Release List Reviews Shop Join News DVD Giveaways Video Games Advertise
DVD Reviews | Theatrical Reviews | Adult DVD Reviews | Video Game Reviews | Price Search Buy Stuff Here
DVD Talk
DVD Reviews DVD Talk Headlines HD Reviews


Add to My Yahoo! - RSS 2.0 - RSS 2.0 - DVD Talk Podcast RSS -


Go Back   DVD Talk Forum > General Discussions > Sports Talk

Sports Talk Discuss all things Sports Related

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 04-26-04, 10:35 AM   #1
NCMojo
DVD Talk Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 14,204
Report: BALCO gave steroids to Bonds, 26 others

From ESPN.com:
Quote:
A report obtained by the San Francisco Chronicle and San Jose Mercury News indicates that the owner of Bay Area Laboratory Co-Operative told federal investigators he gave steroids to nearly 30 athletes, including Barry Bonds and track stars Marion Jones and Tim Montgomery.

According to the newspapers, the document summarizes an Internal Revenue Service investigator's interview of Victor Conte last Sept. 3 during a search of the company, at which time Conte volunteered the names of the athletes.

Conte's lawyers denied the report, which reportedly lists 27 athletes -- among them Bonds, Jones, Montgomery, Kelli White and the Yankees' Jason Giambi and Gary Sheffield -- to whom Conte allegedly gave steroids.

The report, however, apparently does not say if any of the athletes used the substances -- THG, testosterone cream or both -- obtained from Conte.

The story on the Chronicle's Web site, quoting sources who requested anonymity, said Conte told federal investigators that Jones and Montgomery received the performance-enhancing substances in exchange for endorsements of his nutritional supplement.

Conte's attorneys question the legality of the interview and the veracity of the IRS agent's claims. His lawyers contend the IRS report is filled with fabrications and that Conte's statements have either been falsified or were coerced, as the IRS interview was conducted under intimidating circumstances and without a tape recorder.

"The coercive nature of that interview as well as the disputed contents of what the agents claim was said in that mysteriously unrecorded statement will be the subject of pretrial motions," defense lawyers Robert Holley and Troy Ellerman said in a prepared statement.

According to the Mercury News, Conte, in the report by IRS agent Jeff Novitzky and co-signed by San Mateo County Narcotics Task Force officer Jon Columbet, is quoted as saying:
  • Bonds' trainer, Greg Anderson, brought Bonds and several other baseball players to BALCO to obtain drugs at the beginning of the 2003 season. The steroids were the allegedly giving to Bonds in exchange for his endorsement of Conte's legal supplement, ZMA -- a zinc- and magnesium-based, legal nutritional product.
  • Conte allegedly gave Jones steroids for free in exchange for her endorsement of ZMA. Conte stopped working with Jones in 2001.
  • Conte gave Montgomery steroids in 2002 just before the sprinter set the world record in the 100ms, at 9.78 seconds, in Paris.
A lawyer for Conte told the Chronicle that the lab owner denied ever providing information to federal agents about any specific athletes receiving steroids.

Conte said in an e-mail message to The Associated Press that he couldn't comment. Jones' publicist, Lewis Kay, could not be reached for comment.

Jones' attorney, Joseph Burton, issued a statement saying the Chronicle's story was wrong.

"Victor Conte is either lying or the statement was involuntarily coerced. This is a character assassination of the worst kind," Burton said.

"Marion has never had an endorsement deal of any kind with Victor Conte or any of his businesses, and most specifically she has never received any illegal substances from Conte in exchange for her endorsement of his products."

Jones and Montgomery, both of whom testified last fall before a federal grand jury that indicted Conte and three other men, repeatedly have denied steroid use. All four indicted men have pleaded innocent.

Bonds, Giambi and Sheffield -- all of whom testified before the grand jury -- have denied using steroids. No athlete has been charged in the case.
It looks pretty damning for Bonds, Sheffield and Giambi, and especially for Bonds. If they kicked Pete Rose out of baseball for gambling, what should they do with players who knowingly took steroids for years? What does that mean for the record books?

The players are all denying the reports, just as Rose denied his accusations, but the evidence is beginning to mount. It is especially troubling when your name is listed along with a number of football players and track and field athletes who have already tested positive:

List Of Athletes In Report

The following 27 athletes are alleged in an IRS investigator's memorandum to have received THG from BALCO Laboratories, according to the San Jose Mercury News. (* indicates those who have tested positive for the drug.)

BASEBALL
Barry Bonds: No. 3 on all-time home run list. Testified before federal grand jury.
Gary Sheffield: New York Yankees standout. Testified before grand jury.
Jason Giambi: New York Yankees star first baseman. Testified before grand jury.
Jeremy Giambi: Former Oakland A's player. Testified before grand jury.
Armando Rios: Former San Francisco Giants player.

FOOTBALL
* Bill Romanowski: Former Oakland Raiders linebacker. Testified before grand jury.
* Dana Stubblefield: Lineman who was the NFL's 1997 defensive player of the year. Testified before grand jury.
Josh Taves: Former Raiders defensive lineman.
* Barret Robbins: Raiders center. Testified before grand jury.
* Chris Cooper: Raiders defensive lineman. Testified before grand jury.
Johnnie Morton: Wide receiver with the Kansas City Chiefs. Testified before grand jury.
Daryl Gardener: Was with the Denver Broncos last season.

TRACK AND FIELD
Marion Jones: Five-medal winner at 2000 Olympics, including three gold. Testified before grand jury.
Tim Montgomery: World-record holder in the 100 meters. Testified before grand jury.
* Regina Jacobs: Qualified for four U.S. Olympic teams in middle-distance events. Testified before grand jury.
* Kevin Toth: Shot put of 74 feet, 4 inches last April was world's best since 1990. Testified before grand jury.
Alvin Harrison: 2000 Olympic 400m silver medalist; two-time gold medalist in 4x400 relay. Testified before grand jury.
Calvin Harrison (Alvin's twin): 2000 Olympic gold medalist in 4x400 relay. Testified before grand jury.
Kelli White: 2003 world outdoor 100- and 200m champion. Testified before grand jury.
Chryste Gaines: 2000 Olympic 4x100 relay bronze medalist; 1996 Olympic 4x100 relay gold medalist. Testified before grand jury.
Eric Thomas: 2003 U.S. 400m hurdles champion.
Michelle Collins: 2003 world indoor and U.S. indoor 200m champion. Testified before grand jury.
Ramon Clay: 2002 U.S. outdoor 200m champion.
* Dwain Chambers: English sprinter banned by UK Athletics in Feb. for taking steroids.
* John McEwen: Second at 2002 U.S. outdoor hammer-throw compeition.
Zhanna Block: Ukrainian sprinter; two-time world outdoor gold medalist.
Olga Vasdeki: Greek triple jumper.

Your thoughts?
__________________
Sometimes the light's all shinin' on me; other times I can barely see.

The Official Cabinet
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-04, 10:52 AM   #2
HistoryProf
DVD Talk Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Formerly known as "brizz"/kck
Posts: 23,384
aside from Romo, how many of that list are confirmed to have taken any?

and of course it looks bad for Bonds....people simply do not expand like he did.....not naturally anyway.

Vs.
__________________
Pavel Datsyuk on his coach saying he gives teammates extra room on the ice: "I think he meant that I am really small," Datsyuk explained. "So when I, a small slim person, am on the ice, there is more room for bigger guys. Maybe he said that to cheer me up that I look skinny!"
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-04, 10:58 AM   #3
twikoff
DVD Talk God
 
twikoff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Right Behind You!!!
Posts: 79,459
my thoughts

its a thg that wasnt banned

does anyone care that big mac took a thg that is now banned by baseball when he set the record?

compare the pictures of mark from his early days up until when he retired.. and youll see the same difference in body mass (they did a good writeup on it in maxim or one of those mags this month)
__________________
Do you live in Idaho or Wyoming? If so, its time to Check In!
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-04, 11:17 AM   #4
LurkerDan
DVD Talk Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: The People's Republic of Boulder
Posts: 18,420
Re: Report: BALCO gave steroids to Bonds, 26 others

Quote:
Originally posted by NCMojo
It looks pretty damning for Bonds, Sheffield and Giambi, and especially for Bonds. If they kicked Pete Rose out of baseball for gambling, what should they do with players who knowingly took steroids for years? What does that mean for the record books?

The players are all denying the reports, just as Rose denied his accusations, but the evidence is beginning to mount. It is especially troubling when your name is listed along with a number of football players and track and field athletes who have already tested positive:
Were the steroids they took on a list of substances banned by MLB? If not, then they do nothing.

As for comparing the young Bonds to the old Bonds, take a look at a young Aaron to an old Aaron, in an era without weightlifting. Aaron is noticeably thicker in his late career. That's the way the body works, and it certainly happens to a greater degree when you start lifting weights. I'm not saying Bonds hasn't taken steroids, I'd be a fool to make such a statement, but the photo comparison just isn't enough evidence to me.
__________________
"I have dictionary facts to support me." - art

"we get paid for butt time" - mosquitobite

"It felt much more comfortable when I was trying them on. No sharp edge poking my skin." - Buford T. Pusser
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-04, 11:24 AM   #5
twikoff
DVD Talk God
 
twikoff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Right Behind You!!!
Posts: 79,459




More Big Mac/Steroids Pics
__________________
Do you live in Idaho or Wyoming? If so, its time to Check In!

Last edited by twikoff; 04-26-04 at 11:31 AM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-04, 11:36 AM   #6
El Scorcho
DVD Talk Hero
 
El Scorcho's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 39,619
Bonds' bulk is part steroids, part weight training. He's well known for being a gym rat. He has to be in order to stay healthy.

BTW, am I the only one that's saddened by this news? All of Armando Rios' statistics are now tainted.
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-04, 11:36 AM   #7
Red Dog
DVD Talk God
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Directionally Challenged (for DirecTV)
Posts: 112,860
Quote:
* Dana Stubblefield: Lineman who was the NFL's 1997 defensive player of the year. Testified before grand jury.
Josh Taves: Former Raiders defensive lineman.

That could explain a lot. He must have taken them when he was a Niner and then stopped when he came to the Redskins after signing the fat contract. A$$hole! Worst FA signing ever!
__________________
"A question for you. Would you rather Bucknell make the NCAA's once every 20 years or so and get ass raped by teams like Kansas in the first round or have them drop down a rung to a confernce where they can compete for a title?"
- Josh Hinkle
1st Round Final Scores: Bucknell 64 Kansas 63 | Bucknell 59 Arkansas 55
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-04, 11:58 AM   #8
HistoryProf
DVD Talk Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Formerly known as "brizz"/kck
Posts: 23,384
Quote:
Originally posted by twikoff

does anyone care that big mac took a thg that is now banned by baseball when he set the record?

As I see it, this is akin to invoking Clinton in a discussion about Bush. what difference does it make? or are you in the S.A. Smith "it's all racial" camp?
__________________
Pavel Datsyuk on his coach saying he gives teammates extra room on the ice: "I think he meant that I am really small," Datsyuk explained. "So when I, a small slim person, am on the ice, there is more room for bigger guys. Maybe he said that to cheer me up that I look skinny!"
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-04, 12:13 PM   #9
LurkerDan
DVD Talk Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: The People's Republic of Boulder
Posts: 18,420
Quote:
Originally posted by brizz
As I see it, this is akin to invoking Clinton in a discussion about Bush. what difference does it make?
It makes a lot of difference, because you are talking about a very recent player, whose career and performance were revered. If you or others are prepared to villify Bonds and taint his accomplishments, you must also--IMO--be prepared to do the same thing with Big Mac. To try to separate them is disingenuous at best.
__________________
"I have dictionary facts to support me." - art

"we get paid for butt time" - mosquitobite

"It felt much more comfortable when I was trying them on. No sharp edge poking my skin." - Buford T. Pusser
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-04, 12:27 PM   #10
HistoryProf
DVD Talk Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Formerly known as "brizz"/kck
Posts: 23,384
No it's not...did this guy say he gave steroids to Mac? Not that i can see in the article....that's the story here....
__________________
Pavel Datsyuk on his coach saying he gives teammates extra room on the ice: "I think he meant that I am really small," Datsyuk explained. "So when I, a small slim person, am on the ice, there is more room for bigger guys. Maybe he said that to cheer me up that I look skinny!"
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-04, 12:41 PM   #11
twikoff
DVD Talk God
 
twikoff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Right Behind You!!!
Posts: 79,459
Quote:
Originally posted by brizz
As I see it, this is akin to invoking Clinton in a discussion about Bush. what difference does it make? or are you in the S.A. Smith "it's all racial" camp?
the question is.. why would this be a bigger issue for bonds than it was for mark.

mark was well loved and media friendly.. so it was easy to dismiss

barry is hard to get along with and a media nightmare.. so he is an easier target

nothing to do with race.. and not just comparing the current to the old..

its comparing perspective used

and no.. conte didnt say he gave steroids to big mac.. but mcgwire readily admitted that he used andro.. because even though it was a thg, it was not banned (in baseball at least, it was already banned by the other sports).
__________________
Do you live in Idaho or Wyoming? If so, its time to Check In!
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-04, 01:55 PM   #12
namja
Stealth Moderator
 
namja's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: High Definition
Posts: 24,879
This will tarnish Bonds' image if it is determined that Bonds used steroids. But that doesn't take anything away from his talent. As many argue, instead of the balls landing in the cove, they'll land in the seats.

Comparing Bonds to McGwire, Bonds will definitely take a bigger hit mostly because (1) he's STILL PLAYING, (2) he holds the single season HR record, and (3) he's chasing the all-time HR record. A lot more records are at stake with Bonds.

Now, I just hope Selig doesn't take some drastic action "in the best interest of baseball" ...
__________________

life in high definition
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-04, 02:06 PM   #13
jmaxlow
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: VA
Posts: 751
If this particular story is true, then that means that Bonds used the substance during the 2003 season. He's been putting up terrific numbers for years now. He may have gotten a boost but it certainly isn't sufficient to explain his output. He's just a phenomenal hitter.

That being said, if he took a substance that was banned by baseball at the time, he deserves punishment.
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-04, 02:23 PM   #14
Bushdog
DVD Talk Hero
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Shackled
Posts: 35,372
Quote:
Originally posted by Red Dog
That could explain a lot. He must have taken them when he was a Niner and then stopped when he came to the Redskins after signing the fat contract. A$$hole! Worst FA signing ever!
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-04, 03:34 PM   #15
wabio
DVD Talk Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: in Bush territory!
Posts: 11,613
Where's Sugar Shane Mosley! He's supposed to be on that list too!!! Once again, boxing doesn't get the respect it deserves!!
__________________
wabio's Economic Threat-O-Meter:
[ ] No biggie. [ ] This sucks. [ ] Oh sh_t! [X] The wheels are coming off!! [ ] Time to fear GOD!!!
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-27-04, 06:34 AM   #16
kenbuzz
DVD Talk Legend
 
kenbuzz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Bloomington, IN "Who Dey!"
Posts: 16,284
Giambi

Before and After...
__________________
(Twitter) Janay Rice says she deeply regrets the role she played the night of the incident. - Baltimore Ravens, 5-23-14
Sweed goes down with an achillies injury. As a Steelers fan, this is great news. - Tarantino, 5-02-10
If Tebow beats the Steelers today, I will post a pic of me Tebow'ing in one of my Pittsburgh jerseys. - Tarantino, 1-08-12
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-04, 11:16 AM   #17
J-Dubya
DVD Talk Ultimate Edition
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 4,292
at least McGwire hit 47? HR as a rookie, and I'm sure he did a lot of lifting when his heel was bad in the early 90s
__________________
"I would imagine if you could understand Morse code, a tap dancer would drive you crazy. You'd say "Shut up! I don't understand! 'Share'...'the'...'we'...'too' -- I don't get it!" - Mitch Hedberg
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-04, 11:43 AM   #18
Josh H
Retired
 
Join Date: May 1999
Posts: 27,449
Quote:
Originally posted by twikoff
my thoughts

its a thg that wasnt banned

does anyone care that big mac took a thg that is now banned by baseball when he set the record?
Exactly, I don't care because neither were using banned substances, so it's no different that taking say creatine IMO.
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-04, 12:01 PM   #19
Mad Dawg
DVD Talk Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 12,005
Quote:
Originally posted by Josh Hinkle
Exactly, I don't care because neither were using banned substances, so it's no different that taking say creatine IMO.
Again, I'd point out that the only major difference between THG and any other illegal anabolic steroid is that THG was designed in such a way not to be detected. Therefore it could fly under the radar without being banned. It was a way to take steroids without being caught.

Andro or creatine were a way to acheive many of the effects of steroids without actually taking them. Neither are right, but at least a case can be made for ignorance of the latter since they were available on the shelves of any supplement store.
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-04, 12:21 PM   #20
Josh H
Retired
 
Join Date: May 1999
Posts: 27,449
Quote:
Originally posted by Mad Dawg
Andro or creatine were a way to acheive many of the effects of steroids without actually taking them. Neither are right, but at least a case can be made for ignorance of the latter since they were available on the shelves of any supplement store.
Is that a typo? Creatine is nothing like steroids.
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-04, 12:32 PM   #21
Mad Dawg
DVD Talk Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 12,005
Quote:
Originally posted by Josh Hinkle
Is that a typo? Creatine is nothing like steroids.
It certainly is supposed to have one of the major "positive" effects of steroids: quicker healing times. I didn't say, "Hey, they are steroids, too." Only that you can acheive many of the effects of 'roids by using them. Perhaps I should have said "one of the desired effects of steroids" instead.
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-04, 03:04 PM   #22
Josh H
Retired
 
Join Date: May 1999
Posts: 27,449
I'd have to disagree. Creatine doesn't really do much for healing times, in mainly just improves muscle endurance. I.E. you can get in a few more reps on each excercise in the weight room.

I never noticed getting over soreness any faster when on creatine than off in my 2 years or so of using it.
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-04, 03:12 PM   #23
NCMojo
DVD Talk Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 14,204
Bah, the McGwire/Bonds comparison is tiresome. Creatine and andro can be bought right off the shelf. The designer drugs that Bonds and others were given were clearly illegal and were only available through private sources.

Frankly, I think it is extremely likely that McGwire was taking steroids as well, but until or unless some kind of proof comes out, his record will have to be listed as clear.

Bonds is another story. It is beginning to be quite clear that he knowingly used steroids, and that these drugs assisted him in setting his home-run records. There will almost certainly be enough proof in his case, and it will be convincing. Anyone who says "well, it wasn't an illegal drug at the time" is just fooling themselves. It was a performance-enhancing drug, and it belonged to a class of drugs banned by every sports organization, including Major League Baseball.

In my opinion, what Bonds and the others have done is worse than the Black Sox scandal that caused this nation to lose faith in the integrity of the game. Not only does the taint of steroid use threaten to demean and diminish the very idea of "fair play", but it also sends an extraordinarily dangerous message to kids: if you want to play in the big leagues, you'll need to take these drugs.
__________________
Sometimes the light's all shinin' on me; other times I can barely see.

The Official Cabinet
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-04, 05:03 PM   #24
twikoff
DVD Talk God
 
twikoff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Right Behind You!!!
Posts: 79,459
the comparison between bonds and mcgwire is that both used a THG

creatine is not in the same catagory

over the counter or not.. it was already banned by the other sports

and neither were banned by baseball
__________________
Do you live in Idaho or Wyoming? If so, its time to Check In!
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-04, 05:08 PM   #25
Mad Dawg
DVD Talk Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 12,005
Quote:
Originally posted by twikoff
the comparison between bonds and mcgwire is that both used a THG
THG is a unique designer steroid, not a category. Andro isn't a THG.
  Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:42 AM.

Rules - DVD Talk - Archive - Privacy Statement - Top

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.2.0
Copyright 2011 DVDTalk.com All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy and Terms of Use.