Release List Reviews Shop Join News DVD Giveaways Video Games Advertise
DVD Reviews | Theatrical Reviews | Adult DVD Reviews | Video Game Reviews | Price Search Buy Stuff Here
DVD Talk
DVD Reviews DVD Talk Headlines HD Reviews


Add to My Yahoo! - RSS 2.0 - RSS 2.0 - DVD Talk Podcast RSS -


Go Back   DVD Talk Forum > Shopping Discussions > Store Forum

Store Forum Share Your Shopping Experiences at Stores both Online and Off.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 01-05-12, 12:06 AM   #1
JZ1276
DVD Talk Gold Edition
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Long Island
Posts: 2,656
eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

So I sold an item on ebay that the buyer is claiming he never received. He filed for a refund which eBay gave him which was taken out of my paypal account. I informed ebay the item was shipped and I have the receipt for USPS to prove it. They still denied my appeal.
Basically, if anyone decides to buy an item from ebay and that item is shipped without a tracking number or delivery confirmation you can claim you never received it and get it for free! Have fun!
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-12, 12:13 AM   #2
Cardsfan111
DVD Talk Legend
 
Cardsfan111's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Indiana
Posts: 13,533
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

Hopefully it was an inexpensive item and therefore not a costly lesson to learn. Got burned once and have used delivery confirmation ever since.
__________________
DVD/BD Spending Tab: 2010 2011 2012 2013 2014
Rank 'Em As You See 'Em: 2010 2011 2012 2013 2014

"i 'm new here. most of people in here are good. but there is a miserable person. Look into your mirror. Superboy!" --New Member, robert11
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-12, 12:21 AM   #3
ChristianB
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Toronto, Ontario, CANADA
Posts: 366
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

Just like with selling on Amazon, the onus is on the seller to PROVE delivery.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-12, 03:21 AM   #4
JZ1276
DVD Talk Gold Edition
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Long Island
Posts: 2,656
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristianB View Post
Just like with selling on Amazon, the onus is on the seller to PROVE delivery.
Shouldn't the receipt be sufficient proof? I had this problem on Amazon recently. I sold a DVD to someone that claimed they never received it. Amazon contacted me asking if I had the shipping receipt which I didn't so the buyer ended up getting a refund. From that point I kept the receipts for every item I sold and shipped (which looks like is still pointless to do, at least for ebay).

This is a ridiculously easy way to get free stuff. Maybe 10% of people I buy from on ebay issue a tracking number. I might as well start taking advantage of those who don't from now on.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-12, 10:10 AM   #5
adrenaline78
DVD Talk Gold Edition
 
adrenaline78's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Janesville, WI
Posts: 2,991
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

Quote:
Originally Posted by JZ1276 View Post
Shouldn't the receipt be sufficient proof? I had this problem on Amazon recently. I sold a DVD to someone that claimed they never received it. Amazon contacted me asking if I had the shipping receipt which I didn't so the buyer ended up getting a refund. From that point I kept the receipts for every item I sold and shipped (which looks like is still pointless to do, at least for ebay).

This is a ridiculously easy way to get free stuff. Maybe 10% of people I buy from on ebay issue a tracking number. I might as well start taking advantage of those who don't from now on.
So what if they didn't receive the item?? So they should be out the $? I don't think so. Stuff gets lost in the mail all the time. It happens. Delivery confirmation is a must when dealing with selling to people.
__________________
PSN Network ID- al_adrenaline
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-12, 10:47 AM   #6
Larry C.
DVD Talk Limited Edition
 
Larry C.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Let's Go Heat!
Posts: 7,294
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

Why didn't you send him his item?

But wait I can send a package and get a tracking number and put nothing in the package but still have a tracking number?

So what does the tracking number prove?
__________________
Miami Heat Fan since 1987.
Lets Go HEAT!!!
Miami Heat 2006 NBA Champions!
Miami Heat 2012 NBA Champions!!
Miami Heat 2013 NBA Champions!!!
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-12, 10:53 AM   #7
Noonan
DVD Talk Limited Edition
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: MA
Posts: 5,955
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

Quote:
Originally Posted by adrenaline78 View Post
Delivery confirmation is a must when dealing with selling to people.
This x100
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-12, 10:59 AM   #8
disneyguy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 743
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

Quote:
Originally Posted by adrenaline78 View Post
So what if they didn't receive the item?? So they should be out the $? I don't think so. Stuff gets lost in the mail all the time. It happens. Delivery confirmation is a must when dealing with selling to people.
12 cents thru PayPal postage...well worth it..

DG
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-12, 11:12 AM   #9
Groucho
Moderator
 
Groucho's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
Posts: 66,988
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

Quote:
Originally Posted by disneyguy View Post
12 cents thru PayPal postage...well worth it..

DG
Yep. I've had more than one occasion where a buyer "didn't receive the item", I produced the delivery confirmation, and the item was mysteriously "found" and the issue was closed.
__________________
Xbox Live: Runner Groucho
PSN: RunnerGroucho

"The Borg is a species" -- Tracer Bullet (Citation)
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-12, 11:32 AM   #10
The Man with the Golden Doujinshi
DVD Talk Limited Edition
 
The Man with the Golden Doujinshi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Mister Peepers
Posts: 6,918
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

Quote:
Originally Posted by JZ1276 View Post
Basically, if anyone decides to buy an item from ebay and that item is shipped without a tracking number or delivery confirmation you can claim you never received it and get it for free! Have fun!
There's a section on ebay dealing with what you need to do to prove a shipment and a usps deliver confirmation doesn't count because it doesn't show the address it was delivered to, which is what they require for proof.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-12, 01:27 PM   #11
JZ1276
DVD Talk Gold Edition
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Long Island
Posts: 2,656
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

Quote:
Originally Posted by adrenaline78 View Post
So what if they didn't receive the item?? So they should be out the $? I don't think so. Stuff gets lost in the mail all the time. It happens. Delivery confirmation is a must when dealing with selling to people.
And thast USPS's fault. Not mine.
Who's not to say he did receive the item and is just claimed not to?
You think it's never been done before?
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-12, 01:47 PM   #12
Larry C.
DVD Talk Limited Edition
 
Larry C.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Let's Go Heat!
Posts: 7,294
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

This is all great but can't you just sent an empty package to the the buyer and have proof and something was sent? There is no way to prove that what was sent is indeed the correct item that was bought. If this is the case the system is flawed for both parties.
__________________
Miami Heat Fan since 1987.
Lets Go HEAT!!!
Miami Heat 2006 NBA Champions!
Miami Heat 2012 NBA Champions!!
Miami Heat 2013 NBA Champions!!!
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-12, 02:27 PM   #13
Trout
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Sub-basement 3b
Posts: 3,215
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

E-bay, the Mos Eisley of the internet...a wretched hive of scum and villainy.
__________________
Heathen pride.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-12, 07:01 PM   #14
TheBang
DVD Talk Limited Edition
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Formerly known as "Todd B."/Honolulu, HI
Posts: 5,476
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

Quote:
Originally Posted by JZ1276 View Post
And thast USPS's fault. Not mine.
No, as the seller you are responsible for contracting with the carrier to deliver the item successfully to the buyer. Until that item is delivered successfully to the possession of the buyer by the carrier you contracted, it is still your responsibility. Why should the buyer shoulder any responsibility for not receiving the item if YOUR carrier didn't deliver it?

The receipt is not sufficient proof. That only proves that you handed a package off to the carrier, not that the carrier has successfully delivered it to the recipient. For that, you need to take advantage of the carrier services that provide sufficient proof that you fulfilled your obligations (i.e. successfully delivering the item to the customer). This is where Delivery Confirmation comes in, and as others have said, you should get this for all your packages. You should ship through PayPal shipping, where you get Delivery Confirmation for free (or at a discounted rate off of retail rates). The postage you pay on the package weight is also discounted off of retail rates, so it's a win-win to ship through PayPal vs. USPS retail counter.

https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_ship-now

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister Peepers View Post
There's a section on ebay dealing with what you need to do to prove a shipment and a usps deliver confirmation doesn't count because it doesn't show the address it was delivered to, which is what they require for proof.
You're going to have to provide a citation to back up your claim, because this is incorrect. Here are my citations that show that Delivery Confirmation (which provides the delivered Zip Code) is sufficient for protection:

PayPal Seller Protection
"you'll need to provide Proof of Delivery from a shipping company that meets the following conditions:
...
It includes the recipient's address, including a minimum of the city & state, city & country or zip/postal code (or equivalent)."

eBay Protection:
"To be protected, the tracking information will need to show proof of delivery from a shipping company that clearly displays:
...
the recipient's address, displaying at least the city/state or ZIP code (or the equivalent)"
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry C. View Post
This is all great but can't you just sent an empty package to the the buyer and have proof and something was sent? There is no way to prove that what was sent is indeed the correct item that was bought.
You're absolutely right. In fact, there have been stories about people receiving an empty box or whatever from a seller, and not being able to win on the basis of "item not delivered" because something was delivered. The buyer should still be able to win on "item not as described", but that's harder to prove. Nevertheless, those are the rules. If, as a seller, you have a delivery confirmation, you're protected from "item not delivered" claims.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-12, 08:35 PM   #15
bigjim25
DVD Talk Legend
 
bigjim25's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: WV
Posts: 11,057
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry C. View Post
But wait I can send a package and get a tracking number and put nothing in the package but still have a tracking number?

So what does the tracking number prove?
Some asshole done that to me and a few others. My guess is he sent letters with confirmation and changed the address somewhat to look like it delivered at the PO. Me and the others buyers were out our money because he had proved it was delivered. I'm just about done with ebay after this. Costed me a little over $80 but the other buyers I contacted were out as much as $150. This guy had a pretty good scam going on.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-12, 04:04 AM   #16
JZ1276
DVD Talk Gold Edition
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Long Island
Posts: 2,656
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

Thanks for all the feedback. I thought receipt was proof enough, guess not. Although there's a slight chance the buyer really didn't get the item, I'm betting he did and would rather just take a shot at getting it free.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-12, 04:14 PM   #17
joeblow69
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
 
joeblow69's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 3,912
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

I've got a similar question I guess ... ordered something on ebay before xmas. The guy shipped it with delivery confirmation, but it never arrived. According to USPS, it was out for delivery on Dec 23, but never made it, and status was never updated since then.

The seller says that I have to deal with USPS. I'm thinking if they can't find it I can just put in a complaint with eBay? I'm assuming he should have bought insurance? Is that right?
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-12, 04:48 PM   #18
Obi-Wan Jabroni
DVD Talk Limited Edition
 
Obi-Wan Jabroni's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Detroit
Posts: 5,678
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

Quote:
Originally Posted by joeblow69 View Post
I've got a similar question I guess ... ordered something on ebay before xmas. The guy shipped it with delivery confirmation, but it never arrived. According to USPS, it was out for delivery on Dec 23, but never made it, and status was never updated since then.

The seller says that I have to deal with USPS. I'm thinking if they can't find it I can just put in a complaint with eBay? I'm assuming he should have bought insurance? Is that right?
You actually should send a missing package inquiry to USPS, because it does have a tracking number and who knows, they might find it, but yes, if there is no luck with that, you can put in a package not delivered complainted to ebay and you should get your money back, since the delivery confirmation doesn't show that it was delivered.
__________________
"I doubt anyone would use any of my comments in their signature." - gcribbs

-----
PSN: CactusKind
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-12, 05:01 PM   #19
Larry C.
DVD Talk Limited Edition
 
Larry C.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Let's Go Heat!
Posts: 7,294
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

I learned my lesson when I sold a radio/dvd/TV flip out dash kit and got really lucky. I had the auction end and a buyer sent me a msg that he really wanted it and would pay me directly via paypal. I accepted and then when he got it, he claimed I sent him one not as described with scratches and such. Luckily I had taken pics for the listing and had pics of the serial #. He wanted to send me his that was broken and keep the one I sent him.

But because it wasn't through ebay paypal wouldn't give him the time of day.
__________________
Miami Heat Fan since 1987.
Lets Go HEAT!!!
Miami Heat 2006 NBA Champions!
Miami Heat 2012 NBA Champions!!
Miami Heat 2013 NBA Champions!!!
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-12, 05:47 PM   #20
The Man with the Golden Doujinshi
DVD Talk Limited Edition
 
The Man with the Golden Doujinshi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Mister Peepers
Posts: 6,918
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Obi-Wan Jabroni View Post
You actually should send a missing package inquiry to USPS, because it does have a tracking number and who knows, they might find it, but yes, if there is no luck with that, you can put in a package not delivered complainted to ebay and you should get your money back, since the delivery confirmation doesn't show that it was delivered.
I just had a missing package turn up. I sent it to the guy and USPS said it was delivered on the 26th or 27th but he never got it. He reported it and then they delivered it this morning.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-12, 06:55 PM   #21
SkullOrchard
DVD Talk Platinum Edition
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: West Central Georgia
Posts: 3,104
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

Delivery confirmation doesn't mean shit if an incompetent postal worker delivers a package to the wrong address.

I never ship anything without delivery confirmation, but it's certainly not fail safe.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-12, 08:56 PM   #22
movieguru
DVD Talk Gold Edition
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,586
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

Quote:
Originally Posted by joeblow69 View Post
I've got a similar question I guess ... ordered something on ebay before xmas. The guy shipped it with delivery confirmation, but it never arrived. According to USPS, it was out for delivery on Dec 23, but never made it, and status was never updated since then.

The seller says that I have to deal with USPS. I'm thinking if they can't find it I can just put in a complaint with eBay? I'm assuming he should have bought insurance? Is that right?
Had this happen to me on an item I sold during the x-mas holiday. It showed "out for delivery" and then nothing. The buyer contacted me and I kept looking into it daily; even checking with a clerk at the post office who was no help at all. It finally did show up and was delivered 8 days later. It took just over 2 weeks for it to be delivered on a first class package. Luckily the buyer was understanding and left me positve feedback with all 5 stars.

I had 2 buyers give me a neutral for shipping out the same day and having the item delivered to them in 3 business days; saying it was too slow. Just out of curiousity I checked them out on faebook and my suspicions were correct. They were both fat lazy housewives who have nothing better to do than be idiots, eat, and watch Lifetime TV all day.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-12, 09:55 PM   #23
Texan26
Senior Member
 
Texan26's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 811
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

Quote:
Originally Posted by SkullOrchard View Post
Delivery confirmation doesn't mean shit if an incompetent postal worker delivers a package to the wrong address.

I never ship anything without delivery confirmation, but it's certainly not fail safe.
You can get delivery confirmation with signature. It costs more but if you are shipping an expensive item, I would get it. That's safer.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-12, 12:18 PM   #24
foxdvd
gamer for life
 
foxdvd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Muskogee, OK
Posts: 7,127
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

I buy just about everything from amazon, and they use ups....This Christmas I had a record 4 items "delivered" to my doorstep...only to not find them, and have a neighbor bring them to me later that day or the next day. I also received 2 packages that were not mine...just saying..
__________________


"Maybe she made the girl like her ass" Baron Of Hell

My Countdown Counting down to: THE FINAL
2126 days 7 hours 56 minutes
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-12, 07:58 PM   #25
TheBang
DVD Talk Limited Edition
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Formerly known as "Todd B."/Honolulu, HI
Posts: 5,476
Re: eBay buyer claims he didnt receive item...

So, just a quick follow-up to the discussion in this thread regarding delivery confirmation, an interesting thing happened with the USPS postage rate increases today. One of the changes the USPS made is that Delivery Confirmation is now FREE for electronically generated First Class Mail Parcels. This had the interesting side effect of making First Class parcels with Delivery Confirmation CHEAPER now than before the rate hike. For example, the 3 oz rate:

Electronically-generated First Class Mail Parcel

Prior to Jan. 22:
Up to 3 oz - $1.56
Delivery Confirmation - $0.19

After Jan. 22:
Up to 3 oz - $1.64
Delivery Confirmation - Free

Contrast this with the Retail rate (parcels mailed at the post office counter, or with stamps)

Prior to Jan. 22:
Up to 3 oz - $1.71
Delivery Confirmation - $0.80

After Jan. 22:
Up to 3 oz - $1.95
Delivery Confirmation - $0.85

It should be clear that there is tremendous benefit to printing your parcel postage using PayPal now:

https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_ship-now
  Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:03 AM.

Rules - DVD Talk - Archive - Privacy Statement - Top

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.2.0
Copyright 2011 DVDTalk.com All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy and Terms of Use.