambus or DDR ram, there's really no point in getting PC133 just because the number is capable of going faster, even if the prices for PC100 and PC133 are very close.
Actually i do not think that is true.Remember cas3 pc133 ram does not have to stay cas 3 when it runs with pc100 ram at the lower 100 FSB. For example cas 3 pc133 dimms will almost certainly run at pc100 cas2. and not all pc100 cas 2 ram will run at pc133 cas 3. the pc100 cas 2 dimms are 8 ns ( http://www.crucial.com/store/PartSpe...e=CT16M72S4D8E ) whereas the pc133 cas3 dimms are 7.5 ns( http://www.crucial.com/store/PartSpe...e=CT16M64S4D75 ) and the pc133 cas 2 dimms are 7 to 7.5 ns. so pc133 cas3 dimms can be faster not slower than pc 100 cas 2 dimms. i know this varies by maker somewhat but then so does the PCB board that the chips are on

The price difference for cas 2 pc133 and cas 3 pc133 is very small 90 cents for a 64 Mb dimm at crucial. i do not know about you why not spend the extra 90 cents to get the cas 2 64 MB dimm.

here are some prices from crucial:

64 MB pc100 cas 2 $27.89
64 MB pc133 cas 3 $31.49
64 MB pc133 cas 2 $32.39

difference of $4.50 to get better ram

128 MB pc100 cas 2 $49.49
128 MB pc133 cas 3 $51.29
128 MB pc133 cas 2 $54.89

difference of $5.40 to get better ram


256 MB pc100 cas 2 $81.89
256 MB pc133 cas 3 $89.99
256 MB pc133 cas 2 $94.49

difference of $12.60 to get better ram


I would buy the 128 MB dimm in this case since for only $5.40 more you can use it in new motherboards right now like the a7v133 that allows you to use Athlon-c running at 266 FSB and still use pc133 cas 2 dimms.

Really it is up to you if you want to pay a little bit more to get a little longer life span on your ram. It is worth it for me. maybe 5 bucks is not worth it for you.

YMMV




[Edited by gcribbs on 03-18-01 at 03:06 AM]
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Old 03-18-01, 08:11 AM   #10
raytseng
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The cas number relates to the timing of the ram.

CAS3 means it will take 3 cycles to get the data. CAS2 means it will take 2 cycles. It is a discrete number, you can't have 1/2 a CAS number. So on a PC100 machine, even if you make your PC133 CAS3 Ram run at CAS2 it performs exactly the same as the PC100 CAS2 in terms of latency (2 cycles=20 ns). Once data starts getting transferred, it'll happen pretty fast, but the transfer time will still be based on the clock (10ns for PC100 7.5 ns on PC133).

But anyway, in terms of this particular situation, you shouldn't spend the extra money because you don't need it. If you are supplementing your existing PC100 RAM, which is the situation in this case, then just get PC100 RAM , PC133 won't run any faster 2 cycles is 2 cycles (not 8ns vs 7 ns). When you are going to upgrade from your P3-500 you're not going to just get a PIII800-PIII1GHz which is not that big of a jump, you will probably go the full way and get a the latest, which would mean DDR SDRAM or Rambus RDRAM.

Really it doesn't matter, RAM is so cheap now and PC133 prices are very close to PC100. But I'm replying just for the sake of arguing, like how premium gas will actually perform worse than regular; in terms of mileage (i.e. power to engine from burning) if your car only requires regular.
=)
Ray

[Edited by raytseng on 03-18-01 at 06:27 AM]
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Old 03-18-01, 12:06 PM   #11
phantom_azazel
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there is no local computer shop where i live
this is the ram im looking to get

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applicati...=tc1-mem-256-3
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Old 03-18-01, 05:35 PM   #12
raytseng
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Since you have no idea what ram you will need, I suggest you get ram from a place with a good return policy, even if it means paying more. Crucial has a 30 day return policy and makes extremely high quality ram. Tiger Direct may cause a little more trouble for you in terms of customer service if the ram doesn't work, despite what they say in their help page.

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Old 03-19-01, 12:12 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by raytseng
Since you have no idea what ram you will need, I suggest you get ram from a place with a good return policy, even if it means paying more. Crucial has a 30 day return policy and makes extremely high quality ram. Tiger Direct may cause a little more trouble for you in terms of customer service if the ram doesn't work, despite what they say in their help page.

see we agree on something

I believe the webpromo 15% off link at crucial still works for your first order. so you will get an additional 5% off the already low prices http://www.crucial.com/webpromo/

I still think the value of pc133 ram will hold up longer than pc100 ram so that even if you do not need it in your next upgrade you will find some market interest in it via ebay and the difference is very small to get the better ram.

I understand that the ns rating does not directly relate to cas timing but as you move to 133 FSB and need the ram to run at the faster speed it is important usually especially if you are going to push the ram faster than it is rated to go.

I may be coming at this from a strange position because i do minor overclocking and these little things can allow you to be stable at a faster speed because you bought high quality ram. my pc133 cas 2 ram is running at 146 at cas 2 the cheaper ram i have which is pc100 will not run over 125 at cas 3. for me the ram makes a huge difference.

sometimes at 3 am i tell people what i would do because it is only 5-6 bucks to get better ram. I guess for others the 5-6 bucks is a lot .

Raytseng, I enjoyed the discussion
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Old 03-19-01, 02:31 AM   #14
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yup, i agree with you that if you are an overclocker or tweak your computer, than getting the faster ram will make a difference. However, for this particular situation: a not to experienced person wanting to expand their current PC100 ram, then getting faster PC133 ram that will be used at PC100 won't make a difference. I was recommending to the user to get PC100 ram over PC133 (both PC133cas2 or PC133cas3). If you are running a FSB of 133+ I agree get the CAS2 and as fast as it gets.

Additionally, faster PC133 ram downclocked to PC100 ram can actually perform worse under certain situations, (but they're both so fast it doesn't matter, your HD for memory swapping will be the bottleneck). There are timing cycles that are in both modules that have constants that don't change. For example the row access speed takes about 40ns on both chips. So micron hardwires the PC100 chip to use 4 cycles for row access(4*10=40). The PC133 chip still takes the same 40ns to do row access so micron hardwires the timing to take 6 cycles for row access (6*7.5=45ns). When you slow down the PC133 chip to PC100, it will still use the 6 cycle timing. There are other timing latencies in addition to row access, but like I said before, a few nanoseconds are so fast it doesn't even matter! Defragging or doing stuff to the HD=like upgrading to 7200RPM and ATA66 or putting separate HDs on different buses will probably result in much more noticable speed increases (from VM speedups)!

I agree that the $5-6 is not a lot, but if you're certain that you're not going to use the extra features provided by the $5-$6 than you shouldn't get it. It's kinda like getting a decoder card for your DVDRom even though you always use a software decoder player that doesn't use the card(to a lesser degree though...)

This was a fun discussion, but it's getting sidetracked now and probably isn't helpful to the original poster anymore.

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