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Old 04-26-04, 05:51 PM   #1
Nickel-01
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Patent an idea that may solve the P2P predicament for Record & Movie Industry

Patent an idea that may solve the P2P predicament for Record & Movie Industry


Hi all,

First of all, I would like to say that I'm not standing on the record companies' side. Those greedy bastards piss me off when they started sueing people and now, they're talking about stopping your internet connection if you've downloaded a file with a suspicious filename!! This is "presumed guilty until proven innocent" at its best! The exact opposite of our country's criminal law system. But I think that no matter how much these businessmen and lawyers try to prevent people from downloading music and movies, it will continue to happen, and it is only going to get worse (in their current standpoint) with the advancement of technology.

The other thing is, I also hate the "organizations" which mass produce pirated materials - movies, music, games, software... etc. Sure I download them for free off the web and I am a pirate... but at least I didn't try to make a buck off of these stuff. I am a hypocrite in that respect, but I am trying to think of ways to fix the whole situation...


Now, I thought of an idea, a possible, viable business model and technical solution that may *ease* this problem. (I used *ease* because I truly think there's no way to stamp out piracy.) But my question is, can I patent an *idea* like that? I thought through the whole business model, and I thought through the technical side of "how this can be done"... ... I think it can be done, but before I present my idea to a few great programmers out there, I want to make sure that they won't go "Oh well, this is not gonna work" and then stole my idea and start a new company with it.

So, if any of you has experience securing a patent for an idea and started a business with it, can you please share your experience with me.

Thanks,

Nick
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Old 04-26-04, 08:37 PM   #2
TheSilverSurfer
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Consult a local copyright, patent, business lawyer.

If your truly serious then you'll be willing to fork out a little dough to secure your idea. Then you can do waht Bill did and license your idea out to companies, royalties etc. Never sell it unless your contract allows for royalties steming down the treee to whoever they may sell or lease too.

You may do some searches out there and see if your idea has already been thunk up. Chances are it has, but perhaps no one has acted.

About all I'm thinking of now....i'm hungry and going to go eat.

Good Luck.
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Old 04-26-04, 10:04 PM   #3
ElementZ
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Why don't you tell me your idea and I will guide you
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Old 04-26-04, 11:51 PM   #4
sfsdfd
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Coincidentally, I am a practicing patent attorney. I am certified to practice both before the U.S. Patent & Trademark Office and in the state of Ohio.

Even more coincidentally, I specialize in software patents. In order to bolster my career, I am currently completing a masters degree in computer science while working toward several Microsoft certifications.

So I think I can give you some decent advice. However, a public disclosure of any kind - including describing the idea here - completely bars you from subsequently filing for international patent protection, and also limits the time frame for filing within the U.S. So, please do not disclose the idea at DVD Talk (to me or anyone else.)

If you will email me, we can start a dialogue.

- David Stein
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Old 04-27-04, 04:07 AM   #5
TheSilverSurfer
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Quote:
Originally posted by sfsdfd
Coincidentally, I am a practicing patent attorney. I am certified to practice both before the U.S. Patent & Trademark Office and in the state of Ohio.

Even more coincidentally, I specialize in software patents. In order to bolster my career, I am currently completing a masters degree in computer science while working toward several Microsoft certifications.

So I think I can give you some decent advice. However, a public disclosure of any kind - including describing the idea here - completely bars you from subsequently filing for international patent protection, and also limits the time frame for filing within the U.S. So, please do not disclose the idea at DVD Talk (to me or anyone else.)

If you will email me, we can start a dialogue.

- David Stein
Just remember to take his advise and don't disclose the information to him.
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Old 04-27-04, 08:54 AM   #6
sfsdfd
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Quote:
Originally posted by TheSilverSurfer
Just remember to take his advise and don't disclose the information to him.
Quote:
Main Entry: con·text
Pronunciation: 'kän-"tekst
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, weaving together of words, from Latin contextus connection of words, coherence, from contexere to weave together, from com- + texere to weave -- more at TECHNICAL
1 : the parts of a discourse that surround a word or passage and can throw light on its meaning
2 : the interrelated conditions in which something exists or occurs


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Old 04-27-04, 09:34 AM   #7
Nickel-01
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Wow... I didn't even know i need a lawyer for securing a patent... but I should've known, I went to the gov's patent office website and there are so many terms on there the whole site is like cryptic! LOL.

Thanks for the advice David... I sure won't disclose any part of the idea on a public forum, I just came here to ask for advice. But before I ask anymore questions about patents, I have some questions about you...

It's the err... Microsoft Certifications... Why are you doing those? I mean, if I'm a practicing lawyer and getting my master degree in CS, the last thing I would do is to get more certifications (especially from MS.) I have some MS certs myself, got them mainly back in the days when I worked at MS, they're useless to me now. (They were never very useful neiter...) I would imagine that sticking to your attorney side of skills will bring you the most fortune... am I wrong?
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Old 04-27-04, 10:30 AM   #8
sfsdfd
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Quote:
Originally posted by Nickel-01
Wow... I didn't even know i need a lawyer for securing a patent...
In fact, you don't. Any inventor can submit a patent application to the USPTO. Next time you're at a Borders, stop by the law section - you'll find at least one "Patent It Yourself!"-type book.

But, just like representing yourself at your own criminal trial, filing your own patent application is probably not a good idea. Patent prosecution is a very subtle and complicated skill - in the claims section (the most important part of the application), literally a single misplaced word can destroy an otherwise solid patent. Since a single patent typically costs several thousand dollars and two years for prosecution, you need to be very careful that you don't end up with a useless patent.
Quote:
Originally posted by Nickel-01
It's the err... Microsoft Certifications... Why are you doing those?
Two reasons. First, I'll be using them to support my technical background. The MCIS demonstrates academic proficiency; the certifications verify my understanding of real-world computing practices. Together, they should make me stand out from my peers in terms of sufficient background for prosecuting software patents.

(Simply put, there are a lot of really bad software patents out there - mostly because they're written by EEs, who approach software patents like circuits. While it's true that hardware and software are functionally identical, that doesn't mean they're equivalent. One of my long-term goals for my patent prosecution career is to improve the quality of software patents in general - my profession really needs a different perspective altogether.)

Second, it's really just personal interest. I've been doing amateur Windows programming for almost a decade now, but I never really focused on learning it - like most programmers, I just foraged for useful code on an as-needed basis. This is the one point in my career where I can devote a considerable amount of time to an activity like this, and it's been richly rewarding so far.

Quote:
Originally posted by Nickel-01
I would imagine that sticking to your attorney side of skills will bring you the most fortune... am I wrong?
Heh... you're not wrong, it just hasn't happened yet. I expect to make a big career move at the conclusion of this program (in a year), and then this may come to pass.

- David Stein
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Old 04-27-04, 01:37 PM   #9
Nickel-01
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I see...

From here on, it's gonna get serious so I think I better email you instead of posting here.
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Old 04-27-04, 06:17 PM   #10
ravan
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Software patents are evil
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Old 04-27-04, 11:46 PM   #11
sfsdfd
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Quote:
Originally posted by ravan
Software patents are evil
Methinks you've been reading too much slashdot.

Software patents are not evil. They're inherently neutral, like every other business tool. They can be abused - and of course, that's what you hear about - but that's true of every business tool, including fax machines and SEC filings.

You also hear about boneheaded software patents that stupid examiners sometimes let slip through. However, those problems are resolving themselves, for several reasons:
  • The familiarity and skill of patent examiners regarding software is improving;
  • Companies are realizing that pursuing really dumb patents is just a huge money pit, with no enforcement opportunities; and
  • All of those lame patents serve as prior art - they serve to document the current state of the art, so that no one else can later patent the same (non-novel) concepts.
Perhaps the biggest problem with the "software patents are evil" crowd is that the exact same arguments were raised 20 years ago in reference to biotech. But you don't hear any strong objection to biotech patents today, because they work well - indeed, they're the primary reason why we have an amazing flood of great drugs these days (Paxil, Ritalin, interferon beta, and Viagra, among others.)

Software patents will come around, too. Keep in mind - this whole field is basically five years old. Give it some time to mature.

Finally, one shining example of a successful software patent: RSA public-key encryption, which powers virtually all encryption these days. It's not clear that the research would have been conducted (with such a thorough and practical focus) had RSA Industries not had a (patent-protectible) business reason for doing so - and RSA made a handsome profit from the patent enforcement. Today we have worldwide free usage of RSA, and with it this whole thing called e-commerce...

- David Stein
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Old 04-28-04, 09:46 AM   #12
Nickel-01
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Hey Dave, did you get my email? I sent it yesterday. I know my return address is a little werid, it's one of Yahoo Mail Plus's feature called "Address Guard", basically that's a fake address that redirect emails to my real email address. Can you please shoot me an email when you get a chance? Thank you.
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Old 04-28-04, 11:33 AM   #13
sfsdfd
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Nickel-01: I've been watching for your email, but it may have gotten swamped in the flood of spam. Please send me an email with "sfsdfd" in the subject line - that will evade my spam filters (both digital and mental.)

- David Stein
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Old 04-29-04, 02:01 PM   #14
sfsdfd
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Nickel-01: I got your email, but my attempts to return it keep bouncing with the following message: "----- The following addresses had permanent delivery errors -----"... do you have an alternate email address?

- David Stein
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Old 04-29-04, 04:47 PM   #15
Nickel-01
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Just sent you another w/ my work email in it. This one definitely works.

Nick
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