Release List Reviews Shop Join News DVD Giveaways Video Games Advertise
DVD Reviews | Theatrical Reviews | Price Search Buy Stuff Here
DVD Talk
DVD Reviews DVD Talk Headlines HD Reviews


Add to My Yahoo! - RSS 2.0 - RSS 2.0 - DVD Talk Podcast RSS -


Go Back   DVD Talk Forum > General Discussions > Other Talk > Religion, Politics and World Events

Religion, Politics and World Events They make great dinner conversation, don't you think? plus Political Film

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 05-09-17, 09:51 PM   #701
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
 
hdnmickey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Pacific NW
Posts: 9,377
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vibiana View Post


My Facebook cover picture is a photo of a cat holding a gun and riding a unicorn.
My family is partial to this little cutie.



Quote:
Originally Posted by inri222 View Post
You mean a 600 year old guy didn't build a wooden boat that housed thousands of animals including dinosaurs?
First Santa Clause and now this. DAMN YOU!!!
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-17, 10:10 PM   #702
DVD Talk Legend
 
creekdipper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,852
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

And yet...the same person who enters a Christian idea thread solely to mock the eternal precepts of God has no problem with appealing to the concept of "true morality."

If this were the "bashing" thread (where the bashing from atheists toward biblical Christianity should go), appropriate comments could be made.

Instead, this verse comes to mind:

For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. Hebrews 4:12
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-17, 10:23 PM   #703
DVD Talk Legend
 
creekdipper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,852
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

Quote:
Originally Posted by creekdipper View Post
(For Protestants, obviously):

Are your churches doing anything special to celebrate the 500th anniversary of the beginnings of the Protestant Reformation (to be specific, 500 years since Martin Luther posted his 95 theses on the door)?

We have an annual Reformation Day celebration that usually includes "visits" from historical figures, games for kids, etc. This year we may do some extras.

This Friday for Movie Night we'll be viewing the DVD "Luther" (recent color version). Our Fall Conference will be on the Five Solas.

Anyone else recognizing this anniversary with special events?
(bump)
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-17, 11:47 PM   #704
DVD Talk Hero
 
Josh-da-man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: The Bible Belt
Posts: 26,784
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

Sounds like somebody needs a safe space.
__________________
"Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful."

-- Lucius Annaeus Seneca
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 09:31 AM   #705
DVD Talk Legend
 
creekdipper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,852
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh-da-man View Post
Sounds like somebody needs a safe space.
Everyone needs a safe space in times of distress. God provides that to His elect.


Jeremiah 16:19
O LORD, my strength and my stronghold, And my refuge in the day of distress, To You the nations will come From the ends of the earth and say, "Our fathers have inherited nothing but falsehood, Futility and things of no profit."

Psalm 18:2
The LORD is my rock and my fortress and my deliverer, My God, my rock, in whom I take refuge; My shield and the horn of my salvation, my stronghold.

Last edited by creekdipper; 05-10-17 at 09:44 AM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 09:39 AM   #706
DVD Talk Legend
 
creekdipper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,852
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

Answering the question, "If predestination (election) is true, why evangelize?"

http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninf...SID=5717135374

Title: Evangelism: An Absolute Necessity.


Text: Romans 10:14-21 (NKJV)

14 How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher?

15 And how shall they preach unless they are sent? As it is written: “How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the gospel of peace,[a] Who bring glad tidings of good things!”[b]

16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed our report?”[c] 17 So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

18 But I say, have they not heard? Yes indeed: “Their sound has gone out to all the earth, And their words to the ends of the world.”[d]

19 But I say, did Israel not know? First Moses says:“I will provoke you to jealousy by those who are not a nation, I will move you to anger by a foolish nation.”[e]

20 But Isaiah is very bold and says:“I was found by those who did not seek Me; I was made manifest to those who did not ask for Me.”[f]

21 But to Israel he says: “All day long I have stretched out My hands To a disobedient and contrary people.”[g]
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 10:10 AM   #707
Time Lord
 
Supermallet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Termite Terrace
Posts: 52,857
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

Quote:
Originally Posted by creekdipper View Post
Which evangelicals?

Do you understand the difference between a theocracy in which an official state church has its own armies and makes public policy as opposed to people advocating for policies which are consistent with their belief systems (i.e., nearly all of the populace)?

Do you understand the role of Reformers such as John Calvin in helping to establish separate roles for government and religion in a functioning society based upon morality?

The very secularists who rail the most against Christianity owe a great debt to Protestant Christianity in establishing ideals of individual freedoms within societal limitations.

When you were slaves to sin, you were free from the control of righteousness. What benefit did you reap at that time from those things you are now ashamed of? Those things result in death! Romans 6:20-21
First off, evangelical ideals are NOT shared by nearly all of the populace. That's completely disingenuous. Second, our Constitution and democracy are designed to protect against the tyranny of the majority, so even if nearly all of the populace did agree with evangelical ideals, we still shouldn't be legislating from it.
__________________
Never stop punching fascists.
Stop employing thugs and murderers: Abolish police, abolish the military.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 10:39 AM   #708
DVD Talk Legend
 
creekdipper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,852
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

Quote:
Originally Posted by Supermallet View Post
First off, evangelical ideals are NOT shared by nearly all of the populace. That's completely disingenuous. Second, our Constitution and democracy are designed to protect against the tyranny of the majority, so even if nearly all of the populace did agree with evangelical ideals, we still shouldn't be legislating from it.
No one said that "evangelical ideals" (which needs clarification) are shared by nearly all of the populace.

What was said was that nearly all of the populace vote for policies that reflect their ideals, whatever those may be. There are undoubtedly those who vote strictly based upon party or because someone told them how to vote or because they think a particular party offers them more things or simply because they don't think about issues at all.

However, those who do consider the issues probably pick the stances which reflect what they feel is best for the country and/or morally correct according to their ideals. In other words..."people advocating for policies which are consistent with their belief systems." Not "evangelicals," "Christians," or any other specific group. All people..."the populace."

The point is that, just as you use your ideas about morality to influence your vote, you should allow other theists (and atheists) to use their ideas about morality to influence their vote. Do you object to that? If you said that you voted according to your conscience, would you accept as valid the criticism that you should "keep your beliefs to yourself?"

I think not. And there would be nothing "disingenuous" about your claiming that right for yourself (and affording it to others).

While I would agree that the Constitution affords some protection from the "tyranny of the majority" (which obviously reflects the opposition of the minority), it also allows the populace to choose leaders who nominate and confirm court appointees. The makeup of the courts may or may not reflect the will of the majority. One thing that most will agree upon: When you agree with the majority, the policies do not represent "tyranny."

Last edited by creekdipper; 05-10-17 at 10:52 AM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 11:09 AM   #709
Time Lord
 
Supermallet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Termite Terrace
Posts: 52,857
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

I'll make a simple analogy. I think people shouldn't eat or use animal products. It's unhealthy, harmful to the environment, and results in the needless slaughter of millions upon millions of creatures every year, easily eclipsing the amount of human fetuses aborted every year. But I'm not trying to outlaw meat eating or using leather, because I realize outlawing such things will be ineffective. People will still eat meat, they'll just be driven underground and likely more people will be hurt because the meat isn't regulated, and more animals will be hurt because amateurs will be slaughtering them.

Similarly, you can believe what you want, but you also need to recognize that there is a point where your personal beliefs infringe on the rights of others to live as they choose. You're free to pursue your happiness m but when your happiness is derived from depriving others of the same chance to pursue theirs, you've gone too far. And at this point, the Christian Right has gone too far.
__________________
Never stop punching fascists.
Stop employing thugs and murderers: Abolish police, abolish the military.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 11:33 AM   #710
DVD Talk Legend
 
creekdipper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,852
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

Quote:
Originally Posted by Supermallet View Post
I'll make a simple analogy. I think people shouldn't eat or use animal products. It's unhealthy, harmful to the environment, and results in the needless slaughter of millions upon millions of creatures every year, easily eclipsing the amount of human fetuses aborted every year. But I'm not trying to outlaw meat eating or using leather, because I realize outlawing such things will be ineffective. People will still eat meat, they'll just be driven underground and likely more people will be hurt because the meat isn't regulated, and more animals will be hurt because amateurs will be slaughtering them.

Similarly, you can believe what you want, but you also need to recognize that there is a point where your personal beliefs infringe on the rights of others to live as they choose. You're free to pursue your happiness m but when your happiness is derived from depriving others of the same chance to pursue theirs, you've gone too far. And at this point, the Christian Right has gone too far.
Would you have voted for the abolitionist party in 1860 even if you thought that abolition efforts would be ineffective at best and cause hundreds of thousands of deaths in a civil war at worst? Or would you have gone ahead and voted for what you thought was morally correct?

To avoid specific analogies and just come straight to the point...do you always weigh how "effective" a moral policy position may be when deciding which policies to advocate? There are many social problems which cannot be legislated away due to human nature being what it is (also a Christian concept), yet we still pass laws to regulate behavior as much as possible. Effectiveness of laws may be considered in cases such as Prohibition (along with unintended consequences), but confusing compromised laws reflecting flawed human responses with moral convictions leads to questioning the very underlying principles driving laws.

In effect, when faced with the choice of moral stances, is your response to do what you feel is right regardless of whether others agree or will follow the policies? Is that what is now regarded as a "profile in courage"...saying, "I believe in my heart that this is right, but it won't do any good; therefore, I'm going along with the majority?"

Tyranny (and "depriving others of their right to happiness") is in the eye of the beholder. The "Christian right" should be free to advocate for policies consistent with their beliefs just as much as the "Christian left," the "Buddhist middle," the secular whatever, etc.

I would counter your statement about "personal beliefs infringing upon the rights of others to live as they choose" by saying that is exactly what those who coerce others through fines, loss of licenses, etc. to act against their conscience are doing just that. When conflicting worldviews collide, someone is going to be made unhappy. And I would counter by saying that the Left has gone too far in this direction.


James 4:17(NKJV)

17 Therefore, to him who knows to do good and does not do it, to him it is sin.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 11:53 AM   #711
DVD Talk Hero
 
inri222's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 37,060
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

Quote:
Originally Posted by Supermallet View Post
I'll make a simple analogy. I think people shouldn't eat or use animal products. It's unhealthy, harmful to the environment, and results in the needless slaughter of millions upon millions of creatures every year, easily eclipsing the amount of human fetuses aborted every year. But I'm not trying to outlaw meat eating or using leather, because I realize outlawing such things will be ineffective. People will still eat meat, they'll just be driven underground and likely more people will be hurt because the meat isn't regulated, and more animals will be hurt because amateurs will be slaughtering them.

Similarly, you can believe what you want, but you also need to recognize that there is a point where your personal beliefs infringe on the rights of others to live as they choose. You're free to pursue your happiness m but when your happiness is derived from depriving others of the same chance to pursue theirs, you've gone too far. And at this point, the Christian Right has gone too far.
I know a Jewish guy who killed someone for selling Bacon.
__________________
If non violence is so fantastic, why isn't the state practicing it?
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 12:16 PM   #712
Time Lord
 
Supermallet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Termite Terrace
Posts: 52,857
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

Quote:
Originally Posted by creekdipper View Post
Would you have voted for the abolitionist party in 1860 even if you thought that abolition efforts would be ineffective at best and cause hundreds of thousands of deaths in a civil war at worst? Or would you have gone ahead and voted for what you thought was morally correct?

To avoid specific analogies and just come straight to the point...do you always weigh how "effective" a moral policy position may be when deciding which policies to advocate? There are many social problems which cannot be legislated away due to human nature being what it is (also a Christian concept), yet we still pass laws to regulate behavior as much as possible. Effectiveness of laws may be considered in cases such as Prohibition (along with unintended consequences), but confusing compromised laws reflecting flawed human responses with moral convictions leads to questioning the very underlying principles driving laws.

In effect, when faced with the choice of moral stances, is your response to do what you feel is right regardless of whether others agree or will follow the policies? Is that what is now regarded as a "profile in courage"...saying, "I believe in my heart that this is right, but it won't do any good; therefore, I'm going along with the majority?"

Tyranny (and "depriving others of their right to happiness") is in the eye of the beholder. The "Christian right" should be free to advocate for policies consistent with their beliefs just as much as the "Christian left," the "Buddhist middle," the secular whatever, etc.

I would counter your statement about "personal beliefs infringing upon the rights of others to live as they choose" by saying that is exactly what those who coerce others through fines, loss of licenses, etc. to act against their conscience are doing just that. When conflicting worldviews collide, someone is going to be made unhappy. And I would counter by saying that the Left has gone too far in this direction.


James 4:17(NKJV)

17 Therefore, to him who knows to do good and does not do it, to him it is sin.
Funny that you compare abortion to abolitionism, since outlawing abortion would essentially enslave women who do not want to bear children but accidentally get pregnant, or are raped.
__________________
Never stop punching fascists.
Stop employing thugs and murderers: Abolish police, abolish the military.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 12:40 PM   #713
DVD Talk Legend
 
creekdipper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,852
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

Quote:
Originally Posted by Supermallet View Post
Funny that you compare abortion to abolitionism, since outlawing abortion would essentially enslave women who do not want to bear children but accidentally get pregnant, or are raped.
It's more ironic that you, who feel that it's immoral to kill animals for food, would find that in comparing two undesirable sets of circumstances (nine month's pregnancy vs. death) would choose death over the other circumstance.

Christians acknowledge that we live in a fallen world and that choices are often not ideal. Nonetheless, even non-Christians normally recognize that life takes precedence over physical and mental hardship, not matter how inconvenient.

That is the choice. Nine months of hardship vs. a death sentence.

And I note that you didn't answer the questions about how you arrive at "moral" decisions and which factors outweigh others.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 01:02 PM   #714
DVD Talk Legend
 
Vibiana's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Living in a van down by the river
Posts: 12,852
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

A safe, legal abortion vs. another unwanted, unwelcomed child in the world. Yeah, what a conundrum.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 01:15 PM   #715
Time Lord
 
Supermallet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Termite Terrace
Posts: 52,857
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

Quote:
Originally Posted by creekdipper View Post
It's more ironic that you, who feel that it's immoral to kill animals for food, would find that in comparing two undesirable sets of circumstances (nine month's pregnancy vs. death) would choose death over the other circumstance.

Christians acknowledge that we live in a fallen world and that choices are often not ideal. Nonetheless, even non-Christians normally recognize that life takes precedence over physical and mental hardship, not matter how inconvenient.

That is the choice. Nine months of hardship vs. a death sentence.

And I note that you didn't answer the questions about how you arrive at "moral" decisions and which factors outweigh others.
It's not my body, it's not my life, it's not my nine months, it's not my choice.

That you could seriously consider saying to a woman who's just been raped that she simply has to endure nine more months of hardship on top of the trauma of being raped, every day a constant reminder of what was done to her, and that she has no choice in the matter, is sickening. You're essentially telling rapists that their right to rape and dominate a woman is greater than the woman's right to handle the consequences as she deems necessary.
__________________
Never stop punching fascists.
Stop employing thugs and murderers: Abolish police, abolish the military.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 01:28 PM   #716
Dan
DVD Talk Legend
 
Dan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: More drinks, more fun!
Posts: 13,727
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

Quote:
Originally Posted by Supermallet View Post
It's not my body, it's not my life, it's not my nine months, it's not my choice.
That's very succinct.

Quote:
That you could seriously consider saying to a woman who's just been raped that she simply has to endure nine more months of hardship on top of the trauma of being raped, every day a constant reminder of what was done to her, and that she has no choice in the matter, is sickening.
Not to mention that the physical effects of pregnancy can take a toll on the mother's life well after that nine months. So not only would the nine months be a constant reminder of the rape, but in some cases, the physical pain and damage for the rest of her life would be a constant reminder of the event, on top of the emotional stuff, as well.

Quote:
You're essentially telling rapists that their right to rape and dominate a woman is greater than the woman's right to handle the consequences as she deems necessary.
Intentional or not, this is the exact message being sent. Gross.
__________________
"...you've taken a side in an ideological battle, while pretending all the way
that you're simply defending the supposedly neutral value of free speech.
Don't think we don't notice which instances of speech you choose to defend." - Contrapoints
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 01:35 PM   #717
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
 
hdnmickey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Pacific NW
Posts: 9,377
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

It's the lasting effects of giving birth that it always seems these people never give any consideration. These effects can be very life altering to the extent that the cause issues til the day they die and the effects gets worse as they grow older. But of course the standard go to response it they put themselves in that position by having sex in the first place, so it's on them! But many of these women choosing to never give birth are married and 100% monogamous.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 01:43 PM   #718
DVD Talk Hero
 
inri222's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 37,060
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

Quote:
Originally Posted by hdnmickey View Post
It's the lasting effects of giving birth that it always seems these people never give any consideration.
I'm a man, why should I care? I'll never have to go through that.
__________________
If non violence is so fantastic, why isn't the state practicing it?
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 08:12 PM   #719
DVD Talk Legend
 
creekdipper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,852
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

And to think that Draven thought this thread gets no responses.

(Of course, it is interesting to see the thread suddenly turn into the Abortion Thread, Pt. II).
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 08:21 PM   #720
DVD Talk Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Rosemount, MN
Posts: 24,790
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

Quote:
Originally Posted by creekdipper View Post
And to think that Draven thought this thread gets no responses.

(Of course, it is interesting to see the thread suddenly turn into the Abortion Thread, Pt. II).
Oh I'm sure you'll go back to posting sermons no one listens to soon enough
__________________
Fifteen hundred years ago everybody knew the Earth was the center of the universe. Five hundred years ago, everybody knew the Earth was flat, and fifteen minutes ago, you knew that humans were alone on this planet. Imagine what you'll know tomorrow. - Men in Black
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 08:41 PM   #721
DVD Talk Hall of Fame
 
hdnmickey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Pacific NW
Posts: 9,377
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

It's safe to assume everybody knows how easy it use Ctrl F search for a word and have every use of that word highlighted on the page, Which makes it crystal clear who actually used any given word to divert discussions in a new direction. Right?
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 08:52 PM   #722
DVD Talk Legend
 
creekdipper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,852
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

Quote:
Originally Posted by Draven View Post
Oh I'm sure you'll go back to posting sermons no one listens to soon enough
And how do you know that "no one listens?"

Do you respond to every thread or post that you read? If so, you're either highly selective in what you read or you have tons of spare time (contrary to what you said earlier).

You may be surprised (or not) to learn that occasional conversations go on between forum members off the board. You shouldn't assume that everyone reacts to posts in exactly the same manner as you.

It seems that you totally ignored the post detailing the purpose of posting the sermons. Making the information available is my only concern; whether others choose to take advantage of the resources is totally up to them.

For the same reason, our church posts the sermons on SermonAudio where they can be heard worldwide. The persons whom God intends to hear the sermons will hear the sermons; the persons whose minds/hearts will be changed by the sermons will be affected.

Could it be that your background in programming leads you to the conclusion that "ratings" equals success? That's the view of the world; sadly, many churches have adopted that approach and equated numbers with success. We see that reflected in the mega-church movement which emphasizes personal comforts in this life (health & wealth prosperity gospel) over serving God and glorifying Him (which means that sin is rarely if ever mentioned in some of those churches since that makes people feel bad).

You may recall the biblical principle that many are called but few are chosen and the broad path which leads to destruction followed by most and the narrow way leading to life which is followed by the few. Even secular people understand that "popularity" is not the sole determiner of value, as some major artists and writers now held in high regard by the artistic community were largely obscure and ignored during their lifetimes, sometimes considering themselves failures at the time of their deaths. So it's not a hard concept to grasp.

There have been some threads on many topics that have engendered only a handful (literally) of response and views...and yet I have found some of those threads much more interesting than some other, more popular threads devoted to trivial or juvenile matters. And that is just speaking about threads on worldly matters.

It does illustrate a disconnect between both nonbelievers and "seeker-friendly" churches who both regard numbers as the measure of success vs. a biblical view that God is sovereign and will accomplish His purposes as He chooses. It's part of the "irresistible grace" element in the TULIP acronym.

You have brought up an important issue for Christians to discuss. Do Christians follow the regulative principle of worship or hire marketers to find out what things are most appealing to the public regardless of whether those "techniques" are biblical or not?
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-17, 09:01 PM   #723
DVD Talk Legend
 
creekdipper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,852
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

Quote:
Originally Posted by hdnmickey View Post
It's safe to assume everybody knows how easy it use Ctrl F search for a word and have every use of that word highlighted on the page, Which makes it crystal clear who actually used any given word to divert discussions in a new direction. Right?
You seem pleased with yourself for some reason, but do you have a point?'

If so, could you please be specific and share the joke with the rest of us?

A merry heart does good, like medicine, but a broken spirit dries the bones. Proverbs 17:22
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-14-17, 11:28 PM   #724
DVD Talk Legend
 
creekdipper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,852
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

(Latest in series on Romans.)

Key points:

God will redeem a remnant of the Jews to join the modern Israel.

True Christianity relies upon grace alone and gives total glory to God. No one can be arrogant about an undeserved salvation which is totally God's work and His choosing.

The Bible is clear on the main points of the faith, but clouded minds insist upon believing "interpretations" which are at odds with scripture.


Title: Grace = Unconditional Election.

http://www.sermonaudio.com/saplayer/...D=514171247144

Text: Romans 11: 1-10. (NKJV)

1 I say then, has God cast away His people? Certainly not! For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. 2 God has not cast away His people whom He foreknew. Or do you not know what the Scripture says of Elijah, how he pleads with God against Israel, saying, 3 “Lord, they have killed Your prophets and torn down Your altars, and I alone am left, and they seek my life”?[a] 4 But what does the divine response say to him? “I have reserved for Myself seven thousand men who have not bowed the knee to Baal.”[b] 5 Even so then, at this present time there is a remnant according to the election of grace. 6 And if by grace, then it is no longer of works; otherwise grace is no longer grace.[c] But if it is of works, it is no longer grace; otherwise work is no longer work.

7 What then? Israel has not obtained what it seeks; but the elect have obtained it, and the rest were blinded. 8 Just as it is written:

“God has given them a spirit of stupor, Eyes that they should not see And ears that they should not hear, To this very day.”[d]

9 And David says: “Let their table become a snare and a trap, A stumbling block and a recompense to them.

10 Let their eyes be darkened, so that they do not see, And bow down their back always.”[e]

Last edited by creekdipper; 05-15-17 at 03:22 AM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-17, 10:17 AM   #725
DVD Talk Legend
 
creekdipper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,852
Re: Christian Idea Exchange

More examination of the fallacy of "ancient Earth," evolution, etc.

Title: The True History of Time and the Age of the Earth.

http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninf...D=514172025515

Text: Genesis 7:1-6
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:46 PM.


Copyright 2011 DVDTalk.com All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy and Terms of Use.

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.2.0