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Religion, Politics and World Events They make great dinner conversation, don't you think? plus Political Film

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Old 11-25-15, 10:02 PM   #101
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

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Originally Posted by Bandoman View Post
I guess I don't get why this issue is so much more complicated today than it was when I went to college. I never raped anyone. I never did anything with a woman that she didn't also want to do. It was pretty fucking clear to me when a woman didn't want to go any further. My male friends seemed to know the same thing. We all knew that a woman who was drunk should be escorted back to her dorm or apartment and left there safely. Of course there were the rare assholes who didn't respect that, but we called them what they were - rapists. Why do today's college students have such a difficult time with this?
What has changed is that the definition of rape has changed to the point that we are all rapists. According to California law (and this is absolutely not hyperbole) my wife and I have raped each other hundreds of times.
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Old 11-25-15, 10:29 PM   #102
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

Do you have to ask permission before slipping a lubricated finger into your partner's anus?

Kind of takes the element od surprise out of "the shocker."
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Old 11-25-15, 10:49 PM   #103
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

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Originally Posted by grundle View Post
As far as I am aware, most of the college rape accusations that have received national media attention in recent years turned out to be fake.

Among the college rape accusations that only receive attention from local media, it seems that most of them are true. It also seems that most of them involve a victim who is drunk. Although it's never a woman's fault that she is raped, I do think it would be a good idea for women to avoid getting drunk when they are at college.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dave-o View Post
Most research puts the false claims rate at between 2-7% (many experts converge around 5%).

Now you are more aware...



I think it would be a better idea if people stopped raping so much and started understanding consent better at college. If only someone would offer a class on that or something...


By the way, as someone who works at a college, and has witnessed firsthand many of these types of classes, I have yet to see one that doesn't involve a major debate surrounding what consent is at some point. Many college kids are truly confused and there is a wide variety in their individual definitions of consent in various circumstances...

I said I thought that that most of the cases of college rape that received national media attention in recent years turned out to be fake. Your claim about how 5% of all rape cases are fake has nothing to do with that. I was only talking about the rape cases that received national media attention: Duke rape case, that Rolling Stone article, Lena Dunham, etc. Most of those did indeed turn out to be fake.

Of course it would be great if people stopped raping. But as long as people are raping, female college students can greatly reduce their risk of being raped by not getting drunk.

It would be great if there were no car crashes. But as long as there are car crashes, people can reduce their risk of being killed by wearing a seat belt.

It would be great if there were no deadly germs in milk. But as long as there are deadly germs in milk, we can reduce the risk by pasteurizing the milk.
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Old 11-25-15, 10:56 PM   #104
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

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Originally Posted by grundle View Post
As far as I am aware, most of the college rape accusations that have received national media attention in recent years turned out to be fake.

Among the college rape accusations that only receive attention from local media, it seems that most of them are true. It also seems that most of them involve a victim who is drunk. Although it's never a woman's fault that she is raped, I do think it would be a good idea for women to avoid getting drunk when they are at college.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Draven View Post
Why can't a woman get drunk? Can men get drunk at college?

And apparently you do think it's a woman's fault if she is raped. Because if she hadn't gotten drunk it wouldn't have happened, right? That's called "blaming the victim".

I have a better idea - men should stop raping women. Then women can get as drunk as they want.

Of course men should stop raping women. But as long as men are raping women, there is nothing wrong with me pointing out how women can reduce their risk of getting raped.

Let's say that you had a daughter in college, and she told you that she was planning to go to a frat party and get drunk. Are you seriously telling me that you would not try to talk her out of it?
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Old 11-25-15, 10:57 PM   #105
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

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Originally Posted by PerryD View Post
What if the woman consents or initiates sex while drunk? What is the acceptable blood alcohol level? It's still the man's fault?
I don't know.

What if the man and the women are both drunk? Did they rape each other? I don't know.
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Old 11-25-15, 10:58 PM   #106
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

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Originally Posted by dork View Post
I have good ideas, too. I'm smart, not like everybody says. First, people should stop stealing stuff. Then I can leave my car unlocked when I park. Also, people should stop murdering. Then we can let go all the cops and they can become poets instead.
Excellent!


Quote:
Originally Posted by creekdipper View Post
I have a better idea than yours. People...men & women, whether cisgender or transgender...shouldn't get drunk. Problem solved!

Of course, having mandatory consent training for all incoming students will correct the misapprehension that it's okay to rape people...which, obviously, has never been addressed in pre-college years.

Again, problem solved!

Still can't understand why colleges haven't initiated mandatory training to inform students that they shouldn't steal from other students. And the one instructing them that it's not a good idea to shoot other people.

Perhaps adding a few questions on college application forms to determine whether prospective students know that it's not okay to rape, shoot, or steal from other students would help to screen out the rapists, murderers, and thieves.

Then again, it would be nice if parents would teach those values to students beforehand...just as it would be nice if elementary & high schools would teach students to read & write before going on to university.

Fantastic!

Quote:
Originally Posted by joeblow69 View Post
PEOPLE shouldn't get drunk because they make bad choices when drunk. A common bad choice women make when they are drunk is to have sex with someone they otherwise wouldn't have. Men make bad choices drunk too, but those usually end up with them having broken limbs and stuff.
Awesome!
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Old 11-25-15, 11:11 PM   #107
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

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Originally Posted by grundle View Post
I said I thought that that most of the cases of college rape that received national media attention in recent years turned out to be fake. Your claim about how 5% of all rape cases are fake has nothing to do with that. I was only talking about the rape cases that received national media attention: Duke rape case, that Rolling Stone article, Lena Dunham, etc. Most of those did indeed turn out to be fake.

Of course it would be great if people stopped raping. But as long as people are raping, female college students can greatly reduce their risk of being raped by not getting drunk.

It would be great if there were no car crashes. But as long as there are car crashes, people can reduce their risk of being killed by wearing a seat belt.

It would be great if there were no deadly germs in milk. But as long as there are deadly germs in milk, we can reduce the risk by pasteurizing the milk.
Ahh, so you draw your insights about rape from a select few well publicized cases that you can remember, that is logical and quite useful.. But when I bring up actual scientific evidence about rape it's dismissed because it doesn't fit your preconceived beliefs. Excellent example of motivated reasoning!
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Old 11-25-15, 11:12 PM   #108
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

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Originally Posted by creekdipper View Post
Since I don't know how to separate your comments for individual responses, I've added bold numbers in order to respond to individual statements.

After you hit the "quote" button, you copy and paste the quoted part to make as many copies as you need.

Then, you go into each individual copy, and you erase everything except the specific part that you want to respond to.
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Old 11-25-15, 11:22 PM   #109
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

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Originally Posted by dave-o View Post
Ahh, so you draw your insights about rape from a select few well publicized cases that you can remember, that is logical and quite useful.. But when I bring up actual scientific evidence about rape it's dismissed because it doesn't fit your preconceived beliefs. Excellent example of motivated reasoning!

I never denied your claim that 5% of rape accusations turn out to be false. In fact, just be clear: I believe your claim that 5% of rape accusations turn out to be false, and that 95% of rape accusations are true.

If you think I am wrong in my claim that most recent, nationally reported college rape cases turn out to be false, then please cite at least four recent, nationally publicized college rape cases that were not proven to be false. Because I pointed out three that were false, then if you want to prove me wrong, please point out four that were not proven false.
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Old 11-26-15, 12:38 AM   #110
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

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Originally Posted by grundle View Post
After you hit the "quote" button, you copy and paste the quoted part to make as many copies as you need.

Then, you go into each individual copy, and you erase everything except the specific part that you want to respond to.
Thanks!

Forum members have been most helpful in instructing me in my techno illiteracy (teaching me how to multi-quote, do bold print & italics, etc.), but this one eluded me. Usually I figure things out through trial & error.

Now that you've explained it, it seems so simple & obvious!
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Old 11-26-15, 12:53 AM   #111
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

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Originally Posted by creekdipper View Post
Thanks!

Forum members have been most helpful in instructing me in my techno illiteracy (teaching me how to multi-quote, do bold print & italics, etc.), but this one eluded me. Usually I figure things out through trial & error.

Now that you've explained it, it seems so simple & obvious!
You can also go to where you want to break the post you're replying to and type "/quote" inside square brackets (with no quotation marks). This will end the block quote. Type your response, then type "quote" inside square brackets (again, with no quotation marks) to start the block quote again.
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Old 11-26-15, 07:40 AM   #112
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

Confederate flag sparks controversy, conversation on Framingham State campus

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FRAMINGHAM – With four reports of bias on campus since September, a recent complaint about the Confederate flag could spark larger talks about race at Framingham State University.

Students filed two separate bias reports at Framingham State as a result of another student in some way displaying the Confederate flag in the past month, the school’s chief diversity and inclusion officer Sean Huddleston said. Now, Huddleston said he’s considering a campus-wide forum about what the flag means to different people, to turn discord into education.

This month alone, the school saw two bias reports - complaints to the administration about something a student witnessed or experienced that made them feel discriminated against or otherwise uncomfortable - about students displaying the Confederate flag. The most recent came on Nov. 19, after a student reported seeing a Confederate flag sticker on another student’s laptop.

Huddleston sent out a campus-wide email with information about the report
, noting that “symbols such as these are not condoned by Framingham State University.”
More at the link. Breitbart reports that students were offered "counseling services" after being exposed to the offending sticker, but there's no mention of it in the news article.
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Old 11-26-15, 12:40 PM   #113
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonF View Post
You can also go to where you want to break the post you're replying to and type "/quote" inside square brackets (with no quotation marks). This will end the block quote. Type your response, then type "quote" inside square brackets (again, with no quotation marks) to start the block quote again.
Again, thanks!

I'll have to write down some cheat sheets to keep handy.

Now if we can get indoor plumbing & running water, we'll be set.

And the slave...er, wife... will be so happy not to have to carry buckets of water uphill from the crick. It tires her out just pedaling the generator to power the computer. After an hour or so, she gets a break, so she don't never complain none.
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Old 11-26-15, 06:41 PM   #114
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

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Old 11-26-15, 08:03 PM   #115
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

The Counter-Revolution Begins Now!

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/politi...144600464.html

(Opening paragraphs

While students from Yale University in Connecticut to Claremont McKenna in California are protesting, demanding more cultural sensitivity, safe spaces and trigger warnings, some students at Princeton University in New Jersey are fighting back.

In response to a sit-in of the university president’s office by 200 members of the Black Justice League, over 1,300 members of the university community signed a petition to ensure that Princeton “maintains its commitment to free speech and open dialogue and condemns political correctness to the extent that it infringes upon those fundamental academic values.”
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Old 11-26-15, 08:32 PM   #116
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

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Originally Posted by printerati View Post
Confederate flag sparks controversy, conversation on Framingham State campus



More at the link. Breitbart reports that students were offered "counseling services" after being exposed to the offending sticker, but there's no mention of it in the news article.
Wel, if it's reported at breitbart and not in any legitimate news source, my money is on it being bullshit.

Occams razor, dont 'cha know?
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Old 11-27-15, 11:22 AM   #117
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

The Counter-Revolution continues...this time with a university president chastising a "whiny" student:

https://pjmedia.com/trending/2015/11...space-students
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Old 11-27-15, 12:09 PM   #118
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

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Originally Posted by creekdipper View Post
Thanks!

Forum members have been most helpful in instructing me in my techno illiteracy (teaching me how to multi-quote, do bold print & italics, etc.), but this one eluded me. Usually I figure things out through trial & error.

Now that you've explained it, it seems so simple & obvious!

You're welcome.

Each person has some things that seem really easy for them, and some things that seem really hard to them, as compared to how most other people see those things.
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Old 11-27-15, 12:16 PM   #119
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

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Originally Posted by creekdipper View Post
The Counter-Revolution Begins Now!

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/politi...144600464.html

(Opening paragraphs

While students from Yale University in Connecticut to Claremont McKenna in California are protesting, demanding more cultural sensitivity, safe spaces and trigger warnings, some students at Princeton University in New Jersey are fighting back.

In response to a sit-in of the university president’s office by 200 members of the Black Justice League, over 1,300 members of the university community signed a petition to ensure that Princeton “maintains its commitment to free speech and open dialogue and condemns political correctness to the extent that it infringes upon those fundamental academic values.”
Quote:
Originally Posted by creekdipper View Post
The Counter-Revolution continues...this time with a university president chastising a "whiny" student:

https://pjmedia.com/trending/2015/11...space-students

Thanks for posting both of those awesome articles!
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Old 11-27-15, 12:21 PM   #120
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

George Will cites a whole bunch of examples, and his article at the link includes links to verify each and every one of them.

I'm not bolding anything because I suggest reading the entire thing to see how big this issue is.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...8a6_story.html

America’s higher education brought low

By George F. Will

November 25, 2015

Give thanks this day for some indirect blessings of liberty, including the behavior-beyond-satire of what are generously called institutions of higher education. People who are imprecisely called educators have taught, by their negative examples, what intelligence is not.

Melissa Click is the University of Missouri academic who shouted “I need some muscle over here” to prevent a photojournalist from informing the public about a public demonstration intended to influence the public. Click’s academic credentials include a University of Massachusetts doctoral dissertation titled “It’s ‘a good thing’: The Commodification of Femininity, Affluence, and Whiteness in the Martha Stewart Phenomenon.” Her curriculum vitae says she has a graduate certificate in “advanced feminist studies.” Advanced. The best kind.

University of Missouri law students, who evidently cut class the day the First Amendment was taught, wrote a social media policy that included this: “Do not comment despairingly [disparagingly?] on others.” A grammatically challenged Ithaca College professor produced this cri de coeur regarding the school’s president: “There have been a litany of episodes and incidents during [his] tenure here which have led to frustration because, when brought to his attention, the view of the protesters is that he has been unresponsive.” Symptomatic of Ithaca’s intellectual flavor is another professor, who says agriculture is “capitalist, racialized patriarchy.”

The University of Wisconsin at Milwaukee, an irony-free campus, declared the phrase “politically correct” a microaggression. The master of Yale’s Pierson College said his regrettable title reminds distressed students of slavery. Wesleyan University’s student government threatened to cut the school newspaper’s funding because it published a column critical of campus leftists. Wesleyan created a “safe space,” a.k.a. a house, for LGBTTQQFAGPBDSM students (Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender, Transsexual, Queer, Questioning, Flexual, Asexual, Genderf---, Polyamorous, Bondage/Discipline, Dominance/Submission, Sadism/Masochism).

A Washington State University professor said she would lower the grade of any student who used the term “illegal immigrants” when referring to immigrants here illegally. Another Washington State professor warned in his syllabus that white students who want “to do well” in his “Introduction to Multicultural Literature” should show their “grasp of history and social relations” by “deferring to the experiences of people of color.” Another Washington State teacher, in her syllabus for “Women & Popular Culture,” warned that students risk “failure for the semester” if they use “derogatory/oppressive language” such as “referring to women/men as females or males.”

The University of Tennessee’s Office for Diversity and Inclusion, worried that students might be uncomfortable with gender-specific pronouns (“he,” “she,” “him,” “her”), suggests gender-neutral noises (“ze,” “hir,” “xe,” “xem,” “xyr”). The University of California system’s sensitivity auditors stipulated that “hostile” and “derogatory” thoughts include “I believe the most qualified person should get the job” and “America is the land of opportunity.” The University of Wisconsin at Stevens Point’s list of racial microaggressions includes “America is a melting pot” and “There is only one race, the human race.”

Some Johns Hopkins University students proclaimed themselves microaggressed by the possibility of a Chick-fil-A restaurant on campus. (Chick-fil-A’s chief executive defines marriage as Barack Obama did until 2012.) Mount Holyoke College canceled its annual production of “The Vagina Monologues” because it is insufficiently inclusive regarding women without vaginas and men who, as the saying goes, “self-identify” as women. “Gender,” said a student, “is a wide and varied experience, one that cannot simply be reduced to biological or anatomical distinctions,” and the show “is inherently reductionist and exclusive.”

Writing in the University of California at Berkeley paper, two geographically challenged students objected to a class featuring Plato and Aristotle and other “economically privileged white males from five imperial countries (England, France, Germany, Italy and the United States).” A branch of the University of California at Irvine’s student government passed a resolution against the display of flags. Written by a student in the School of Social Ecology ( “transformative research to alleviate social inequality and human suffering”), the resolution said flags are “weapons for nationalism” and “construct” dangerous “cultural mythologies and narratives” and “paradigms of conformity” and “homogenized standards” and interfere with “designing a culturally inclusive space.”

Students on Columbia University’s Multicultural Affairs Advisory Board suggested trigger warnings for persons who might be traumatized by reading, say, Ovid’s “Metamorphoses,” wherein some myths portray bad sexual behavior. But a feminist blog warned that the phrase “trigger warning” itself needs a warning attached to it because it might remind people of guns. But, then, the word “warning” might [substitute word for “trigger”] fright.

So, today give thanks that 2015 has raised an important question about American higher education: What, exactly, is it higher than?

Last edited by grundle; 11-27-15 at 12:40 PM.
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Old 11-27-15, 12:27 PM   #121
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

Apparently, the Viking Mascot at Western Washington University has incited controversy for not being "diverse" enough. The ensuing controversy resulted in threats of violence on some social media platform and they've canceled classes:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...ncels-classes/

As someone of Swedish descent who's been told by a psychic that I was a Viking shipbuilder in a past life, I'm offended by this racist attack and I call discrimination.

Hagar, let's join the fray!

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Last edited by Ash Ketchum; 11-27-15 at 12:33 PM.
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Old 11-27-15, 12:30 PM   #122
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

Cracked tackled a few of these.

Here's a point about that Vagina Monologues story -

Quote:
The problem is that if you actually read those stories instead of just phrasing them in the most alarmist way possible, you'll find that none of them happened the way you think. The Vagina Monologues wasn't just abruptly cancelled; it was replaced with a different show that they felt might be more inclusive of trans people. The goal was to add more perspectives, which is literally the opposite of censorship.
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Old 11-27-15, 03:23 PM   #123
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

One confounding factor is that many students graduate college so intellectually and morally crippled that the only job they are qualified for is writing for Cracked.
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Old 11-27-15, 04:26 PM   #124
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

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Originally Posted by dork View Post
One confounding factor is that many students graduate college so intellectually and morally crippled that the only job they are qualified for is writing for Cracked.
What is intellectually and morally crippled about the article I posted?
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Old 11-27-15, 04:42 PM   #125
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Re: The War for Free Expression at College: The One & Only Megathread

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Originally Posted by Draven View Post
What is intellectually and morally crippled about the article I posted?
If you're able to read an explanation of how cancelling a performance of a play can be "literally the opposite of censorship" without attempting to hurl your computer out a window, I doubt I'll be able to answer your question to your satisfaction.
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